Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Oops, I didn't get that part about honour roll the first time. My bad.

Since Jack Simth went with the standard "throw four dice" approach, I guess I will do the same. I will have a look at OpenRPG to figure out how it works in the meantime; hopfully, I won't have to ask any more question in this regard.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

I will be lazy as well and just give you a link of something I typed up already. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif Don't follow the connect to server instructions, as there is currently no Alkazhar server... there are instructions on how to make your character sheet in there. You can right click on it and select Save Node or somesuch to save it to an explicit file after you are done.

http://www.spaceempires.net/dnd/start.php

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Ok, revision. I don't know the normal rule for this and I'm going to be lazy too and not look it up, so: Full HP for first level. First level only.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

The normal rule is full hit points for the first character level (NOT class level).

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Yep, ok, thanks. Pointless post, then.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

in in :-) you run a character and we wait till friday for someone else?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Yep, basically. I'm going to go with a basic human fighter, since it looks like we're low on meelee.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Narf: what's your e-mail address? I think I've got my character all entered into OpenRPG to send you, I'm just lacking the destination.

And here I thought I was lucky that I rolled max. Oh well.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

When you start your session in OpenRPG, you can easily send the character node to the GM (Narf in this case) by right clicking on it and using the Send to Player function. Depends on whether Narf needs complete details before the first session I guess. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Don't see why I'd need them in advance.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Narf:
I can see why you might want the characters a little in advance: balancing the campaign. You don't want a situation where my character casting Ghost Hand completely negates the puzzle you spent an hour laying out. Likewise, you don't usually want to include a puzzle/encounter that isn't solveable with the skillset available. Having the characters initial state available in the initial planning stages allows for eliminating both extremes.

As for your character, depending on what Eorg decides to go with, it might be better for you to pick a rouge. So far, the list is:

Alneyan: Sorceror(Wizard?)
Jack Simth: Bard
Eorg: Fighter(?)/Wizard(?)

So we have a spellcaster, and someone who can pick up a healing spell after a level. If Eorg picks Fighter, all that's needed to round out the skill set is a Rouge (for the traps). Also, the "creeping rouge" issue matters a lot less if it is the DM's filler character who is afflicted.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

True, I could go rogue. Eorg? Class?

Creeping rogue?

Oh, don't worry. There aren't any complex traps...yet. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif for the first dungeon, I just want to see how things go.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

The rogue that is used for pretty much a single purpose: spotting and neutralizing traps and locks. It becomes a problem because the player of the rouge doesn't do anything much; just rolls the dice over and over in response to whatever traps the DM throws at the party, in an extremely repetitive fashion. Similar problems can occur with priests (traveling medicine cabinet), if no undead are encountered, although it is less likely as d20 priests also get other nifty spells and spell-like abilities.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Well, the only way I'd allow more than one roll per character to find/disarm/lockpick is if there was a rational for it, like new information or say a day has passed. And if I present information on something, then it's expected that you go over it in-character and at least attempt to figure some of it out before you roll.

Undead will be encountered in some sessions, and as I get better, hopefully other things for clerics to do besides heal and buff.

Does that address your concerns?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

On the creeping rouge, I don't so much mean rolling on the same trap over and over, as rolling on different traps, which quickly becomes repetitive; sure, the traps are different, the difficulty of the traps are different, but the handling of them is pretty much exactly the same every time: roll to spot trap, roll to disable trap, continue. In combat, a rouge's options are more limitied than those of a spellcaster (no spells to choose from), and they are less effective than a fighter of equivalent level (can't wear armor, so usually has a poorer AC, can't use as strong of weapons) and are usually relegated to repeatedly firing arrows (or otherwise fighting from a distance) at the current opponent(s). It can become difficult to avoid making the player of the rouge bored very quickly. It becomes a bit less of an issue at higher levels, as the rogue's other abilities start kicking in, granting a better AC from dex bonuses, the better damage from hiding, the ability to snipe from cover, and whatnot.

But pretty much, yeah.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Hmm... I never seemed to have any problem finding non-healing things to do with clerics in AD&D 2.x, or even just plain old AD&D...

D&D 3.x Rogues are faily proficient killing machines, as long as they have good hiding skills and can exploit sneak attacks. Also, give the rogue 2 weapons (and appropriate feats) and he can do a lot of damage with those sneak attacks...

I don't know what you mean by can't wear armor? Heavy armors reduce dexterity bonuses significantly, so rogues can have as high of an AC as a fighter decked in plate mail can, easily. The skill penalties of the heavier "light armors" are fairly negligible. +15 from skill, -2 from armor. Not much to worry about.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Hmm...

Note: Make traps more interesting.

Hmm...

* Jack is now hanging by his ankles from a rope swinging from an iron loop in the ceiling 18 feet above Jack's feet. Ten feet to either side are ten-foot ledges, each with a door. Jack is 5'6", by DM fiat. Eight and a half feet below are crocadiles. Each crocadile is twelve feet long and can lunge nine feet into the air. Since each crocadile must pause for five seconds before lunging, Jack can avoid their lunges as long as he keeps watching them. There are three crocadiles and they each lunge 1.6~ seconds apart.

MWUHAHAHAHA!!!!

Ah, feel free to ignore me. Just being goofy.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

[/quote]You seem to be missing the distinction between "can" and "will" in your response there. A decent cleric player, or a decent DM, can rather successfully keep the issue from ever cropping up.The fighter gets greater attack bonuses at all levels, and increased attacks earlier; usually has better strength for more damage, better constitution for greater health, and a higher hit roll to begin with. Giving the rouge appropriet feats requires later levels, which I mentioned earlier as allieviating the problem to an extent.If you assume that the fighter doesn't have a decent mundane equipment set, that's true. However, a lower-level fighter decked out in full plate with a tower shield (fighters start proficient with all of that, and so take no attack penalties for it) and a dex of 12 gets 10 (base) + 8 (plate) + 4 (shield) + 1 (dex) = 23 AC; A lower-level rouge with 18 Dex (highest initial) gets a +4 dex bonus; with the heaviest armor that allows that +4 (chain shirt), the rouge is running at 10 (base) +4 (armor) +4 (dex) = 18 AC. As the rouge does not (by default, at least) start with proficencies in medium armor, heavy armor, or shields, the rouge can't take any further mundane protection without taking a penalty to their attack. The problem with sneak attacks is that until the rouge gets up high enough that the rouge can re-hide, in the middle of combat, reasonably reliably, it works once per fight. A fighter, out of the box, is proficient with essentially any weapon (s)he can lay hands on; the rouge is limited to ranged, light, or simple weapons (assuming that you don't want to take the penalty for using a weapon that the rouge isn't proficient with). Much of this is alleviated at later levels, where the rouge can have stat gains, multiple feats, class abilities, increased sneak attack damage, and sufficient skill to make sneak attacks more frequent. Of course, by that time, the fighter has even more feats, much improved attack bonuses, more attacks, and his own stat increases. A fighter is a combat specialist; a rogue is a stealth and safe passage specialist with combat ability. Sure, rouges can hold their own in fights. However, fighters specialize in it. With players of equivalent skill and characters of equivalent level, a fighter will usually be meaningfully better at combat than a rouge.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

*Casts prestidigitation, and uses the simple tricks to give the crocks other things (small, trivially replaced, cheap conjoured objects moving close to them) to lunge at. Then uses some acrobatics to swing over to the ledges, and uses a casting of Mage Hand to untie the ropes to get onto a ledge at a critical moment.

*Then uses a bardsong to Fascinate narf so Eorg can quietly slip around behind him and hit him on the back of the head with a hammer. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

:-P

chaotic good elven wizard named eorg - will multiclass to fighter-wizard

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Let's see... that gives us, to start, two dedicated spellcasters, a bard, and an unassigned (probably a rouge). Will probably work; both bard and rouge are half-fighters, as long as both remember to wear leather or some other light armor.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Erm... those are some absurdly wealthy 1st level characters! 8-O

Note that never once did I say that a rogue could be a direct comparison to a fighter in combat... that would defeat the purpose of the Fighter class.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Narf: Actually, the prestidigitation description says that it can be used to flavor things - as scent is 90% of flavor, they DO smell like meat.

While granted platemail is a little much to expect, differing armor sets still can easily leave the fighter with a higher AC - suppose they both have 100 gp in their armor budget:
Fighter: Scale Mail (50), Tower Shield (30) (total 80)
Rouge: Chain Shirt (100)
Give the rouge 18 Dex, the rouge has 10 (base) + 4 (dex) + 4 (armor) = 18.
Give the fighter 14 dex (or more, but the armor limits the dex bonus to that), and then the fighter has 10 (base) + 2 (dex) + 4 (tower shield) + 4 (armor) = 20.

Fighter still has the advantage in AC, it's just been reduced from an advantage of 5 to an advantage of 2. However, you did say they could "easily" have as high of an AC, which isn't really the case, at least starting out. Sufficently later on, the rouge's AC can continue to climb for as long as the rouge can find some way to increase dexterity, while the fighter is left with trying to find, make, or enchant better armor. Which has the more difficult task ultimately depends on the campaign.
Not directly, no. However, you did say "rogues can have as high of an AC as a fighter decked in plate mail can, easily" which was making a direct comparison to a fighter in combat. Sure, you didn't say you could do that, you just did (at least once) in a context where it was fairly easy to come to the conclusion that you meant to say rouges were better than fighters in combat.

Likewise, note that I never once said the rouge was a pansy in combat - just (and I'm quoting here) "In combat, a rouge's options are more limitied than those of a spellcaster (no spells to choose from), and they are less effective than a fighter of equivalent level", yet you jumped on me as though I had said the rouge was worthless in combat.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

I don't see any point in continuing any sort of argument with you Jack, as you will never let anything die...

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

That, coming from the guy who never admits to any specific instance of being wrong?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Whatever. So back to your regularly scheduled D&D planning...

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

However, from a re-reading of it, it can only do one thing at a time. However, you could confuse them with a meat smell from thin air.

Either way, it's a successfull trap. After all, you had to think and consider your options. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

In response to Jack-of-all-trades (you are a bard after all) post so far below: I am playing as a Wizard, since Sorcerer was only my first idea before race's choice (Tieflings aren't exactly the best Sorcerers around). I may switch to Wizard/Rogue later on, or perhaps not; that will mostly depend on the need for some extra muscle or not I guess.

Narf, my Tiefling should be more or less a normal character, with no hidden genes to speak of (assuming that part of your post was directed towards me that is). They can have some odd characteristics (many related to appearance, a few to game mechanisms) at character creation, but this would require the use of a table outside your sources, and isn't that primordial, so.

*Goes back to trying to install that OpenRPG, and its Pythium minion* Am I the only one for who it won't run, and won't show up an error message? Pythium is installed, with the 2.32 Version and the 2.4 update, as explained in the download page.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Did you install both Python and wxPython?

Maybe the fact that you are installing Dominions empires is the problem? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

The regular Pythium and the themed ZPythium (Serpent Cult) have been installed. Launching the Start Client (with or without the console) shortcuts do nothing at all; launching the Server application works though.

Perhaps I should indeed create my character with the Pythium built in Dominions. I hope you won't mind if I send you a Pretender file Narf? (My Titan might be a tad bit overpowered, but...) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Try navigating to the OpenRPG folder and running "start.pyw" or "start.py" manually, bypassing the shortcuts.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Oh, Narf, what types of opponents will we be facing (or would that be a spoiler?)? Mindless undead? Animals? Intelligent types? Plants and molds? A mix?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Column A and column I, for the first dungeon.

Alneyan, you must be working from an older book. MM 1, 3.5 has tieflings listed with the following:

Darkness, once per day. +2 racial bonus on Bluff and Hide. +2 Dex, +2 Int, -2 Cha. Darkvision 60 feet. No racial feats. Special qualities: Resistance cold, electricity and fire 5. Automatic Languages: Common, Infernal. Bonus Languages: Draconic, Dwarven, Elven, Gnome, Goblin, Halfling, Orc. Favored class: Rogue. Level adjustment: +1

You could have your character be a tiefling for role-playing purposes and start as a tiefling at level 1, or if you want those advantages, wait a level and then spend it.

Or simply have your character start a tiefling and just spend your second level to gain those advantages. *Shrug*

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Sorry Narf; I wasn't speaking of the racial adjustements, but of the "special" characteristics at character creation (I believe it is something like "throw a d100 several times, and pick what it corresponds to", or the like. Such characteristics are "have a tail" and the like, but they do not really matter). These come from Planescape proper if memory serves. As for the racial changes, I will simply wait for level 2, and see then. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Running the files directly did not work either Fyron. I think I will uninstall the whole thing, and give it another try; knowing me, I have quite likely bypassed a step in the install process.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Ah. Nope, don't have that. Feel free to have a tail if you want. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Not prehensile, though. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Narf: we could use connection details - the server name, room, and the like for use with OpenRPG.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Sever name and room? Right. Brain, work.

How about names that fit the thread? Looney and D&D. Password cheese.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Fyron, how do you make a room on a server?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Narf: It seems to be something you do from the client side; there is a section on it in the browse servers segment.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

I tried using that, but the create button never lit up.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

You have to be connected to an active server in order to be able to create a room.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

I made a server. Then I tried to connect to it. It wouldn't connent.

Idea! (We need a lightbulb graemlin, DEG, please. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif ) Make two openRPG's?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Narf: I've got a server up and running; can you connect to it?

Otherwise:

Did you register the server?

Can you connect to:
127.0.0.1:6774
?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

No. The server program is a separate program. There should be 4 links in the OpenRPG start menu folder.

You need to enable the ports that the server uses in your firewall before incoming connections will be allowed.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

I can register my server and stopped off in yours for a second out of curiosity.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Well, if you can successfully log into a server I put up, then there isn't really an issue, is there? I can host the server, and set you to GM. I've got the server named to loony now, would you mind stopping by the D&D room (cheese) and seeing if we can actually talk to each other via it?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

I'm on.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Well, I now have confirmation that my server works, and that others can get to it. Either that, or I'm hallucinating. One of the two.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.(Edit
 

Of course you're hallucinating. I would never make a character named Lae'nial. In fact, this forum is a hallucination. We, your doctors, have been trying to prepare you for the horrifying, terrifying truth. And, now that you are questioning 'reality', we think your ready to know.

'Jack Simth', you ARE Bill Gates. You alone caused the crash of the world economy and a reVersion to a horse and donkey economy.

* Some of my best, that was. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif