Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

Usually Lich + staff + skullface + ring of sorcery (30 astral gems if forged with hammer). If you can forge the sceptre of dark regency (+3 staff) you can use that one as well.

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

gift of reason... not in my spellbooks..

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

Gift of Reason: thaumaturgy 4, nature 3, 25 gems - see manual for details.

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

ether warriors are actually rather good against rlyeh, by virtue of all carrying moonblades....

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

I am thinking about an Oracle W4 E4 S9 versus F4 W4 S9

what do you think about it ?

E4 will be very useful for
1°) mages and revig versus +2 ATK for Vestals
2°) forging hammer => research skull cost fall at 7D
3°) a lot of spells from construction (Golem, Dragon, ...).

Indeed I plan to rush construct 8 for uniques items like +3D staff

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

yeah frostmorne I knew that.. I'm just not really into the whole 3 nature thingie http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif.. and I must say.. 25 gems more than triples the gem cost of the tartarians.. I just keep casting 2 a turn atm and see what happens http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif.. I'm now fighting abyssia in the seas.... it's annoying that not all undead titans can go into water... a bug?

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

As not all undead can enter water I would say it is not a bug. You should be able to give them a ring of water breathing.

I do not know if it has been meantioned before. Do not use Shadow Vestals against astral nations. Solar rays are just Evocation lvl 2 and will exterminate your Vestals. They could also mind duel your Theurgs.

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

Well, Mathusalem... that oracle will be a bit flawed. The bless is nice, but with no recruitable earth mages, you may go without finding any earth gem producing sites. In that case, you'll have to convert astral pearls to earth gems for Gnome Lore. A decent rate of change, at least. And it is possible, though rare, that you'll cast a site search spell nine times without finding anything of that path.

As there are a few astral sites with earth gems, you may find some if you are patient. But in the early game, you can't depend on any earth income, especially being immobile. Also, if you have the appropriate neighbors, consider conquering the nearest earth-based nation, if you can. If they've found most of the sites for you, all the better. Of course, there is Acashic Record, but it is a bit pricey.

You may get lucky, but equally likely is that you'll be horribly pinched for earth gems in the early game. You can depend on it later in the game, though. Perhaps go for a dormant or imprisoned pretender. Spend those points on diversifying your bless. Air can make you even harder to hit by missiles, including those inevitable flaming arrows. Blood 4 will give +2 strength, which can help.

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

I'm going to be starting an MP game soon, playing MA Ermor, and I'm playing around with Pretender builds. I'm resurrecting a slightly aged thread here to ask a question:

Is +1 defense, +50% movement, and +50% attacks to your vestals really worth 7 Dominion Scales?

Azeal and DrP both present Imprisoned Oracle pretenders with W9S9. When I was examining this build, I noticed that to go from W4 to W9 costs 280 points, for which all you get is +1 defense and the water bless on your sacreds. Or for that 280 points you could go from Sloth-3 and Growth 0, to Prod-3 and Growth-1 (or Growth 3/Prod 0/Luck -1, and so on). Going from Water-4 to Water-9 on your Pretender nets you almost *nothing* in greater magical power, so it's not even factored as a consideration here. (You could also, for those 280 points, take any two of Fire-4, Blood-4, and Earth-4, for +2 attack, strength, and/or reinvigoration respectively--and then still have room for N2 as well, which all allows for greater crafting/summoning diversity...)

I'm having problems picking the final stats on my pretender. So convince me you're right! ; ) What would you recommend? Do you think it's better to enhance the vestals, improve the scales, or take multiple magic paths? Or even to use an entirely different pretender build? And why?

Thanks,

IndyPendant.

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

it gives you +3 defense not +1, and 50% more attacks makes them (slightly more than) 50% more valuable units, not counting the defense bonus...

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

Well, maybe I could have been clearer, but I meant that W4 gives you +2 defense. W9 gives you +3 defense and half-quickness. So the net difference between W4 and W9, for 280 pretender points, is +1 defense and water bless...

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

I think W9 is pretty well mandatory for these guys. you could just try an f4w4?4 bless, take production, and have them backed by a bunch of principe/hastatii/alae, but I think you will find that your expansion is significantly curtailed.

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

Crazy Vestal hordes is fun. With a big water bless, they can attack rear faster to get rid of pesky archers and dangerous mages (and when they get there, they kill them 50% faster too!)
Edit: Please note I'm not saying just take a W9 bless .. I think protection-zero ethereal Vestals are the optimal nation for S9W9, so take both blesses.

If you are building vestal hordes, you don't need Prod-3. Sloth-3 does the job just fine. You don't need growth because your only old age unit has death magic.

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

The most standard MA Ermor opening is to use a S9 oracle with good scales. Get animators + nether darts and just expand like crazy since you have both principes + animators and vestals to allow you to take over indies with easy.

Re: MA Ermor advice please
 

W4 is +2 Defense, W9 is +4 Defense, that's a difference of 2 Defense. (And of course the quickness)