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-   -   Bug: Bug Thread: Discussion (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=30593)

lch November 12th, 2007 05:11 AM

Re: Patala and Blood
 
Okay, didn't look and thought you meant Bowl of Blood.

However, Gift of Reason does not show you types of units, it shows you every non-commander unit in the province. The one you pick is done by unit ID. There can be multiple units of the same type and they'll be in the GoR list in the same order as they're in the army list, when not assigned to a commander. Otherwise it wouldn't be possible to select specific units without afflictions, for example. You just can't sensibly cast GoR monthly, it is not possible.

Folket November 12th, 2007 06:07 AM

Re: Patala and Blood
 
You can just avoid recruiting any ordinary units and you will be able to monthly cast gift of reason.

Loren November 12th, 2007 01:36 PM

Re: Patala and Blood
 
Quote:

Folket said:
You can just avoid recruiting any ordinary units and you will be able to monthly cast gift of reason.

I was monthly casting it on a summons, not a recruit. I had another mage monthly casting the summons, it worked fine. What *SHOULD* have happened is that every month the first mage GOR's the unit in the province and the second mage brings a new one in. I should have gotten one commander a month with no further orders.

Loren November 12th, 2007 01:37 PM

Re: Patala and Blood
 
Quote:

lch said:
Okay, didn't look and thought you meant Bowl of Blood.

However, Gift of Reason does not show you types of units, it shows you every non-commander unit in the province. The one you pick is done by unit ID. There can be multiple units of the same type and they'll be in the GoR list in the same order as they're in the army list, when not assigned to a commander. Otherwise it wouldn't be possible to select specific units without afflictions, for example. You just can't sensibly cast GoR monthly, it is not possible.

The GoR list showed me one entry for each type of unit in the province, not one entry per unit in the province.

cleveland November 13th, 2007 10:44 AM

Behemoth bug
 
[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif[/img]: Behemoth

The Enchantment summon Behemoth seems to be working improperly, or has an improper description.

The description implies that you lose the casting mage (he's supposedly riding on top of it & can't cast spells), however, this isn't the case. I've tested in 2 different games, both times the mage is still there, and can cast both ritual and battlefield spells.

WAD with misleading description, or[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif[/img]?

thejeff November 13th, 2007 10:53 AM

Re: Behemoth bug
 
WAD with misleading description.
Conceptually, you actually summon a Behemoth and a mage to control it, but the controlling mage can't cast.

Humakty November 13th, 2007 10:57 AM

Re: Behemoth bug
 
Don't think there is any pbm with mammoth, apart from an unclear description.
I've got a pbm once in a SP game : one of my fortress wasn't producing anything ( the order queue was preserved each turn). I stupidly erased the game, so I won't be able to prove my statement.

cleveland November 13th, 2007 10:58 AM

Re: Minor Bug
 
Fair enough. Pretty powerful summon, then.

thejeff November 13th, 2007 11:35 AM

Re: Minor Bug
 
Humakty: the fortress not producing anything was probably over 100% unrest.

Loren November 13th, 2007 07:23 PM

Something strange with the income graph
 
Situation: SP game. From a practical standpoint it's won, I'm just letting it run because I'm trying to see how effective The Looming Hells is.

One AI is left. Not too many turns ago I crushed half his empire. The score graph shows his income shooting *UP* at this point, it's now approaching mine. I've got 2/3 of the world + Gift of Nature's Bounty--he shouldn't be making anything like mine, nor should his have started skyrocketing when I took half his empire.

I also think it's got some sort of income cap in there as my income has been flat for some time now even when I took half his empire.

Loren November 14th, 2007 12:57 AM

Unique Summons aren\'t
 
Supposedly the unique (and semi-unique, like Arch Devils) summons call back the same critter you had if he dies and you summon him again.

Oops--I empowered one. He died, I summoned him again. The empowerment was gone. Obviously I didn't get back the same critter I had previously.

I think this is more a matter of the description than anything else.

Edi November 14th, 2007 03:00 AM

Re: Unique Summons aren\'t
 
It's the same creature, but the unique ones are actually reset when they die unless you call them back via Ritual of Rebirth. This is WAD.

The score graphs have an upper limit that is much too low for big games, so that you could have triple or more what the ceiling shows, so if the AI is just approaching the ceiling, the score graphs lie. Known issue, shortlisted.

Loren November 14th, 2007 02:06 PM

Re: Unique Summons aren\'t
 
Quote:

Edi said:
The score graphs have an upper limit that is much too low for big games, so that you could have triple or more what the ceiling shows, so if the AI is just approaching the ceiling, the score graphs lie. Known issue, shortlisted.

This explains why my income line is flat but it says nothing about why his is increasing. Why should his income shoot up when I take half his empire???

Edi November 14th, 2007 03:40 PM

Re: Unique Summons aren\'t
 
Maybe you killed off enough of his units that upkeep is no longer an issue? Especially if you were playing with the Better Independents gold mod, he might have had enslaved 9k (600 upkeep) units. If they went poof, his income would go up even with the province losses to you.

lch November 14th, 2007 04:32 PM

Re: Unique Summons aren\'t
 
I think the income graph is not tied to covering expenses like upkeep but just the gross total of income from all provinces.

Edi November 14th, 2007 06:35 PM

Re: Unique Summons aren\'t
 
Could be. I'm not completely certain about that. *shrug*

DireAussie November 15th, 2007 07:28 AM

triple magic site of same type
 
I came across this in a multiplayer game in a swamp province.

http://users.on.net/~dfidge/forums/sitesbug.jpg

It looks like a bug to me - bile marshes allow recruitment of hydra hatchlings. In the army recruitment screen it has 3 duplicate hydra hatchling icons.

My main concern is that the duplicate marshes add to the global magic site count, thus there will be less useful magic sites in the game.

Edi November 15th, 2007 08:25 AM

Re: triple magic site of same type
 
If those were randomly determined, then it's WAD, though very rare. It sucks to get 3 less useful sites of the same kind, but nothing you can do. Note that this is a swamp province, where this is more common, since there are not that many swamp only sites, so this can happen.

If it's something in the map file, then it's a map problem, not a game bug. So I'd chalk this up as a statistical fluke. I've seen 3x Arena in the same province myself.

vfb November 15th, 2007 10:39 AM

In-game message corruption with \'%\' character
 
The '%' character in in-game messages gets used as a print token (with a possible crash if you have %s I think), for example I sent an in-game message:

" - I up my taxes to 120%-140% on turn 1, and patrol"

The message received was:

" - I up my taxes to 120%-14027771505110n turn 1, and patrol"

The "% o" was interpreted as "%o" and printed a stack value as an octal number.

Loren November 21st, 2007 01:24 AM

The other guy\'s recruits
 
I've had this happen twice in a row now. I take a province and I get whatever he was building there.

Edi November 21st, 2007 04:31 AM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

Loren said:
I've had this happen twice in a row now. I take a province and I get whatever he was building there.

Could be bug, could be WAD, depending on how you read the turn resolution sequence, since buildings happen only after movement and battles. Generally the money is lost and nothing is built if the commander building things is killed, but I do not know what happens if the commander with build orders routs and escapes. It could be that since he didn't die, the game determines that "X had orders to build <building> in province Z, X is alive, therefore complete building", when it should do

- X has build orders in Z for this turn
- Check if X is alive
- If yes, check if X is in Z after battles
- If yes, execute build

But that's just an educated guess on the basis of how mercenary hiring happens (if you hire them in a province you lose that turn, they will serve your enemy).

vfb November 21st, 2007 05:37 AM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
I think mercenary handling has been changed.

Now when you hire a merc in a province which is lost on the current turn, the merc stays unhired. Repeated testing on the battle simulator map of hiring a merc in a province, which is invaded on same the turn and lost, leaves the merc in the unhired state. The money bid on the merc is returned to the Treasury.

lch November 21st, 2007 06:46 AM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

vfb said:
Now when you hire a merc in a province which is lost on the current turn, the merc stays unhired. Repeated testing on the battle simulator map of hiring a merc in a province, which is invaded on same the turn and lost, leaves the merc in the unhired state. The money bid on the merc is returned to the Treasury.

That has always been the case in the exact same way. Movement/battles before mercs.

Edi November 21st, 2007 08:12 AM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

lch said:
Quote:

vfb said:
Now when you hire a merc in a province which is lost on the current turn, the merc stays unhired. Repeated testing on the battle simulator map of hiring a merc in a province, which is invaded on same the turn and lost, leaves the merc in the unhired state. The money bid on the merc is returned to the Treasury.

That has always been the case in the exact same way. Movement/battles before mercs.

Yes, but it used to be that if you hired a merc in some province and your enemy captured it, the mercenaries appeared under the enemy's command, bought and paid for with your gold, which is what vfb is referring to as being changed. I need to scratch that bug off the list then.

Edi November 21st, 2007 10:26 AM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Added Legions of Steel to the spell bug list. Greenified a number of entries based on progress page and discussions in the mods/maps forum.

vfb November 21st, 2007 11:52 AM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

Edi said:
Added Legions of Steel to the spell bug list.

Thank you! Thanks from my overworked Yomi Sorcerers too, who have spent the last 10 battles trying and retrying to turn Aka-Oni skin into steel, and failing miserably, even though they were scripted to do something completely different.

calmon November 21st, 2007 12:23 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:


* ITEM 101 Twin Spear (death) Does not reanimate killed target as it should (related to Weapon 296, which this item gives?)
* ITEM 282 Gatestone Discussion thread here Also somewhat related to traveling spell issues above in this thread. Astral Travel cannot be cast from Gatestone unless Thaumaturgy lv 9 is researched first (or appropirate level if using mods that alter Astral Travel research level)
* ITEM 293 Soulstone of the Wolves See discussion link for Gatestone. Call of the Wild cannot be cast from Soulstone unless Conjuration 3 is researched first (or appropriate level if game is using mods)
* ITEM 296 Gift of Kurgi Discussion thread here Looks much like the the Gatestone/Soulstone problem, unable to cast Send Lesser Horror. Not tested extensively, but symptoms are the same.


Gatestone etc works fine for me /JK

Does it works now or didn't Johan notice the problem with researching the spell first to make the item workable? Maybe Edi you can write him something or edit his comment.

thejeff November 21st, 2007 12:40 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

Edi said:
Quote:

Loren said:
I've had this happen twice in a row now. I take a province and I get whatever he was building there.

Could be bug, could be WAD, depending on how you read the turn resolution sequence, since buildings happen only after movement and battles. Generally the money is lost and nothing is built if the commander building things is killed, but I do not know what happens if the commander with build orders routs and escapes.

Given the title of the post: The other guy's recruits
I think he was talking about troops not buildings. This may be the same as "BHV Recruitment Queue 2", but if it's happening in non-castle provinces that's a new data point.

Edi November 21st, 2007 01:22 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
calmon, I'm going to test that one myself first, then talk to JK. Ideally, I should test everything I put into the shortlist, but realistically, if it's not a statfix, I probably won't be able to, unless it can be easily reproduced without games that have progressed very far. I have test setup that can address that particular set easily.

Edi November 21st, 2007 01:26 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

thejeff said:
Quote:

Edi said:
Quote:

Loren said:
I've had this happen twice in a row now. I take a province and I get whatever he was building there.

Could be bug, could be WAD, depending on how you read the turn resolution sequence, since buildings happen only after movement and battles. Generally the money is lost and nothing is built if the commander building things is killed, but I do not know what happens if the commander with build orders routs and escapes.

Given the title of the post: The other guy's recruits
I think he was talking about troops not buildings. This may be the same as "BHV Recruitment Queue 2", but if it's happening in non-castle provinces that's a new data point.

Ah, recruitment. Then it's easy. WAD, because if the AI builds troops that require more resources than available, the production will be spread over several turns and popping in like that will just transfer ownership of the province to you, thus also any units that were being built there.

Building queues should probably reset to nothing if a province is conquered, that wouldsolve that problem.

Edi November 21st, 2007 01:26 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

thejeff said:
Quote:

Edi said:
Quote:

Loren said:
I've had this happen twice in a row now. I take a province and I get whatever he was building there.

Could be bug, could be WAD, depending on how you read the turn resolution sequence, since buildings happen only after movement and battles. Generally the money is lost and nothing is built if the commander building things is killed, but I do not know what happens if the commander with build orders routs and escapes.

Given the title of the post: The other guy's recruits
I think he was talking about troops not buildings. This may be the same as "BHV Recruitment Queue 2", but if it's happening in non-castle provinces that's a new data point.

Ah, recruitment. Then it's easy. WAD, because if the AI builds troops that require more resources than available, the production will be spread over several turns and popping in like that will just transfer ownership of the province to you, thus also any units that were being built there.

Building queues should probably reset to nothing if a province is conquered, that would solve that problem.

lch November 21st, 2007 03:04 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

Edi said:
Yes, but it used to be that if you hired a merc in some province and your enemy captured it, the mercenaries appeared under the enemy's command, bought and paid for with your gold, which is what vfb is referring to as being changed. I need to scratch that bug off the list then.

I've never seen that, and I used to run into the occasion a number of times. But I started playing with patch 3.04, I think, maybe it was a bug before that.

Loren November 21st, 2007 04:51 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

thejeff said:
Given the title of the post: The other guy's recruits
I think he was talking about troops not buildings. This may be the same as "BHV Recruitment Queue 2", but if it's happening in non-castle provinces that's a new data point.

Yeah, it's the other guy's recruits. The queue is empty but I get one turn worth of whatever he was building.

No castles, these are water provinces and we are both land nations. I've got a SC smashing the main forces and a weaker follow-up unit keeping him from being flanked and building temples.

Edi November 21st, 2007 05:03 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
The items have been tested and they are still buggy.

calmon November 21st, 2007 07:09 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

Edi said:
The items have been tested and they are still buggy.

Thanks for the test. Hope JK fix this by time. I would love to have a working gatestone without researching the spell http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

llamabeast November 22nd, 2007 06:21 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Apologies if this has already been submitted: When LA Pythium's serpent cataphract rider is killed, the remaining serpent has silver armour, whereas it had gold armour before it's rider was killed.

archaeolept November 23rd, 2007 04:36 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Vale of the Silver Cattle magic site says +200 supply, which it doesn't give but is no surprise, but also says +40 gold, which it also doesn't give...

Endoperez November 23rd, 2007 05:46 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
Quote:

archaeolept said:
Vale of the Silver Cattle magic site says +200 supply, which it doesn't give but is no surprise, but also says +40 gold, which it also doesn't give...

Sites that produce gold increase the province's income (and thus are affected by taxation and unrest).

archaeolept November 23rd, 2007 07:16 PM

Re: The other guy\'s recruits
 
yah... that's not the case. income is almost identical to the neighbouring province w/ very similar pop and scales, whereas the +40 should almost double the relative value of that province.

Maraxus November 23rd, 2007 07:24 PM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
Blood Lord: Unit #1389
Is equipped with (among other stuff)
Full chain mail (armor #18)
and
Leather Hauberk (armor #10)

Instead, it should be Full chain and: Iron Cap (#20)

vfb November 23rd, 2007 09:35 PM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
Unit# 553 Jotun Skratti has old age at 200 in Skratti form, but this changes to 400 in U#1653 Jotun Wolf and U#1652 Jotun Werewolf forms. (U#1653 and U#1652 are already in the shortlist because of age issues with mods, but the change shape issue is not listed).

Burnsaber November 24th, 2007 05:55 AM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
1 Attachment(s)
Weapon number 336 (the Deadliest Poison), which acts as a secondaryeffect for the artifact "The Sharpest Tooth", is bugged. It does not affect poison immune creatures, like hinted in the description of the artifact "The Sharpest Tooth" (weapon number 337, Item Number 112 ).

I tested this by making a quick mod whic gave some C'tis troops the Sharpest Tooth as a weapon and the bidding them against modded 100hp sitting duck units, some which had posionres 100 and others didn't. The poisonres 100 units did not take any poison damage from units using the Deadliest Poison or The Sharpest Tooth as weapons (I tested both possibilites).

The mod I used is attached to this post.

vfb November 24th, 2007 09:26 AM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
Edit: Not a bug! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif If I had bothered to scroll down a little more, or paid attention to the icon more closely, I would have seen that the Kokythiad was leading 5 non-flying units. Duh. Sorry!

Unit #1477 Kokythiad is amphibious and stealthy. I gave a Kokythiad in a coastal (land) castle a pair of winged shoes. The Kokythiad's possible movement did not change at all. The "Flight" icon appears on the Kokythiad view unit screen, but the Kokythiad does not get any overland flight.

The castle the Kokythiad is located in is friendly and not sieged.

Specifically, the Kokythiad is unable to fly over any enemy land territory. The Kokythiad is even unable to fly over 2 consecutive friendly land provinces into a 3rd friendly land province. If I give the winged boots to a Commander (Unit#34) instead, he can fly to any land province within 3 moves.

Twan November 24th, 2007 09:52 AM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
To know for mapmaking :
[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Fish.gif[/img] Only aquatic magic sites seem to appear on Sea + (most land terrains) - so underwater mountains may be used for a sea with more ressources.
BUT [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif[/img] Deep Sea + (a land terrain) may make land sites appear (at least seen with deep sea + cave and deep sea + mountain)

lch November 24th, 2007 03:02 PM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
Quote:

Twan said:
[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif[/img] Deep Sea + (a land terrain) may make land sites appear (at least seen with deep sea + cave and deep sea + mountain)

Despite lots of people trying to combine sea provinces and caves, like last seen in the World of Geometry map, the sea / deep sea should not be combined with any other terrain modifier by design. I have asked about exactly the same thing some weeks ago and I was told that this is WAD.

vfb November 29th, 2007 08:19 PM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
Info on two bugs:

If you start a new game after playing dom3, without exiting the application, then provinces can have "Ghost" neighbors. This causes dominion problems and counts towards the "more than 6 neighbors" bug.

If your province has more than 6 neighbors, and you do not have positive dominion in the 7th neighbor (in map file order), your beneficial scales will decrease in your province. If you also do not have positive dominion in the 1st neighbor, then the beneficial scales will evaporate in your province.

Please see:

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...;Number=567585

Twan December 1st, 2007 10:39 AM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
MOD :

Game (may) crash at game creation stage if a mod using nametype 148 or 149 is enabled.

edit : It seems a really strange bug as other modders didn't have a crash using 148 (but if I only change a #selectnametype 143 by 148 I have a crash with Greyhawk mod).

Cor2 December 1st, 2007 04:15 PM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
Seige bonuses from items on commanders don't stack. In other words a cleaver (+50) and a wall shaker (+25) = 50.

I am not sure if this is a bug or intended. It seems both items use the same effect and that is why they do't stack.

calmon December 2nd, 2007 09:02 AM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
In one of my current MP games i had it twice that a whole army didn't move (different turns). The commanders + units just stand still, ignore the move order and do nothing. I never had this before in all my other games.

The only special is that i used a mixed of stealth & non-stealth commanders but all got the "move" command (approved).

At least in one case i'm sure that no other army tried to intercept me. I never got a battle on the province. Mysterious for me. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

lch December 2nd, 2007 07:26 PM

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 
Quote:

calmon said:
In one of my current MP games i had it twice that a whole army didn't move (different turns). The commanders + units just stand still, ignore the move order and do nothing. I never had this before in all my other games.

I've seen it a lot. This is not a new bug, it's a very very old one. Might even date back to Dominions 2. It's happening only occasionally, but pops up from time to time in games.


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