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-   -   What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=52992)

DRG November 7th, 2023 10:59 AM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 855724)
Latest drone news...

...supposedly, the Ukrainians are now using robot boats to transport jammers into the middle of the Dneipr river to prevent Russian FPV Drone attacks on Ukrainian boats/troops crossing the Dneipr or on the other bank.

Previous attempts to protect crossings with fixed jammers resulted in said jammers eating Iskander-M SRBMs.

BMP-3s *may* get a built in drone jammer

https://twitter.com/Shaimurato13576/...01415154032934

Quote:

BMP-3 will get a FPV jammer, looks like Volnorez on a mast.
Drones in the battlefield are now beginning to incorporate shielding to partially negate GPS jamming:

https://twitter.com/DanielR33187703/...21895138537964

Russian Drone workshops assembling drones in videos are now showing a metal can on a rod -- it appears to be a shielding device that protects GPS receivers from jamming coming from below, while the top is open, allowing GPS signals to be received.




https://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/p...sized_6484.jpg

Suhiir November 12th, 2023 07:17 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
And on the subject of drones/jammers/etc.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jaWV...ist=WL&index=7
48:53

MarkSheppard November 13th, 2023 11:36 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 855725)

The russians are making makeshift RF shields using workshop materials to match commercially available anti-interference shields for GPS receivers:

https://ae01.alicdn.com/kf/Sad32feeb...k-Blue-Red.jpg

The idea is that it blocks signals coming from below the drone (likely to be jamming/interference) but the top (aka GPS signals) are clear.

Anyway. Some more drone stuff dropped -- we've got clear videos/pics of the russian minelaying UGVs

https://twitter.com/TheDeadDistrict/...05538697007109

https://twitter.com/sambendett/statu...61745172328769

Quote:

Continuing the Russian DIY UGV thread - two more small UGVs in this videos: Su-4 small UGV for mining ops that is guided by a small drone, can deliver two 50kg bombs, was tested around Bakhmut, around 15 are at the front; and Su-6 larger UGV combat platform.
https://twitter.com/sambendett/statu...27667624198411

Quote:

Apparently, Russian state media reports that the BRG-1 light UGV (see posts below) will get #AI installed for autonomous ops and greater working range, with tests to take place this October. Taking this with a grain of salt?
https://twitter.com/sambendett/statu...71031953379470

Quote:

Apparently, according to Russian TASS state media, this BRG-1 UGV is now officially used by the military for evacuating injured and delivering supplies. Earlier test runs in a short thread below.

MarkSheppard November 15th, 2023 07:02 AM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
Another issue for 2025 and onwards is that we're seeing datalinks proliferate to the ground user.

One of the big reasons Ukraine's offensive slowed down was because of the KA-52 Black Shark fleet; specifically the newer model -- Ka-52M which has the LMUR (ЛМУР -- Легкая многоцелевая управляемая ракета) Legkaya Mnogotselevaya Upravlyayemaya Raketa, lit. 'Light Multipurpose Guided Rocket'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LMUR

The LMUR is a big boy -- 100 kg and a 25 kg warhead (versus Hellfire's 50 kg and 9 kg warhead); but what makes it so dangerous is that it's the first real "digital/datalinked" weapon the Russians have and it has an extremely long range of 14.5 km.

LMUR has two modes:

Mode 1: The target is marked by the operator before launch, and the carrier helicopter can turn away directly after the missile launch -- essentially "fire and forget" Hellfire logic.

But what's new is Mode 2.

Mode 2: The missile is launched by the Ka-52M without on-board target lock. The LMUR flies towards a point selected by the operator; with GPS guidance and transmits what it's seeker sees back to the launching platform. The operator can then look at what the LMUR sees and select a target (or change it) while the missile is flying towards it.

LMUR is the only Russian ATGM capable of this -- and this Mode 2 is the only one in which it reaches the 14.5 km range.

In Ukraine, the Russians have used UAS Drones to spot enemy targets, with the target location/information being passed on to nearby Ka-52Ms who launch their LMURs into the blue (for them). This is extremely effective, because the Ka-52M can destroy targets without exposing themselves personally to Ukranian air defenses and LMUR's 14+ km range means they can stay out of range of a large portion of Ukranian air defenses.

Ukraine now has received an ATGM that operates upon the same "datalink" principles:

https://www.armyrecognition.com/defe...o_ukraine.html

Quote:

On November 9, Défense & Sécurité Internationale posted a tweet broadcasting a short speech by Lionel Royer-Perreaut, a member of the French National Assembly, during a hearing of the Defense Commission dedicated to the French military assistance to Ukraine. A delivery so far unnoticed, he confirmed the supply of Akeron MP ATGMs, among other weapon systems consisting mainly of Mistral air defense missiles, CAESAR self-propelled howitzers and TRF1 155mm towed howitzers.
Akeron MP operates much like LMUR -- Mode 1 (Fire & Forget) or Mode 2 (Post-Launch Targeting) -- so while an individual Akeron ATGM operator may not be able to see a target; he can be told via other methods that there's a target, and launch into the blind and target after launch.

DRG November 15th, 2023 10:53 AM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 855736)

In Ukraine, the Russians have used UAS Drones to spot enemy targets, with the target location/information being passed on to nearby Ka-52Ms who launch their LMURs into the blue (for them). This is extremely effective because the Ka-52M can destroy targets without exposing themselves personally to Ukranian air defenses and LMUR's 14+ km range means they can stay out of range of a large portion of Ukranian air defenses.


The game already allows this .( more or less)

A recce Drone can be used to call in an NLOS weapon and a NLOS weapon can be carried by a Helo

...... the combination is very effective

What we don't have are Russian NLOS weapons and we don't use NLOS weapons as off-map assets

EDIT


What I can say now is off map NLOS units can be built and they work REALLY WELL with drones and they also Counter Battery very well

As in "Thunderbolts from Thors hammer Mjölnir" well

DRG November 16th, 2023 06:37 AM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
Something we need to identify as these weapons evolve is which would be or should be, classed as NLOS as opposed to just being a "normal" ATGM system or should there be one of each....a Mode 1 (Fire & Forget) and a Mode 2 (Post-Launch Targeting).

The issue is unit cost ( and weapon and unit slots ) two ATGM that are the same except one uses a multi charge ATGM weapns class so is a F&F/ Mode 1 unit and the other uses the designated NLOS weapons class--- the NLOS team will be roughly 100 points more expensive --but also more effective-- in the game when coupled with drone control

That said a NLOS unit can target as direct fire and NLOS so one NLOS unit would probably be simpler for everyone

DRG November 16th, 2023 02:39 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 855736)

One of the big reasons Ukraine's offensive slowed down was because of the KA-52 Black Shark fleet; specifically the newer model -- Ka-52M which has the LMUR (ЛМУР -- Легкая многоцелевая управляемая ракета) Legkaya Mnogotselevaya Upravlyayemaya Raketa, lit. 'Light Multipurpose Guided Rocket'.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LMUR

The LMUR is a big boy -- 100 kg and a 25 kg warhead (versus Hellfire's 50 kg and 9 kg warhead); but what makes it so dangerous is that it's the first real "digital/datalinked" weapon the Russians have and it has an extremely long range of 14.5 km.

LMUR ?......... If that thing doesn't get code named ELMER I will be very surprised
https://forum.shrapnelgames.com/atta...1&d=1700160055

DRG November 16th, 2023 02:52 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
There is info I can use for the game if anyone finds it..... so far I have struck out
  1. How many Elmers can an KA-52 carry ?
  2. If anyone finds a list of NLOS capable ATGM that includes Elmer post it, please.

Thanks

For now, temporary I figure since they weigh twice what the Vikir does it can carry half as many but that's just a WAG

scorpio_rocks November 16th, 2023 03:35 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
Looks like the Mi-28 carries 2 on each pylon in the places it is visible in the photos/vids here:
https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zon...ile-in-ukraine

"The helicopter carries two LMUR missiles on a twin APU-L rail on the outer pylon under the right wing; the other pylon is empty. It’s not possible to see exactly what’s hanging under the left wing, except for an extra fuel tank. In another video, published a few days earlier by the Ugolok_Sitha channel, a Mi-28NM is seen carrying one LMUR missile under its right wing (on an APU-L twin rail), with a B8V-20 rocket launcher and an additional fuel tank under the left wing."

so 2 for every 6 or 8 Vikhr / Ataka

DRG November 16th, 2023 04:27 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
OK. 4 works for me

EDIT

The caption for this is "The APU-L double rail for LMUR missiles."

https://www.thedrive.com/uploads/202...=70&width=1920

DRG November 17th, 2023 02:06 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
It's difficult to outrun a drone in the open

https://youtu.be/voshtfn9PRM

MarkSheppard November 22nd, 2023 06:47 AM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
Excerpts from a Twitter thread on the life of a "mobile" drone operator

https://twitter.com/NOELreports/stat...97077518151973

Quote:

A DAY AT THE FRONT - The 28th mechanized

We spent a day with the 28th mechanized brigade, operating in eastern Ukraine. In this thread we give an honest insight of what we saw and what the current situation is at the front.

A story with
@guillaume_ptak
and
@PDocumentarians

...

We woke up at 3:30am and met the press-officer of the 28th Mechanized Brigade in Kramatorsk. We had to move under the cover of darkness so as to avoid being targeted by the Russian FPV drones now plaguing Ukrainian defenders on the frontline....

...

According to the officer, FPV drones are responsible for the vast majority of casualties now sustained by Ukrainian soldiers in eastern Ukraine. After meeting the drone operators, we jumped in the back of their flat-bed truck and set out towards the cold and snowy frontline....

...


After finally getting the drone to work, they flew it out towards the frontline but quickly lost its signal. The onset of winter has proven an obstacle for drones operators, as batteries discharge faster in the cold and the humidity interferes with the signal....


....

Andrii apologized to us, and explained that their work for the day was over. However, they would have to stay at the position until evening, making their way back under the cover of darkness. Artillery shells kept landing in the distance, on Russian positions....
Seems drones on both sides have forced everyone to a semi-nocturnal lifestyle -- i.e. personnel & equipment resupply has to operate under conditions of darkness or very bad weather, lest ubiquitous FPS drones strike.

...

Returning to Lasers:

https://twitter.com/AirPowerNEW1/sta...87727758627172

Quote:

While power levels are not the only consideration, early DOD evaluations with first and second gen. solid state HEL's has led to the following:

🔸5-15kW: Group 1 & 2 [UAV] defeat
🔸20kW: G 1, 2 & 3 [UAV] defeat
🔸50-60kW: G 1,2 & 3 [UAVs] + RAM [Rockets & Mortars] & some CM [Cruise Missiles]
🔸100-300kW: Long-Range Rockets & Cruise Missiles
Back to drones...

We finally know what "Baba Yaga" is -- the mysterious Ukrainian Drone that Russians have been calling that.

https://twitter.com/PStyle0ne1/statu...98616020283439

Essentially, the AFU have been using a large, heavy drone as a "mothership" -- most Drones only have a range of 5 to 8 km, limited by both batteries and line of sight propagation of radio for control signals.

The Baba Yaga drone acts as a mothership, carrying smaller drones deep into the battlefield, before releasing them and then acting as a mobile radio relay at an altitude of 1000m for the released drones. This lets AFU strike 20 to 30 km into the rear with drones that normally could only strike 5 to 8 km.

MarkSheppard November 22nd, 2023 08:01 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
I'm basically turning this thread into a dumping place for "new tactics, new technologies"; rather than a raw OOB thread, because there's a lot of changes going on now.

Konrad Muzyka visited Southern Ukraine with Kofman, [Rob] Lee, and Gady -- it was detailed in this paywalled article:

https://rochanconsulting.substack.co...or-impressions

But some people cut and pasted it. The things of most interest to this thread:

Quote:

The war is also very drone-centric. There could be 20 drones flying near the frontline along the 10 km wide front. Neither side has the ability to achieve a tactical surprise unless an attack is launched in drone adverse weather (rain with very heavy winds); Readiness to respond to ground attacks is very high. We saw Russian troops (a platoon) walking towards the frontline. Once they were detected, they were engaged by mortars within 30 seconds and by artillery cluster munitions after an additional four minutes. Both sides have capabilities to ISR opposing forces' tactical depths;
(emphasis mine).

The "detect to destroy" cycle is very short now. :shock:

Dion November 22nd, 2023 09:30 PM

Re: What happens in 2025?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 855758)
The Baba Yaga drone acts as a mothership, carrying smaller drones deep into the battlefield, before releasing them and then acting as a mobile radio relay at an altitude of 1000m for the released drones. This lets AFU strike 20 to 30 km into the rear with drones that normally could only strike 5 to 8 km.

Sounds like "No Mans Land" has been extended exponentially, making the front to big for conventional weapons, making Weapons of Mass Destruction a viable choice again. Sounds deadly, for both soldiers and civilians alike. It's like WWI all over again, but with high technology. Looks like SPWWIII is becoming more viable all the time. I don't know how practical a new title would be though. I say just extend the game beyond 2025, a simple solution for a complicated situation, at least until we figure out a better way to do it.

MarkSheppard November 29th, 2023 08:53 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
GPS guided bombs from standoff distances are playing a larger part:

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GAF7OtWW...jpg&name=small

Russians are starting to serially produce helicopter UAS:

https://twitter.com/Karmabash/status...96852709884036

https://t.me/mertviorku/3813

Quote:

Serial production of new unmanned Termit helicopters was shown in the Russian Federation - Defense Express

They can carry three laser-guided missiles and fire at a distance of up to six kilometers. The drone itself reaches a speed of 150 km/h and can stay in the air for up to six hours.

It is noted that drones were being developed even before the invasion of Ukraine, and at least three of them are at a high level of readiness.
https://twitter.com/sambendett/statu...61730954608865

Quote:

Russia's PPSh Lab is starting to mass-produce its "Triton" counter-FPV system that can be mounted on tanks, vehicles and stationary targets; the backpack version is for assault ground troops - presumably that backpack can suppress FPV drone signals as well.
Ukraine is now placing UGVs into service

https://twitter.com/anno1540/status/1698599349859578357

Quote:

the ground drone "Karakurt" has appeared in the service of the Armed Forces of Ukraine , the "Engineering Corps" association, which is engaged in the development of equipment for our military.

The drone is good at overcoming trenches and earthen embankments. It was named after the most poisonous spider found in Ukraine - the karakurt. This ground drone was developed on the basis of a gyroboard. It can be made in 2 days with a team of 3-4 people. Now there are dozens of them on the front lines.
https://twitter.com/front_ukrainian/...98508582990192

Quote:

Russian sources write that the Armed Forces of 🇺🇦Ukraine, in addition to kamikaze aerial drones, are beginning to use remote-controlled ground drones. Mobile drones are maneuverable and silent. According to Russian soldiers, these drones have a heat sensor, as soon as they get close, the drone detonates
https://twitter.com/PStyle0ne1/statu...94103283859909

Quote:

New weapon used by Ukraine per Russian report

A ground drone loaded with explosive to clear Russian trenches ahead of an assault

This one, unfortunately, did not work out as intended

DRG November 30th, 2023 07:35 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
https://sundries.ua/en/ukrainian-arm...he-first-time/

MarkSheppard January 12th, 2024 08:53 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
More UGVs:

Footage of the Ukranian minelaying UGVs in the front:

https://twitter.com/clashreport/stat...07371711410391
Ukrainian unmanned ground vehicles are being at the front for laying anti-tank mines.

The AFU has deployed to combat the "Ironclad" UGV, which is armed with the Remote weapon station SHABLYA + thermal sight

https://twitter.com/Alfaiomi/status/1745848837732745631
https://twitter.com/infussambas/stat...26258867679650

It seems that AFU is now deploying fixed site versions of the Shablya RWS:

https://www.defenceconnect.com.au/la...use-by-ukraine

Three of the armed and thermal/video image-equipped RWS, built by Lviv robotics manufacturer Roboneers, have been approved for use by the Armed Forces of Ukraine, according to a Ministry of Defence (MOD) statement published late last year.

...

The Ukrainian MOD has approved the ShaBlya remote weapon station for use in conducting reconnaissance, identifying targets on the battlefield, for checkpoint and border defence as well as offensively engaging infantry, lightly armoured combat vehicles, unmanned aerial vehicles, and suppressing opposing firing positions.

The rotating tripod turret system can reportedly be armed with a 7.62mm, M240 or M2 machine gun, automatic grenade launcher and other weapons to engage targets up to 1,200 metres away. It has also previously been shown using a Steamdeck console as its controller and aiming maintained on a video monitor from a distance of 100 metres via direct cable.


Or basically...

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/c...ORK/img-66.jpg

Suhiir January 12th, 2024 11:05 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 855776)

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 855870)
The AFU has deployed to combat the "Ironclad" UGV, which is armed with the Remote weapon station SHABLYA + thermal sight
https://twitter.com/Alfaiomi/status/1745848837732745631
https://twitter.com/infussambas/stat...26258867679650

I expect to see a LOT of these, or something similar, in future conflicts.

MarkSheppard January 13th, 2024 12:35 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
This will only increase as the world faces a manpower crunch due to collapsing birthrates.

You'll see this with the increasing penetration of UGVs to do tasks traditionally seen as manpower intensive or very dangerous:

Minelaying
Mineclearing
Scouting
Manning fixed defensive lines

IOW; with a TFR of less than 2.1 in many countries; you can't just scout using the traditional method of "drive down that road until something happens or you get blown up" (aka advance to contact).

Not enough manpower anymore to be like that. So robots will be the ones advancing to contact.

Dion January 14th, 2024 04:08 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
I know a lot of robots that would be really good at that, especially the ones who call you and can talk. Not only the robots, but also the people that run them too, people who think they are protected by the constitutional right of free speech to program robots to trick the gullible to answer questions that make people feel foolish for answering, then asking the person for money based on how they answer the question. What a disgrace.

Felix Nephthys January 15th, 2024 02:14 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Dion (Post 855894)
I know a lot of robots that would be really good at that, especially the ones who call you and can talk. Not only the robots, but also the people that run them too, people who think they are protected by the constitutional right of free speech to program robots to trick the gullible to answer questions that make people feel foolish for answering, then asking the person for money based on how they answer the question. What a disgrace.

Can this be modeled in the game? Seriously though, this is a story I'd like to hear more about. They have blackmail droids now?

Dion January 15th, 2024 03:06 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Ya, people will do anything for money. These "droids" speak perfect English, they don't even have an accent, they laugh and everything. I hate talking to anybody on the phone nowadays that I don't know. People are getting scammed on the phone all the time.

Suhiir January 15th, 2024 04:55 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Few weeks ago some telemarketer was calling me 5-10 times a day with different offers (i.e. scams) and was using a different "voice" for each. It could/did answer certain basic questions but the general speale was always the same so that sort of gave it away.

DRG January 17th, 2024 10:18 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 855878)
This will only increase as the world faces a manpower crunch due to collapsing birthrates.

IOW; with a TFR of less than 2.1 in many countries; you can't just scout using the traditional method of "drive down that road until something happens or you get blown up" (aka advance to contact).

Not enough manpower anymore to be like that. So robots will be the ones advancing to contact.

Its a lot simpler to "order" a robot to " Go over to that tree line and draw fire"

That ties in with something I noticed recently in building a little scenario to "simulate" that engagement between the Ukrainian Bradleys and the T-90 attached

In the game it's trickier than RL as the T-90 can detect the Brads no matter which way it's facing

You need to dismount the troops in the Brads to distract i.e "draw fire" OR you use the drone that I added to simulate the one that was used to record the event

Even then, it's tricky getting the Brads into position without losing one

MarkSheppard January 18th, 2024 07:51 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Begun these Drone Wars, they have...

https://i.imgur.com/ml2ExxK.png
UGV used by Russian forces to deliver ammo in sights of Ukrainian FPV drone.

Also, the happiest dog and his new drone friend....

https://twitter.com/front_ukrainian/...43593367478592
(Testing of a new AFU Ground Combat Drone armed with RPK)

MarkSheppard January 20th, 2024 10:41 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
https://twitter.com/wartranslated/st...81037821919526

Ukrainian EW and drone specialist Serhii Flash estimates the effectiveness of Ukrainian FPVs to be around 30%, highly dependent on the unit.

Quote:

Дуже багатьох цікавить питання ефективності FPV.

До целi долітає та попадае 30% FPV. Це середня цифра по країни. І то її ніхто ніколи не рахував, це просто моє припущення. В одних підрозділів вона може бути часом 70%, а в інших 20%.

Залежить це від таких факторів:
1. Якість БПЛА
2. Правильний підбір частот та протоколів для конкретної ділянки фронту
3. Активність російського РЕБ на дільниці фронту
4. Досвід пілотiв
5. Правильність та достовірність розвідки

Бувае так шо одним підрозділам постiйно дають «жирні» та точні цілі і вонi мають успішність 60%. Їх ставлять у приклад, всіх тягнуть під їхній показник, натомість замовчуючи, як він досягається

Я прошу великих командирів на фронтах «не гнати план». Зростання показників має бути з МІСЯЦЯМИ. Це означає, що підрозділ розвивається.
Але успішність на усiх фронтах різна.

Якщо цікавить моя особиста думка, то довгостроковий показник 50% - це дуже, дуже хороший результат. Але не завжди його реально досягти.
Quote:

Many are interested in the question of FPV efficiency.

30% FPV reaches and hits the target. This is the average figure for the country. And no one has ever counted her, this is just my guess. In some divisions, it can sometimes be 70%, and in others 20%.

It depends on the following factors:

1. UAV quality
2. Correct selection of frequencies and protocols for a specific section of the front
3. The activity of the Russian EW on the front line
4. Experience of pilots
5. Correctness and reliability of intelligence

It happens that some divisions are constantly given "fat" and precise goals and they have a success rate of 60%. They are set as an example, everyone is dragged under their indicator, instead of keeping silent about how it is achieved

I ask the great commanders on the fronts "not to pursue the plan." The increase in indicators should be with MONTHS. This means that the unit is developing.

But success on all fronts is different.

If you're interested in my personal opinion, a long-term figure of 50% is a very, very good result. But it is not always realistic to achieve it.

MarkSheppard January 22nd, 2024 11:11 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
The famous Bradley that mogged that T-90 has a drone jammer on the turret.

https://twitter.com/TheDeadDistrict/...15646653948411

Apparently the average range of this type of jammer that AFU is using widely is 40 to 80 meters.

It doesn't stop drones from hovering 200-400 meters away and taking video of you with zoom lens; but it does mitigate a little bit of the suicide FPV drone threat...

...with one caveat...

...you've got to be moving. A jamming range of 40-50m means that if you're stationary; even if you jam a suicide FPV drone in it's attack dive, the ballistics of the drone will mean that it has a good chance of hitting you.

Rough figures...

Objects in free fall drop about 25 m/sec.

Average height of a 10-story building is about 30-35m.

A FPV UAV in power dive takes maybe 1 to 1.2 seconds to hit the target.

Bradleys are 6.55m long...figure an average speed of 7 m/sec so that a Bradley can clear it's own length through the aim point for the FPV UAV operator.

That's roughly 25 km/hr (or 15.6 mph).

Essentially, from the math above; if you have a EW Jammer...movement is life.

EDIT: I just realized that Drones themselves are causing combined arms. They force units to be mobile to avoid drone attack runs; which in turn makes the units visible and targets for other weapons systems on the battlefield.

EDIT II -- and of course someone pointed out that the NEXT generation of FPV kamikaze drones coming online will have machine recognition and AI tracking (currently available in larger stuff like Lancets); so they'd be able to track through jamming; unlike a remotely human operated UAV using a datalink.

DRG January 22nd, 2024 03:16 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
"Slightly" off topic but it's not worth making a new thread

https://www.pravda.com.ua/eng/news/2024/01/22/7438289/
https://i.imgur.com/sy8Vysy.png

A the bottom of the map are given the distance of the Russian advances

500m x 700 m = 10 game hexes by 14 game hexes

450m x 140 m = 9 hexes by 3 ( rounded )

150m = 3 game hexes

They are advances but.......

https://blogger.googleusercontent.co...HmJ0=w488-h640

Suhiir January 23rd, 2024 03:09 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
The more I see from Ukraine the more I'm reminded of WWI.

Minus:
Gas
Modern counter-batter makes prolonged artillery pounding a non-issue.
Modern AA makes air strikes VERY difficult.
Suicide drones make even mortars much less of a problem.

DRG January 23rd, 2024 07:19 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Suhiir (Post 855951)
The more I see from Ukraine the more I'm reminded of WWI.


To paraphrase and slightly adjust a quote widely attributed to Stalin....

" in a war of attrition, quantity has a quality all it's own"



Ukraine Population (July 2021 est.) 43,745,640
Russia Population (July 2021 est.) 142,320,790

MarkSheppard January 23rd, 2024 07:22 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Felix Nephthys (Post 855906)
Seriously though, this is a story I'd like to hear more about. They have blackmail droids now?

OK, this is a slight detour from SPCAMO games, but I think it's worthy to tell in some detail, if nothing else but to get the word out so that people are less likely to fall for scams.

Okay.

AI blackmail / Whitemail is a variant of the old "bad news" scam:

You get a message or phone call in the middle of the night saying that your son/daughter has been in a car accident / been arrested / whatever; and that they need money (which of course is gonna be gift cards).

What makes AI Black/Whitemail so much more dangerous is that AI is advanced enough to "fake a voice" if given a sufficiently long speech sample -- maybe 20 seconds of you talking might be enough for them to make an AI to fake your voice with 85% accuracy.

So now, instead of a super sketchy text message saying that your son has been in an accident -- it literally sounds like your son/daughter is calling you -- maybe from jail; maybe from the hospital, doesn't matter.

AI voice algorithms have also given new life to the "indian call center scam" -- i.e. you get a call from "Microsoft Tech Support" saying that they've detected a virus on your computer; and if you would do the needful, they can fix it for you (which entails you setting up a remote connection to their PC, allowing them to steal everything of note on your hard drive).

The Indian Call Center Scam has been slowly dying out as people now refuse to answer any calls which have Indian accents.

Enter real time voice AI synthesization -- now they don't sound like Pradvisha from Delhi, but John from Peoria.

It's not 100% though; because of the limited english skills of a lot of these call center scammers; they mangle the verbs and syntax of english, so even though they now sound like Bob from Peoria, they are asking you to do the needful.

In a military context; there's a lot you could do with AI voice/visual synthesization (Deep Fakes). For example, you could fake the voice and video of a commanding officer and tell his troops to surrender; or insert fake orders into the command stream -- even if they're countermanded by real orders in the secure encrypted text communications system, it's still uncertainity that slows down the speed of execution of orders if you have to verify each one.

There's also some nastiness; like possibly using AI/Video deepfakes to break POWs to make them give you information; a variant of the "we have captured your children. You will give us your bank account information or we do bad things to them -- and then cut to AI generated audio/video of your children begging for their lives -- a "virtual kidnapping"

https://www.cnn.com/2023/04/29/us/ai...cec/index.html

Quote:

Jennifer DeStefano’s phone rang one afternoon as she climbed out of her car outside the dance studio where her younger daughter Aubrey had a rehearsal. The caller showed up as unknown, and she briefly contemplated not picking up.

But her older daughter, 15-year-old Brianna, was away training for a ski race and DeStefano feared it could be a medical emergency.

“Hello?” she answered on speaker phone as she locked her car and lugged her purse and laptop bag into the studio.

She was greeted by yelling and sobbing.

“Mom! I messed up!” screamed a girl’s voice.

“What did you do?!? What happened?!?” DeStefano asked.

“The voice sounded just like Brie’s, the inflection, everything,” she told CNN recently. “Then, all of a sudden, I heard a man say, ‘Lay down, put your head back.’ I’m thinking she’s being gurnied off the mountain, which is common in skiing. So I started to panic.”

As the cries for help continued in the background, a deep male voice started firing off commands: “Listen here. I have your daughter. You call the police, you call anybody, I’m gonna pop her something so full of drugs. I’m gonna have my way with her then drop her off in Mexico, and you’re never going to see her again.”

DeStefano froze. Then she ran into the dance studio, shaking and screaming for help. She felt like she was suddenly drowning.

After a chaotic, rapid-fire series of events that included a $1 million ransom demand, a 911 call and a frantic effort to reach Brianna, the “kidnapping” was exposed as a scam. A puzzled Brianna called to tell her mother that she didn’t know what the fuss was about and that everything was fine.

lansoar January 27th, 2024 01:08 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
CHATGPT! ..well maybe not. :). hopefully the dedicated will remain.

we all want a WinSPMBT with ai Drones connected to Amazon.com and remote MBT's with alien armor alloys.

MarkSheppard February 3rd, 2024 10:55 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
New stuff just dropped, babe:

https://twitter.com/markito0171/stat...68549583311286
https://twitter.com/SenftPatrick/sta...20941415498026

Ukrainian military used a UGV and drove it 4 km (2.5 miles) behind enemy lines to deliver a KZ-4 demolition charge to drop a bridge:

https://twitter.com/SenftPatrick/sta...20946515706253

Quote:

The KZ-4 used here as a warhead is designed to disable roads and reinforced concrete structures.

The KZ-4 packs a substantial 49kg of TG-50 explosive (weighing 63kg in total).

It's quite impressive that the UGV managed to drive 4km with that much weight without falling over.
And elsewhere, you have further use of UGVs to deploy TM-62 mines

https://twitter.com/front_ukrainian/...96740574658839
https://twitter.com/front_ukrainian/...69691993366970

But what's new is that both sides apparently now are using UAVs to deploy mines from the air silently:

https://twitter.com/Jamie04381095/st...94077756211484

Quote:

The [RUSSIAN] enemy continues to mine [UKRANIAN] our positions with anti-personnel mines at night using drones 😡

So be careful & watch your step, especially in the morning when you leave your dugout or shelter.

DRG February 3rd, 2024 02:42 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 856011)


FORTUNATELY it is possible to hit the mute button for this vid..... you WILL want to before the earworm burrows too deep!

Isto February 16th, 2024 08:32 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
I like the idea of Future MBT type of third Steel Panthers game. As in, keeping the WinSPMBT as it is with no new modern add ons, and create an entire new game to be updated (for example starting at date 2025).

That would make things simpler, and possibly even preserve the old WinSPMBT from any possible malfunctioning it can have because of new added features, and only add the new features to entirely new platform, updating it as the time goes on (by whoever is up for that task).

Dion February 16th, 2024 12:56 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
I like it! As it would give Shrapnel the excuse to do all the little things that they have been saying can't done without having to create a whole new game. I have my doubts that it would work as described though. I think they would accidentally forget to include some of the "old" features of the current system, or forget to include some obscure feature that not many people use, but in reality the feature is very important to some players, just not used by the majority of players.

If they made a whole new game, it would give them a reason to raise the system requirements without ruining the current version. In my opinion that would be an outstanding consequence, as that would mean the graphics and other features would be state of the art!

Really, the only thing I see that's missing are mainly walls, tunnels, and some other obscure types of terrain, and possibly the upgrade of graphics too, but to tell you the truth, I think the current version has the best "top down" graphics on the market. The only games I see that has better graphics are real time games, and if Steel Panthers became a real time game, I think the game would change so much, it would become a different game, as a result, action scenes would become more important than game play.

KAreil February 25th, 2024 05:57 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Isto (Post 856073)
I like the idea of Future MBT type of third Steel Panthers game. As in, keeping the WinSPMBT as it is with no new modern add ons, and create an entire new game to be updated (for example starting at date 2025).

That would make things simpler, and possibly even preserve the old WinSPMBT from any possible malfunctioning it can have because of new added features, and only add the new features to entirely new platform, updating it as the time goes on (by whoever is up for that task).


Wanted to post something like that myself. Personally I would fully support a third game like "WinSP2k" or similar.

I would let it start in the year 2000 and have an overlap of the database with WinSPMBT. The new game could have (if possible from the code) new features not available in the older engines to make all this UAV centric warfare possible.

MarkSheppard March 1st, 2024 07:43 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
https://twitter.com/front_ukrainian/...62908430008813

More drones proliferating, this one is Ukranian

Quote:

Ground drone with 7.62-mm PKT in service of the 🇺🇦61st Separate Mechanized Brigade.
Combined effects warhead for FPV drones

https://twitter.com/GrandpaRoy2/stat...22462576713729

Quote:

Ukraine is expanding the variety and lethality of warheads for its FPVs. Here we see a HEAT/ball-bearing fragmentation ammunition with roller bearings added to the front as additional fragmentation pieces. The copper cone to form the explosive jet is nicely visible.
Another thing to note is that when FPVs are used; they're used en masse -- i.e. as of late 2023 / early 2024, instead of lone or triplet FPV attacks, we're seeing swarming attacks; many of them going after a single target.

MarkSheppard March 1st, 2024 07:18 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Remember that UGV I posted about a few pages back carrying a demolition charge to blow a bridge some 4 km from the operator?

We've gotten the scaled down version

https://twitter.com/War_Gang_/status...67779889119274

Translated from the Polish

Quote:

Probably the first published (?) use of a robot (UGV) to paralyze 🇷🇺 positions.

The ground unmanned aircraft was - according to the description - carrying a TM-62M anti-tank mine, which was detonated remotely.

This will complement FPV drones to some extent. Why? Because the structures currently used cannot support the weight of the TM-62M (over 9kg); and the drones that can do this only fly at night because they are big and slow.

It is therefore possible that, to some narrow extent, UGVs will be able to complement the activities of drones and multiply each other's actions. FPV drones as fighters covering the way to the target for their driving colleagues 😉

UxV combined arms 😉

And yes - we are aware of the limitations of equipment, terrain, and enemy actions 🙂

MarkSheppard March 2nd, 2024 11:16 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
More evolution!

https://twitter.com/Osinttechnical/s...09659927162966

Ukraine is now using WWII bomber escort solutions for drones -- the slower, bigger "Baba Yaga" carrying heavy munitions is escorted by swarms of smaller FPV drones.

DRG March 2nd, 2024 01:58 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Tactics on the battlefield always evolve or in this case, are rediscovered. It is more noticeable with drones because its' use is evolving so quickly

They discovered quickly in WW1 that the light bombers needed fighter support and the Ukrainians have simply applied that lesson to the new tech

MarkSheppard March 4th, 2024 07:02 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Speaking of evolution; right now, the gangs in Haiti are using drones in a method similar to Hamas during the first few days of the Gaza War; i.e. for recon and to drop grenades onto the Haitian police.

Moving off Haiti and onto Israel v Hamas in Gaza...

Apparently one of the reasons we haven't seen a lot of drone footage from Gaza of Hamas v. Israel since the first few weeks of this (current) war is because the IDF brought up a lot of EW equipment once they came under attack from drones and managed to achieve a modicum of electronic warfare superiority.

Moving off drones...

https://breakingdefense.com/2024/03/...rmy-no-2-says/

Quote:

EXCLUSIVE: Strykers with 50-kilowatt lasers in CENTCOM for experiment, Army No. 2 says
By ASHLEY ROQUE on March 01, 2024 at 10:05 AM

“Is it 100 percent ready? Is it going to work perfectly? Probably not but we're going to learn from it,” Army Vice Chief of Staff Gen. James Mingus told Breaking Defense.

CAMP PENDLETON, Calif. — Early last month, the US Army sent four Stryker-mounted 50-kilowatt laser prototypes to the Middle East for real-world testing that includes facing down dust particles, the service’s new vice chief, Gen. James Mingus, revealed to Breaking Defense.

“It’s a prototype, but we want to experiment in a live environment,” Mingus said Wednesday in his first interview since being sworn in as the vice-chief in January. “Is it 100 percent ready? Is it going to work perfectly? Probably not, but we’re going to learn from it.”

At a breakfast in February, Army Chief Gen. Randy George said the US Central Command (CENTCOM) region is aligned to receive new counter-unmanned aerial systems (C-UAS) as part of his new “transforming in contact” push where users, developers and testers can converge and provide feedback. Part of that initiative seemingly includes the Directed Energy Maneuver Short-Range Air Defense (DE M-SHORAD) prototype that integrates a 50-kilowatt laser onto Strykers to down class 1 to 3 aerial drones and incoming rockets, artillery and mortars. (Kord Technologies was tasked with integrating an RTX laser onto combat vehicles.)

Four of those prototypes arrived in CENTCOM’s area of operations in early February, and the service has begun initial testing activities but not live-fire ones. Once they do, Mingus surmised that it may take several months to process observations that could fuel tech maturation and acquisition decisions.

“Our high-energy lasers are so susceptible to weather. That’s why I think this is going to be a great laboratory because anytime there’s a dust storm, anytime there’s that kind of thing, it starts to alter the physics of the light particles that actually shoot that beam,” he said.

One question the service is looking to answer is just which class of lasers is right for the threat set, instead of people simply getting enamored with the power difference between 300-kilowatt lasers versus 50-kilowatt ones. Specifically, Mingus wants more answers about the directed energy value per square centimeter.

“You may have a 50-kilowatt laser, [but] at 10 kilometers can you put at least four kilowatts in a centimeter square because … that’s what you need to burn through a quarter inch steel plate?” he asked. “But that’s really hard to get … from a big beam to get the small portion of it on the exact spot to be able to burn at that high intensity and any kind of dust particle or that starts to disrupt that.”

If this experiment series proves fruitful, it could help the service decide if that 50-kilowatt class laser is the right fit, or if it should maybe spend more time looking at a 28-kilowatt option.

At the same time, service leaders are also keeping an eye on logistics concerns associated with keeping high-energy weapons up and running on the battlefield, where higher tech replacement parts aren’t in plenty. But because the DE M-SHORAD system is still a prototype and not mass, this round of testing is not representative of the exact challenges soldiers will face on the battlefield since the supply chain remains “shallow.”

“We knew that, but we thought that it was still worth pushing them over there,” he added.

The proliferation of aerial drones on the battlefield in places like Ukraine and in the Red Sea — to include loitering, one-way attack ones — is accelerating a push to develop and field new defense weapons to down them. CENTCOM, in particular, has in recent months contended with dozens of attacks on US installations in Iraq and Syria — as well as a drone attack in Jordan that killed three American soldiers — though those attacks have taped off since the fatal incident.

While Pentagon leaders note the need for such weapons, they are also grappling with the per-kill cost of launching kinetic interceptors that can be in the millions of dollars.

If directed energy ones like the DE M-SHORAD prove fruitful in mass, it offers a window for significantly lowering that per-unit kill price point and/or providing commanders with a mix of kinetic and directed energy C-UASs to use depending on the threat set or weather conditions.

Isto March 5th, 2024 05:31 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Not sure is it appropriate to comment on this thread on this subject. But somehow i see Energy Weapons, especially Laser weapons of something that might not stand the test of time. There might be a timeframe they excell, but that timeframe might stay short as others adapt to their use.

It can be as easy, than just coat the missile with a material, that either absorbs or mirrors the beam away in some way.

For example, if you shoot Laser beam to mirror, what happens ?


So the production of Laser Weapons, can be very expensive and time consuming. When the counter can be very cheap, easy and simple. So in the end, can very much be, that it is not worth it.

But the Air Burst munition for example, that use kinetic projectiles that can track the missile and change direction in the air, exploding to hundreds of pellets before hitting the target, even one pellet enough to possible neutralize the target. Can be shot on rapid fire rates like 300 rounds per minute on 40-50mm platform and something like 120 rounds a minute with 76mm platform, and 90 rounds a minute with 127mm platform or the likes. Which can become the Mainstay for any Infantry Fighting Vehicle (An Airburst fully automated CIWS turret that tracks and destroys missiles, drones, loitering munitions automatically offering close range air defence to troops, artillery, supply and so).

The smaller calibers can even be installed to a tank. For example, a future thank contains 2 x 25mm CIWS turrets with AirBurst munition in both sides of turret. And for why not, also can transport infantry similar than IFV (like Merkava can) and function as Artillery shooting guided munitions.

No matter what kind of missiles, drones or loitering munitions you develop in the future, the AirBurst munition is always relevant against them because it uses Kinetic Energy to destroy the target.

This is the route Italy Army have chosen. They go the Autocannon route, and are heavily invested in AirBurst type of munitions. You can see this in their Navy too. When others install few turrets in their Ships, Italy instals 4 in each ship (3 in front, and one in back so, that at certain angle, they can all fire at same direction). The largest of these can be used to shoot guided munitions further away than 120 kilometers. So especially in that Mediterranean area, those turrets have a high threat range to ships too, can be used to Shore Bombardment instead of missiles, and can be used to effectically neutralize any missile Threats to the ships. The munition is also way cheaper to produce than missiles, and you can take more of them on the ship than missiles. Lets say opposing ship have 80 missiles, they can very well have 8 000 munitions available against them and they are effective on neutralizing any missile threats, as they track the missile, and change course in the air, exploding on front of target to smaller pellets on rapid fire rate. It is a new development, the AirBurst (OTO Melara) and Vulcano rounds are new. Germany uses the similar type of munitions, but they emphasis on smaller caliber (35mm Millenium Gun) combined with Missile Defence (IRIS-T) - SkyGuard.


So for example. What can a tank like i described achieve ?

It can support the troops with Guided Artillery fire. It can protect itself and the troops with AirBurst CIWS munitions from any aerial threats. It can transport the troops. So if needed, you could only produce them and they can do everything you need (Air Defence, Artillery Support and Transporting the Troops). You can only produce one platforms, and just spam it.

If you want higher caliber air defence, you can make dedicated 76mm Air Burst Autocannon unit, that can be operated by 2 persons. And when parked somewhere on standby (automated), the crew can get out and do not even need to be within the vehicle, as it is fully automated. Italy already uses this approach, and it is operational.


For these reasons. I would not invest on Laser equipment. I would invest on Autocannons. How i see things (and i suppose, how Italy sees it). Automated Autocannons is the platform for the future, and the development of Seek and Destroy algorithm for the Guided Artillery and Autocannon munitions in Low and Mid Range. That is the most Cost Effective way.

You do not need Drones or Loitering Munitions, if you have Guided Munitions. Guided Munitions are always superior to Drones, and you only use Drones because you are out of Guided Munitons, or do not have the option to acquire them. If you could choose as a commander, you would of course always choose a Guided Munition or Missile over Loitering Muniton or Drone because their properties are superior.

The Seek and Destroy Algorithm: can even be very simple. It only need to function Offline (as in high EW environment) and be able to confirm than target, seek and destroy (independently offline after the launch).

It is also a matter of Logistics. You need less storage space and less Maintenance. When you have less platforms with Motors, less Missiles (platforms with Motors) and so on.

Having stored enough Guided Rounds. Makes you very powerful player in the military scene. And they will be relevant now and forever. This will never change. (if they are Offline Guided).

(And if needed, can possibly be coated against Laser Weapons).


These Properties:

1. Is able to Seek and Destroy targets independently without Outside Guidance.

2. Is coated against Laser Weapons.

Then what you do, when opponent pummels endlessly with this kind of munition and you invested on Laser Defence, which is not functional against them. And your EW does nothing ?

And then when you launch your small supply of expensive Missiles to them, they get destroyed by high volume of Guided Air Burst Munitions which is a mainstay for even the most basic of troops.


It sounds very fancy and futuristic to speak of High Tech Laser Weapons and Autonomous Platforms. But in the end can very much be, that they achieve nothing and the direct approach is way more Efficient.

The only AI you really need is Seek and Destroy Algorithm.


The Rail Gun development i see as something that would be relevant. But the problem for it consuming too much energy to be practical may never be fixed, and there might never be new energy sources. The Cold Fusion probably, consumes more energy than produces because the laws of physics dictate so meaning, that most likely it can never be used as an Energy Source.

I also feel like, that certain Thresholds have been achieved in Technology Development on certain areas. That cannot be broken. The Laws of Physics dictate so, and the challenge is to fine tune the existing techniques rather than, find new ones as very possibly (in some cases), the new techniques are not there if the Laws of Physics cannot be altered.

Foe example, the technique for CIWS was originally introduced in the 70's (if i remember right) trough Phalanx CIWS, and stays relative for a long time to come. The challenge have been to fine tune it. But include modern Air Burst munition to the original Phalanx CIWS code, and it will be very effective even without changing the direction of the munitions in the air, what the current algorithm and development can achieve.

Still, even the oldest Phalanx CIWS have not outdated yet, and probably never will.

Of course the original Phalanx CIWS could not use the Air Burst munition without Update. But the Update for it would probably be very minor. The same with the guided Air Burst. It is probably not a major update for the Program, but a major update for the Ammunition it uses.

MarkSheppard March 5th, 2024 07:58 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Isto (Post 856167)
It can be as easy, than just coat the missile with a material, that either absorbs or mirrors the beam away in some way.

They give a specific power figure in the above article (4 kW/cm2) and a specific penetration figure at 10 km (quarter inch steel plate = 6.35mm)

The 122 mm OF-462 artillery shell has a wall thickness of about 17mm

LINK to drawing

60 to 80mm mortars have a wall thickness of about 12mm

81mm mortar drawing

60mm mortar drawing

A large commercial aircraft like the 747/Airbus/etc has about 2 to 4 mm skin thickness in aluminum; while ballistic missiles differ -- Titan II ICBM had a maximum skin thickness of 6~mm; while the Titan III Space Launch Vehicle went up to 12~mm to support heavier payloads on top.

Aeraaa March 5th, 2024 04:35 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
A very interesting article about the way drones shape the battlefield in Ukraine:

https://warontherocks.com/2024/03/dr...onary-fashion/

MarkSheppard March 8th, 2024 07:27 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Babe, new drone specialized type just dropped! :hurt:

Russians have started to deploy FPS and battlefield UAS using fiber optics guidance

https://twitter.com/clashreport/stat...36910943613005

Quote:

New Russian Russian FPV drone with a coil of thin fiber optic cable over 10 kilometers long.

The drone transmits digital, real-time video over a 10.5km spool of fiber-optic cable.

This kind of drone is almost impossible to stop with EW.

DRG March 8th, 2024 05:54 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
The only way to simulate that in the game is to give a drone a very high EW value.

That would be better suited to scenario work as I doubt these are going to become really common

MarkSheppard March 12th, 2024 06:03 PM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Russia is now using semi or powered glide bomb kits.

Basically normal FAB bombs with pop out wings and GPS guidance; and in some cases, a small turbojet to extend range.

It's how they were able to take Avdiivka -- by dropping 100~ of them each day.

This way, they can drop them from 60-70 km away, and stay out of range of Ukrainian SAMs.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...orce-avdiivka/

Quote:

In an account posted on the social media site Telegram during the battle, Maksym Zhorin of Ukraine’s 3rd Separate Assault Brigade described how 60 to 80 of the glide bombs were crashing into his area every day. “These bombs completely destroy any position. All buildings and structures simply turn into a pit after the arrival of just one.”
Quote:

Since January, Russian airstrikes across the front line have routinely exceeded 100 a day, with nearly 160 occurring four days before Avdiivka fell, he said.
Big difference over the last few months of Russian glide bomb use is that instead of 250 kg bombs as a base... it's now 1500 kg (!!!)

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/w...-b2511360.html

Quote:

The FAB-1500 (ФАБ-1500) is the latest iteration. It includes 675kg of explosives, can be fired from between 40km and 70km away from its target, and has a destruction radius of 200 metres. It has been nicknamed the “building destroyer” by Russian war bloggers.

MarkSheppard March 14th, 2024 06:41 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
Back to lasers:

https://twitter.com/MyLordBebo/statu...66050308551008

Quote:

Britain showed the results of the DragonFire combat laser.

It is reported that the photos of the British government laboratory of defense equipment shows the results of the laser - it burned through a 120-mm mortar shell, cut the metal casing and burned the camera of the copter.

Also the day before, the British Ministry of Defense showed a video of a laser test.

DragonFire was successfully tested in January of this year. The laser is stated to be very accurate with a direct beam, can hit visible targets at the speed of light, and is very cheap to use.

Bunch of media at that twitter post; but the one most of interest (once I do calculations) is this:

https://i.imgur.com/Sr3qSgB.jpeg

MarkSheppard March 15th, 2024 06:23 AM

Re: What happens in 2025? / new tactics- new technologies
 
https://twitter.com/bayraktar_1love/...64270247350478

Quote:

Tests of Ukrainian mine laying drone equipped with 15 TM-62 anti tank mines
Rather simple; the mines are attached to each other by string, so it requires somewhat level ground, and it results in a very obvious pattern. More of a "deny ground" tactic that wastes the enemy's time by forcing them to dismount and demine.


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