Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

Game delayed by 24 hours as requested.

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

Ok. I will turn my nation AI. I have better things to do and I will let noobs play with noobs. I will switch to invite only games mostly, at least people try there. Congrats to Eriu on winning that game. Not that simply getting into game where everyone is not willing to fight at all was a big challenge :P

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

Yeah, fight you bunch of slackers!
So, who were you again Zeldor? And who was Shinuyama? It's hard being the admin and not knowing the players...

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

I subbed into this game for Shinuyama so that that nation would fight to the bitter end. I gave it all I had, but the armies of my oppressors were too great, although I got myself many escorts in my journey to the land of the dead. In the end, my cyclops pretender could not be brought down, but died while retreating. If only it had been possible to limp back to the mages and start wreaking havoc... ahh well, good fight!

Zeldor... joining a RAND/no diplomacy game, then crying when people don't gangbang the #1 guy, then naming him publicly, calling everyone else noobs, and turning AI when people are making serious efforts to make sure that no one goes AI? You'd better hope that no one running your 'invite only' games sees this thread. Stay classy.

As it seems to be my role to sub to keep a nation in this game from going AI and giving someone an easy cap, I can take over whatever nation Zeldor is attempting to vacate, if it's still possible. I don't promise to light the sky up, but I can keep it from being a complete pushover.

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

Nah, my nation was not a complete pushover. I asked for a sub like 30 turns ago and there were not good volunteers. Only one possible recently, who'd not cope with problems.

And yeah, I can tell what I think. People know that I can fight till the end [like only my cap left in Faerun] and I'm just stating facts, not crying. I'm simply not going to participate in that. And those who create invite-only games make them because they don't want to see things that happen here.

P.S. It's not about banging on number 1 guy, it's about common sense :) I love RAND as people there know the game, can read score graphs, can use scotus and make decisions based on that. Decisions that will be good for them.

You will know my nation after that turn, I don't need to make it easier for anyone by saying which nation is going AI :)

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

Since Abysia imho is the strongest nation in the game while Zeldor continue to rail against Eriu I will presume that he is playing Abysia himself.

In that case I must ask him why he doesn't use all the archdevils + heliographus + artifacts etc that he has to attack Eriu himself.

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

There's something wrong with folks playing here. I've never seen a slower game. Turn 47 and only 3 out of 16 nations are killed?

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

Zeldor, I find so many things wrong about your post, and indeed slightly offensive, that I don't even know where to begin.

Firstly, thanks for breaking the Rules of a RAND game by basically declaring your nation and hinting at the gangbanging of another nation. Many players are enjoying this game, even if you are not, so I for one would appreciate it if your didn't attempt to diminish and de-rail the game for everyone else.


Secondly, how can you accuse players of not trying? I know I am trying, trying hard. And my scouts are reporting back to me that all the other players seem to be trying hard as well. Or is your comment in reference to players 'not trying' to prevent someone winning. In your supposed case, Eriu. And everyone seems to be fighting as well, just not fighting the nation you want them to, or you think they should be. Given all the wars that have gone on, your claim that players are not willing to fight is almost as absurd as saying they are not trying. Or is the complaint about players not fighting the nation you perceive to be the biggest threat (because of course only your opinion of which nation is the biggest threat is the correct one)

But what do you want players to do exactly. Give up on, and risk possibly losing their own current war just to attack someone else? While simultaneously managing to transmit a subliminal message to their current opponent saying 'Can we stop our war now please so that I can attack someone else'. And what about nations who don't border the correct nation, what do you want them to do? Do you want them to make a bee-line for them, and hope the nations whose territory they would have to take to get to them just 'happen to understand' that they were only being attacked because their provinces were in they way of the nation they were really attacking? Maybe several nations are going to launch new attacks in the coming turns. Who knows. Well obviously you with your precognitive abilities, since you are claiming everyone is just going to stand around idly and let one nation win without a fight.

I do actually agree with you on many of the opinions you've voiced regarding how a lot of players don't always know how to play larger scale games properly. As more often than not players do nothing to stop one or two nations becoming incredibly powerful, but you of all people should know a RAND game is different, and ganging on leading nations is a hell of a lot tougher than in games with diplomacy. It does require more skill and experience in 'reading' the game, but this actually brings me nicely onto my third point.............


Thirdly, since when have Eriu clearly been the top nation to congratulate them on winning? Unless I've been playing the wrong game for 47 turns, it appears to me there are at least two or three other nations doing just as well, if not better than Eriu. And another two or three nations closely following behind them. I'd actually put Eriu's (apparent) opponent up just as high as Eriu. Given that they have the Well of Misery, a huge level of research, and easy access to multiple high level death mages. And if the C'tis player can't do something with all that lot to make Eriu's life a living hell, then they need shooting. Although if they can't, then I would agree with your assessment of at least one player in the game being a complete noob. ie. The C'tis player.


For me, there are no signs at all of a clear leader yet in this game, which I'm hoping is largely because the AI's have to the greater part been kept out of this game, meaning that taking a nation's scalp is being made as difficult as it is supposed to be. (O/T. This would also give evidence to my belief that players turning AI completely ruins games, and keeping AI's out leads to far more enjoyable, and more competitive games all round).

So as far as I can tell Zeldor, you are complaining that Eriu are doing what Eriu do best. Raiding. Which for me is the equivalent of complaining about Mictlan recruiting Jag warriors. That's what Mictlan does best. What should we complain about next? Abysia blood hunting. Or maybe Ermor reanimating? I know, Marignon are not allowed to summon any angels, because if they do I will complain like hell and declare them the winner.

Eriu have gained the upper hand in both their previous wars against Man and Caelum by mass raiding, which is pretty obvious both from the graphs, and from having some knowledge of Eriu as a nation. And this will always be a feature of any war with Eriu. Will this lead them to victory over C'tis? Only further turns will tell us that. But it appears to me that C'tis started the war against Eriu, so it's up to them to handle the consequences of their actions as well.


Also, if your misgivings about how the course this game has run, or is running, possibly because nobody has yet come to the aid of C'tis against Eriu, then have you considered players don't actually want C'tis around? They are a far more dangerous nation in the long run than Eriu IMO, and living next door to the Miasma isn't always a fun experience. So calling everyone a noob just because they are, by appearance, not helping C'tis is way out of line. Maybe some are actually cheering for Eriu, as they'd much rather fight them in the late game than C'tis. Also consider that the Eriu - C'tis war is only a few turns old. So to expect a third nation to enter that war at the drop of a hat, in a RAND game, is probably asking a bit much.

So before you make any blanket statements again Zeldor, please pause for a moment to think that maybe, just maybe, just this one time, you don't know everything that's going on in a game of Dominions.


And can I ask you to please have some consideration for the players who are enjoying the game before saying things, like revealing who's playing which nation. Or doing things, like turning yourself AI, that will only serve to spoil the game for everyone. If you wish to leave the game then I fully entrust WingedDog and Executor to find a sub for you. Maybe the sub won't be as good as you, given your vast experience and knowledge of the game, but they will certainly be better than the AI, and maybe also keener to play in such an enjoyable game than you currently seem to be.

All players deserve enough respect so that no individual players actions should be the cause of ruining their games. Be they a noob or a vet. A star player or a complete incompetent. The members on these forums are nowhere near equal as players (in ability), but they should all be treated equal as people.


ps. Zeldor, I also wouldn't say Pasha's RAND game is so well balanced, and 'being played better by all' either. As there seems to be a few nations there who are pulling well away from the others. And as yet I don't see any 'in-built vet instinct' kicking in that's stopping it from happening. Some nations also appear to have hardly been involved in any fighting all game. So are they not trying, or not fighting as well? Are you voicing similar complaints in their direction? Or are you one of the nations happily turtling away, so there you are happy that nothing is being done about it.

And to me Pasha's RAND game also has a lot more clear leaders in it than this game does. So there it's a lot easier, and more obvious, which nations should be brought down a peg or two. Not that any of that has happened yet, since other nations are wrapped up in, or recovering from their own wars. Exactly like what is happening in this game.

I am enjoying that game like I am enjoying this one, but I see nothing 'superior' about it, and see no big difference between them in terms of how they are currently being played.

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

I put that down to purely the fact that only two nations (Man+Pan) have so far gone AI in this game. When the AI takes over, you can put good money on the fact that they'll break any sieges taking places, lose all thier troops as a result, leaving their enemies with a simple walkover.

But if a human player bunkers down it their forts, it can easily take 10-20+ turns to finish them off. Sometimes it's not even worth trying to storm the forts, as it's easier to dom-kill them than risk heavy loses. Only 3 nations have been knocked out, but there are another two or three that are on the verge.

And I'd actually say that there is 'something wrong' with the games that have lots of casualties before mid-game, and that it is actually this game that is the normal one. Problem is that the vast majority of games have lots of early casualties due to the common, and toxic mix of AI-turning and high newbiecide rate. So it just 'appears' that things are not normal in this game because there are so many nations in it fighting to the last.

This should be credited to all the players who have stuck it out (and shame to the ones who bailed) and all the subs who have come in to put up the last ditch fights. The latter deserve huge thanks and credit in my books. (and of course thanks again to WingedDog for doing the work to find them)

Re: New game - The Art of War, Fight!
 

Not necessarily correct, the absence of AI's does provides a much more enjoyable and harder conquest but that still doesn't change my mind about this being a slower game. Normally I'm used to seeing a few nation killed in the first 20-30 turns due to rushes, with or without AI's, hell I always try to rush someone as soon as I can, didn't seem to work here doe.:)

I still feel that 3 nations dead is a slow kill rate, especially since there are some great players here.
And take a look at Yarg, turn 20, two players dead, and there are some on the verge as well, and I think they're all fighting it out.