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Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
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What do you mean by "occultists," exactly? Do you mean, mixing in a bit of Norse mythology to help instill national pride? That is not "occultist" by any means. Unless, of course, you are a Christian Fundamentalist... but that is an entirely different can of worms... Quote:
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Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
I am a better person because of my religeon than I would be without it. No other institution, save that of my family, I have ever encountered, could have taught me morality so successfully.
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Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
Unfortunately I have to admit it, but watching reruns of TNG after coming home from school at 4:00 pm (yes, I rushed home to watch it) is what I attribute to some of my morality. Especially the "Prime Directive" and live and let live philosophy, although now that I'm older I see Star Trek as a totally unworkable dream fantasy and the possibility a "Prime Directive" mentality being used as justification of withholding help from needy people.
Brian |
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Nothing wrong with that. One of our LDS (The other short form, not LSD) beliefs is 'if there is anything virtious, lovely or of good report, or praiseworthy, we seek after these things.' As I remember it. My memory might not be exact, but the meaning is clear.
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Brian |
Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
[/quote]Your family could easily have taught you morality in the absence of religion. It happens all the time. Religion is in no way required for morality. [/quote] Well Imperator as I said you are free to hold to your own beliefs in this country, and I suppose to understand what a Christian (I am talking about a good normal person that happens to be a christian, not including the far right or far left Groups in this term) means when they say that they are better because of their religious beleifs then they would be without them you'd have to feel it for yourself. It truely is different to have faith then simple morality. As a friend of mine often said "Faith does not equal morality and morality does not equal faith, one can exist with out the other, but when they become one it is a far better thing." It is true I can have faith in God but be immoral I can also have faith in only myself but be a very "moral" person, Religion and morality are not by default in the same boat and each can exist without the other but it's always better to have Faith in God AND be moral then just to be Moral in my opinion http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif |
Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
LOL I always saw the Federation as a weak organization, I mean the Klingons and Romulans BOTH being warlike expansionistic empires should be able to easily kick the crap out of such a weak and gutless group.
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And I would also be annoyed if someone advocated banning atheism. |
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If you choose "having faith" to be something really ambigious, like being optimistic and thinking there is a creator out there, it is different than saying "having faith" and intepreting the words in the Bible. At risk of sounding offensive to you, "in my opinion", faith is something that a person needs to think that they have a purpose in life/are superior to those without faith, including other types of lifeforms. In other words, "faith" is burying your head in the sand "in my opinion" (see how offensive that sounds lol). Brian |
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Could we quit trying to offend each other now? |
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I side with Imperator and Braineyci. I too think that religion (any religion) is not something we absolutely need to become better people.
And as I stated in my first message here I said the that banishing all religion is not a viable option. Like Starhawk said, the problem is too complex for that. Yes, I said "the problem" and I meant religion and the difficulties that go with it. Religion is not always the believe in a higher power, it can also be a strong believe in a certain way of live (Hindoeism), confidence in a leader of a country (Thailand) or an absolute dedication to the realisation of something (the progress of technology). Core of this is my definition of religion. I define religion as a very strong believe in something, for examples see the text above. Too many kill in the name of some god or deity. The only way to eradicate acts like this is to banish all the beliefs. Unfortunately that isn't an option. So maybe it's possible to do as the Roman did; absorp all religions and adpat them slightly to accomodate everyone. Then the only problem you have is tolerance or extremism (depending how you want to translate it). So then you must find a way to let those "people" change their mind. Oh, and a bit late, but countries like China do have a religion. They officially have no religion, but every Chinese has it's own gods (depending on where they live in China). And don't forget the religion that glorify the head of the state. Everyone: Please don't use the word "offensive" or "be offended" by anything that is said in this intersting thread. The name of this thread is crystalclear and you can expect to find alternate believs in this thread. So don't enter this discussion if you are easily offended by other beliefs. |
Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
I have yet to be offended; I have been angry, annoyed, peeved, confused and worried, but I'm not offended. I was simply worried about the possibility. As for my anger...It's a familiar problem.
[qoute] The name of this thread is crystalclear and you can expect to find alternate believs in this thread. [/qoute] I think you are a little tired, my friend, because this is the one about aliens. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif As for the roman 'absorpsion', would that include forcing nearly everybody to worship the emporer? I would also like to say that intollerance and discrimination are two of the foundations of civilization. First, a civilization cannot tolerate crime, and then a civilization must discriminate between the criminal and the innocent, untill the punishment is over. (Barring certain circumstances, like ex-criminals in the police force, which would certainly be difficult if one wished to permit it.) They are certainly not bad words. |
Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
Hahaha... great answers Narf!
This is one of the reasons I really love this forum. he people are inteligent, tolerant and very funny. They always make me smile on a bad day (especially Raging Deadstar, but that's another story). I really appreciate your answers. As for worshipping the emperor concerns. I don't know if you should give one person absolute power. I could be good, it could be bad. But back to the aliens. Maybe they have already visited this planet and feld it in terror. We poison ourselfs and our planet and we play very bad music on the radio. ALso most of the programs on the tube aren't worthwhile. Nah, they're long gone... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif |
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Anyway, religion is not the cause for war, it on its own is not the bad thing. The bad thing is the prejudices of humans and their greed and their willingness to use religion to justify to themselves and others that their evil actions are in the right. Religion was often just the political tool used to leverage the masses into serving the religion's political interest. Because, in the past, people lived so harshly, they had to believe in the afterlife, as a reward for all their hard effort, as well as punishment for their crimes. In this way, the religious organisation maintained a level of peace within society while being able to turn the populace against an enemy, I mean, hey, they're the priests, they should know evil when they see it, right? The Spanish Inquisition was an organisation whose members were good people. Good, religious people. They thought that all their torturous acts were cleansing the souls of those they 'helped' so their victims would make it into Heaven. After all, what is a period of incredible pain compared to the possibility of eternity in hell? And these fine people weren't even sure that they themselves wouldn't be punished for their acts with eternal damnation, but they put others first. Anyway, I'd be very surprised if the whole organisation wasn't being used for political gain. Now, back to the original topic. Meeting aliens would lead to us developing interstellar travel far faster than any sane alien would want us to. Facts: We are capable of rapid expansion. We are on the verge of making ourselves live for aeons. We are adaptable. We are quick to pick things up. We are treacherous. We do not like others being in more powerful positions than us, it engenders fear and suspicion. Why would any sane alien want to let beings with our physical and mental abilities, and mindset, loose in the Galaxy? They wouldn't. It's best to either wait for us to change our mindset and culture, or to simply wipe ourselves out. Either way, we're a safer faction for them than we are now. |
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Just to make it clear who I'm responding too:
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As for aliens, if you havn't watched Men In Black, go watch it at the next available opportunity. But not MIB 2, which suffered from the problem of many sequals. It had some good points, but not enough. Just a let-down. There are scenes in MIB that make it a classic... |
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Yeah, I agree MIB was a lot better than MIB II. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/smile.gif
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BTW Hindos (sp?) Do beleive in various Gods/Godesses and monor deitys so I don't know how you brought them into the [not believing in divinity] Category http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Quote:
Money Land Ideology (independent of religion) Nationalism Raw Materials Gold Political SNAFU Revenge removing a political enemy Buisness Spite Desperation Women Men Animals (not falling into the Category of women and men lol) Conquest "Self Defense" (most empires claimed self defense) Security Fear Mistrust Theft Cars Drugs Toys (yeah I actually heard of a six year old who killed a girl over the fact that she broke his toy) Fun So you want to remove every single thing on that list before you blame religion for most of the "problems" of the world's disunity? Quote:
And as far as me saying "morals are better when you have faith" that shouldn't make you sound as if I'm claiming superiority as my morals may or may not be the same I simply meant for me Faith makes my morals stronger. But many people also constantly argue about what is "moral" so that's a very difficult thing to say who is "better" or not anyway :p Quote:
I assume you meant Chinese provinces? and weren't referring to the people as "it". While technically true "China" has no religion as in the PRC (People's Republic) because they have Banned all religions "officially" and will punish those they find following a religion (thus the underground churches and temples) so religious belief there is dangerous in the extreme and most don't worship openly. A friend of mine (granted he could be a bit pushy with his religious beliefs sometimes) once asked a Chinese woman how she felt about her country banning religion to which she replied (oddly enough). "Oh you can beleive in God, just don't tell anyone." Quote:
If you'd like me to define that better I guess I could say it like this The "Inquisitions" and "Witch Hunters" had a lot of faith in God yet what they did was constantly immoral and wrong (Same goes for an assload of Catholic priests these days). Now as far as the second part goes, as I said I knew a guy that would give you the shirt off his back (literally) yet he did not beleive in God and generally believed only in himself, yet he rarely even cussed lol never drinked (not saying drinking is immoral by that I mean he never got drunk off his ***) and that's something I can't say I never did hehe, never hurt anyone unless they tried to hurt him first and was generally a great person to know. Thus he was moral without being Godly. Quote:
I "personally" only felt a little insulted by some of the comments made earlier but that's only because the guy saying it was practically calling me an idiot because of my beleifs while I havn't said anything offensive against people who do not believe in God, Heck i even said I was very good friends with a "neo-pagan" (though I honestly don't know what that means as she mainly sounds ignostic to me)and a girl I'd LOVE to date is a buddist http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif. NOW on to the Aliens I agree with the folks that say the aliens probobly wouldn't want us humans to go throwing ourselves out into space because of how aggressive we can be when we feel threatened, and some countries on this world (thinking of a few places in the mideas take a guess which ones lol) getting out into space and onto other worlds is a SCARY prospect. |
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Note that a large number of religions have no "gods" to speak of. |
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I would like to clarify, that in the face of apparent atheism-bashing and glorification of religion on the part of Starhawk I was simply trying to provide examples in which religion was the primary or sole cause of violence. I was in no way defending atheism nor was I trying to say that atheists don't commit violence.
... Aliens haven't visited because our stargate is buried and it takes too long to get here by ship! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif |
Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
Not glorification, defense, Religion does cause a lot of crap but it's not the "main provider" of crap in the world so to speak http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
You can't blame "religion" or "atheism" for violence in my opinion you can only blame people. [Edit] Oh and big deal the dictionary defines Fart as letting wind fly lose from the anus, but IT'S NOT WIND IT'S GAS!.(you'd be suprised the strange stuff I looked up in the dictionary when I was 10 :p) Anyway my point is the dictionary does describes things on a broad basis and does indeed include as part of religion as "anything you follow with zeal" yet 90% of people I talk to (not all christians as I have said many times) say that it's generally only something that beleives in a god or some form of creator. Anyway you guys let's stop the fussin and the fuedin and agree that we all have our own seperate opinions and that that's okay (best southern accent) and get back to discussin them little green men. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif |
Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
GREY! I tell you, they are GREY! AND ANYONE WHO SAYS OTHERWISE SHALL BE LOBOTOMIZED!
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*agrees with Narf and Starhawk*
I volunteer to preform the lobotomies. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif |
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Bad Fyron! Lobotomy for you! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif
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Hahaha... LOL!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif
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LOBOTOMIZE FYRON!
Forward, my Mouse-Bots! |
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Mousebots?! What about me?!
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/me impales and gores Narf with his horns and tusks, then eats him with his sharp teeth and gaping jaw.
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/me rips out of Fyron's stomach in an aliens-esque scene. "LOBOTOMIZE FYRON" was, of course, code for LOBOTOMIZE TIMSTONE.
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Oh my goodness, they killed Narf1 The bastards!
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Damn, Narf! Why would you want to kill me?! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/Injured.gif
Don't kill me, I'm indispensable... I hope. |
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I dunno. You said "What about me?!" so I thought you felt left out.
Anyway, their standard mad scientist robots, which means that their invulnerable to everything except ripping out the exposed wires. Tired...ZZZZZZZZZ |
Re: OT:Why Aliens dont come here
Sleepy, sleepy Narf. Till next time! Sweet dreams!
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Not yet. I've got some things to do.
Although I havn't started doing them yet... |
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Oh, and you're tired already?
Then a bucket of coffee is the answer. |
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It's 1:30 in the morning here.
And coffee? Yuck. Smells like sewer water. |
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1:30 in the moring! Damn, and you're still up?! Why mouse? What needs to be finished?
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Now we all know that the aliens are greyish blue unless you talk the the Raelians (cuckoo cuckoo) in which case the aliens are called Elohim (he turned the singular Hebrew word meaning "God on High" into a plural describing an entire race, odd eh?)and they conveniently look just like us humans so that Rael himself can claim that those same aliens who got Mary preggers got his mama preggers....LOL AHAHAHAHA anyway I'm sorry it's just HAHAHAHAHA a greasy looking bald guy is our next jesus LOL Anyway though, the aliens are not all gray http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif(some say the've seen blues and reds that look just like the grey cept the blue's have fins on their heasd) So are we looking at different alien races? OR one species with multiple skin colors much like us Hummies? |
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