Re: WINSPWW2?
 

It would be nice to see South Africa and Brazil.

troopie

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Ach don't forgot Slovaks was the first germans ally they fights in 1939 in Zakopane and Rabka area atack the south flank of polish army Krakow and Karpaty. Slovaks give for atack on poland a three divisions of infantery , tanks group and aircrafts see here this green units are slovakian army
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...wrzesien_1.png

All description of Polish defense war in 1939
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polish_September_Campaign

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

see that in thema Warsaw upspring

The beast source in English are photos of used weapons of both side
http://www.warsawuprising.com/

The site with many essays and links in thema polish underground in english
http://www.polishresistance-ak.org/

AND aircraft fotos map of Warszawa from 1935 a ultimate and best map of Warsaw from upspring times
http://www.warszawa1939.pl/fotoplan/...ie_arkuszy.htm

and the legend in english
http://www.warszawa1939.pl/index.php

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

http://www.warszawa1939.pl/fotoplan/...ie_arkuszy.htm


That one is simply stunning. I never , in my wildest dreams, expected to find some thing like that. THANK YOU!

Don

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Absolutely amazing resource - and you can zoom in and get photos of some key buildings. Simply stunning.

Andy

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

I have a proposition of add a new OOB polish comunists LWP army (Ludowe Wojsko Polskie) because they are a major rusian ally on estern front like czechoslovakian army. I made the OOB for this is completed so you moust only put them in game code. This OOB should be useful too after war years 1945-1949 because in this times we have two polish goverments. One in London with army in England (in SPWW2 has his OOB) and the secound controled by Rusians in Poland with LWP (my proposition OOB) in hypotetical WWIII clash after WWII betwen East and West we should have polish on both sides and that should simulate secound polish OOB. In 17.09.1939 russia atack poland and take many poles to death camp during ocupation of eastern poland. After german invasion 22.06.1941 poland becam a rusian ally not enemy like before. So poles parole from death camps on siberia created the army under general Anders command. Rusians want used this army on front as a cannon fodder fast as posible without traing and enaught weapons (because we were problematical ally for rusians) so G.Anders escape with his army to Iran to the western Alies. Furious Stalin break the diplomatic connections with polish goverment in England and creates from polish comunists in russia his own polish goverment know as PKWN. LWP (Ludowe Wojsko Polskie)(Polish people's army) was created in Juni 1943 from poles colected from rusians Deads camps. Only not more than half catch to Iran so the rest join to LWP that was a one method for leave this deth's camps on siberia. Rusian know that this polish soliders don't trust the rusians goverment so all the key comanders becam rusians officers or NKVD agents. Rusians don't wants secound escape. This soliders was too under heavy propaganda influency because see too many and know too many about comunism in russia. Polish division was used the first time in october 1943 in middle byelorussia to the crush the front in Lenino area. This battle was wery bloody and was tootaly disaster because rusians don't give a artilery , air support and help of neighbour rusians division. After this battle poles was retrat from the front and used in battle next time in 1944 during fights in south east poland. Than LWP soliders fights on the right bank of Wisla river in east Warsaw and can't help the insuregents during upspring (Rusians prohibit). In 1944 one infantery division grow too the 1th polish army. This army fights in the early 1945 on the Pomernn Stelung (north-west poland after war) in Danzing(Gdansk) crosing Oder river and than fighst in the north suburbies of Berlin. The 2th polish army created by polish comunists in 1944 fights in south poland in Krakow area than in Silesia and fights last fights in the Dresden are with gen. Steiner army.

About flag for this OOB i thing LWP should use simple polish flag (prefered by this goverment) red-white. For polish prewar army , army in France and than in England I sugest a new polish flag with small Eagle on white part like in my avatar.

What do you thing about secound "Polish Comunists OOB" as I write before I have this OOB ready so include of this OOB don't need a resarch I do this before. Only what is need that is a picklist and if you accept this I can do this very fast. This OOB generally is copy from rusians OOB the same units and formations only changes in some dates of avaiablity and in units moust of them was not used in LWP. This OOB don't need a new icons and new lbm's because lbm's of LWP soliders and vehicles was included before in last DOS SPWW2 se the range Pm29304 to Pm29421.

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Why will there be no desert? Will it be removed completely?

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Where did you get that idea?

If youre referring to these posts:

Btw, you do get a summer map at least in v7.1.

You just misunderstood them. They were talking about default battle locations regarding different nation setups and battle dates. The: "Don't worry. They don't give you desert." means only that if you choose a random battle whit Britain vs Italy in 1943 you will not get a desert map. If you choose Britain vs Italy in 1942 you will get a desert map, etc... So desert is stil there in WinSPWW2.

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

I Sugested three cauntrys
A) Iranian OOB - indenpendent cauntry invaded in 1941 by alies rusians and british
B) Iraq OOB - should be nice fight in battles with british in 1941 in iraq this cauntry used his own equipment buy in italy CV tankeetes for example
C) Tibet - was invaded by comunists china in 1949 should be nice play in this misions

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

RELAX. The maps will match the battle locations. There will be desert where desert is applicable.

Don

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Does any have a notion as to what nations will be included? I presume, every one that was in the Dos version, but what others?

Take your time in answering, enjoy Christmas.

troopie

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

In addition to the nations that were in SPww2v7 we have added the following

Slovak Republic
Manchukuo
Italian Social Republic (RSI)
Vichy France
Polish Communists (LWP)
Chinese Communists


In all cases where this means a split from a parent OOB (like the Slovak rep and Czechoslovakia and the RSI from Italy and Vichy from France etc.) those parent nations have been redone as well. We ***MAY*** add Croatia but that is in no way a promise so I don't want anyone coming back in 6 months asking where Croatia is if it doesn't make it to the game.

Don

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Come on Don, you really think we would do that to you guys? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Yes.

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

All right, I going to say it. Is there a chance of seeing South Africa in WinSPWW2. and do you want help in putting an SA orbat together?

My father fought in WW2, and I want to honour him. Beside that, we always seem to get left out.

troopie

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

No current plans to make a separated SA OOB for WW2. Too small a force to justify an OOB, batloc codes etc.

Cheers
Andy

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Is there special WinSPWW2 forum?

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

There will be one, when the game is released.

Cheers
Andy

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

What about a Danish OOB (1930-1940)?

I have released this danish oob for old SPWW2v7.01

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Thanks Andy

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

I'd like a Danish OOB for obvious reason - I'm Danish http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Even though the Army only fought for a couple of hours in 1940 and again in 1943, it would be usefull for a Weserübung campaign (the German attack on Denmark/Norway) and what-ifs. After all, the Danish Army saw more figthting than the Swedes, who are already in the game (v. 7.x) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

And the OOB should be extended to 8/43.

Claus B

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Claus

The Swedes got in as I recall, as an Ally for Finland. Some Expiditionary force or other.

Denmark might happen (as with Portugal, Brazil etc who fought in Italy), at a later release. But right now, I don't have a man week or so to spare to integrate a new OOB with the game, which is shortly about to go to playtesting anyway.

Can't think of any nations left out that actually fought in WW2 (e.g Switzerland, Turkey and Eire would never make it in).

Cheers
Andy

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

AFAIK the Swedes sent military aid in the form of equipment, but never sent any forces. The Swedes that went to Finland were volunteers as were many Norwegians and Danes.
Denmark was probably closer to being an ally of Germany then Sweden was to Finland, as the Germans were allowed to raise a national Waffen-SS battalion - Freikorps Danmark - from recruiting offices in Denmark. Danish officers got permission to leave the Danish Army to serve in the Freikorps from King and goverment (promptly forgotten in 1945 of course http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif ). Danish goverment ministers were even inspecting the unit in Germany.

I know, of course, that a Freikorps scenario could (and probably should) be made by using the German OOB. But if being a near ally of a WWII combatant is a criteria, the Danes should be in (on the wrong side, unfortunately, but still in http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif )

No problem, just wanted to strike a blow for the ol' countrys chances of making the game if the powers that be decide to expand the roster http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Claus B

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

I'd like a Danish OOB too, for obvious reasons - then one could fight Sweden vs Denmark battles. Just like in the good old days, eh...? I'm Swedish. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

LOL. Neighbours are just the same...

Artur.

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Having Swedish OOB in the game is unrealistic. Sweden was a neutral country and did not participate in the war in any way. Sweden did not give any military support to Finland. And most sertanly Sweden was not an Ally to anyone. (Hence the word neutral country.) Finland did buy some weapons from Sweden but this is not the same as giving military support. Sweden did give humanitarian aid to Finland which was allowed for a neutral country to do. If Sweden is there already then why not add other neutral countries like Spain, Switzerland, etc. also?

I dont see any sence in adding Denmark either. Denmark was an occupied country. If you want to represent Danish born people fighting alongside German units then add them to the German OOB.

If you have to add Danish OOB then make it from 1930-1940 only.
Same thing for Swedish OOB 1930-1940.

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I disagree with pretty much everything you've stated.

Swedish OOB unrealistic? I don't see how...? Sweden as a country existed during the war. The same goes for the other neutrals - Spain for example which is also in the game http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Limiting OOBs to certain stop dates...? Why? So that no "what ifs" can be created - sounds like a hopeless crusade to me...

I'd support the inclusion of any country in the game, however minor it may have been. After all, it's not like anybody is forceing players to use them...

Lastly:

Are two puzzeling statements but interesting nonetheless. If you have the time it would be happy to hear what you base them on. PM me if you like...

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

France was an occupied country, Poland was an occupied country, Holland was an occupied country... I could go on and on. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

The fact is that Denmark was attacked by Germany on April 9th 1940 and there was a few hours of fighting in Jutland as well as in Copenhagen. There was fighting again in 1943 when the German Army decided to disarm and demobilize the Danish Army, also about half a day.
Of course, both occasions could be elaborated on with what-ifs and you could even make a two-battle campaign http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif Or include the Danish debacle in a "Weserübung" campaign.

Why? The Danish Army remained operational under the German occupation until August 1943.

As I said before, though Denmark was not a major combattant, at least the country did fight - as opposed to Sweden (but keep the Swedes in - we have scores to settle, particularily since the latest articles in Aftonbladet about Denmark http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif ). So if participation is a criterum - then Denmark should be in - at some point.

Claus B

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

What I mean is that Sweden was neutral in 1941-1945. It was not in war whit any country. As for the military support. If you count the selling of ammunition and old guns. Then yes Sweden did give military support to Finland. However this was not done officialy or in so large scale that the Allies or the Russians would have wanted to declare war against Sweden. Neither did Sweden engage in actual fighting whit any country or deploy its forces to fight alongside other forces. A few thousand volunteers does not count for actual military support if you compare this to the weapons and military forces that were coming from Germany at the time. So at that time the official oppinion of all the major powers was that Sweden was not giving military support to Finland and that Sweden remained a neutral country.

Also Sweden as every other neutral country was not neutral just because it was not engaging in the war. The neutral treaty was an official writen document signed whit all the major forces (USA, Great Britain, USSR, Germany) and breaking it would have had wery serious consequences.

A few hours in 1940 and about a day of fighting in 1943 is not enough for a new OOB in my oppinion. Denmark as a country whit free will and political power did not exist during the time of German occupation so it should not be in the game, at least during the years of 1941-1945. I doubt the Danish Army was nothing more than a national puppet for the people to keep them happy. I cant see that they could have really attacked Germany or Sweden under the Danish flag in those years. Bottom line is that Denmark had capitulated in 1940.

IMHO every country in-game should seize to be available after they were conquered or turned neutral. Whatif scenarions can still be created using the Editor even if the country is unavailable for a random battle at that date.

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Why 1941? What happened in 1941? Also, the Danish goverment did excercise a large degree of control until 1943.

But German attacked the Danish Army in 1943. The Army had most of its weapons available and was primarily disarmed because the German military command in Denmark did not want to have it in their rear in case of an allied invasion.

So France should be removed in June 1940?

I dont think your ideas quite manage to reflect how complex the political situation was in Europe during WWII and your suggestions would remove the possibility of many odd and interesting encounters. I guess I take quite the opposite point of view. Rather than reducing the game to a limited number of countries available at very limited periods, it should be expanded as much as the developers have the time and energy for. Once you've played your 253rd German vs US encounter, that tends to get a bit old, so being able to do something odd like Belgium vs Italy in Etheopia 1941 or Denmark vs Germany in 1943 is what adds flavour to the game and, together with the many SPCAMO improvements, makes it playable still, 10 years after it first came out.

Claus B

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

Sweden was not at war 1930-1940 either yet you think a Swedish OOB might be allowed during this time...? That is a bit odd IMHO, the greatest threat of invasion came in 1942 in conjunction with the February crisis...? Not to mention the far advanced preparations for marching into Danmark/Norway in 1945…? Won’t be able to play those scenarios if you have your way.

US Army and USMC OOBs should be eliminated prior to Dec 1941 as well maybe...? It being a neutral country and all...?

You don't count intelligence co-operation then..., not even Stella Polaris…?


No? When does it begin to count then…?

Official opinion heh… http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
It was convenient. Nobody was fooled by the so called neutrality.

The neutrality that never was…
It’s a myth.

The neutrality was broken on such numerous occasions during WWII and after that it’s almost like a poor joke.

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

I agree with Claus. Include instead of reduce, the more possibileties the better. The ones who prefer to play that 254th German vs US encounter can still do it. For us who don't mind a little variation here's to hoping a Danish OOB gets included some time in the future.

If it does, we're coming you know. Dubbel svensk lösen! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

http://www.smb.nu/images/pos/9707_per_albin3_2.gif

Re: WINSPWW2?
 

It is a great asset to the game to have these so-called 'minor' countries represented. Too many games (not to mention history texts) fail to give enough exposure to the roles played by these countries.

Even if a particular country did not mobilize an invasion force or other large scale operation there are often countless small internal engagements where the military or militia was used in countering sabotage, searching for escaped prisoners of war, civil uprising or even unofficial covert operations. These types of actions are prime material for gameplay and in my experience with the various SP games are often my favorites.

If someone is willing to spend the time to include these countries it can only benefit the entire SP community.

Rubberneck

Re: Danish OOB
 

Just dawned on my, that the Danish OOB should really be expanded to 1945 (or 1946 for what-ifs) as there was a brigade of Danish troops training in Sweden, equipped with Swedish weapons and intended to land in Denmark in case of an allied invasion. In the end, they sailed over when the Germans capitulated.
As per Wulfirs post - Swedish neutrality had a flexible quality to it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Claus B