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-   -   Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41 (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=42022)

Burnsaber April 28th, 2009 06:02 AM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DonCorazon (Post 688228)
I like that idea. It would be cool and maybe help balance things if it specified a region of provinces where it might be found.

"A merchant arrives with tales that a mystical portal called the Ultimate Gateway has been found. His tales indicate it could lie in X, Y. or Z province."

That would be nice. But it cannot be done (nor can anything like that, actually) with the current modding tools. One can always dream..

But since we are talking about MP here, you could just devise a new rule on the games one hosts.

Quote:

"If a player finds a magical site [X, Y, Z] he must immediately send a message (using the in-game messaging system) to all other players about the finding and the province number where the site lies."
It's pretty easy to cheat out of this, but it can be pretty easily checked after the game if the guy actually had left a "I win!" site unannounced.

Illuminated One April 28th, 2009 05:06 PM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
Hmm, I like the idea, really.
Maybe when I have time (and it can be added to llamaserver) I could make an external tool that does this.

llamabeast April 28th, 2009 06:14 PM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
Sounds like a good idea to me Burn.

chrispedersen April 28th, 2009 08:51 PM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
Hrm. p3e or pyg could actually probably code this; the guy that did the msg checker.

All you would have to do is check compile a list of unique sites and search the turn file for them. If found modify the turn file to include a message to everyone saying "Player Y has found Site X yada yada yada".

.*all*.

Burnsaber April 28th, 2009 11:12 PM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
OK, yesterday I did a list of problematic sites. There's 19 of them, and most of them are rare + unique. Steel ovens and Mount Chining are uncommon, thought. I used the following criteria (thanks to archaeo in the dom3 IrC channel)

alt and const: max 0%
conj and blood: max 20%
others: 30%

Code:

id#        name        era        frq        mask        lvl        type        F        A        W        E        S        D        N        B        gold        res        sup        unr        exp        lab        fort        runit1                conj        alter        evo        const        ench        thau        blood
474        Ancient Forge                2        735        1        Earth                                1                                                                                EPÄTOSI                                                        20%                       
481        Banefire Forge                2        735        1        Death        1                                        1                                                                EPÄTOSI                                                        20%                       
475        Chamber of Changes                2        735        1        Earth                                1                                                                                EPÄTOSI                                        20%                                       
477        Conjurer's Cave                2        516        3        Earth                                1                                                                                EPÄTOSI                                30%                                               
482        Crown of Darkness                2        16388        4        Death                                                3                                                                EPÄTOSI                                                                        40%       
466        Gorge of Mystery                2        256        2        Astral                                        1                                                                        EPÄTOSI                                        20%                                       
397        Mount Chaining                1        16607        1        Blood                                                                                                                EPÄTOSI                                                                                40%
520        Oak of Ages                2        16607        3        Nature                                                                                                                EPÄTOSI                                                                50%               
637        Pool of Unhealthy Rites                2        223        2        Blood                        1                        1                                                                                                        20%                                       
395        Summoning Circle                2        223        3        Blood                                                                                                                EPÄTOSI                                                                                60%
471        Temple of the Turning Tide                2        223        1        Water                        1                                                                                        EPÄTOSI                529        Sea Father                20%                                       
696        The Basalt Forge                2        16640        2        Earth                                1                                                                                                                                        20%                       
495        The Blood Rock                2        16388        3        Blood                                                                                                                EPÄTOSI                                                                                30%
401        The Ebony Circle                2        16607        2        Blood                                        1        3                                                                TOSI                339        Sorcerer        30%                                               
313        The Ultimate Gateway                2        17119        3        Astral                                                                                                                EPÄTOSI                                50%                                               
173        The Steel Ovens                1        17119        0        Fire                                                                                75                                EPÄTOSI                                                        20%                       
455        The Water Solstice                2        16416        2        Astral                        4                2                                                                        EPÄTOSI                                                                50%               
484        Twisting Woods                2        2        1        Nature                                                        1                                                        EPÄTOSI                                        20%                                       
305        Village of Strange Men                2        223        1        Astral                                        1                                                                        EPÄTOSI                                        20%

I admit, it's pretty hard to read. But anyone out there is doing such a program, he can pick the names from there.

lch April 29th, 2009 02:15 AM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by chrispedersen (Post 688378)
Hrm. p3e or pyg could actually probably code this; the guy that did the msg checker.

That was Illuminated One, who already posted above.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chrispedersen (Post 688378)
If found modify the turn file to include a message to everyone saying "Player Y has found Site X yada yada yada"

That's nothing else than hacking the turn files. It would require breaking through the game's safety measures. A program that just reads the turn files and finds out if a nation found a new site that hasn't been uncovered before, then allows to prepare a MOTD on a website or an email to all, would be quite a feat.

Wrana April 29th, 2009 08:31 PM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
An idea of such sites being announced to all players is good. Of course, it will require cooperation from those who find them. In this case, it's a pity that the current patch doesn't allow sites to be seen by scouts/scrying. Of course, this also goes beyond the mod scope...
As for unique recruits idea, I don't think it has any feasibility. By the time such sites are found and become useful, one more SC just isn't going to cut it. He will be much more useful if site is found at early game, but it probably won't be found at this time. "Lots of gold and resources" probably fall into the same category - they are useful at start, but not so much at lategame, while discount sites are other way around.

llamabeast April 30th, 2009 04:35 AM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
With lch's help, it looks possible that such a feature could be included in the llamaserver. That won't be for a couple of months though.

Burnsaber April 30th, 2009 11:36 AM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by llamabeast (Post 688595)
With lch's help, it looks possible that such a feature could be included in the llamaserver. That won't be for a couple of months though.

Sweeet.

That's pretty much the best fix. It takes away the most problematic aspect of these sites, the secrecy. Now their power has price.

You found Sacrificial Circle? Congratulations, you can use it to attain great power. Just be prepared to defend it. At least the player who finds the site has two turns to reinforce his defenses.

May I also suggest to make the post to other players pretty epic. I was thinking something along the line of the Dire Portent messages when someone casts a global. Different one for each site would be perfect, me thinks, but could be a lot of work. If there's need for it, I could take a shot at writing these messages (there probably are better writers out there, thought).

In the mean time, I made a mod to eliminate the 19 problematic sites (DBS = Disable Bonus Sites). I've set them to rarity = 5, so that they cannot be randomly generated, only placed by map and mod commands.

Wrana May 1st, 2009 03:11 PM

Re: Conceptual Balance Mod 1.41
 
Agree - that would be the best way.


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