Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I think Panther's original point, amplified by Cainehill, is that you are clearly the most experienced player in this group. As such, the sporting thing to do, would be to play a nation that you are uncomfortable with (e.g. Mictlan). Rapidly picking one of the most popular nations, that most people regard as one of most powerful nations, is sort of, well, "unsporting".

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Sure, like I said: decent/good army and blood. There are not many options when you want a serious blood economy you have Mictlain and Abysia ( and I guess Marignon Diabolic Failt, but turmoil ... bleech ). Those are the 1st tier blood nations.

Jotunhiem, Ulm-Black Forest these are the tier 2 blood nations. I suppose I should include vaniheim as a teir 2 .. but really their blood hunters are so expensive and so useful in combat that they are hardly a blood nation.

Pythium is an air nation? Those 2A's are pretty expensive, fragile, and slow. I would really consider them much more of a tier 2 air nation right there with Arco.

Oh and Man LotT is also a tier 1 air nation.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Abysia is maybe the most powerful race (or second most powerful after Caelum) simply because it can get blood slaves so fast that the arch devils for sure and even the ice devils typically belong to Abysia. It also can easily get hordes of vampires in the late game. Plus the fire 3 (or cold 3 with Caelum) is a free 120 points.

Abysia does miss out on the air queens, which is I think the point from Cohen.

The other thing is that Abysia (along with Caelum) are two of the first races selected in any MP game. Look at Eben Moses and see just how many MP games do not include those two races. The answer? Almost none! Pretty much only the ones where it is prohibited.

I cannot speak with experience, though, for I have played neither of these two races in an MP game. But they sure are quite popular among the better dominions players.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

i've been studying the map, and Faerun is pretty cool. I love how major trading cities have income up to 250 gold!!!

And the map is so huge, its quite likely that many of us will go through the entire game without meeting some of the players (either due to death or geography). I've never played on such a big map, so this should be interesting!

Oh, and how do you spot a "special" province?

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

there's also Ermor which is often Banned because its the "most powerful". Truth is, there's at least a half dozen races that are no-brainer-powerhouses. The others require a bit more experience to really kickbutt. But it seems obvious that all the races, when played intelligently and while avoiding their weaknesses and playing to their strengths, can destroy all other races.

if the Devs got a dime for every time people realized how balanced this game is, they'd have enough money to hire some staff and finally improve the interface!

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Panther has agreed to let me play this game instead of him. (We have the same CD key between us so us both being in the same game is, while not undoable, somewhat of a hassle.) I'll be playing man.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

2 air only costs Pythium 250 gold. 1 Theurg and 2 communicants gives you more magical power than a single Arch Theurg. They can cast more spells for less cost. Arch theurgs give you better mobility than theurgs with communicants, but are otherwise only needed for searching for air sites and whatever randoms you may want.

Given enough time, Pythium is probably the most powerful nation available. Arco would come in at a close second, followed by the other strong astral nations. R'lyeh and Atlantis in particular thanks to their long-term survivability. The blood nations can also be very powerful given time thanks to things like the devil commanders and soul contracts, along with the very nice blood items. The death nations get all of the benefits of the various undead troops. The nature nations get wonderful summons like Lamias, great global enchantments, and troop enhancing battlefield enchantments like mass regeneration. Really, the only nation that has a lot of trouble as the game goes on is the two standard themes of Ulm. They very badly need to find useful independent mages to cover their weaknesses.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

hmm.. I was looking at the map some more, and I noticed that Soapyfrog (playing Mictlan) currently has the entire Southern Hemisphere to himself! We definitly need 4 more players! (remaining races are Arco, Atlantis, Pythium, Ulm, Ctis, Marignon, and Machaka)

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Hey, I am Mictlan I need every little advantage I can scrape up! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

I figure if I can make it past turn 30, we'll have a GAME! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Well I know of only 2 ways:

1) they have freaky troops in the scouting report. That usually means something is up.
2) You can simply look at the map file. That will also tell you exactly what is defending the province.

Oh and I just tried Diabolic Faith Marignon. Not Bad. With a very heavy bless (F9S9) they are not too horrible. Of course this means that you have no SC. And that's really, really bad.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Well yes and no. You have to realize that those communicants are *dead* if the battle goes on for any amount of time. If you have access to releif then they will survive a little longer, perhaps until turn 10. But then they are dead. And there is really nothing that you can do about it.

I have learnt my lesson with them. Make sure that when you use them the battles are short and sweet. This means pull out the biggest guns you have as early as possible. If you have research shimmering fields, bLast away. If you have nifel flames bLast away. You can control the exact endurance useage for the 1st 5 turns. And you probably can get your communicants to survive that time. If the battle goes 10 or god help you 15 rounds they will never survive.

I would rank R'lgeh quite a big above Atlantis. They are really a 1st rate nation.

Indeed. Few nations scare me more than Blood nations that are able to sit for a while by themselves. They scale very well.

I would say Ulm, Atlantis, T'ien Ch'i and Matchaka all suffer as the game goes on.

Oh and probably Pangea, but not on this map. Hellkeep if they can keep it away from Ermor would, I figure, make all of the difference in the world. I know I would base my pangea strategy ( if I had one ) around getting that province and keeping it.

Only C'tis and Arco are really near him from that list. But it would be nice if those two nations are taken. They are both great nations. It's a shame to play without them.

And I *suppose* we need an atlantis if we have a r'lyeh.

Oh and hey, Pythium is taken!

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Hi, I would like to play Pythium, but as it is already chosen I'll try Arcos.

Thank you

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Which doesn't change the equation in any noticeable manner. Two communicants gives you the ability to cast more than three times as many spells as many spells as the master could normally cast. They are also cheap enough that you can afford a dozen a turn.

Sure there is. You buy more in your wizard's tower.

As long as you have enough to bring the fatigue cost for any particular spell down to 1 per cast, then they can handle 5 spells per turn indefinitely. It's a matter of how many masters you have.

R'lyeh loses to Atlantis underwater due to its inferior troops in the early game, and loses in the late game due to its inferior mages.

Atlantis has access to the highest astral income in the game more easily than any other nation. They should have little problem keeping up in the end game as they can reach the 100 clam benchmark at turn 51 using only their starting gem income. Shorter if they use the hammers that they'll have fairly soon.

T'ien C'hi is weak only if you don't use their superior forging ability and have to go up against a nation with astral magic.

Machaka has great counters to just about everything, but needs to build large armies to make it work. They also have as much gold income as they need to build these large armies once they get their fever fetish production going. Webs and tangle vines are great for killing SCs, and Machakan hoplites are the best human troop available.

Pangaea should always make use of its blood magic. Earth stones are a great investment for them. They can also swamp SCs with a horde of Lamias.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I see the map file has a *.rar extension. Will this work? I wonder because all my other map files have *.map or *.tga. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif Well I downloaded the Faerun_small.rar and, after placing it in the map file, Dom2 did not recognize it. Can anyone help? Thanks. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

.rar files are compressed. You need a program like WinRar to uncompress it.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Dice - Thank you so much! That makes much more sense. And that program seems pretty nifty too. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I'll take Machaka if that's ok. I'm gunna upload tonight. I'll check tomarrow and back out if that's not acceptable.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I met my hubby via an AD&D campaign in this map setting, so! My second big MP game! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif (I game mostly SP, or with my husband and one friend of his.) It looks like I can be the Dark Lady of either Marignon, Machaka, Ulm, C'tis, or Atlantis?

(Incidentally - their really ought to be more female pretenders. A friend of mine here, a translator, was interested in playing, until she realized almost all of the pretenders were male. Even ones that should be either - druids, lichs. Her friend's husbands are all playing lineage or Starcraft, but a lot of her friends might play if things weren't so predominantly male - her culture makes a big difference out of genders in some ways, but still - Korea is maybe the biggest computer game country in the world, per capita.)

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

It sure does. That 100 gold is disposable. Don't get me wrong I generally make thurges + communicants instead of arch thurges, but you have to make sure that your wars are concluded in a few short battles or you are going to lose a lot of gold.

Really? I don't know what metric you are going by. In terms of awesome human troops I would think that the Emerald Guard would be the best human troops in the game. If you think that elves are human than probably vans are the best. If you are saying that they have the best price performance then I don't know what is the best troop. I always figured it was the principes of either Pythium or Ermor ( BE ) but really I have never crunched the numbers.

Yes this is, IMO their strength.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Oh BTW we have so many players now, it would be *really* nice if we could get a full house. We should wait a day or two for that if possible.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

i just looked at the map file, and almost everyone's got at least one special province near their capital, EXCEPT for Caelum!! what an outrage!!! the nearest specials are like right smack inbetween Ermor and Pangeae or between Pangeae and Vanheim! Talk about asking for trouble!!

(and I'm guessing that "special" provinces basically have alot more magic sites then normal provinces)

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

i've claimed the annonymous Caelum slot, and uploaded my God. so no need to kick off anonynous players anymore

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Each communicant is only the equivalent of 3 principes in cost, and you'll lose more than that in a large battle.

Machakan hoplites are far more affordable for nearly the same combat potential.

Human troops refers to units that don't have superhuman stats and aren't referred to as being non-humans or augmented humans. No humanbred, wardens, or van.

That plus having fire, earth, nature, and death magic, along with fairly cheap mages for most of those paths. They really don't have to worry much about undead SCs for example, with all the witchdoctors they'll have.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

good morning http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

new player list :

Thufir : T'ien Chi
- DragonFire11 alias Melkor : Jotunheim
- Boron : Ermor
- Cohen : Abysia
- Msew : Ryleh
- Puffyn : Pangenea
- Lex : Caelum
- Panther : Man
- FM_Surrigon : Vanheim
- Soapyfrog : Mictlan
- Huzurdaddi : Pythium
- Tyrant : Machaka
- Tannath : Arcosnuffle
- Deccan : Atlantis
- Lawless : ???

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

yeah saw it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
if you want to be 100% sure though you can go anonymous , i kick it now and you reupload http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

still unassigned :

-Marignon
-Ulm
-Atlantis
-Ctis

so if we could get at least 2 more players would be great imo http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
if nobody wants to play atlantis i understand this .

but would be really great if we get a full house or at least 15 players http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Is Atlantis somehow penalized on this map?

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

not afaik they have even a rather good position because they and ryleh have each a sea for themselves http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

my statement was just because atlantis seems to be the least liked nation of all for mp .

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I have 2 questions:
1 - What do you think if the unassigned nations are played by the AI? That way we would have a full map.
2 - When are we going to start? I need a few hours to work in my pretender...

Thank you

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

This is using the faerun small map right? If so, then I'll take Atlantis. At the very least I can hide in the ocean so hopefully I won't be killed too quickly.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

yeah the small faerun map http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
you have a rather good position there as atlantis imo .
the sea for you alone and your nearest neighbors have not too good go to water abilities .
so you shouldn't be wiped out too quickly and i am happy you chose atlantis so we hopefully get now really a fullhouse http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

2 : no problem if everybody has uploaded in about 12 hours i will probably start the game if not then tomorrow http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
at the moment 8 pretenders are uploaded so no need to hurry tannath http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

1 : we have only missing now Marignon , Ulm and Ctis .
hopefully we find 3 players for them in the next hours .

with your ai player idea :

everybody who has an opinion on this please post your preferences . i will check the votes then later today and if the majority wants them go ai if they are still unclaimed i set them to ai .
oh and please claim the ai difficulty level you wish if you wish ai players too .

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Ill take C'tis.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

i vote for impossible AIs

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I vote against AIs.

(but if we must have them, make them impossible).

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

iI'd agree to fill the map with Impossible AI.
At least there will be no one that has a nice amount of provinces for itself without any fight except the indies.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I vote for impossible AI.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

yup, go AIs!

oh.. just curious: if atlantis expands to where Vanheim is, would they cut off Vans from the continent? Or can Vans sail accross enemy seas?

and I'm gonna trust in the Mose server that my pretender has been uploaded properly. Everything seems in order.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Might Join up if this game is still open in a day..
(Buisy watching the Hurricane!)
-Yc

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Not on the Version of the map I downloaded. In the big faerun map they each have an ocean. In this one they are in the same ocean.

I don't know what you mean by "nearly the same" they are relly different units. The Emerald Guard simply have better stats.

And if you want to talk about affordable or price/performance then I addressed that. I think that the principes are probably a better price performing unit. And now that I think of it all of the "free" units are probably the best price/perforamnce ( slaves/Maenad ).

So we are only missing Ulm and Marignon. Let's wait a couple of hours or even a day to fill those two spots with people. Even insane AI's suck compared to people.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Rlyeh is SUPPOSED to be in the Sea of Fallen Stars, but instead they appear to start on the Sword Coast, just North of Vanheim... strange

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

A little weird I admit. But it probably works out well. Those two will see ( sea ) action right away.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I will play as Ulm.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

SWEET. That only leaves marignon. Come one someone must like them. A holy empire. Solid troops. Lots of fire power.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

I'll give Marignon a shot. Just give me a bit to figure out a pretender...

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Boron, you may have missed it in all these Posts, but I have relinquished control of Man over to Tauren. I will not be playing in this game.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

Thanks! Full House. SWEET. Now I have to figure out that winning thing.

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : open
 

cool .

now the complete player list :

- Thufir : T'ien Chi
- DragonFire11 alias Melkor : Jotunheim
- Boron : Ermor
- Cohen : Abysia
- Msew : Ryleh
- Puffyn : Pangenea
- Lex : Caelum
- Tauren : Man
- FM_Surrigon : Vanheim
- Soapyfrog : Mictlan
- Huzurdaddi : Pythium
- Tyrant : Machaka
- Tannath : Arcosnuffle
- PashaDawg : Atlantis
- Regen : Ctis
- Grim Knight : Ulm
- Ygorl : Marignon

Re: Newbiegame 3 on mosehansen . status : full
 

cool 14 people have already uploaded their pretenders http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

only Msew , Soapyfrog and Dragonfire11 left . If you upload your pretenders in the next few hours i can start before going to bed otherwise tomorrow morning http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif