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-   -   Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not? (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=12001)

solops May 5th, 2004 02:47 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
Quote:

Originally posted by spoon:
Yes, the talisman is overpowered. However, it does not guarantee a win if you are playing with people who know about how overpowered it is. The "balancing factor" that has emerged amongst experienced players is to gang up against and wipe out anyone who chooses the Religious trait before they get the chance to weild the talisman effectively. So in a way, choosing religious can be more of a liability, which makes for a neat mechanic.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">How do you tell when someone has chosen "Religious"?

UseOfWeps May 5th, 2004 03:03 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
Once you've met a race in-game, you can click on their flag at the top left of one of their units or on the empire picture in the diplomacy screen, and one of the tabs lists what starting options that race has, eg advanced storage, religious, etc.

Baron Munchausen May 5th, 2004 04:55 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
Quote:

Originally posted by solops:
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Originally posted by spoon:
Yes, the talisman is overpowered. However, it does not guarantee a win if you are playing with people who know about how overpowered it is. The "balancing factor" that has emerged amongst experienced players is to gang up against and wipe out anyone who chooses the Religious trait before they get the chance to weild the talisman effectively. So in a way, choosing religious can be more of a liability, which makes for a neat mechanic.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">How do you tell when someone has chosen "Religious"? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The game is too simple in certain ways. One of them is that it tells you exactly what racial traits a given empire has as soon as you meet them. Stupid.

I hope things like this will be fixed in SE 5.

spoon May 5th, 2004 05:17 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
Quote:

Originally posted by Baron Munchausen:
...it tells you exactly what racial traits a given empire has as soon as you meet them.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Could you mod all the Advanced Traits so they have the same name, like "Secret Advanced Trait", so that when you meet an empire, you only know how many advanced traits they have, but not what they are? Or do duplicate names cause an error?

Spoo May 5th, 2004 05:30 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
Quote:

Or do duplicate names cause an error?
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">If they do, you can just add a differing number of spaces to the end.

Fyron May 5th, 2004 07:59 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
I think spaces at the end would show up, so you would want enough spaces to go past the 3rd line of display for the traits (which is only half a line, but you can still figure out what the traits are from the top halves of the names) for EVERY trait, then a random character after those spaces, as it will never be shown in-game.

The problem is that when you meet a race, most of their traits would be painfully obvious. How do you hide the fact that you use organic stuff on your ships? Or crystalline? Or the fact that you are deeply religious (your entire demeanor would give it away)? Some traits could be hidden, but most would be obvious, especially if you ever get to scan or visit a planet of theirs...

Spoo May 5th, 2004 08:10 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
Quote:

The problem is that when you meet a race, most of their traits would be painfully obvious. How do you hide the fact that you use organic stuff on your ships? Or crystalline? Or the fact that you are deeply religious (your entire demeanor would give it away)? Some traits could be hidden, but most would be obvious, especially if you ever get to scan or visit a planet of theirs...
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It might be obvious that a race is religious, but that doesn't guarantee (or even imply) that they have the technology to never miss. Of course in SE4, there's only one type of "religious".

I supose as a mod idea, you could split the racial techs up and have one "religious" that gives you the talisman, and "religious " that gives you the facilities, etc. Maybe also have a "religious " that gives you nothing and costs 0 points.

EDIT: Hey, I've been promoted! Better watch out, Fyron. I'm catching up http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

[ May 05, 2004, 19:13: Message edited by: Spoo ]

Fyron May 5th, 2004 08:11 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
Quote:

Of course in SE4, there's only one type of "religious".
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Not if you play Adamant Mod, where there are 7 types. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Quote:

I supose as a mod idea, you could split the racial techs up and have one "religious" that gives you the talisman, and "religious " that gives you the facilities, etc. Maybe also have a "religious " that gives you nothing and costs 0 points.
<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Way ahead of you. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif Psychic is also split into numerous subtraits.

[ May 05, 2004, 19:12: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Spoo May 5th, 2004 08:15 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
Such a fast reply! I didn't even have a chance to edit!

Looks like I should finally try out Adamant. One day I'll have free time http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif

Fyron May 5th, 2004 08:20 PM

Re: Religious Talisman - unbalancing or not?
 
I didn't have a whole lot to type. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

But getting back to the discussion at hand... it would indeed be good if you had an optional field in RacialTraits.txt that was "Hidden Trait := TRUE" which would hide the trait from being displayed to other races. I would not like to see all traits forcibly hidden, even with a global setting in Settings.txt. More choices are always good. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif


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