Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

John to your last, I would say it depends on the aircraft being flown due to the electronics onboard. One must remember "stealth" goes beyond just it's radar cross section. I'm going to it simple and use what I've read up to this point.

In an environment (Sweden) where I know the Russians are operating S-300/S-400 SAM Systems there's less than a handful of Jets in the world I would trust in potential combat environment as noted above, and the GRIPEN E/F is onE of them.

Two I'll knock out for all the "hoopla" that surrounded them and they are Chinas J-20 and Russia's T-50 (Used to be PAK-FA).

The J-20 it seems isn't as stealthy as first thought, and there are questions concerning it systems capabilities and reliability to include the powerplant.

If there was to be a foreign contender to the F-22 it would've been the PAK-FA/T-50 joint venture between India and Russia that I reported on extensively for years in here.

Basically with everything else Russia was trying to accomplish with their defensive needs, something had to give and it was the PAK-FA/T-50(And you might've heard about the T-14 as well!?!) they wanted to cut most of assets that would've truly have made this jet only the 2nd 5th GEN fighter in the world behind the F-22.

And NO the F-35 doesn't have true Super Cruise, because it has to go to "afterburner" first and it can only sustain "Super Cruise like" capability for around 150NM.
Super Cruise has been one of long standing 6-8 requirements to be met by a truly stealth jet. You might as well "Be on Broadway" with those bright LED (Neon just so not today.) lights.

So back to PAF-FA/T-50, India had warned Russia for more then a couple of years that if they didn't "reset" to the original concept of the joint venture (Stealth) they would withdraw from the the program. And so they did.

This next then should tell tell you a lot, India is now flying the latest version RAFALE and Russia with the T-50 is in "limbo" with it. An old saying comes to mind...Don't bite the hand that feeds you. India's hand healed quickly.

So I wish to leave with an article I would've rather have posted but just found today from a well industry respected source, talking about Canada, Sweden and Russia, GRIPEN E/F, Stealth and in the first para a remark about the F-35 and more.
https://skiesmag.com/features/saab-gripen-e-dark-horse/

USAF 4th GEN being around for a couple of more decades and how we're making them better...
https://www.airforcemag.com/article/...s-in-the-Game/

I've done enough damage for one day, take care!

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

They do make a compelling argument. What gets picked in the end will be a political decision and the coin is in mid air how that will go.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

John, because you you enjoy (As some others as well.) a good technical read once in awhile, I provide you with the the following abstract on the Chinese J-20. It was dated 04 July 2014. That's about 3 years after the J-20 Prototype made it's first appearance while then Defense Secretary Robert Gates was in Beijing China to "temp down" military tensions that were occurring at the time and are still continuing.
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-c...70B11720110112
https://www.nytimes.com/2011/01/12/w...12fighter.html

We didn't appreciate the "message" at the time.

As I noted in my last, it wasn't all it was "touted" as being which is at best and taken from Ref. 2...
"Actually the new J-20 is an advanced fourth-generation fighter, rather than a true fifth-generation fighter. Still though it easily outclasses older fourth-generation fighters, such as the US F-16 or the Russian Su-27."

I agree with that to an extent, however, we're flying much more capable F-16's now and Taiwan would be able to hold their own against the J-20 as we're updating (Now) their current F-16 fleet to the F-16V standard. And for Russia they are beyond the Su-27 with the Su-30 (Improved 27.), Su-35 and MiG-31BM.

I had to ref. the glossary a couple of times myself this is "deep reading" so it won't be for most people.

But it also demonstrates why I like this "think tank" because of the depth of their research, I can very much appreciate that! ;)
http://www.ausairpower.net/APA-2011-03.html
Note it is titled "Preliminary Assessment"
http://www.military-today.com/aircraft/j20.htm

The rest as noted from above and keeping it easy for me...
http://www.military-today.com/aircraft/f16v_viper.htm
You have no idea how much an AESA capability truly means in a "stealthy" environment.
http://www.military-today.com/aircraft/su_30.htm
http://www.military-today.com/aircraft/su_35.htm
Highly capable aircraft.
http://www.military-today.com/aircraft/mig_31bm.htm
One of the fastest in the world but, sacrifices some maneuverability as a cost to speed.

Enjoy the rest of your Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!!

Happy Holidays if you prefer!! :D

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Read an article that one of your MPs blasted the idea of buying older Aussie F18s. Compared it a certain submarine. I will post the article if you want it.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Not necessary. I know about that

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

https://www.businessinsider.com/brit...ighter-2020-12

The main image looks like a model mockup but it is an interesting looking aircraft.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Awhile back you were asking about weapons loadout "graphs" for Aircraft. If I would've taken a "deep breadth" I would've remembered about AUSA, I would've provided the following...

Just scroll down, you'll find them.

F-22: Yes this in one of the one's I did submit already, however, this could be a check against it or slightly more detailed which I believe will be the case here.
http://www.ausairpower.net/raptor.html

In order top to bottom Su-35+35S/Su-27SKM and Su-30MK2.
http://www.ausairpower.net/flanker.html Also:

Besides those good looking silhouettes, by clicking on them you get this "bonus" read on Asia's FLANKERS and Asia's aviation in general. It is both informative and technical in scope.

Unless I'm mistaken, something one of my first associates would find worth his while, so John enjoy!! I hope some of you will as well.
http://www.ausairpower.net/PDF-A/TE-Flankers-Aug03.pdf

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

This is another reason why the F-35 hasn't reached FOC, and this situation wasn't limited to just the USMC. They all did it because it's a "common" platform. In fact there's another modification just contracted that won't be complete until mid-2023 as DID has reported earlier this week.

The JANE's ref below just nicely encapsulates the situation. Para 3 will lead you into the problem, while Para 4/5 tell you how bad the problem is.

From Para 4 from DOD, "For example, 44% of purchased parts were incompatible with aircraft the Marine Corps took on a recent deployment."

I touched on this last when discussing ODIN situation which will be used to hopefully address these issues and the complexities of aircraft operability. You cannot maintain normal operational tempo, let alone sustained combat operations without a reliable supply chain.
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/n...b-parts-issues

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

It sometimes amazes me how something "old" can be so accurate and relevant well into the future. It's a topic I've kept up with for a very, very longtime. Tonight is the first time I've read or seen this article.

I've seen over the years many times out here the question asked in many variations of the topic concerning stealth aircraft and countermeasures against it.

This is the first article I've read to date that covers the topics above with a little more clarity and sense of purpose. And as always, they leave you better informed afterwards then what you thought you knew starting it.

Of course I speak about AUSA. The topic STEALTH and COUNTERMEASURES. I'm "better informed" in particular concerning Countermeasures from a technical standpoint.

And to think, I thought I knew it all, well OK, almost all anyway!?! :shock: :p :D :doh:
http://www.ausairpower.net/PDF-A/APA...ay-2009-AE.pdf

Besides it also agrees with what I've been saying about the F-22 for I don't know how many years now. It's still true now and will be into the future for at least for another 10 years or more.

If you missed my post on this, the whole F-22 fleet is being modernized and will be more stealthy then it is as they're to be "recoated" with a new "hush/hush" paint if you will.

Another one for John!

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

https://www.popularmechanics.com/mil...ially-retired/

Seems the F-18 has made its final flight with the US Navy/Marines as of the 25 of Feb 2021.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Doubtful.

Last I heard the US Navy planned to keep it's F/A-18Es and Fs for their Air Superiority role. Something the F-35 isn't terribly well suited for. Contrary to what many idiots claim the F-35 was never intended or designed as an air superiority platform.

The USMC does plan to get rid of it's F-18s as they expect the US Navy (and possibly USAF) to handle air superiority. Their aircraft are ground support assets.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

That is the plan. The USN has and will be receiving "new build" F/A-18E/F HORNETS for the air superiority role as my Marine "buddy" has pointed out.

As it currently stands, VMFA-533 Beaufort, S.C. is planned to be the first USMC air unit to reach FOC with their F-35B jets in the last quarter of FY 2025 (JUL-SEP 2025) providing there's no "hiccups" for any one.

And that's straight from the USMC.

So here's a recent "hiccup" for all three services...

"February 17/21: Engine Shortage F-35 fighter plane engines are in short supply external link, with the solution months away, causing the Defense Department to reduce its schedule of exhibition flights and to start planning for a shortage as soon as 2022. The Defense Department’s F-35 office has advised that about five to six percent of the US. F-35 fleet could be without useable engines by 2022, and up to 20 percent of the plane’s fleet could be sidelined by 2025. According to Defense News external link, the F-35 Heavy Maintenance Center, located at Tinker Air Force Base, Oklahoma, has been unable to process engines for repairs and maintenance, and catching up will take months."
https://www.defenseindustrydaily.com...m-edit-037947/

I couldn't make this up if I tried.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

So do the dates change for the plane in the USMC OOB or not?

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

No. They are assumed to be USN assents supporting USMC

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

If you look a the USMC OOB you'll see some helos and aircraft have an "*" as part of the unit name. These are USN assets.

Example:
Unit# 106 SH-2DSeasprite*

As to the F/A-18
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ade-of-service

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

The blue part of the navy assisting the green part of the navy....
:evil: :angel

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Suggestion: We are constantly hearing what this or that organisation is GOING to do. Let us wait until they actually DO it.

troopie

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

If referring to the F/A-18E/F that's already and has been ongoing.

If referring to the F-35 series, than yes that's currently "premature" but in the game. So now what do we do? That's not my final decision, all I can do is point it out.

It's not limited to this topic, as Don pointed when I found issue with the LEOPARD 2A5 (German OOB.) I believe he indicated that error (They got them to soon in in the OOB, as compared to RL. Fixed for the next patch.) was in there for a very longtime.

Again I've found legacy issues, prototypes (AJAX/F-35) and programs go by the wayside (SADF BADGER which now I don't even see actually being produced now before 2025 due to industry incompetence and corruption.

Some of the above was due to our lack of oversight or at the time all the sources we had pretty much indicated said piece of equipment "was on the way" or written "that it's there."

It took me a couple of years to learn I needed to "deep read" my information and learn to speck "industry" language as they "tout" every step in the process as a victory to getting said piece of equipment into the field.

This has lead to so much rework in the OOB's, it's getting to the point of becoming ridiculous if not just plain frustrating.

All we can do is fix the issues as we find them. Anything less leaves us with a game not as good as it could be or should be for ALL the hard work that's been done by Andy, Don and everyone else that's contributed to the game.

I would last see the following alive during the 25th Anniversary of the commissioning of the USS NEBRASKA SSBN-739 Reunion 3 years ago, knowing that CINCLANTHOME and I saved the Reunion and made it happen, CAPT. Will Porter USN/SS Ret. (My last CO on there.) told us "I'm glad to see after all these years since you transferred off the boat, that somethings haven't changed, you're still the conscious of the crew and the boat."

We miss him.

And yes, "somethings haven't changed" and there's only one way it will.

You have your name and your character anything else is "fleeting" and will not stand the test of time.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Part of the problem has always been WinSMPBTs end date is in the future.

So we're constantly looking at what's planned then later what's actually implemented.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

IDK if they are or not. I sent you the current OOB to use as a guide for any changes and I have not had any feedback.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Have the end date set in the future show be a good thing since it allows things to change, as we are talking about with the fighters and who is buying what etc...to me if one branch is no longer using X for something then to me that should be reflected in the OOBs. Now with USMC, sure they could still call on Navy F18s but that might not be doctrine and that is where we seem to gloss over or so to me it seems, country X stops using a doctrine and that means certain vehicles, fighters, weapons are no longer used in the same manner, so IMO, the stop date is a reflection of that. Can a LAWs rocket stop a current front-line MBT? Sure, engine hit or track/road wheels taken out or that lucky hit that just happens. Is it standard practice to use a LAWs rocket to take on a T80 or M1? No, however, it can be done, but no one is using that weapon system anymore to do it, with the very few exceptions of terrorist or low-end rebels.

Might not be the best example but the point is if doctrines change then certain things won't be available to a country after a certain date.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

There is reality and "game reality" and in this case, the game reality is USMC has access to USN air assets because, in reality, they do. It has been that way from the beginning and is not going to change. Without the USN assets, the game USMC would be missing potential air assets which in reality they would not be. USMC doesn't have its own naval support either. It relies on the USN for that.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

I get that, however, if doctrine changes then they won't be calling on F18s for CAS, which is what changed, they would be calling on the F35s for CAS. Just like they don't have battleship-sized guns post 2000 to call on for naval gunfire either, and the game doesn't offer Tomahawk support to them which is something they would have access to as well.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Another "minor" asset many OOBs (not just the USMC) have access to is naval gunfire.

If US forces are in range they have access to each other's air assets.

It was "common knowledge" (i.e. maybe true, maybe not) that during Vietnam (and reportedly Afghanistan) the US Army preferred USN and particularly USMC air support because they got down in the weeds and hit their target rather then passing 20,000 feet overhead and dropping their load somewhere in the vicinity of the target.
( In all fairness USAF A-10 pilots are a much loved exception to this. )

WinSPMBT represents assets (and formations) available during a time frame. Those available for a specific scenario are up to the scenario designer. If you're playing vs the AI then you get what's in the piclists, and that can be almost anything available during the time frame.

An AT-4 or RPG can't take out most front line MBTs head on either by-the-way.

It's not a matter of what's "good" or "useful", it's one of what's available. The USMC is currently getting rid of most (if not all) of it's M1's. EVERYONE (but the USMC top brass) knows this is a mistake, but it's being done anyway.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Key.Aero reports that the U.S.A.F. accepted their first F-15EX at Boeings St. Louis facility on March 10th.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

The reports are true, started tracking in Early/Mid 2020...
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/n...ombat-aircraft
https://www.flightglobal.com/fixed-w...139799.article
https://theaviationist.com/2021/02/1...-first-flight/
(From Para 8 from above"...173rd Fighter Wing of the Oregon ANG, stationed at Kingsley Field, will become the first F-15EX Formal Training Unit (FTU) in 2022, and the 142nd Fighter Wing of the Oregon ANG, stationed in Portland, will become the first F-15EX operational unit in 2023.")
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/n...-15ex-for-usaf
https://theaviationist.com/2021/02/2...-and-markings/
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...-the-air-force

Foreign Potential Sales:

India
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/n...ry-plans_15168

Indonesia
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/n...curement-plans

Abstract
A couple of points and issues for the following based on some other data I have...
1) I believe the author is under estimating the detection range versus the F-35A. I would agree with those numbers based on the original S-400 fielded but not with the current upgraded versions since fielded by the Russians.

2) The calculus will change later this year (Early next year.) when Russia fields the S-500, which they hope will be able to deal with the F-22 (However as I've already reported and "as we speak", the F-22's are getting new "skin treatments" and advanced EW systems.)

3) The F-15EX will still be the worlds heaviest weapons platform in it's class.
https://www.airforcemag.com/article/f-15ex-vs-f-35a/
https://www.airforcemag.com/PDF/Maga...rtical.v30.pdf

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Poland plan to buy 32 F-35A in years 2024-2026 pilots oficially starts training in USA.

https://translate.google.com/transla...ja-sie-na-f-35

https://www.altair.com.pl/process/ho...-f35-bg_01.jpg

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Egypt OBAT (01) seems to be missing Mirage 5, which was decently large type in the Egyptian air force

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

And would it be significantly different in the game than the multiple Mirage 2000 that are already there?

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

One of my "older" projected issues I've mentioned in the forum were projects going back to 2014/2015 mine concerned the same jets but a different country-BRAZIL. And I'll leave that there.

But concerning EYGPT and the MIRAGE 5SDE (Specifically.) and the MIRAGE 2000EM (Specifically), I'll try to make Marks case for him differently that maybe he might not be aware of himself :dk:, there exists at least a ten year gap between the two aircraft in their respective delivery dates to EYGPT, that in of itself should be enough reason I would think to get the MIRAGE 5SDE entered.

The next is from of course, SIPRI which I consider the "great arbitrator" for such issues as these.
20 Mirage-2000 FGA aircraft (1983) 1986-1988 (Delivered-Mine) (20) $1 b deal (incl production of components in Egypt); Mirage-2000EM version; incl 4 Mirage-2000BM trainer version

38 Mirage-5 FGA aircraft 1973 1973-1975 (Delivered-Mine) (38) Financed by Saudi Arabia; Mirage-5SDE version; incl 6 Mirage-5SB trainer version

EYGPT would order 34 total more MIRAGE-5 aircraft...
14 Mirage-5 FGA aircraft 1975 1977 14 Financed by Saudi Arabia; Mirage-5SDE version

14 Mirage-5 FGA aircraft 1977 1980 14 Financed by Saudi Arabia; Mirage-5SDE version; incl 6 Mirage-5SDR reconnaissance version

16 Mirage-5 FGA aircraft 1980 1983 (16) Mirage-5E2 version (I believe if memory serves, these are the more advanced French Air Force versions.)

And finally, just to wrap up all the Jet Fighters bought from France by EYGPT...
24 Rafale FGA aircraft 2015 2015-2019 24 Part of $5.2-6 b deal; incl 8 Rafale-EM and 16 Rafale-DM version

My search criteria Supplier France/Recipient Egypt/Aircraft/1970-2020.

Make no mistake there are differences between these types. I hate "cookie cutters" especially when it comes to tanks and combat aircraft.

Oh!, because I can F-35 FOC by 2023? Don't hold your breath, I really wish that we would make this right in the game since we do it with the tanks etc. which is our "main purpose" I believe.

Anyway...I only hope those that read the next, will read it as carefully as I have. Israel is the ONLY country to declare their F-35 jets at FOC and they're also already modifying them to suit their needs. Of course as I've already posted.
https://www.airforcemag.com/article/...-for-the-f-35/

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

OK. the Mirage 5 SDE is a Single-seat radar-equipped fighter-bomber version that was built for Egypt and is equivalent to Mirage IIIE and they were delivered to Egypt in 1974 and I assume it is still in service?

and Pat...... did you look in the Egyptian OOB for the Rafael ? it's there entering service 7/2015

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Don,
I already knew it was in there sometime ago, I remember posting on it's possible buy to acquisition (REFALE) though I don't know who purposed it for the game.

I thought, I commented that I added it just to close out the "combat" jets supplied by France between 1970-2020. If not, my apologies for not stating that in my last post.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

The Mirage 5 is now in the Egyptian OOB and it has its own new Icon replacing an old SSI Mirage repaint that had been sitting unused in the graphics files for years

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

I feel it necessary to thank Mark for the Egyptian MIRAGE "catch", it probably goes without saying that issue has been around for a very longtime.

But it's also refreshing to see players pointing out these things, especially from countries that might not always be on the "radar screen" and quite frankly, it's good to know you're not alone in supporting the "little guys" in the game. OWOOOB!

And Don, responded as usual to these "things" and the issue is done.

So knowing the "boys" can use a break, I'll be working in the "dark" where I can promise every continent will have issues covered when "Plan B" is executed.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

F-35C UPDATE: FINALLY, the USN's F-35C will be making it's FIRST deployment (On the USS CARL VINSON.)) later this year in a consolidated air wing. They've not gone to sea since 2018 when they were tested for carrier qualification operations.

Also the new tilt rotor CMV-22 OSPREY will be going to sea on the same deployment to test it's transport capabilities (It has already flown in an "air ambulance" capacity.).

Of course again, all F-35 variants are still only IOC. The program starting around this summer through 2022 will be suffering across all military services from a severe shortage of engines, which expected to limit operations. I believe I've already posted on this issue.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/techn...?ocid=msedgntp
https://news.usni.org/2021/04/29/fir...r-strike-group

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Wasn't to far off, had the F-35C becoming operational 1/2023.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

I'm just going to leave the in service date as-is for now

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Link containing the pics of the 1st Greek Rafale during flight:

https://www.ptisidiastima.com/greek-rafale-pics/

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Something some of you may find interesting

https://getpocket.com/explore/item/h...=pocket-newtab

His Obit

https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries...ary?id=8291257

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

China has tested a twin seat (Pilot/Guy in Back) J-20 (Unit 164 China) prototype. We're still years away from it entering service; but presumably when it enters service, it will be used for training or an EW/SEAD/Heavy Strike version of the J-20.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

China has unveiled a variant of the J-16 (Unit 168); the J-16D, an EW/attack variant similar to the EF-18G Growler and reportedly deployed a few planes near taiwan.

https://militarywatchmagazine.com/ar...16d-unique-new

The J-16D:

Removes the 30mm cannon and IRST pod of the basic J-16 fighter in favor of 6 x Anti Radiation Missiles; but it's not known which missile will be chosen for the J-16D:

CM-103 -- 100 km range ARM
LD-10 - ARM derived from PL-12 AAM.
YJ-91 -- Apparently most widely used ARM by PLAAF.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

The Chinese now have 20~ or more Y-20 transports.

On 6 July 2016 the first serial Y-20A (serial number 11051) was handed over to the PLAAF in a ceremony. The second aircraft numbered 11052 followed soon after - it was assigned to the 12th Regiment of the 4th Transport Division at Qionglai, Chengdu.

In May 2018; the first airborne airdrops occurred from the Y-20.

These planes use Russian supplied Soloviev D-30 turbofans.

They basically can lift up to 66 tons (2 x Type 15 light tanks or 1 x Type 99 Tank).

Not much information is known about the Y-20B; but this model will use the first indigenously produced Chinese Turbofans (WS-18 or WS-20).

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Though I hope the following will finally get these jets inline to the "real world" I remain pessimistically/optimistic this might finally happen because, there is no more guessing to disrupt that thought process.

We have finally, an FOC date, with cavoites, but none the less an FOC date from NAVAIR for one variant but also for only one service.

By now most will know I'm speaking of the F-35. Specifically, the USMC F-35C. I don't know for how many years I've been saying the CORPS would reach that milestone first.

So...
USMC/CHANGE/F-35C/UNITS 584 & 585/START/JUL 2021 vice JAN 2023//
With this OFFICIAL announcement, this now throws all other F-35 start dates "out the window" the wait period is now over with this news coming from NAVAIR and after linking to F-35 LIGHTNING II JOINT PROGRAM OFFICE.
https://www.navair.navy.mil/
(Click on Fixed Wing>F-35)
https://www.jsf.mil/news
From the ref below...
"The Marine Corps has been first to reach a number of F-35 milestones, but unlike the F-35C variant, its sibling F-35B model has yet to reach full operational capability. Each service sets its own requirements for operational capability based on a number of factors, including the level of training personnel receive and the number of squadrons flying the aircraft."
https://www.military.com/daily-news/...rtime-use.html
(As linked to from NAVAIR and JSF sites as above.)

This following gives some prospective from BOTH the USN and USAF from the ref below these...
"By 2025, the Navy will have solved its strike fighter shortfall in part by changing how it will field the F-35C Lighting II Joint Strike Fighter. Instead of two squadrons per air wing with 10 tails, the Navy will now field a single squadron with 14 tails, Rear Adm. Andrew Loiselle, director of the Air Warfare Division (OPNAV/N98), told the House Armed Services subcommittee on tactical air and land forces on Tuesday. testified it was reducing F-35C Lightning II Joint Strike Fight from two to one squadron per air wing."

USAF...
Looking at the F-35’s impact on the Air Force, Lt. Gen. David Nahom, deputy chief of staff for plans and programs, said, “we’re paying for outstanding but not getting outstanding. ” Today and in the immediate future, “we’re filling in the holes with F-16s and A-10s.”
https://news.usni.org/2021/07/14/nav...rtfall-by-2025

The article above encapsulates all the issues I've brought up about the F-35. It also admits finally that foreign competition is also delaying the F-35A, F-35C USN and F-35B.

So how did the USMC get theirs to FOC? Two factors their F/A-18C/D jets are older and PLAN 2030. They also only require 68 aircraft to fulfill their mission requirements. Because of this they ca keep them reengined (As I've posted) during the engine shortage that will continue through 2025. F-55B engines are still be tested through mid 2022 if all goes well.

My thoughts for the rest and based on current refs (And an officer I know currently assigned to a carrier.) and everything else I've posted, are F-35A & F-35C based on earliest dates AND the fact they both have contracts running through the middle of 2024+ for SYSTEM/HARDWARD upgrades and retrofits are
START OCT 2024 and based more on the contracts JAN 2025.

I feel there's a reasonable expectation that the F-35B and pending the engine testing results, I see START APR 2023 to OCT 2023.

I will either eat "humble pie" or "gloat" (Without malicious aspect to it.) more than likely however I'll just appreciate getting this as close to right after so many years of dealing with this.

If anything, if more is required I can with what I have "drop a ref bomb" but everything to date posted provides a base for what's and what I still have.

I think with the FOC reached for the USMC F-35C that we should move forward. As a player after a Patch Post said, and I paraphrase, He grew tired of playing against INDIA as the AI was using T-90MS tanks regularly against him knowing they didn't have them yet.

I believe I submitted a date that pushed the FOC out about 3-4 years.

I wonder how many feel the same with the F-35 beating them up with SAM assets which might prove ineffective against a jet that's not at FOC except as noted? Many countries have updated their SAM systems to counter this (i.e., TURKEY FOC S-400. ) "[b] future" threat. Another area to be addressed at some point.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Pat......... 583 and 584 are the C versions not 584 and 585.

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Sorry! :doh: Also, my last post has been edited for more clarification

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Maybe you did by I can't find it

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Don...
To answer your last on the FOC 3-4 yr. START concerning INDIA's T-90MS, it was 3yrs. to JAN 2022 vice JAN 2019.
See MBT THREAD PG. 88/POST #879

Concerning the player feedback on the above change, that came from RC4 his comment is also in the MBT THREAD PG. 89/POST #885.

I assume you made the search for a reason, as you posted in your last, so my answer will hopefully clear up any issue you might be having.

Have a good morning!

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

Alright from JANE'S the following country has reached FOC with their F-35A fighters.

NORWAY

The last Norwegian F-16AM/BM fighters were also fully retired on 06 JAN 2022 to coincide with the F-35A fighters' operations for Norway.
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/a...al-air-defence

Do not for one second "assume" that these or any foreign governments F-35 versions are as fully capable as ours.

We currently have several modification contracts running through 2024+ for our F-35 versions before they reach FOC. See Contract section below in a "[b]sparse open read/B]" in which you'll see as I had already posted we're experiencing an engine shortage that'll cut into 20% of our fleet by 2025.

"February 17/21: Engine Shortage F-35 fighter plane engines are in short supply external link, with the solution months away, causing the Defense Department to reduce its schedule of exhibition flights and to start planning for a shortage as soon as 2022. The Defense Department’s F-35 office has advised that about five to six percent of the US. F-35 fleet could be without useable engines by 2022, and up to 20 percent of the plane’s fleet could be sidelined by 2025. According to Defense News external link, the F-135 Heavy Maintenance Center, located at Tinker Air Force Base, Oklahoma, has been unable to process engines for repairs and maintenance, and catching up will take months."
Thought I'd save you some time. ;)

I already addressed the NAVAIR/USMC decision (POST 643 above.) for the F-35B. It's I'm sure an honor for the USMC pilots to do some of the "real world" OPEVAL testing for the USAF and USN until theirs reach FOC.
https://www.defenseindustrydaily.com...m-edit-037947/

TRACKING the NETHERLANDS for FOC.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

With a war on their border (Ukraine) March 2nd was a real bad day for the Romanian Air Force.
https://www.flightglobal.com/defence...ent=newsletter

This what I saw in my account:
"Romania’s air force suffered two fatal accidents on 2 March, in separate crashes which killed eight military personnel.

The pilot of a Mikoyan MiG-21 fighter from the 861st Air Combat Squadron was killed when his aircraft crashed near Cogealac in the south-eastern Constanta region.

Romanian air force MiG-21

Source: Jason Wells/Shutterstock

A Romanian air force MiG-21 crashed on 2 March, killing its pilot

Romania’s defence ministry says the aircraft “was part of a formation of two MiG-21 Lancer planes performing air patrol missions over Dobrogea” during a sortie flown from Borcea air base. Radio transmissions ceased at 20:00 local time, and radar contact was lost 3min later, it says.

Following the fighter’s disappearance, an IAR SA330 Puma transport helicopter took off from Mihail Kogalniceanu air base, to conduct a search and rescue mission.

Romanian air force SA330

Source: Mircea Moira/Shutterstock

Seven personnel died when their SA330 was lost during search and rescue mission

The rotorcraft crashed at 20:44, killing all seven personnel aboard, including two from the naval forces. The accident happened near Gura Dobrogei, around 6.8 miles (11km) from its base.

The air force has initiated a commission to investigate the accidents, and temporarily grounded operations with its MiG-21 and SA330 fleets pending its initial findings."

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Jets & Planes but no UAV's here.
 

lets see, you lose contact with an aircraft and to goes off the radar then you send SAR to look for it and the same thing happens to it ?

Either Romania has a Bermuda triangle we've never heard of or the worst luck ever or something fishy is going on