Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

no. boron had already claimed abysia, and i had posted that the game was full. odd_enuf, pls set your pretender on the mose page to anonymous (check the "that's not me" box and submit) so that i can delete it.

its not a good system to let positions be taken out of the thread. the page on mosehansen specifically says to come here to register. pretenders need not be uploaded until tomorrow.

krool_death, we are one over, so if you don't want to play that's ok, but otherwise stay in.

[ July 31, 2004, 00:11: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

double post

[ July 31, 2004, 00:10: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

thnx archaeolept
and thnx odd_enuf for setting it on anonymous .

i guess i was only 5-10 minutes earlier claiming abysia than you odd_enuf .
perhaps you even uploaded your pretender while i registered here first .
it is 2.45 am here i will be Online 15 more minutes if abysia isn't deleted then i will upload my pretender tomorrow morning . so in about 11-12 hours .


abysia was one of my first nations i tried and they are one of my 3 most liked races so far http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif
at the moment i have some insane ideas and am tensed how they turn out http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif .
further interesting will be if the no watchtower turns out as a slight handicap or as a blessing http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

thank you odd_enuf for goin anonymous.

kicked his pretender so you can upload at your leisure boron.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

my sweet http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif belkelel is up http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

lets see how i do so far i am content .
if i am still content with my pretenderddesign tomorrow morning this is a good sign http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Tauren, are you registered on mosehansen as "bite_me", because that's who seems to have the slot?

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

ok my pretender for Marignon is up

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'll have my pretender in sometime before tomorrow afternoonish, depending on what time zone. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Still working on my setup, since I haven't played Jotuns in ages.

(And 65 turns with luck 3 gave me a whopping one national hero, while I'm trying to find out who other than the goblin and the huge hag can show up.)

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I think that's it. Those are your two Jotun heroes. The goblin is less than impressive, but Angerboda is one of the best heroes out there.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

I think Sporsnjall exists only to balance out Angerboda by reducing the likelihood that she will show up. He's got to be just about the most useless hero out there.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

I RE-Uploaded my pretender because the Last one was a bit... bizzarely built.
Im still not to happy with my design...
And I still wonder wether just taking the slot again after designing the pretender is enough for it to be replaced :/

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">according to unitattributes.xls that 2 are jotuns only special heros .

hopefully you don't take niefelheim they are so scary . guess i would have taken jotun if i would have been fast enough myself in this game http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif
with my abysia i have a very simple minded strat now i am tensed how it turns out http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Bleh, after a bit of expirimentation with SP I realized that the concept of my pretender was (yet again) bad, I think Im on to a winning pretender now though, I'll create a new one (yet again) and upload it (yet again) in a couple of minutes.
Just for common knowledge...
Oh, and I got stung by a jelly fish (a very little sting, but it BURNS), just some more common knowledge... :\

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'm not sure. did the MD5 checksum change?

to be safe, if you disown the slot (go anonymous) I could kick you, and then you could re-upload.

also, Panther or Tauren, could you tell me whether "Bite_Me" who is occupying the Mictlan slot is Tauren or not?

edit: i see from another game that Tauren is most likely the same person as bite_me. ok, then.

[ July 31, 2004, 15:16: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yes

guess i should have regestered in mosehansen with the same sn to avoid confusion, but at the time i made it i didnt know the shrapnel forums were so closely tied in with mose hansen's server

[ July 31, 2004, 16:55: Message edited by: The_Tauren13 ]

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Okay, I'm in, and I think I'm the Last (12 players).

May the best giant, er, person win!

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

ok i'll wait a few hours to see if agrajag wants to reupload his pretender, and then i'll upload mine, and start it - probably around 6 pm EST

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Im pretty sure the md5 # changed, and I'd rather not go through all the mess of going anonymous and being kicked and the likes.
I'll also have to recreate the pretender all over again since I used the Pangaea slot for some testing =P.
WCS (Worst Case Scenario) I get stuck with a not-so-good-unless-I-put-a-lot-of-effort-into-it pretender.
I guess it doesnt matter much since I'll be gone pretty quickly http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
Though the old (and not so good) pretender has advantages over the Last (and slightly better) pretender.
I guess time will tell!
And 6PM EST is, iirc, 2AM here =P
EDIT: just posting and edit, just in case, I'll be sure to upload my latest pretender by 2AM EST in case I decide to change him (yet again).
EDIT II : Did anyone here check my Email (probably at mosehanson) and add me to his MSN messenger?
If not I have someone to "ban" :/

[ July 31, 2004, 19:49: Message edited by: Agrajag ]

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

ok, the game's afoot

[ July 31, 2004, 22:31: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Victory Conditions update:

basically, it turns out that I had a different understanding of how VP worked than did the mosehansen server
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

as such, there are 33 crowns (i believe). technically, victory according to the server rules is now set at getting 40 of those http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

so, when it gets down to it, the contenders will have to keep track, since it is the first person to get a majority (ie. 17) of these crowns who will win.

[ August 01, 2004, 01:18: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Cainehill just connected to mosehansen, so turn three ought to be right on the way.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

turn 6 is now up

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Just for common knowledge:
My suckier pretender is the one that is in the game, oh well!

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

ahh, so mosen did manage to get it to work that way. shoulda kicked you first http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Pfft!
Nothing to it...
I got a sucky pretender...
A sucky starting point...
Bad luck...
Noobness...

Doesn't matter, as atleast I'll get some MP gaming expirience =P
BTW, I see some people here are real brutes, you got 3+ provinces already? =O

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

I just noticed score graphs were on myself and I was like omg people are rampaging already. Looks like a bunch of us are going to have very short lives lmfao.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

I hate it when a stealthy commander leading stealthy troops won't attack the province Im telling it to go to even thuogh another commander is attacking it >_<
Major troop loss >_<
>_<
Should have remembered that crap >_<

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Console yourself with the thought that those people are the ones who don't have a long range strategy, so they have to rampage early. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

heh, i'm rampaging because every single province near me is a piece of crap, like 12 gp/turn type crap http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

I, on the other hand, am scared of just about everything around me.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Truper...I know the feeling.

Krool

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

I am in the same boat with you as well truper.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

hm i got a serious dominionstrengths loss but have no idea what that could be .

is there a GE arco in it with a atheist or how the special unit is called which reduces faith ?


i am surrounded by barbarians not so nice when there are 80 of them http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I managed to overcome that fear, only to be smashed to bits by an army twice its "Information" size and with half my dumb army, hoorah!
Maybe in a few turns I'll manage to take it :\

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">So true. There are so many powerful neutrals around me that it is hard to do anything. My god already has an affliction. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

This game seems to be yet another indication that the VQ is grossly overpowered and must be nerfed (or eliminated) in the next patch. Look at Vanheim taking level 9 provinces with a single god and no army. He is now also taking additional provinces with his real army (getting two in the Last turn).

This just does not seem right to me. No god should ever be able to take a level 5 or above neutral province without troops, for it messes up the basic structure of the game. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Excuse me? "No god should ever be able to take a level 5 or above neutral province by itself"? Almost any but the combat-useless human rainbows can take independent-6 or higher provinces all by themselves. Some require more magic research than others, or a magic item or two, and it may require some cherry picking of provinces, but it's easily doable.

I guess maybe I'm not playing the same Dominions 2 you're playing? The only major thing wrong with the VQ is that immortality is overpowered because of free recuperation. It'd also be nice if the VQ had a fire susceptibility to balance its strengths (and also because it's thematic - crosses, stakes, sunlight, fire, holy water - traditional banes of vampires).

Marignon with a Phoenix can take indies 6 or higher right out the gate - sure, it dies a few times, no biggie.

Pangaea's Carrion Dragon - alteration 2 or 3, enchantment 1, rips through independents 6 and higher, barring knights and some mage types.

PoD : With heavy armor and a shield, ditto; easily doable for Ulm, some Vanheim themes, etc.

In fact : Vanheim might easily be doing this with their VQ : Full Black Plate, 18 armor etherealness, by turn ... 5?

Great Wyrm, Cyclops, Shedu, Niefel Giant, Ghost King - there's a whole list of pretenders capable of soloing independents at 6 or above.

If you want to slam the VQ as still being overpowered, please come up with some more compelling reasoning and logic.

(And I'm not even a VQ fan.)

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

If you want to see real Pretender problems right out of the gate, go look at mine in the Hall of Fame. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I'm C'Tis.

Krool

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">huh? my VQ has taken two provinces - since all the provinces around me are crap, its not too difficult. This Last turn she took out 55 light infantry and militia. anything can do that. I think perhaps you just haven't seen many SC's at work yet.

Frankly, I'm not that impressed w/ her potential as my dominion hasn't bothered to spread much at all. A VQ is definitely a contender though, and since I had refused to play her before the nerf, I thought I'd give her a go again. Any reasonable SC could have been taking bunches of 40-50 infantry, militia, and archers w/out breaking a sweat. <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yeah, that's my take on it too. its not very germaine to the present situation though, since my VQ has had to attack non-dominion provinces http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yeah, i'm vanheim, so black plate is a go http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

For instance, Panther, for 150 pts less than i spent on the VQ you could have had a Nataraja w/ A4 W3 E3, which is a true indy smashing monster (w/ Alt-3 and Ench-1), especially as it gets healed by Arcos' priestess.

[ August 04, 2004, 17:56: Message edited by: archaeolept ]

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Yeah, one should keep their mouth closed and have people suspect you as a fool instead of opening it and proving it like I did. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Obviously, I am a rank newbie. But what I actually said is that no pretender OUGHT to be able to kill level 5s and above striaght out of the box. The VQ is just one of many such problems against this obviously wistful notion.

When I first started playing SP in this game, one of the best features I found was that you had to get lots of varied commanders and troops to do anything useful. It was as far removed from Heroes of Might and Magic as it could be. The HMM series was all about creating the ultimate power hero. Dominions was a pleasant change from that.

But then I get on line and discover that Dom2 is all about getting the ultimate SC. The fact that ANY super commander can take the highest level of indy all alone without breaking a sweat is simply a sign of this problem. Level 20 indys? Level 30? Level 100??? How high would it need to go to stop this from happening?

I should talk, for my god is actually #1 in the HOF. But I am too ignorant and/or chicken to send him in alone. So I have been losing troops taking the powerful indys. And will continue to do so, for I am surrounded by knights and heavy calvary and dark vines other such toughies.

I suspect the truth of the matter is that I do not know all that much about the deep secrets in this game. And it obviously has a steep learning curve, as do ALL complicated games.

But it sure is fun and addicting! The fact that I have about a 0.01% chance of winning this game does not bother me in the slightest. It will be an enjoyable experience and I will go down fighting to the bitter end.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Keep in mind that we are talking pretender *gods* here. So the idea that they ought not to be able to smack down a bunch of poor joes with swords and spears just doesn't fly.

And on the subject of the VQ, yeah, she works great, but these days she's expensive. You've really got to accept some compromises in terms of scales, castle and dominion strength in order to build a real vq monster. As it should be.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Panther:

I think you should take heart. While gods and other supercombatants are extremely good at busting independents, the game isn't really about fighting the independents. Once you get later in the game and start fighting the other players, who have powerful summons and/or magic in battle, the lone supercombatant stops working quite so well. You still use them, obviously, but only as a component of your overall strategy.

Cainehill:

Removing recuperation from immortality would just nerf all the other immortals. But since the VQ has built in regeneration it would hardly hurt her at all.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">yep totally true .
sc pretenders excel at indy killing but later in the game they are only a part of your strat .
dominions is very different from heros of might and magic because you have so many options .
and in homm a hero only dies when all his troops are wiped out while a pretender god can be killed or get afflictions http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

indies 9 are tough i had to fight 90 barbarians Last turn they got through my mistform + mirror image the suckers hehe *G
i had 10 hp left then they routed so i almost lost my pretender against them but was lucky http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Removing, or rather modifying, the recuperation from immortality would put some limitations on the others, yes. But still - what I proposed is that immortals heal all wounds when coming back from the dead via immortality. The immortal simply needs to die to heal those wounds.

Also - all the _OTHER_ pretenders live without recuperation (with the exceptions of the bulls, carrion dragon, etc). The immortals can surely live without it also.

And I disagree about the VQ hardly being effected because of her regeneration - she has tiny HPs, _and_ is in melee quite often, meaning a lot of opportunity for wounds. Many if not all of the other immortals tend to be artillery, not getting hit that often as a result, so not getting as many opportunities for wounds.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">You could always go down Cohen's path and insist on playing games with very difficult magic research, limitting pretender choices to human or immobile pretenders, and other complicated rules intended to make the game play the way you want it to, instead of the way the game designers designed it to be played.

But, bad news : even human pretenders, and immobiles, can take independent provinces all by their lonesome before turn 20. The immobile can teleport in and clean house.

The human can either hurl enough magical artillery to devastate medium sized armies, or have enough death magic to simply summon skeletons upon skeletons upon skeletons until the enemy is wiped out.

And not infrequently, the immobile or human pretender dies trying to do so.

*shrug* Instead of crying out to nerf the VQ, or to nerf all SC pretenders, try figuring out how to use your own pretender and national troops to their fullest.

I've got the second highest number of provinces in this game - and my pretender only this Last turn budged from the capital, so it obviously wasn't my pretender.

You can use scales to your advantage - either giving your armies a boost, or enabling a mighty pretender, or facilitating potent blessings. You can use even puny mercenaries to allow your national armies to take provinces they would otherwise suffer great losses attacking, or you can come up with clever items to put on your national commanders that let them tip the balance of battle in their favor.

Or, you can always design and implement a game that does as you wish. But frankly, a game without the mighty magics and potent godlings probably wouldn't appeal to nearly as wide an audience.

Lastly : Write to Illwinter and ask them to put in some switches that put limits on the game - limitting research to level 2, 3, 4, etc, that force all people to use a human or an immobile pretender, etc. Fairly simple for them to do, albeit not very much fun either, but you can always ask.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

**** why do i have so low dominion everywhere ?
grmml

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

hah. my dominion is lower than anyones! I'm actually losing provinces that were mine to a mictlan dominion push http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

gotta love blood sacrifices...

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">so lets all attack the evil mictlan http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

or at least i and archaeolept die because we have no friendly dominion left http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

Turn eighteen is up.

Re: MP Game - New Mosehansen Game - hard_slog
 

The next turn will be up soon, I figure (22 hours to go, but only 2-3 nations didn't take their turn).
But thats not why I posted this post, I just wanted to say the to my surprise Im really having fun, I expected to be brutally masacred, or atleast to be the absolutely worst player, but it seems Im still in the game and not the weakest nation (though Im not strong either &gt;_&lt;).
Thats it...
And check out my cool 2nd mod! =P