Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">On what basis do you make this claim? There have been hypothesis in the past that there are other universes - the problem being that they can neither be proved nor disproved, and thus they haven't recieved much serious attention.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I didn't say you had. It appears you missed the qualifier "if" . . . and then you ignored the rest of the statement about quantum mechanics, which does leave room for non-determinism (one way of saying free will).

However, if you don't postulate that, then you leave the option of an independent soul open, which would really throw determinism out the window.

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That is a ridiculously tight-fisted statement, Fyron. "... a perfectly free-willed decision devoid of any other factors ..."(emhasis added) I don't think anyone who claims sanity claims to be totally unaffected by events, while it seems you would only be satisfied by such a response. This strikes me as unrealistic of you.

Edit: And just to beat you to the punch, it is a very big jump to go from affected by to determined solely by.

[ March 20, 2003, 01:15: Message edited by: Jack Simth ]

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

I was just trying to start a philosophical debate, but I can see that has failed miserably. Maybe I should just stop looking at this thread altogether.

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Ah, but how can you tell for sure? Or within a reasonable doubt?

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">That is the fastest I have seen you back off of a position. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Turn it around - How can you tell for sure (or wihin a reasonable doubt) that free will is an illusion? Until you can demonstrate your side, one hypothesis is as equally valid as the other. However, I made a point about quantum mechanics a while back which would support free will....

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Failed how? There are people in this thread making logical arguments on exactly the topic in question.

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

You mean I was able to turn Fyron around?!? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
Sorry to deter your philosophical debate Fyron, that wasn't my intentions, I just simply wanted to bring out that we do have free will. I will now leave and you can have your debate. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

What is this thread about? I have never seen it before. It just appeared here magically one day. And now it has swelled in size. OMG! Its taking over!

Re: [OT] Plato\'s Pub and Philosophical Society
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I'm not entierly sure it was you....