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-   -   AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=8703)

oleg November 21st, 2003 01:07 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
Quote:

Originally posted by QBrigid:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by oleg:
I have some comments about Stellar Manipulation.

AI plays very well now IMHO. But, and I mean BUT, the combination of those two tweaks made human SM very robust. In the game I play with latest settins, it is very easy for humans to get very effective expansion tool.

I suggest to restor the values of human SM warp openers to 3,4 and 6 LY. It should't be a problem given the new cheap research cost !

Just MHO, may be i'm too harsh on feloow humans http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Oleg do you think raising the SM tech cost up a little maybe better in slowing the pace to prevent the rapid expansion.

Existing AIC warp opened at 4ly, 6ly and 10ly at sm3 works really good in a no-warp game with most FQM and upper AIC maps.
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">May be. I really not sure. Old cost was too high for current AI settings IMHO - some races would wait 200+ turns before 1st WP. Now, with low AI bonuses, EEE opens WP at turn 50 ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif May be some value in between is optimal.

Deathstalker November 21st, 2003 01:36 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
"AI plays very well now IMHO. But, and I mean BUT, the combination of those two tweaks made human SM very robust. In the game I play with latest settins, it is very easy for humans to get very effective expansion tool. "

Just my 2 cents but....if what your looking for is a cheaper way for the AI use stellar manip then you could go one of two routes.

One, make a tech tree that is for the AI only and have certain techs (like SM) available early on.

Two, make a mount (yeah I know, I AM mount happy http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif ), have the stellar manip component cost a HUGE amount to begin with in resources and then make an AI mount reducing the cost, that way if humans want to use it it costs alot to build the ship itself even though the research is fairly easy....

just my 2 cents anyway...... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

JLS November 21st, 2003 01:45 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Deathstalker:
make a mount (yeah I know, I AM mount happy http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">AIC v4.11 will be released very soon; there are some added AI Player SM provisions to assist with FQM, and that really do not have much effect on most the AIC standard maps http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Deathstalker after this release, we would be beholden if you could spruce up the AIC comp enhancement file http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

[ November 21, 2003, 00:18: Message edited by: JLS ]

JLS November 21st, 2003 01:48 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
Quote:

Originally posted by oleg:
Old cost was too high for current AI settings IMHO - some races would wait 200+ turns before 1st WP. Now, with low AI bonuses, EEE opens WP at turn 50 ! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif May be some value in between is optimal.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I could not agree with you more Oleg http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

JLS November 21st, 2003 01:58 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
Quote:

Originally posted by QBrigid:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by oleg:
JLC, I remember you posted about returning to the 3.02 AI politics in the next patch. What exactly is the change ? Right now I am playing 4.01 game against 10 AIs and almost WHOLE politics table is green. Only two wars. I am at peace with all AIs http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif Boring !!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The Violent psycos declare wars in my game.

But I think JLS has set the declare war value high for other races in the Last release so they will not commit to a full game at war but they will get very angry and break treaty negotians but there is always a chance they will become freinds much latter.

I like this approach but I tend to agree with you Oleg the Psycos should be a little more psyco http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">AI Players to commit fewer wars, and yet still be very aggressive is a goal we will obtain.

As you recall with v3.02 and prior, the AI was tuned for the Human Player to have 20 to 40+ odd Star Liners plus the usual combat and support fleets.
With v4.0 for the Players that have chosen starting trait option SO* now alleviates most of the need for a large Star Liner fleet and I did not want the the AI Players to find this an early weakness with Human Players ship totals. There was a need to tone down the AI politics a bit and then set to a happy medium, and this may require a few more tweaks.

However, the Violent and Psychotic and even the Impulsive Races should still be true to form with the previous AIC v4.01 http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ November 21, 2003, 00:15: Message edited by: JLS ]

oleg November 21st, 2003 02:39 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
I would like another culture added:

Gedonists !! - Close to artisans but still different:

++ to happines (obvious)
+ to reproduction (not sure here, kids are pain !)
-- to conditions tolerance (obvious)
- to ground combat (painfull business!)

Fyron November 21st, 2003 02:57 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
Quote:

+ to reproduction (not sure here, kids are pain !)
-- to conditions tolerance (obvious)
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">These can not be modified via culture.

Deathstalker November 21st, 2003 04:12 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
"Deathstalker after this release, we would be beholden if you could spruce up the AIC comp enhancement file "

I would love to (as I stated much earlier) but I'm afraid of one thing and that is ruining the game. My mods have one thing in common and that is big dramatic changes. Your mod is very exact and quite complex (and thats a compliment, trust me, its obvious the time you guys have put into this....I just cut/paste and throw in some ideas and see what works...)

If I did do some mounts I'd worry I'd upset some sort of balance that would throw off some players (ie, make a Robo-Miner mount and make it too easy to aquire minerals, make an engine mount and all of a sudden fuel is no longer a worry.)

How about if those of you who have a little stake in the game (the modders and players) give me an idea of what could use mounts and what couldn't? The Last thing I want to do is ruin a good thing.

oleg November 21st, 2003 04:16 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">+ to reproduction (not sure here, kids are pain !)
-- to conditions tolerance (obvious)

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">These can not be modified via culture. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Ouh, did't know about this. Than this idea is kind of moot http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif .

Taera November 21st, 2003 06:56 AM

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent
 
I would like to suggest AIC AI players to have their 'gets angry over enemy/ally colonizable planets' falsed down. This setting makes little sense and realy distrupts the political world of the AI, no matter how bad it is.


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