Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

My SP "having my *** handed to me " story goes back to the Original SP playing a long campaign as the Germans ( so considerably fewer units to deal with ) and I had, over time carefully preserved my core and built up to the best I could buy from the stock SP1 OOB up to Dec 1944.

Everything went well up to January 1945 when the AI unleashed an air attack like I had never seen before or since that devastated most of my armour. I had the previous save game so I tried again...... again hell from the sky..... restarted a third time -------same thing no matter what I tried to do differently. The AI unleashed a swarm of aircraft and I still have very clear memories of it. This would have been 1996

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

One more reason to like this game.

Oh yeah, till this moment air was my main threat. Their Mig-31something just kept attacking me, with quite good results for them. Unfortunately my Patriots rarely fired and my ASRAD rarely hit. No complaints, just stating that airplanes can be a pain. :)

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Some Area SAM can have longer min ranges than the map size - in which case they would only be useful for shooting at planes making stand-off attacks, not those coming on the map itself, helos etc.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Not been following heavily but the most obvious thing to take from this is stop always using the best equipment available. I wonder if Russia just expected the Ukraine to capitulate when faced with such a massive force. For the first few days they played nice limiting collateral damage I think that changed when they realised it was not going to be quick as expected.

The big problem is while there is a lot of coverage its cherry picked & biased. The question is who are we watching in action I believe a lot of troops were pulled from the Eastern Military District. My guess as they are facing China probably worse trained & equipment that is not upgraded. As said not following but a lot of vehicles do not seem to have Arena for example.
Is this really a surprise your not talking outfitting a few hundred or at most a few thousand tanks.
Slightly surprising is the level of incompetence shown but we generally only see the success stories. As mentioned elsewhere editing is a wonderful thing to.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

This is a pretty fair and balanced French site (my browser auto translates).

https://lavoiedelepee.blogspot.com/

So far the consensus seems to be that there is a lot of disinformation coming from both sides, the West and the Media seems to support Ukraine and is depicting that Russia is the bad evil invaders (where the US gets a pass for doing the same in the Middle East) and the Russians (almost typed Soviets, lol) has really failed/dropped the ball when it comes to the operational art of war, in particular combined arms.

So its a bloody mess with no end in site.

Hopefully cooler heads will prevail and there will be no thermal nuclear war. But nothing is guaranteed and with the West backed by the frenzied Media wanting a war with Russia and with an idiot like Biden sitting on the button, anyone's guess on our future.

We have gone from a pandemic to the brink of nuclear war in just two short years.

China has remained silent, waiting in the wings to launch there agenda.

And no I don't trust the government, especially the new administration.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

At least you are objective. *sarcasm*

BTW, what the USA or anyone else has done in the past is irrelevant, unless Russia invaded USA. I do NOT agree that USA and allies have done the same thing, but using that hypothetical as an excuse is like robbing someone because someone else has robbed someone third so you might as well rob one yourself.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

War have been fought not necessarily to conquer other people in general, but to conquer the land they live in. To "Expand the Empire" loosely speaking and to take advantage of the geographical and resource situation.

Russia does definitely want to take Ukraine in the long haul. However, their near terms tactical and strategic goals have faltered thus far the drive on Kiev has stopped and with a counter offensive to the NW/NNW and the stiff resistance they are encountering along the S/SE Coast.

Those goal were 1. Take out the capital and Decapite the government. I would argue the following is of more importance 2. Establish a "land bridge" in Eastern Ukraine from the breakaway providences to Crimea and onward to Odessa which would consolidate their 2014 gains and essentially also give them unchallenged control of both the Sea of Azov and the Black Sea.

Anyone seeing where I'm going yet?

About those resources I've seen the following online and CINCLANTHOME has shown it to me on Facebook. Yes, the economics lesson is coming with modification I'll be using the same material but as fact checked by "Snopes" since they did some fact checking. They do the same work as "Onyx" if that doesn't you can check them out yourselves.

Why did Hitler want the Ukraine? Or Russia after WWI? Or "Uncle Joe"
in his time enough so that 3+ million Ukrainians would die from famine? So, their people could get feed instead.

Just before the war it was found that the Ukraine was rich in other natural resources. So, besides the above I'll give what I believe is the rest of the story long term beyond the ego and the past glory of the Soviet Union to be reborn. :rolleyes:

You to look at this as I have from a somewhat purely economic perspective by coupling the following based on what you know or think you know about Russia's natural resources. For instance, Russia is the world's 3rd largest producer of oil in the world accounting for 12% -15% of the world's supply based on source.

So now to Ukraine:
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/wh...kraine-matter/
https://www.emsnow.com/ukrainian-rus...ys-trendforce/

Toyota and I believe, it was Ford will be closing down their USA plants next week for 1 and 2 weeks respectively. Why? Lack of global supply of computer chips that has recently worsened and not from Covid-19 that caused the issue in the first place ~1.5 yrs. ago.

I'm not afraid at all to say that very recently a much more narrowed trend of political views have started to pop up. Which quite frankly, I personally don't appreciate.

When I see pictures of Mariupol, Ukraine I think of the images of London, Hannover (Where my mom lived through MANY bombings as a preteenager.), Cologne, Dresden, Toyko and their more modern counterparts.

My point is, it's nice to be in our homes while others have lost theirs and others as well.

Let's try to keep the politics out of this.

It's damm hard enough to just get reasonable data and information as it is, without having to deal with the rest.

To Andy and Don if I've overstepped my bounds, I extend my apologies.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Yes, in particular.......

AND THIS

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

That happened to me too. SP1, German "Long Campaign". I think I made it to April 45 and there was this battle vs the US Army with plane after plane coming in (IIRC Marauders)...

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Yes that sounds exactly like what happened to me and it was single and double engines aircraft as well. I recall B-25s but it may have been Marauders

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

There is a LOT of seemingly conflicting information and the installation or not of Arena is one of them

This is REPORTED TO BE a photo taken in Ukraine

https://i.redd.it/ld5qkvyflgf81.jpg

The Arena tubes are clearly visible

This is also REPORTED TO BE a photo taken in Ukraine

https://i.redd.it/zw8avc6n0rs61.jpg

That is early style Kontakt ERA

This article from 2017 https://informnapalm.org/en/russia-a...ainian-border/

claims for use by the L/DPR

but it may very well be that there is a wider mix of new and old equipment than assumed but chances are it will be months ( at best ) that we know for sure ( Maybe)

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

About conflicting information.

On the one side we have Ukraine and NATO reports of Russian losses in the 10-15k range in men, but from the Russian side you have an "official" report of 1,300 men in losses.

And then in the media (west and Ukrainian) you have images of tanks lost from 2-5 years ago, and nothing coming out of Russia.

Disinformation and propaganda on both sides.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

10-15K makes more sense than 1300 losses. the first number corresponds to 1.8-2.7 casualties/1000 troops/day. These are normal casualties for conventional operations of high intensity (even higher than that makes sense). The official number is basically a number vs. a very weak opponent, i.e. insurgents or similar type of enemy.

Ukrainian losses are probably on that range too (maybe slightly higher or slightly lower depending on how effective Russian firepower was). Note that losses from both sides can skyrocket if a major operational disaster happens (eg. supply trains breaking down or an encirclement).

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

I am sure folks have read the Russian "official" reports.

"Russia - 1,351 dead and 3,825 wounded. ( 5176 totally looses for first month)
Ukraine - roughly 30,000, 14 thousand - dead, 16 thousand wounded."

And the Ukrainian and NATO reports.

"NATO estimates that, in total, 30,000 to 40,000 Russian troops have been killed, wounded or taken prisoner in Ukraine — an estimate based on the assumption that for every soldier killed, three are wounded, the official added."

So its like both sides are flipping the losses around and neither can be relied on. So it just seems to depend on who or which side you believe is telling the truth.

Most likely we wont know for years to come.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

I will assume a lot of BS by both sides but IMHO the "truth" is probably (maybe) a bit closer to Ukrainian reports than Russians but by how much is unknown and I agree the whole truth will take years to know for sure ( we still don't know for sure what the WW2 casualties actually were ) but that said, 1,300 seems way too low given the amount of fighting and the lack of real progress

5176 vs 30,000 is a HUGE difference. If you halve what the Russians claim as the Ukraine estimate and double the Russian you end up with 10,000 - 15,000 either way, it's a lot on both sides

Has anyone seen a list of Ukraines reported combat casualties?

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Don't know if this guy has been mentioned - most people here is probably familiar with him, he does lists on (equipment) losses where there's some kind of photo or video confirming it - so not likely to be a list of all the losses. He seems to know his stuff though:

https://twitter.com/oryxspioenkop?re...Ctwgr%5Eauthor

https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/0...equipment.html

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

I did a tiny edit on that last post as the quote was wrong

I have seen a post similar made I think by Blazoes earlier on but we have multiple Ukraine related posts and it's difficult to check back but thanks for reposting it. I thought I had saved the link but I hadn't and yes for every vehicle there is confirmation

https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/0...equipment.html

If you look at the first one that is reported to be a T-72B that shows what I thought was supposed to be the Arena launchers
but right now IDK for sure

https://i.postimg.cc/ZbMZg8ct/1366.png

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

The one that is shown as
T-72A: (1, destroyed)

Looks like the one that was shown in that ATGM attack / drone sequence near what looked like a gas station ( the green-roofed buildings )in a small town


https://i.postimg.cc/Prr1LXqZ/58.png

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lem3enNkbV0

One POV this ties in with the posted link above

The premise here is that old equipment DOES NOT make up the bulk of the losses

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

FWIW here's a viddy by an apparently retired US major of British pedigree who served in Iraq as tank commander and Afghanistan as S-3 for his squadron and later as S-1 for a training unit. This is what he has to say about the use of edited footage about combat in Ukraine, including that now-famous ambush of a Russian armored column entering an urban area: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9pVEP0AzZ4&t=2s

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Shared that in one of the links on here as well. We are getting a lot of uhmm, well propaganda and how can I say it nicely, oh yes, bovine excrement from all sides. I personally DO NOT believe anything coming out of the Ukraine or Russia as far as reports go and all of the videos are a bit suspect and as Chieftain says, MISSING CONTEXT.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Yes and that is at least the fourth time it's been posted on these forums ( but I am glad people are watching it )

#23 and #43 on this thread alone

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Oops! Sorry 'bout that.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

I think I am going to cry.
It has finally happened.
Someone who knows the difference between hypothetical and theoretical/in theory.
It feels so good.
Thank you for sharing this video. Not only for the interesting content, but for the detail I mentioned. :)

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

It APPEARS that in some cases at least, the Ukrainians are using drones to spot fall of shot and there is enough drone footage of ambushes to support the idea that this while perhaps not common is not uncommon as well

You can see a drone prepared at one point, small mortars firing and one guy checking his phone

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zCpyRVZw7aM

I am experimenting with observation drones in the light helicopter class as opposed to the AOP aircraft class. This allows full control over where they can go and adjust altitude ( just like a real drone ) AND it allows the drone to act as a FOO

The trade-off for this ability ( they are size zero with TI and 8 EW )is they are not cheap and they are not totally invulnerable to ground fire.

As I said, I'm still in the experimental stage with this but anyone interested can set one up and run their own tests and give feedback. The Icon and photo is just a placeholder for now and sound 19 does not exist in your games so don't use it

https://forum.shrapnelgames.com/atta...1&d=1648380084



and


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V-4Om_4n998

Now that is a $15,000 USD drone but consider what it is capable of

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwCENsYJ-6k

that version is $14,000 CDN ( AND it has a built in range finder)

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

More "questionable" news coverage

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0mwKfc5Ed8

That vehicle was introduced 36-years ago. The latest is the Zavet-D so capturing a vehicle like that while certainly worthwhile it's hardly worth making it a big issue

The tie in between this post, the Zavet-D and the one about drones is the Zavet-D is able to provide data exchange between drones and artillery crews.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

A funny parody, much better if you don't speak Russian, just go with the music and the subtitles. I laughed and thought to share it, for a break.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gSzAnNU4u28

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Well as has been reported thoroughly by reliable sources with analysis from some of our former Top Generals (i.e., U.S. NATO and European Commanders and more.) it looks like from my last post and updated today...

Page 6 Post 67...
"Those goals were 1. Take out the capital and Decapite the government. I would argue the following is of more importance."
Mine now-Currently Ukraine has done over the weekend, and I didn't watch the video as posted from Chieftain(?) and that is to counterattack to the WNW and NW of the capital. They've regained enough ground to push the Russian short and medium range artillery back far enough as not to be a factor for now. Some units have fallen back into Belarus to rest and refit while others have started to dig in. How long this will last is anyone's guess especially since there are also reports some other units have been shifted to the East to consolidate their gains and do what they can to finish off Ukrainian resistance in that part of the country.


"2. Establish a "land bridge" in Eastern Ukraine from the breakaway providences to Crimea and onward to Odessa which would consolidate their 2014 gains and essentially also give them unchallenged control of both the Sea of Azov and the Black Sea."
Mine now- Russian reinforcements have been pulled from Georgia (And there was much celebration!?!) to bolster Russian forces and remove Ukrainian resistance in the Dondas region.

Mariupol is still holding but for how long is the BIG question in importance I take you back to WWII and how important both Cherbourg and Antwerp for the allies' drive to Germany. Some reports indicate they pulled back some units from Odessa to put more pressure on Mariupol.

From both a tactical and strategic point this makes absolute sense to me. It is what I would do before attempting to take Odessa which would be the last major seaport the Ukrainians would have. It should be pointed out it's already under a "light" blockade until more naval units arrive from the Mediterranean Sea (They were already in route and should be there.).

Some of you might have noticed the map behind the Russian Generals from a news brief in Russia that showed Ukraine partitioned, unlike some current news reports (North and South Korea.) it offends my navigation training as I am very much more reminded of East and West Germany. It's a Compass Rose thing for me.

Those are my views as taken not from Cell Phones (When I retired in 2002 it also was retired. And I don't miss it.), Fox News, MSNBC or Blogs. That's how I roll.

Have a great day everyone and CINCLANTHOME got more shots in the mouth then last time. :(

Time to check on her!! :angel:

There "they" are again.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

This seems to be a pretty reasonable appreciation:

https://www.understandingwar.org/bac...sment-march-27

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Now I have watched a few has anyone actually seen a tank kill by a Javelin? They seem oddly missing I have seen MBTLAW & various RPGs kill from the side as you would expect. The video often says its a Javelin but its not.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Thinking that if they were falling short of expectations we would have heard about it by now

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/u...-say-rcna20878



THAT is significant from my POV for three reasons

• This is the first news I have read they have any Spikes
• This is the first news I have read that the Ukrainians have NLOS Spikes.
• I have been testing various NLOS weapons with my drone experiments and the two coupled together is highly effective

https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidax...h=5649222743ca


We do have the Skif in the OOB and I just changed it to make it more selectable to the AI but ( I just discovered ) the Stugna-P was developed from the Skif so that's on the list to investigate ( that may be the Skif 2M-K ATGM W237 ),but I need to investigate further if the Ukrainians do indeed have NLOS Spikes

THIS says they do not

https://www.shephardmedia.com/news/l...s-no-to-spike/

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

If you can do the search in the MBT Thread, you and I covered this ground when discussing getting these on the Ukrainian tanks about 3 years ago. What they had and what was coming most from Ukrainian Industry sources with "outside" ones as well.

Just throwing it out there to save you some work (maybe), we did several posts on the matter.

You might further look at as a reminder, there's a reason the JAVALINs the Ukrainians are using are so effective. Remember also they were to be "under lock and key" with U.S. approved storage and security measures before even one got into country. A couple of the refs included touched on this and the fact they couldn't use them without our authorization. Training missiles were the exception to facilitate training and qualification all addressed in those refs.
Infantry Served Weapons and Organization Page 5/Posts 43 & 44.

It was set up for submission also for the USA.

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

https://www.19fortyfive.com/2022/03/...-so-effective/

Points out again how fluid and flexible "information" is The Forbes article was published Jan 11 and claimed " the Ukrainian army has only a handful of Javelin launchers"

The ABC report that mentioned Spike NLOS was made March 22 but I question it and now we have info thats there are Milans in Ukraine as well

This article claims.....Obviously a lot can ( and apparently had ) happened between Jan 11 and now but that first link claims......

So duel charge AND top attack capable.

We do already have the Stugna in the OOB but it's set up as a vehicle mounted system but there may be more than one "Stugna" and that is what I am investigating now but it would appear that w237 in the OOB now as "Skif 2M-K ATGM" is the larger 152mm missile and w236 is the 130mm verison

https://root-nation.com/en/articles-...ugna-p-review/

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

https://www.lemonde.fr/international...6758_3210.html

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Neither the Javelins nor the Stingers from the US are being shipped as the weapons the US military uses. They have had the most recent classified guidance bits removed and are export versions. This means any updating of the UA kit would have to have different versions developed for use in one game. That may be a bit of a chore. I don't know about the NLAWS. I haven't seen any reports from the UK on what they are sending.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

It may make a slight difference in RL. It won't in the game

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Any idea what this recoilless rifle is?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dKLnX-TcBn8

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

SPG-9 if I'm not mistaken.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

A lot of new things in the Ukrainian OOB for next release.

Recent additions were 40mm Mk 19's. A photo exists of boxes with 40-mm Mk 19 ammo unloaded from an American aircraft at Boryspil Airport on October 10, 2021 and the Supply Classification code for "Machine Gun, 40mm, MK19 Mod III" was seen being unloaded Jan 28. 2022

https://mil.in.ua/uk/news/ssha-pered...atomety-mk-19/

It was recently announced that Australia is sending Bushmaster PMV's that may possibly be in Ukraine in May -June 2022

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

We need to investigate just who uses what armbands like the info on the Russian vehicle markings

Those troops had white bands. Normally Ukraine uses yellow

The text for that video mentions" Russia-backed forces in Mariupol" but earlier footage shows troops in yellow armbands. The ones with the RR are wearing white

One quote found
Soldiers wearing white armbands seen patrolling Ukraine's Kherson
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7YJo2vlGAOQ

That video has this comment.........."hite armband were to indentified this russian brigade as the 17th motorized rifle brigade that were deployed in donbas as early as 2014."

Still digging but it looks like the RR team is not Ukrainian

FURTHER

https://fresno24.com/what-do-the-col...is-the-answer/

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

White Arm Bands - Russian troops as identified early on.

This might explain the other Russian colors.
https://www.forces.net/russia/ribbon...embrance-poppy

Blue or Yellow worn separately or together Ukrainian troops.

Both - Are wearing their country flag patches on their sleeves.

Seen some pointing out in videos and photos where Russian troops are wearing black boots and Ukrainian wearing brown- or dessert-colored ones.

Also found this interesting...
https://www.migjimenez.com/img/cms/P...Colors_ENG.pdf

Also, a bunch of stories about this on the web...I little "psyops"...
https://www.theguardian.com/technolo...ssian-soldiers

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Lots of contradictory stuff out there I read while Israel has been asked several times for Spike they have not supplied any.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

As long as Israel needs Russia's lenience to keep letting them hit targets in Syria, you won't see much direct support. Well...all things considered.

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Good footage from what looks like a Mi-28N getting cut in half from something. According to the video it's a Starstreak missile, though obviously I don't know about that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXnjQmoV2D8

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

As I had already posted, the timing should be right for the Ukraine to start operating them. UK had already shipped them out.
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ce-2022-03-16/
https://www.armyrecognition.com/defe...o_ukraine.html
(This is the one I posted. earlier.)
https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/brit...er-in-ukraine/

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

And this is why distance is important.
I don't think I have seen any more clear footage of an attack on a tank, but at the same time a silly mistake.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n3T8FfOvBBI

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

I had already earlier yesterday morning confirmed the use of the STARSTREAK anti-air missile attack on a Russian Mil Mi-28 Havoc (This is my opinion based on the video.) attack helicopter. The following should bring closure to this issue.

What is different, for whatever reason, is the response from Russia concerning the STARSTREAK. Obviously, it would seem they are much more concerned about STARSTREAK then our STINGER 2 anti-air missile.

The UK STARSTREAK did get updated within the last 3-4 years if memory serves.

Might have to run a comparison between the two systems. I further would point out not to underestimate what or what not they're getting. For instance, the JAVALIN and STINGER 2 missile systems came out of our European pre-deployed storage facilities meant for our troops. How else did they get them so fast at the start of the war?

Unlike the UK, they didn't threaten us over our STINGER 2.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world...e14c131909c239

I have other tasking at the moment.

Don if you see this, know I'm looking onto the Czech T-72 tanks. Along with NATO we've signaled that we'll assist in getting them into the Ukraine.

Also looks like the Ukraine is also from some pictures I've seen, are operating captured Russian T-72B3 tanks. This still needs further investigation on my part. I'm NOT ready to "jump off the bridge" for this yet.
https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...out&li=BBnbfcL

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

It's impossible to keep up with every breaking development in Ukraine. We just try to keep up as best we can

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

Seems Germany is giving BMP-1s to Ukraine from OLD East Germany stocks...I wonder how bad a shape these things will be in?

Re: Updates in light of Ukraine war
 

This may be of interest

Ukrainian Conflict - Tank Recognition

A guide on how to tell apart different tanks that are taking part in the Ukrainian Conflict. Both Russian and Ukrainian tanks are a part of this guide. From T-64BV, T-72B to T-72B3M and T-80BVM, all tanks that have taken part in the conflict so far.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2doYYblaLFU