Re: Fuel and Range
 

Yeah, i noticed this as well. While faster engines add more speed to ships, they dont decrease the fuel usage, actually INCREASING the usage per turn, quickly depleting ships, even using best ram scoops. I suggest to decrease the warpcores supply usage by 10-15 per level

Re: Fuel and Range
 

Rag-X, this was one item I wanted to bring up when/if we were going to have a chat about the mod as per SE.net discussions. It's fairly easy to solve by just decreasing supply usage a tad on the higher level nacelles, or by giving more advanced warp cores a bigger boost in supply storage.

Re: Fuel and Range
 

I will be on #spaceempires later this afternoon, say around 3 PST if nothing comes up.

My goal is to make the STM a polished as possible. So any critizism are welcome along with suggestions and ways to fix things. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I'd like to get it right once and for all. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Fuel and Range
 

I got to thinking about this and I think that more fuel usage for more speed makes sense. In Star Trek ships had a maximum speed and a cruising speed. They couldn't maintain maximum warp for too long because it would deplete their dilithium crystals but they could go slower and have more range. So the way the mod has things set up seems to be true to Trek. The problem comes from the game's mechanics, ships are always moving at their maximum speed and burning supplies faster than they can generate them. Maybe adding supply generation to the warp cores (which is what powers almost everything on a Trek ship) would be a possible solution. Also, before changing anything the question should be asked, do we want ships with unlimited range?

Re: Fuel and Range
 

What is really needed is a bit of range shortening on the early tech ships and longer range on the more advanced ships.

Re: Fuel and Range
 

That could easily be accomplished by reducing the supply storage of the early warp cores and the amount of supplies generated by bussard collectors.

Re: Fuel and Range
 

I have modded the Ram Scoops to 4 per ship instead of two and that solved the cruising problem. Range is still limited (i.e. you still have to stop to resupply) and supplies are used rapidly when attacking, so if you go on raid runs, you still have to stop to resupply, but a lone explorer can travel much further without resupplying.

Re: Fuel and Range
 

Remember that there is now also a Resupply component that works with the resupply ship to generate supplies for the fleet. There is no limit to how many of those ships you can build and fleet.

Re: Fuel and Range
 

In star trek, an ship with full matter and antimatter stores can on average fly around for about 3 years. Perhaps antimatter tanks could hold supply? Ramscooms would generate supplies.

Re: Fuel and Range
 

An Update:

I am gathering a list of things that need to be done for the next version. I have been lucky enough that a few folks have stepped up and pointed out some really glaring problems with the mod and are willing to help me correct them. Thanks guys.

We are also discussing the mod over on its offical forum.

Please come by and make some posts. SE.nets forus are full of very good info about modding and such.

I have an updated list of things that need to be done for the next version at SE.net. Just follow the above link.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

PLEASE KEEP IN MIND THAT:

The Star Trek Mod is a mod of SPACE EMPIRES IV therefore it must follow the physics of this game. The Star Trek Mod is not a STAND ALONE GAME. It is limited to the physics and restrictions of SE IV, thereby many elements of the mod that would be considered as Star Trek Cannon, cannot apply. IE true warp drive, ship sizes, weapons, and star trek acting AI. Albeit I have tried, with the help of many fine people, to simulate as well as we can, a true star trek environment for our game play pleasure.

Re: Fuel and Range
 

Here is my new proposed Supply Useage / Generation Model for
the mod based upon an earlier post that outlined the problem
very well.


<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>
Level = Tech level
Move = Movement bonus
Uses = Amount of supplies used per move
NacT x2 = Nacelle Total Times 2 (Because two warp nacelles are required.)
NacT = Nacelle Total
CombT = Combined Total of Warp Core and Nacelle supply useage per move.
Speed = How many moves total
PerTurn = Total Supply useage per turn mulitplied by speed and CombT.
Store = How much supplies each warp core stores.
Dist = Distance in squars
Max = Maximum components allowed
Gen = Supply Generation per turn
TPT = Total Per Turn
</pre><hr />

Current Model
<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>
Warp Nacelle
Level Move Uses NacT X2

I 1st 40 80
II 2st 40 80
III 3st 40 80
IV 4st 40 80
V 5st 40 80</pre><hr />


<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>Warp Core
Level Move Uses NacT CombT Speed PerTurn Store
I 1b 20 80 100 2 200 700
II 1b 20 80 100 3 300 800
III 2b 30 80 110 4 440 850
IV 2b 40 80 120 5 520 900
V 3b 50 80 130 6 780 1000
VI 3b 40 80 120 6 720 1050
VII 4b 30 80 110 8 880 1100
VIII 4b 30 80 110 8 880 1150
IX 5b 20 80 100 10 1000 1200
X 5b 20 80 100 10 1000 1300

I 6b 20 80 100 11 1100 1400
II 7b 20 80 100 12 1200 1450
III 8b 20 80 100 13 1300 1500</pre><hr />

What I propose is to change the amount of supplies each WC can store:

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>Warp Core
Level Move Uses NacT CombT Speed PerTurn Store Dist**
I 1b 20 80 100 2 200 600 6
II 1b 20 80 100 3 300 900 9
III 2b 30 80 110 4 440 1320 12
IV 2b 40 80 120 5 520 1560 15
V 3b 50 80 130 6 780 2340 18
VI 3b 40 80 120 6 720 2160 18
VII 4b 30 80 110 8 880 2640 24
VIII 4b 30 80 110 8 880 3520 24
IX 5b 20 80 100 10 1000 4000 30
X 5b 20 80 100 10 1000 5000 30

I 6b 20 80 100 11 1100 5500 33
II 7b 20 80 100 12 1200 6000 36
III 8b 20 80 100 13 1300 6500 39</pre><hr />

** (Estimated based on no supply generation)
The proposed changes to the supply use / generation system would be that each ship would have 3 full turns of supplies and the ability to generate about 3/5th of there needed supplies each turn giving a slight bonus to the lower warp cores to help the AI out. So if a ship keeps moving it will run its supplies down eventually, but pausing for a turn or two will rengerate supplies.

Bussard Collectors and Ram scoops currently contribute the following amount of supplies per turn.

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>
Bussard Collectors
Level Max Gen TPT
I 4 50 200
II 4 60 240
III 4 70 280

Ram Scoop I
Level Max Gen TPT
I 2 140 280
II 2 160 320
III 2 180 360</pre><hr />

Proposed changes to Bussard Collectors and Ram Scoops.
1. Change tech requirement to Warp Core - Supply Tech will be tied into Warp Core
2. Change the supply generation per turn.
3. Added a Level IV and X to Bussard Collectors
4. Increase Ram Scoop Max from 2 to 4
5. Or Consider Making Ram Scoop a seperate component that can combine with Bussard Collectors.
6. Or Consider Adding a MOUNT - Name it the Ram Scoop Mount - and remove the components Ram Scoop.

<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>
Bussard Collectors (For the Purpose of this model Ram Scoop Is figured In and Out)
Level Max Gen TPT Warp Tech Lev
I 4 40 180 I - Beginning Tech
II 4 70 280 Warp Technology II
III 4 90 360 Warp Technology III
IV 4 115 460 Warp Technology IV
V 4 160 640 Warp Technology V - VI

Proposed New Levels (Not using Ram Scoop)
VI 4 180 720 Warp Technology VII - VIII
VII 4 195 780 Warp Technology IX - X
VIII 4 250 1000 Adv Warp Technology I
IX 4 260 1040 Adv Warp Technology II
X 4 280 1120 Adv Warp Technology III

Ram Scoop (Max increased to 4 - USING Ram Scoop and not Proposed new levels above)
Level Max Gen TPT
I 4 195 780 Warp Technology IX - X
II 4 230 1040 Adv Warp Technology II
III 4 280 1220 Adv Warp Technology III
</pre><hr />

The Ram Scoop Mount - Could simply just be used to give a 2x supply bonus for all levels and we would simply make the Max for all Bussard Collectors 2 instead of 4 because with the Mount they would be mulitplied 2x = 4 any ways.

Also we could reverse the names making the Ram Scoop the Bussard Collector. Sounds better to me.

What are your thoughts?

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Don't tell me people have been complaining that the mod isn't "canon" again?!? That's just sad.

As for the proposed change of names (making the Ram Scoop the Bussard Collector) sounds good to me.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Add fuel tanks!

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

AT, I think you're working too hard. As I stated in my previous post, changing the Ram Scoop to max 4 per ship worked perfectly and that's it. No other work required. With this, the player can make some ships with 4, some with 3, some with 2, etc. making a conscious design decision to travel far or fight well. Nuff Said?

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

The early tech limits are too low. With a range of only six, a vessel might not even be able to leave the home system without running out of gas.

If the player builds a colony ship on turn 1, it becomes available on turn three. That ship should be able to reach at least a neighboring sector and colonize without failing, a range of about twelve average. Building an explorer on turn one should result in a ship that can do some exploring.

With a storage capacity of three turns, a ship's fuel radius is one and a half turns from a resupply center.
It is the refill rate that determines what speed a ship can travel. The ships travel until out of gas, and then run at their maximum refill rate. This can also be done by stopping to refill, and then running at full speed, but it amounts to the same velocity.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

The range is extend by the use of supply generation components. The loss is only 20 per move so they should have a good range.

To the other post above:
I have been working on this mod for nearly three years now and I have to tell you that it is completely differnt than it was when I started. Given by the amount of downloads this mod has had, and the emails I get, the mod is somewhat popular at the moment. I do get some negative emails, mostly people complaining that the mod is NOT star trek enough. Well no duh, its a mod of Space Empires and not a mod of a star trek game. Believe me when I say that I have grown very inpatient with those kind of emails. It seems that no matter how much I tell people, someone always seems to not get the message. So I have taken a few steps to ENLIGHTEN people about the fundamental basics that govern this, and indeed, any mod.

I get the occational "what in the hell were you thinking email" and again, I just have to say that I was not. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Seriously, when I started modding I knew nothing, I still don't but I am learning. Thanks mainly to people like Rollo, Fyron, Aiken, SJ, Kwok, and many many many more the mod has endure and improved over the last couple of years. Even though I might get discussed with some of the email I get, for the most part, 99% of them are very positive and helpful. I guess that you just cannot please all of the people all of the time. But I try. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

I have not yet tested the new model but I am confident that it will work well. If not I will give the Colony Modules more supply storage to compensate. I want a colony ship to be able to move between 15 and 20 squares with no resupply generation. More with it.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

You could always add supply storage to the colony module itself.

By the way, Atrocities you do a great job on the mod, don't let a few nitpickers get you down.

EDIT oops, I should type faster, you beat me to the idea.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Thanks DH. I like nitpickers though; they help to make the mod more fun. It’s the folks that just don't understand the basics behind the limitations of modding space empires IV that drive me insane. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Those folks just don't listen no matter how many times you tell them something.


The following are expepts from many emails over the last few weeks. (Not direct quotes - I deleted the messages to save disk space.)

"In star trek there are no warp points. Why are there warp points in your mod?"

The star trek mod is a MOD of space empires IV therefore it is limited by the physics of the game. Space empires IV has warp point so we have them in the mod.

"I fail to understand why you simply do not mod out the warp points."

I see that you do not understand what I mean. Space Empires is set up, by that I mean it is hard coded, to use warp points therefore any mod made for the game is stuck with warp points. I cannot mod around this.

"Well in star trek there are no warp points, they use warp engines and I will tell you that your warp engines work nothing like they should. (Enclosed is a warp core speed model and technical break down)"

Thank you for the information. Again I understand that Star Trek does not use warp points, however as I have stated before I am limited by the physics of the game. As for the warp drive system, again we are limited by the physics of the game and have tried to emulate as well as we can, a warp drive propulsion system. If you like, you can read the back-story for the mod. (Link)

"Well I just don't understand why you just don't do away with the warp points. They are not in star trek. As for your back-story I will have you know that Data died and O'Brian went back to earth to be a teacher. Therefore you story does not match the establish facts of Star Trek."

Thanks for the email again Tommy, as I have repeatedly tried to explain to you warp points are hard coded into the game and cannot be modded out or around. We are stuck with them because that is how Aaron Hall has set the game up. It is his game and therefore his rules. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif As for the back-story, you will note that I stated that Data was the duplicate version from Nemesis. As for O'Brian, the story takes place long after the events in DS9 final episode took place. Please read again I believe I may have explained this in the story.

"Your federation star ships do not look like federation star ships. I have never seen some of these Romulan ships you use and I would enjoy knowing where you got the specs for the Vulcan, Vaadwaur, Son's, Orion, Gorn, Kazon, Hirogen, and Andorian ships. I cannot find any of the ships you have in any Star Fleet records or documentations. Additionally I would like to point out that your warp drive system does not properly reflect how a warp drive system should work. Again the warp points in your mod need to be removed and a true star trek propulsion system should be adopted."

The ships are my own models. I wanted to have full control over there use. I could not have full control over the use of other people’s models so I made my own. As for the ship designs I used for the races you listed, well I just made them up. I attempted to make them as true to forum as I could, but without having anything to base designs on, I opted to go with some creative license. I will not get into the warp point or drive discussion again. I have explained this to you many times now.

"I compared your federation models to the ships in star fleet command and Armada, and they do not look anything like them. As to the warp drive and warp point discussion you have not yet told me why you will not adopt a true star trek type of propulsion and do away with warp points."

Thanks for your emails. If you have any more comments please post them on the forum. I am not going to have the time to respond to any more of your emails.

(He sent a few more) - Note: Tommy I have tried to explain things to you, you have not posted on the forum so the loss is yours.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

I admire your patience for even replying to someone like that more than once, twice at the most.

Some people just... don't... get... it...

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

You should have been here for the great debate over the Gorn ship set. Man that was a surprise. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

O'goody...Gorns...lets see there are at least 4 different styles of shipsets one could even possibly consider...Oh..sorry...we don't want to rehash that huh... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Kana

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

AT has already addressed this but I'd like to add, even if a ship runs out of supplies during movement all it has to do is sit still for a few turns and recharge. I think it's a good system.

One thing I'd like to bring up though, IMO Advanced Power Conservation is too cheap considering what it can do for you in this mod. I'd humbly suggest increasing its cost to 1500 racial points.

Edit: AngleWyrm_2, I apologize, I obviously didn't read your entire post and just repeated part of what you had already said. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

heh, I tend to post too fast sometimes also; that's ok. The thought gets covered, even if redundantly.

There is a problem with making exceptions for designer-specified ships: Exploration will have to be conducted by colonizer ships. Players will no longer be able to use Explorer class ships to explore, because Colonizers do the job better. It would make more sense to leave propulsion mechanics to the propulsion equipment, rather than designing exceptions into the system.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

I made a spreadsheet that counts how many guns will fit on each kind of ship in the game. It takes into account bridge, life support, quarters, warp cores, nacelles, number of engines reqired, and propulsion mounts.

It gives a good idea of what kind of firepower a ship can bring to bear, for every model in the game, a basis for comparison.

Link: ship stats spreadsheet

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Congratulations, you've officially entered the ranks of Those Who Are Obsessed With SEIV. [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/icon09.gif[/img] http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Well this is impressive to say the least. I have to agree with Narf, welcome to the club. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

A follow up. Man how long did it take you to enter all that data? I am not sure how to put this info to best use, but thanks anyways for providing it. Thank you again http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

It took a solid day of coding to get Visual Basic to read VehicleSize.txt and load it into a spreadsheet. Check out the SEIV module in Tools-&gt;Macro-&gt;VisualBasicEditor.

If you put the spreadsheet into any mod data folder and then execute the RefreshData macro, it will read in from that mod. Might not apply though, because of other STM stuff, like engine mounts. It can be refreshed after any edits to VehicleSize.txt, and stay current.

It still needs a bunch of work; I've been working on getting Effective Tech Level in, that takes into account the different racial tech costs. Might take a while on that though.

One useful bit of debugging that came up is that it appears like the Warrior trait is in need of some editing. They start the game with Heavy Destroyer technology, when everyone else has only Escorts and Scouts. The warrior tech also requires a player to climb two expensive hull-tech trees in order to get the extra hull sizes, which is WAY expensive.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

The Warrior Trait is best left to the AI in order to give it an edge. It's so powerful I even banned it from the Power Game! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Nodachi is correct. The warrior trait was intended exclusively for single player and AI use. It SHOULD NEVER be used in a PBW game. Not only does it give to many game tilting bonuses.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Proposed new supply useage / generation model. (Subject to change)

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

I'll have to see it for real to know wether or not it works, so I suggest you make a beta with it and We'll play trough a game, we'll know it quite quickly then.

But it looks good on paper(screen)

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

What we seem to have going on here is Maximum Speed and Cruising Speed! Allow me to illustrate:

Maximum speed is the maximum number of squares a ship can travel in one turn, based on the Warp Core, Nacelles, Emergency Propulsion, Solar Sails, etc. Fuel storage technologies determine the number of turns over which Maximum speed can be maintained.

Cruising speed is the maximum sustainable rate of travel; how many squares a ship can travel in a thousand turns, divided by a thousand turns. Fuel replenishment technologies are the main ingredient of cruising speed. The Bussard Collectors, Ram Scoops, and Replicators add up to how fast fuel flows into the system, and therefore the maximum sustainable output.

If the Warp Cores were to generate supply units, rather than burn them, it would be possible to scale the cruising speed with Warp Core technology, as well as the operating time at max warp.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

What I am thinking about doing is giving the ships enough supplies to run three full turns worth of movement each, and re-adjusting the "Ram Scoop" - replaces the name Bussard Collector - to use 2 max components, but combined they generate 1/2 of a ships supply needs every turn. This would reduce a ships range over time, but also over time resupply the ship. The problem is balance. So I am testing it now.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Upping the storage limits can do that; the ships will then be able to maintain maximum warp for three turns, or fly at a slower speed for longer. Note that because ships generate their own fuel, they will always be able to travel indefinitely at slower speeds. It's the same thing as taking a quick run and pausing, or taking the trip slow and steady. If you remove all fuel-generating ship technology from the game, then it would be possible to enforce a radius of operations on ships.

Here is a balanced scenario, that would make the short runs at max warp an interesting design choice, as well as a strategy: Have the core generate supplies which, when added to two scoops produce a sustainable cruise speed listed under CruiseWarp:
<font class="small">Code:</font><hr /><pre>TL MaxWarp MaxUse Core Scoop C+2S CruiseWarp
I 2 200 50 25 100 1.0
II 3 300 100 25 150 1.5
III 4 400 130 35 200 2.0
IV 5 500 150 45 240 2.4
V 6 600 200 50 300 3.0
VI 6 600 220 50 320 3.2
VII 8 800 260 70 400 4.0
VIII 8 800 260 70 400 4.0
IX 10 1000 340 80 500 5.0
X 10 1000 340 80 500 5.0
XI 11 1100 360 90 540 5.4
XII 12 1200 400 100 600 6.0
XIII 13 1300 500 100 700 7.0
</pre><hr />
If you allow a player to add as many ram scoops/bussard collectors/replicators to their ship as they want, players can get ships with sustainable max warp...for a price. It takes eight scoops of the appropriate tech, plus the warp core, to support max warp. If scoop tech is set to 10kT, then the result is the player has some interesting choices.

The figures above are balanced so that if the player adds two scoops, they will receive enough supplies to maintain cruising speeds listed (or stop to refuel between rabbit-runs at max warp.) If the player chooses to spend their hull space on additional scoop/replicator/collector tech, then they can usefully add up to eight of them to contribute towards a higher sustainable speed. Adding more will gather supplies towards fuelling weaponry between fights. But of course all those fuel generators cost space, so the result is less room for weaponry...

On another note, warp-9 and warp-7 are speeds that don't exist in the current core/nacelle configuration.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

I like this. It makes good sense. If I read this correctly your suggesting that I add supply generation to the WC? I am resistant to do that.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

You could also add maintenance penalties to the supply generation components, which would make the faster ships more expensive, in a cumulative fashion. Makes sense to me, although I'm insane.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

There's a sleight problem with relying on 2xScoop tech to provide all supplies for a ship: the scoops provide too large a percentage of the speed. If the player were to add just one more scoop/replicator/collector, then all of a sudden the ship can run at or near max warp indefinitely. So the choice is removed, and the player has nothing to do. But if a significant chunk of the ship's supply generation is separated from scoops (like about half), then it is possible to let players buy as many scoops as they feel they can afford, filling up hull space that would have been guns, looking for a perfect mission balance. It then makes sense to have unarmed deep-space explorers, and slower heavily armed combat vessels. They would still have the same top speed for three-turn durations, but they would have some cost trade-offs about how fast they can cruise on longer missions, and isn't that what the ship design screen is for?

I also like the idea of high maintenance penalties for supply generating componants; it simulates a conversion of resources into supplies. Also, it will effectively create a financial ceiling on fleet size, as a proportion of income. Large fleets of small ships will tend to be more expensive than small fleets of large ships, a reason to buy bigger ships, slower ships, and tankers.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Created a sample of componants.txt/techarea.txt that uses nine levels of ram-scoop/bussard collectors, warp cores that generate supplies, and nacelles that burn 50 each, so that it's easy to tell. 1 square = 100 supplies; no muss no fuss. (zip file attached).

So far it's workin fairly well. I created three klingon scouts, one with 2xScoops, 4xScoops, and 8xScoops. The 2x scout ran low on gas at the end of the third turn, but the 8x scout kept going strong...with it's three guns instead of six. Also tried the Feds; their Explorer could only hold one gun at max scoops and the Escourt could hold two. Rough trade, when faced with ships carrying five or six. As for the Cardassians and their weak-*** little scout ship, they can't load it with enough scoops to maintain max speed, let alone arm it too.

I didn't change the prices, even though I really like the idea, because I don't know what to shoot for on that. Definitely wanting scoops to be expensive maintenance-wise though, so that there is good motivation not to max them out every time on larger hulls.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

AngleWyrm_2, Great work! I like how this idea makes the game's balance better. My personal preference would be to make the scoops more expensive rather than add a maintainance penalty to them because the penalty would cause all the ship's components to be more expensive.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

The maintenance penalty would be consistent with the greater stresses the entire ship would suffer due to the higher sustained speeds. And it wouldn't make the ship any more expensive to produce, just make it's maintenance cost higher--which I think makes better sense than arbitrarily raising the initial costs of the ship.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Respectfully, I disagree. The majority of a ship would not be subjected to higher stresses, just its hull. With maintainance penalties put on these components a long range explorer could wind up costing more each turn than a medium range gunship. We need to keep in mind that a maintainance penalty will dramatically increase the cost of all ships and if a ship happens to use an expensive component even more so.

How about this, keep the two per ship limit on ram scoops and make them cheap (like they are now.) Make the bussard collectors an add-on component to increase a ships range and make them more expensive. That way a we still get the player to make the range vs. guns decision and the increased range (and sustained speed) costs more both intially and each turn with normal maintainance rules.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

What I did was abstract away the 'essentially free' element from ram scoops/bussard collectors. If there is a componant that ought to be included, and is so cheap (in space, research, money) that every ship will have it, it begins to approach irrelevant, and could just as well be assumed to be in the hull and save everyone a few mouse-clicks. It's mostly the position in hyperspace where one desires the game to reside; is it mostly interactive storytelling, mostly game playing, mostly role playing?

The warp core generates some supplies which helps to balance supply income along the history of the game as technology progresses. It also makes it possible to combine the latest warp core with older nacelles, and thereby make the computer fly ships at a slower speed, conserving gas.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

<font color="brown"> PLEASE READ THE "INSTALLATION" AND "BEFORE YOU PLAY" READ ME FILES BEFORE YOU EMAIL ME ASKING ME QUESTIONS </font>

These Question have been asked and answered more times than I can even begin to conceivabley count. They are answered in the INSTALLTION read me

1. USE MOUNTS to reduce the size of the warp nacelles and warp core.
2. PUT 4 Warp Nacelles on Colony Ships. If you read the abilities for the hulls it will tell if you need to add more nacelles.
3. GET THE LATEST versions of the Image Mod and install into your base Space Empires IV / Pictures folder in the correct folders
4. UPDATE YOUR COPY of Space Empires IV to version 1.91 to avoid errors.

I get a lot of emails about this and I have stated this information so many times now on this forum, in the mod documentation, other forums, via email, on the web site, and on chat that I am getting sick of repeating it. I am sure you all can understand why.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Click Attachment to see large image..... Sorry these are my curde star trek models.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Nothing post ignor.

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Nothing Post

Re: The Star Trek Mod - 1.9.1.2 Update Released
 

Did you make those AT? If so, not a bad start at all.