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Ironhawk said:
Yeah now that mauls are AP, they can probably drop a point or two in damage. But I wouldn't go further than that. They are two handed after all, so if the maulers ever come under missle fire, they are pretty much done for.
I agree, it *is* really nice to have the maul be useful!! It went from being a joke weapon to filling a really useful niche. Was there never any AP infantry melee weapon prior to this?? I'm thinking back now and I cant recall one... well, lances I guess? But thats not really infantry per se. On the topic tho, does anyone feel that mauls might be moving in on the territory of heavy cav? 13-14 dam ap attacks every round instead of once per battle?
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No other mundane melee weapons are AP, and AP is pretty rare even for magical weapons. Lances are not AP, despite the description. Unfortunately, Action Points and Armor Piercing have the same abbreviation... lances get a damage bonus based on the unit's speed, and kill things easily because they do massive damage, not because they pierce armor.
That's a very good point, though - I certainly would not want to render an entire unit category obsolete to make a single weapon useful. One *possible* solution is to give mauls a negative attack modifier, and lances a positive attack modifier. When you think about it, it would be WAY easier to hit a moving target with a sword than with a maul, yet they have the same (0) attack modifier. OTOH, a knight charging into a battle is probably going to hit SOMETHING with his lance before his momentum dies. If lances can hit and damage most things, while mauls tend to miss agile units and are best used on heavy / slow things like Living Statues and super-heavy infantry, then both would still have a niche. Not to mention that lances - being a cavalry weapon - are still ideal for many things that mauls can't do, like racing across the field to kill pretenders while they are still buffing.
Anyway, my preliminary thought is to change mauls from (5ap, 0, -1, 0) to (3ap, -1, -1, 3), and I still think they will be highly useful. Considering how seldom Cavalry is deployed (though that may change with the pricing in the mod), lances might be due for an upgrade, like ignoring shields. Part of the point of lances (war lances, not joust lances) is that they can go right through wooden shields and kill an armored unit. They should damage / stun / dehorse / knock down someone even if it is blocked by a metal shield, though I'm not sure that shields with thick enough metal to stop a lance were ever commonly deployed. Either way, it makes sense to me for lances to ignore defense. As a little footsoldier watching a giant, armored, lance-wielding, mounted knight bearing down on me, I wouldn't lift up my leather-bound wooden shield - designed to block swords and rocks - and assume I'll somehow live, if only I keep the shield between me and the lance.
So, I think giving #flail (shield ignoring) to lances - heavy lances, at least - would be a good change. I don't think light lances should get that, though I'm not really sure what they are. If they're just spears aided by charge momentum, I doubt they could pierce shields AND still do damage, since true lances have a very long, sharp, steel head specifically designed for very deep piercing attacks. In fact, it makes sense for heavy lances to get both #flail and #armorpiercing, but that might make them too powerful.
