Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I'm on broadband, but I know when I access it from slower connections, it tends to take a bit longer than I'd like. Plus, breaking it up is better so the user doesn't have to scroll all the time http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif .

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I'd rather scroll than have to load an excessive number of pages.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It'd be instantaneous, if I could spell that word correctly! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

[ January 26, 2003, 21:25: Message edited by: Captain Kwok ]

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

Kwok, mimimizing the number of clicks necessary is often preferable to making sure each page loads instantaneously. That is why most forums let you view a huge number of Posts per page, for people like me that would rather not click 8 million times.

[ January 26, 2003, 21:25: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Scrolling is far preferable to clicking through multiple browser windows, because I don't read as fast as the text downloads in a long window, but I do read faster than a new connection can be set up for a new page to be loaded.

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

FYI just in case you did not know, Will is back in the hospital again.

Also, and this one hurts, his new pc died, and with it, the 3d images for the New Dominion,Ferengi, and Cardassian ship sets.

I have not told him yet, I do not want to added to his worries. Rest assured, there was no back up.
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

[ January 27, 2003, 22:37: Message edited by: CNCRaymond ]

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Let's all hope that Will gets well quickly and is back with us soon!!!

It's unfortunate about the data loss, but lets hope that its recoverable!

The new patch is out, so that means some adjustments are to be made. I'm aiming for Saturday for the website update, which should include details of that sort.

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

As you can see, I've been throwing up some new pages over the Last day, albeit lacking some good content which will follow shortly. There are a few missing links which will also be addressed just as soon as I can get to them (mostly in the treknology section). However, there are some new images up, so it might be worthwhile to check out.

I still can't believe I'm getting about 100 hits a day! I guess I'm not the only one who wanders the internet visiting the same obscure sites all the time!

I'm also looking for suggestions for some tech areas for the latest race additions, these are the directions I'm thinking of:

Tholian - Crystalline
Breen - Tad of organic
Species 8472 - Biological + tad of telepathic

I have a number of idea which I won't stick here right now, but they fall into those categories to some degree.

The Star Trek mod also has its own forum thanks to Fyron, here is the link: Star Trek Mod Forum

Feel free to post there and even create new topics.

In regards to the new release schedule, it's difficult to pinpoint a time due to recent circumstances. I keep everyone updated for sure.

Thanks for all the requests to be beta testers, be assured I have added you all to my list. I'll keep you posted on any new developments!

Thanks again.

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

Hey Captain, as for tech for these races, I think I might have a couple of ideas for the Tholians.

Granted, you probably want to base the Tholians of of what we know from TNG, but the SFB rules for the Tholians where really interesting for weaponry.

Is it ok to make some suggestions for special weapons build by the Tholians from SFB to this mode? I don't know if SE4 will be able to copy exactly how these weapons behave, but it can be close and give the Tholians a unique way of fighting.

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Kwok, the old site layout looked a lot better than this new one.....

[ January 30, 2003, 09:23: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Why is that?

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Because the old one looked better, that's why.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Specifically?

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What do you want? It is not something like "they are 2 pixels too large" or something objective like that. The old design just looked better overall.

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Must be the purple... wait, Fyron's avatar is purple... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif
No, I know, it's the linkbar on the top instead of on the side where linkbars normally go!

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I think it was the particular tone of purple... it clashes http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif with Fyron's purple.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

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I like the color. Keep it.

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i like the new forum layout too.
is it me or did the progress indicator go from 80% done to 60% done?

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Yes it did since the addition of new races and merging the files added some extra work. It should get back up there soon! In fact, I'd say it's already at 70%!

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Ha, ok, it's just that i'm quite excited to play this mod once it's out. I think it adds something extra if you play startrek races because they are "familiar".
It adds to the athmosphere of the game.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Technically, the discussion was about the site layout, not the forum layout. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

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Kwok, please check your Private Messages. Thanks.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Smart*ss http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
You are right off course. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

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is it just me or did the progress indicater just go down again

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">It didn't! It was suppossed to be at 60% but I had forgot to upload the appropriate graphic, so the 80% bar was there but said '60% Complete'. I have sinced fixed that.

Good News:

Atrocities is at home again and doing better, so that means that things should start to pick up a bit (well, in a week or so really since I'm being detained by 'academic' demands). We have connected a few times and made some decisions.

Re: Neutrals

We are planning on about 10 neutral races that are somewhat customized. Major ships for neutral races fall between 100-500kT in size, unlike regular SE:IV where they can build all sizes. After all, you don't expect the Bajorans to be building Dreadnoughts do you? This also means that the neutrals will get some custom ship images rather than generic ones, which adds to the diversity. At this time, no neutrals have custom techs, but who knows what we might be adding in the future.

One other thing - there is a problem with SE:IV. For example, the mod has 10 major races. When you select high AI races, you get duplicate AIs regardless of the max specified in settings.txt - is this a bug and is there a way around it? So far, the only way around this is to have at least 20 AI races...

[ February 05, 2003, 03:42: Message edited by: Captain Kwok ]

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

Set the game to use fewer races with High numbers in Settings.txt. If you have 10 races, make the max races for a high number of races be 10. Be warned: the game will only add up to 5 neutral races randomly. You can manually add more with empire files, but the random process will add only 5.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Did you not read my post?

Setting high AIs to say, 10, in settings.txt does not eliminate the choosing of duplicate AI empires by the game, although it does work in that it chooses only 10 AI empires.

[ February 05, 2003, 04:33: Message edited by: Captain Kwok ]

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

Here are the neutral races for the Star Trek Mod:

Bajorans
Gorn
Hirogen
Kazon
Krenim
Nausicaans
Pakled
Son'a
Talarians
Yridians

Neutral races will have access to the generic technology tree and will employ ship sizes between 100-500kT. I'll probably create an information page for them next week.

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No!!!!!
Not the Pakled, I want them to be a primary race!

"We like things that make us go... Geordie, will you make us go??"

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I know you probably have a warp drive model already, but I thought you might be interested in this idea...

Model warp drives as components that have warp-opening and warp-closing ability of various (but short) distances - the more advanced the drive, the longer the distance. Stipulate that games should (but not necessarily must) begin with no warp points. (Or maybe that can be put into QuadrantTypes.txt... set max. warp points per system to zero...) Then a ship can go to warp by creating a warp point, and other ships can "ride the quantum slipstream" by following the warp point, unless the ship immediately closes the warp point once on the other side. Regular intrasystem travel would then be handled by impulse drives, and maneuvering thrusters would provide extra combat movement (with the Afterburner ability).

Just an idea... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

Ed Kolis:

Unfortunately there are lots of little problems with using a system like that, including warp point limits, simultaneous turn problems, AIs wouldn't be able to use the system as intended. I had considered a system like this before, but it just wouldn't work like you would you hope http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif !

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

AIs are very good at opening warp points in Not Connect games. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

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If your interested in seeing the new Ferengi, just click HERE and away you will go.

I don't know if Kwok is going to use them or not for the Star Trek mod.

Feed back on the set is welcome, but for the most part, they is finished!

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Nice set!

The font on that page for the names of each vehicle size is black, and so unreadable without highlighting.

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Hey Atrocities, great set man! But.... I just don't understand peoples facination with Ferengi. Ya, they are neat to include in SE4, but I think they should not be considered more then a Neutral race. Ya, they are an empire, but I think only an Economic Empire, not a Military Empire. They could have fantastic Money capabilites but limited as a Neutral race. Just my opinion.

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If you check out maps of the Star Trek universe, the Ferengi do get a little big chunk of space and it gives the players the option of playing something other than war monger.

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Ferengi warships are not to be overestimated. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You mean underestimated? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

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The set looks great. One thing i noticed was that you made transport ships. I always thought that all ferengi ships serve as armed freighters. I dunno, but maybe we could set it up so that they don't get normal freighters but all their ships have to have a cargo component. And since they are so obsessed with trade maybe give them a special cargo component that is a little better than the normal one (smaller, holds more or both) just a thought, but lets see what everyone else thinks.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You mean underestimated? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I meant what I said. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: *** Star Trek Mod Discussion ***
 

Agreed! Overestimated! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Ya, I think etheir a certain portion of their ships are cargo capability or they are a neutral race. I just can't see them as a military threat in the universe. Just an economic threat.

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Anyways...

It is obvious that Ferengi ships are smaller and their weapons less effective than the other races, so it would not be wise to be militarily aggressive.

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">As far are Star Charts is conserned, which is considered cannon, the Ferengi Alliance is about the size of Talar space, Badlands, or many other smaller civs, consisting of a homeworld and about a dozen colonies. I would compare them to organized crime, lots of cash, well armed, but not a serious threat to national governments.

With that said, not sure they should be a Neural Race as Ferengi ships can be found throughout local space and neurals cannot leave their system. More appropriatly would be having a very high cost of colony modules so that there growth is much slower than the big powers.

FYI, Bajor seems to have as many colonies as the Ferengi! Does that make them a colonial power?

This raises and interesting point? Maybe races such as the Ferengi, Gorn, Tzenjethi Coalition, Talarians and others could Minor Powers; races that have the ability to colonies outside their home systems but have a very high cost for colonization modules to limit their growth?

Just thinking out loud...

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Fixed.

Magnum 357, good to see you posting again. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I think, just my opinion, that the Ferengi were protrayed as a weak empire and there really is not much information to counter this. However, it was established that they do have a military branch, all be it, one that is based upon trade and protecting trade routes.

BOTF established the Ferengi as a empire, and I think, and perhaps Kwok my agree, that this is why they have been considered by all, (Warp_nine, myself, and Kwok) as a ligitimate power.

But whether or not Kwok wants to include them is really up to him. I will support whatever decision he makes, but I would like to see them as a major race, but could live with them as a minor one.

I think they have a lot to offer as a major race, they are strong traders, merchants and exploiters. What better reason to have a large military than to protect your assets?

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<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I like the idea of having these as minor powers. Doesn't confine them to their home systems but they could still pose a threat if left alone long enough.

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They are either an empire, or a neutral empire. There is no inbetween, except for scenarios. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

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The Ferengi Alliance will remain a major race which might be a slight exaggeration of their actual canon presence, but it allows players to take different roles in a game. The Ferengi will rely more on their economic abilities than military might.

I want to stay away from separate colony modules.

As you may have noticed, I've been kidnapped by schoLastic demands the Last couple of weeks, but I'm hoping to hook up with Atrocities this weekend to finalize the new components and facilities in the mod, so we can get back to the data files and put this monster out.

We'll also try to work out a schedule and stick to it, I know that its been so long already!

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I am working on modifying ship sets for the races that the mod will be using. (That is to say, the races that use New Age Ship Yard sets.) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I would also like to display my newest creation.

Click HERE to take a look. I kinda doubt that any of Cardassian ships I am now making will be in this mod, but if they are, they will be exclusive to this mod as will be the Ferengi.

CNC likes the old sets. I like them too, and am glad that he is going to stick to using them for his AST mod.

Kwok has done a fantastic job with this mod, and it should be noted that his dedication is paying off in spades. The sheer volume of work that he has done is mind boggling. It is no easy task to make even a simple mod, so it goes without saying that the time Kwok has put into the ST mod has been considerable. Kwok has spent a lot of time on detail and quality. He has planned it out so well that there really is not much for me to help him with.

It blows me away at what he has done, and I am sincerely amazed both by the mod, and by Kwoks efforts to make this mod "the" Star Trek mod for all SEIV Players.

The interest people have shown for this mod clearly proves the value of Kwoks work.

Thanks Kwok for going the extra mile for this mod. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ February 11, 2003, 14:56: Message edited by: Atrocities ]

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Geez Atrocities http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif I surely don't deserve all those accolades!

Perhaps when the mod emerges from Kodos status and is playable we can take about praise! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

No, I'm just glad that I can tap in your enthusiasm for this project. It's fun!

I really like the cardassian ship. I'll let you in on my ideas for other designs, but that is a great start!

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Atrocities

The new Cardassian ship rocks! Much better than the rips from BOTF that are floating around.

Capt-Kwok

Fair enough on the Ferengi. I'd hate to suggest something that would delay the mod http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif