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-   -   OT:Tempted to get this book (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=21631)

narf poit chez BOOM November 11th, 2004 03:03 AM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
But what's keeping the block from moving?

Fyron November 11th, 2004 03:06 AM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
The total net force on the block is 0. The force of gravity is balanced by the "normal force" that the ground applies back to the block (equal magnitude but exactly opposing direction). The force that person A exerts on the block is exactly the same in magnitude as the force that person B exerts on the block, but in the opposite direction. Note that Force = Mass X Acceleration. If there is no net force, there is no acceleration, thus no change in velocity. Since the initial velocity of the block was 0, it remains 0.

narf poit chez BOOM November 11th, 2004 03:09 AM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
I submit that the persons squeezing from either end are not directly opposing each other, but are each contracting the block miniscully(sp?), causing it's molecular bonds to contract into a slightly uncomfortable range and exert a countering force.

And even if that's complete blather, my point still stands, that force cannot be exerted without energy.

narf poit chez BOOM November 11th, 2004 04:14 AM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
If light has mass and goes at lightspeed, how come we're not all squished?
Best answer I can think of is that light ignores that rule and simply exerts force according to it's mass. What that might mean, I don't know.

Jack Simth November 11th, 2004 04:32 AM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
Quote:

narf poit chez BOOM said:
If light has mass and goes at lightspeed, how come we're not all squished?
Best answer I can think of is that light ignores that rule and simply exerts force according to it's mass. What that might mean, I don't know.

It's been a while since I've taken physics but ....
Light has 0 rest mass, and thus 0 rest energy. However, it travels at the speed of light. The equation for the energy (mass, energy; essentially the same thing in modern physics) of an object is something like E = sqrt(1/(1-(v^2/c^2)))mc^2. For light, m = 0, but v = c. The equation then translates to
E = sqrt(1/(1-(c^2/c^2)))(0)c^2
= sqrt(1/(1-1))(0)
= sqrt(1/0)(0)
= (1/0)(0)
= (0/0)
Which is mathamatically undefined. However, the universe comes up with an answer! It's a particular constant over the wavelength of the light, for any given photon (there's something similar for the inertia of the photon). Fortunately, it's a VERY SMALL constant, so it takes a LOT of photons to have any measureable impact when they hit you.

narf poit chez BOOM November 11th, 2004 04:34 AM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
If light has 0 rest mass and 0 mass from lightspeed, how can it have any mass at all?

Jack Simth November 11th, 2004 04:48 AM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
The basic energy equation:
E = sqrt(1/(1-(v^2/c^2)))mc^2.
Forget the mc^2 part for a moment, and focus on the stuff inside the sqrt
1/(1-(v^2/c^2))
Now, for light, v = c. So, we get, in the innermost set of parentheses,
c^2/c^2
which is, of course, 1.
So, we replace the innermost parenthesis with the result, and get
1/(1-1)
inside the sqrt. 1-1 = 0, so when we make that replacement, we get
1/0
which, other than being an odd comic, is mathamatically undefined. However, we do know that in the equation
y = 1/x, as x approaches 0, y approaches infinity. So, if we replace 1/0 with infinity, we get infinity inside the square root.
sqrt(infinity)
as the sqrt of infinity is still infinity, we can drop the sqrt function entierly, and the energy equation then becomes
E = infinity*mc^2
As m represents the rest mass, it's 0. If we make that replacement:
E = infinity*0*c^2.
In math, infinity * 0 isn't defined, and the c^2 isn't germain to this conversation (if you like, we can say the 0 eats it up and doesn't notice). The universe, however, makes it's own definitions, and comes up with a result for light contigent on the wavelength of the photon in question. However, that answer only applies when the photon is traveling at the speed of light. Plug any lower real velocity in there (well, any real velocity between c and -c, not inclusive of the endpoints), and the sqrt function comes up with a real answer, and the m=0 eats up everything, leaving a big fat 0 for E.

narf poit chez BOOM November 11th, 2004 05:15 AM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
I think I sorta got it.

Renegade 13 November 11th, 2004 09:10 PM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
Quote:

Imperator Fyron said:
Quote:

Kamog said:
A light beam shining through glass will slow down and it does speed up again once it exits the glass. Why does it speed up again when it exits the glass? That's a good question, and I don't know why. I'm very curious as to what the reason is. But I think the reason a block of glass will heat up when light is shined though it is because the glass is imperfect and not completely transparent. Part of the light is absorbed and turned to heat. So not all the light emerges from the other side.


It doesn't actually slow down, it just refracts within the glass and appears distored...

Light does slow down through different mediums. If I recall correctly, light travels quite a bit slower through water than it does through a vacuum. Or it might be faster, I'm not sure. (If I'm totally wrong on this point, please correct me, but it seems to be what I remember from physics Last year). Therefore, the only thing that can exceed the speed of light, is light itself (depending on the medium) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

deccan November 11th, 2004 09:25 PM

Re: OT:Tempted to get this book
 
Quote:

Renegade 13 said:
Light does slow down through different mediums. If I recall correctly, light travels quite a bit slower through water than it does through a vacuum.

Yep, light can even be "stopped".

Scientists Bring Light to Full Stop, Hold It, Then Send It on Its Way


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