Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

I've already planned a different route; did you read the session with the CE axe where Jason turned paler and left the room? Nobody's asked him about it yet....

Besides, you may find that four legs are very useful when confronting the BBEG at the ceremony....

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

I'm not totally enamored with the idea of spending 20 days casting this spell... (and I'm not so keen on spending XP, but I could do it). The first proposal you gave for the method gaining ability sounds good to me... now we have to come up with a name? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Edit: By the way, I did sort of ask about the Jason thing... I'm guessing there was something historical he was involved in?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Oh, that's not so hard:

Kaylin's Great Warping
Transmutation
Level: Sor/Wiz 7
Components: V, S, F, M, XP
Casting Time: 48 hours (counts as continuous walking, use Forced March rules for walking the entire time; the target can sleep, eat, et cetera as normal, but the caster must cast continuously)
Range: Close (25 ft + 5 ft per 2 caster levels)
Target: Willing subjecy
Saving Throw: Will negates (Harmless)
Spell Resistance: Yes (Harmless)
Duration: Permanent

This spell functions like polymorph, except that it enables the target to assume the form of any single nonunique creature (of any type) from Fine to Colossal size. The assumed form cannot have more Hit Dice than your caster level or the targets Hit Dice (whichever is lower, to a maximum of 15 HD). Unlike polymorph, this spell allows incorporeal or gaseous forms to be assumed.

The target gains all extraordinary and supernatural abilities (both attacks and qualities) of the assumed form, but loses the target's own supernatural abilities. The target also gains the type of the new form in place of the target's original. The new form does not disorient the target. Parts of the target's body or pieces of equipment that are separated from the target do not revert to their original forms.

The target can become just about anything the caster is familiar with. The change takes place as the culimnation of the 48-hour ritual. If you use this spell to create a disguise, you get a +10 bonus on your Disguise check.

Focus: A single diamond worth no less than 100,000 gp.
Material Component: Diamond dust worth at least 10,000 gp.
XP: 2000 xp, which can be taken from the target, the caster, or any combination thereof, at the caster's sole discresion.

Edit: Now you just need to spend the GP, time, and spellcraft checks to actually research the thing.... 1,000 gp per week, 1 week per level of the spell, spellcraft check DC 10+spell level; so 7,000 gp, 7 weeks, and a spellcraft check DC 17.... crafting portal applies.....

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

I don't think you asked Jason while in character... but yes, you did; feel free to ask him, (while wandering around in town, not covered by the wagon....) about it in character, when you are ready to have the plot suddenly zipped along.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Yeah, that'd be it. By the way, does anyone else think that it'd be cool to spend a significant amount of time in a city or something as part of a side quest? Perhaps there's a book we need to find, or some master smith in hiding...



Eeeeeek... I hope she's up for this... it sounds like a side quest just getting the necessary materials http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Looking for something specific? I'm the one to ask....Ah, just a little nonleathal damage... you know, DC 10 con check for hour 9, 12 for hour 10, 14 for hour 11 ... DC 50 for hour 48... but each failure is only 1d6 nonleathal damage (+ fatigue), and there's a Favored Soul with lots of healing readily available to deal with that aspect.Well, yes, of course it would be. What did you expect for something *that* powerful?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

I'm going to enjoy this muchly http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

If I come up with any ideas for plotlines, I'll let you know.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

[/quote]That is the general idea, yes.So no specific set of abilities you want in a widget yet? Okay.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Hey, Kibin... if you wanted to be quite nice to me, I could give you Greater Magic Fang and make it permanent.

Also, I'm thinking I'll buy a scroll of permanency next time I feel like spending lots of XP, so I can get permanent See Invisible and Arcane Sight, and I could start laying Resistance around...

Thinking about plots... Kaylin might have some childhood issues to deal with, perhaps an excuse to go off and butcher some orcs? pleasepleaseplease http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/evil.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Something slightly unbalanced so you can go and slaughter some Orc children before they become Orc Warriors? Hmm.... perhaps.... might even be able to slip it past the Paladin.... although that could get tricky.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Actally, I was more thinking of some ancient blood feud or something that had to be settled with some orc who's now a general or something... that'd provide all the fun of sneaking around in D&D (which I haven't seen much of yet), and getting to do big battles against lots of tough enemies http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/stupid.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

If they are individually "tough", lots of them at once are fatal. It's part of the reason I haven't been sending more than one difficult demon at a time in (the other being that it's difficult to track lots of critters at once).

But if you want, I suppose one CR 12, 2 CR 8's, 4 CR 6's, 8 CR 4's, and 16 CR 2's make for an encounter level of 15... when we have a party level of 14.9; which could make for a nominally resonably difficult encounter ... for rediculously low amounts of xp (630 each for Derrel, Jason, Kaylin, and Elorin, 450 for Kibin). Of course, CR 2 Orcs have three levels of warrior, and probably hit an AC 17 wizard on about a roll of 10 or so, with Greatswords dealing 2d6+4 damage (with appropriet Composite Longbows, they only deal 1d8+3, on a roll of 13 or so, but all can fire at once... potentially at the same robed target... have to clear out the spellcasters first... Orcs are intelligent, after all). Be ready with battlefield control spells and escape battle spells.

A duel situation, on the other hand.... of course, that would be pretty much one on one.... or are you thinking something along the lines of covert ops/assasination of an opposing commander?

Edit: Let's see.... 100 CR 1/2 Orcish Warrior 1's + 1 Orcish Cleric 15 Warlord would officially be a CR 16 encounter. Of course, 100 longbow equipped Orcish Warrior 1's, shots divided evenly amongst 5 targets, would get roughly 1 hit per round per target... assuming that the targets all have AC 21 or better, and assuming totally mundane arrows. A cleric 15, on the other hand, could cast Greater Magic Weapon four times to give each two +3 arrows; burning 5th level spell slots as well, each could get four. 20 arrows per character the first round, at +4 to hit, means: AC 24 or higher (roll of 20 only): 1 hit; below that, +1 hit per -1 AC; so AC 17 could expect.... 8 hits the first round, for 1d8+3 damage (1d8+6, for Composite Str + 3 Longbows at 400 gp each... but that'd be overkill....); 1d8+3 averages... 7.5, eight of them would make for an expected (roughly 50% chance of that amount or more) 60 points of damage... and Kaylin only has 54 hp... assuming they don't give any preference to the spellcaster in the Robe of the Archmagi. Everyone else in the party would have sufficient AC that they would only take one or two arrows....

But do I really want to track 101 Orcs? Decisions, decisions.....

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

The standard orcish soldier probably won't be too tough individually, while the guards around high-ranking officials probably would be. Definitely the latter. But that might cause problems for Sir Derrel... and it's almost certainly against their Code. So, we should probably hold off on that, since it'd leave Derrel out of the fun.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

It'd be rather more difficult to slip it past the player.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Oops, didn't read carefully http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/eek.gif I wouldn't do that unless I was evil...

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Ooo, magic fang. Gimme.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Nothing in a dark shade of gray then? Check.
Of course, as you can't actually cast the Greater Magic Fang yourself, it soaks up the hired caster level... which granted, you will likely want as high as it goes anyway for the +5; let's see.... Permanency for Magic Fange requires 1500 xp ... which translates to 7500 gp for that, Permanency is 5th, and you need at least an 11th level caster.... so another 550 gp; and then you want Greater Magic Fang from a Druid ... 3rd level spell, caster level 20, another 600 gp; runs at a market value of 8650 gp. Of course, a Greater Dispel Magic can trash it for good....

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Theroretically if we get it into a potion form, then it wouldn't be subject to dispel magic. Of course, that's probally more gold right there for the potion, but it wouldn't BE subject to dispel magic.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Hmm, so you're talking about hiring someone to cast it, like we did for the wagon? 3,000 gp for a potion of Greater Magic Fang (+5), and if I cast Permanency myself, that'd save money... and the other question is, would this even carry over once I cast Kaylin's Great Warping (hehe)?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Meh, let's just let the sorcerer change me back.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Considering that he's hostile to us, you might not like all of the changes he'll make to you http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Meh. Let's just try it out, okay? Then you can tell physics to go take a dump outside.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

* Derrel sadly waves good-bye to Kibin.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

It was nice knowing him http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Umm.... where does it say that the effects of a potion aren't subject to Dispel Magic?
If it's the same attack form enhanced that was chosen with Greater Magic Fang (specifically, Bite), yes; otherwise, no.

You might also consider doing so twice; once using the +1 to all version, once using the +5 to one version. Then, if he somehow ends up with multiple natural attacks, they are all at +1, at a minimum.
You do realize what usually happens when you try to tell physics off (and aren't a decent spellcaster, immortal, ludicrously lucky, or the GM) right?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

While we were on the subject of crafting spells, what does the almighty GM think of the following?

Elemental Blast
Evocation
Level: Sor/Wiz 5
Components: V, S, M
Casting Time: 1 Standard action
Range: Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Area: 20-ft.-radius spread
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: Reflex half
Spell Resistance: Yes

This spell functions like Fireball , with every creature in the area of effect taking 1d6 points of random damage (acid, electricity, fire, sonic) per caster level (15d6 max).

Material component:
A small glass prism worth 15 gp that is consumed in the casting.

How reasonable is that for a level 5 spell? perhaps more of an MC cost?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Roll a 1d4 for damage type?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

That, or maybe weight the rolls so the ones that are more commonly resisted come out more.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

It wouldn't be subject to Dispel Magic if the potion was a potion of permanency, since the caster and the target are both yourself for potions, and therefore you would be casting it at yourself and not make the effect suspectable to dispel magic any more. Greater magic fang can still be cast by someone else, however.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

So many plotline ideas...

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Okay, I almost got the basis for a first session of D&D. Plotline, baddies, how all of you people ended up on the same place... I think I'm going to go with level 5 on this one, with 4 party members(at first), a villian, and a couple of encounters to boot. Maybe even TREASURE!

EDIT: Yup, treasure, that's finished too.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

You forgot one type of elemental damage - cold.

This is the same level as Cone of Cold and has the same damage dice cap so that part isn't a problem. I think the 60 ft cone originating at caster vs 20 ft radius spread at medium range is a fairly even tradeoff of some area for range; in fact, judging by fireball, it should be long range (400 + 40/level).

The random damage type shouldn't be worth a level adjustment, I think, because it's not under the caster's control. The only thing that would need compensation for is the inclusion of sonic damage in the possibilities. Change the possible damage types to fire, cold, acid, and electricity, but not sonic, and it should be fine without the expensive MC.
Potions are limited to 3rd level spells or lower. You'd have to get a scroll of Permanency and cast it with Use Magic Device. Also, the immunity to dispelling only applies to casters that aren't higher level than the caster level of Permanency, so you'd have to pay extra to get a high caster level. To get it undispellable by non-epic casters, the scroll would cost 5 (spell level) * 20 (caster level) * 25 (scroll) + 1500 (xp) * 5 (xp to gp converstion) = 10000 gp. To cast from the scroll, you would need to make a DC 40 UMD check, and another check at DC 30 for emulating the ability score if you don't have at least 15 intelligence or charisma, whichever is relevant.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Maybe a d6 roll, with the 6th die roll affecting that creature twice with two different types of energy? Same damage, just that half of it is one element and the other half is the other element.

And I got traps, yay. You can start the character generation now, 3.5 SRD rules, without any of the 'splat' books. Those books with the additional material seem to tend to be unbalanced, and allow you to powergame too much.

EDIT: Hehe, forgot the rules. 32 point buy, level 5, you can use psionics if you want...

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

So... long range instead of medium, cold instead of sonic, cone instead of spread, and no MC? That sounds good - I was trying to ensure that it stays at level 5.

/me goes to write that down

Also, if we're going for a scroll of permanency, why don't I learn the spell and cast? I don't mind paying the XP, and I'd like to at least give myself permanent See Invisibility.

NullAshton: Is grey-elf OK as a race? They're my favorite http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Personally? That it's pushing the bounds of a 5th level spell, but works, as posted above.

Why? Very few direct-damage spells, barring those of a high level (Prismatic Spray, 7th), or those that are severely weakened (Shadow Evocation, 5th, extra save for a fairly extreme partial; or Ice Storm, 4th, with 3d6 bludgeoning (elemental resistance doesn't help with that) and 2d6 Cold - doesn't scale with level) have the potential to still be quite useful when used against a creature that is exceptionally inappropriet due to an elemental immunity (e.g., Fireball vs. Red Dragon, Lightning Bolt against Blue Dragon). This one does, and there isn't anything severely crippled about the spell (like Shadow Evocation's extra save, or Ice Storm's flat damage amount at about half what a minimum caster for the spell would do with a Fireball).

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

That's a good point... now you guys have to help me here, is the GM Narf, douglas, or Jack? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif I keep getting you three confused.

Anyways, whichever one of you is the GM, determine what's reasonable please

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Yeah, I have a slight habit of doing that with the characters....

I GM the currently ECL 14 game (which, researching a 5th level spell, is likely the one you care aout....), Narf GM's the currently CL 3 game (on hold in the middle of a fight....), and Douglas is thinking about running a 5th level game (not started, but apparently mostly set up to run).

However, Medium range, VSM, 15 gp MC, randomly one of four or five elements, 20-foot spread, Reflex half and SR works. Starting to push the bounds, but it works.

Why? Well, it has inherent drawbacks ... you can't prep your allies for it with such spells as Resist Energy or Protection from Energy as you could with Fireball or Lightning Bolt; it does have an extra save (sort of) for any creature with some kind of elemental immunity (1 in 6 chance of no damage to a Red Dragon, for instance), as well as having the inherent drawback to most area-effect spells: can't really use it much after your allies have mixed it up with your opponents. Now, if the element was chosen, those would not apply, as you could prep allies or be sure of dealing something to the Red Dragon - but that's not the case here, so it works.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Wasn't it Ashton who wanted to GM something new?

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

That's Ashton, not me.

Take out the randomness of the damage type and the expensive MC, and it is almost exactly on par with Cone of Cold. I don't think making the damage type random is worth any adjustment at all, as long as sonic is left out of the lineup. Either the damage type doesn't matter, or you're giving up the certainty of getting maximum effect against foes with known vulnerabilities in exchange for having a chance of it working well against anything.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

That's exactly what I'm looking for. And I prefer the 1d4 idea:
1 - Fire
2 - Electricity
3 - Cold
4 - Acid

But a 1d6 with perhaps a two-effect on a 6 would be interesting, although that'd push a level 5 spell by a bit.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Not quite what I meant; a spell where, at casting time, you get to choose between Fire, Cold, Acid, or Electricity would be more powerful than a Cone of Cold; a Cone of Cold, however, always does Cold damage, so you know it's liable to work against that Fire elemental, or that Red Dragon you are facing, with total certainty; but against the White Dragon, or that odd Ice Golem, it's quite useless, and you spend your time casting something else. Casting-time selectable, however, makes it a tad more useful, as: Red dragon? No problem! Cold ball! White dragon? No problem! Fire ball! Blue dragon? No problem! Acid ball! ... especially when it's just low enough for the Wizardess casting it to Empower for 21d6....
A spell-set element can be readily dealt with from a DM's perspective; "she usually favors Chain Lightning? Well, it's her turn to be relatively usless, time for something that's immune to electricity..." something that's chosen at casting time? A little trickier. Something that's random? Lacks a few abilities inherent in a set or selectable spell.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Speaking of useless, all these damn demons we're fighting with their SR and their saves... grr.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Try picking up a summoning spell or two, some battlefield control spells, perhaps some more buffs; sure, you can't do the mega-damage against that high SR critter, but it's rather awkward for the demon when he suddenly finds there's something threatening him... just opposite from where the Rogue is standing. It doesn't really matter if it's a fluff creature (at this level, something from Summon Monster III or IV is mostly fluff) as it still threatens, and grants the Rogue flanking. Sure, it's Full-round; but when up against things you can't affect directly....
Such spells as Heroism or Greater Heroism are also very useful - bonuses to Attack Rolls, saves, and skill checks? Very useful against those high-AC targets, or all that save vs. X stuff out there. The Greater version even grants temporary HP and immunity to fear....
Battlefield control ... well, this is an interesting one, mostly only useful when up against multiple or highly mobile opponents; wouldn't it be great to be able to pin down that archer who shoots three arrows and moves in the same round so Derrel can get a full attack in? Or maybe just a nice solid Wall of Iron ... or better yet, an unbreakable Wall of Force... between you and the thing that's trying to kill you....

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

I have so many difficulties keeping everyone from blurring together.... case in point....

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Grey-elf is fine as long as it's in the SRD.

You know what would be really useful? Rock to mud and mud to rock. Use rock to mud, the demon falls into the mud, gets stuck in mud, you use rock to mud, he's in solid rock.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Nah, that's not how you do it; you use Rock to Mud (5th), then Dispel Magic (3rd) (after all, it's your spell - automatic success!) rather than Mud to Rock (also 5th). A wizard can manage the trick with only a little over half the recources. And hey; Dispel Magic is always useful when there's an opposing sparkcaster around....

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

So I was thinking about possible campaign rules if I were to at some point be seized by the desire to GM... what do people think of the Elementalist class (spells yet to be developed)?

Spells for the class would focus primarily on use of the various elements (Fire (and cold), Earth, Air (and electricity), Water (and ice/steam), and U-235 (just kidding)). I'm thinking it might be a little overpowered though, so any suggestions on where to weaken it would be appreciated.

Edit: I think I'm becoming a little too obsessed...

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Definitly a little too much firepower.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

You might want to look up the Elemental Savant Prestige class in Tome & Blood or Complete Arcane; similar theme, but focusing on one element.

Also, you can mostly do that by using a specialist wizard (Evocation), and look into the Variant Classes from Unearthed Arcana (which was declared OGC, for the most part.... so is available online....) for it's specialist wizard variant classes.

Re: OT: Narf has gone looney and wants to GM.
 

Hmm, OK. I don't have any variant rulebooks.