Re: PBW Needs you!
 

Run a poll, and see how many people would actually refuse to pay. There would be some ppl who say "no I wouldn't pay" hoping to discourage you from introducing fees, and there would equally be some who would say "yes I'd pay" and then not bother to sign up. These would probably balance each other out, but even if you lost 25% of your players then you'd still have 300 odd Subscribers. Call it 300.

300 Users x $5 per year subscription = $1500 dollars. That wouldn't be too bad would it? And that's assuming that loads of players refuse to cough up.

To be honest I can't imagine any existing PBW player begrudging you $5 per YEAR. I know some of us are better off than others, but if you can afford to buy the game in the first place you can afford 40cents per month. $5 per year. Per YEAR. I mean come on...

I don't know about prices anywhere else but round here I could go down the pub and spend US$5 on one drink and not think about it too much. I mean if you met Geo in a pub wouldn't you buy him a pint? I would.

Besides, existing players are too far hooked to give up now. Recruiting new players might be harder, but they could be given 6 months' free play time to get them addicted. Sure, they could just sign on again with a different username, but then they'd lose all the reputation they had built up under their first name - especially if a ranking system was introduced.

Anyway, I'm in favour of annual fees. In the meantime, I'm going to get a donation together...

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

Another idea: Get Shrapnel to add a few dollars to the price of the game and pass the extra cash straight onto PBW. Ppl buying the game would be subsidising the pirates but hell, that happens anyway.

Perhaps for SEV this could be integrated into the overall game marketting strategy:

-Sell the SEV CDs and manuals at cost+shipping, and have the game as a free download. Encourage ppl to distribute the copy the game for their friends. Maybe restrict the number of AI players possible in a game whilst allowing loads and loads of humans, but otherwise have the freely distributable Version fully functional.

-Now hard-code the game so that the only way to play Online multiplayer is via a specific PBW server. Maybe take hotseat out, but I'd say leave it in.

-Then you simply charge for each PBW login & password, either a one-off payment or a recurring fee. Obviously for this to work Shrapnel and PBW would have to be somehow integrated into one-another, business wise.

In other words, the one-player game would become effectively freeware with the money coming from access to the multiplayer functions. Maybe some hacker could get in and alter the game to allow multiplayer without the PBW servers or somehow fool the game into connecting to an illegitimate server, but it sure wouldn't be easy. Piracy would therefore be redundant, since you want everyone to have a copy of the software, and all you'd have to police would be access to the game servers.

Just an idea. Two, actually.

[ September 09, 2002, 16:33: Message edited by: dogscoff ]

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, it depends on (a) how hard he looked, (b) whether he looked wealthy enough to do over, (c) whether he had good legs and nice eyes or (d) whether he misses any more of my turns on the PBW http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

I am scrambling to put together another donation for PBW (and I am not even using the service!!) and hoping Geo doesn't embezzle this one

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

ROFL! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

< rant > It never ceases to amaze me how readily people suggest how other people should spend their money.

The total PBW user base is only a fraction of Shrapnel's sales of SE IV. Shrapnel has NO OBLIGATION to support PBW. It's nice that they do, but there's no reason that they HAVE to. < /rant >

[ September 09, 2002, 19:47: Message edited by: capnq ]

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

We actually considered integrating some of PBW into SE:IV Gold, but at the time we did not have the cash to support an extra server like this.

I think keeping PBW independent is a great thing and adds to the strength of the community. I know all of you have have played on the service have enjoyed many hours of fun, and to me that warrants supporting the server cost.

In fact I contributed awhile back myself.

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">i can imagine. people stacking up their build queue and research orders so they can survive a couple turns without actually playing them http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I think the best plan yet is the small dollar ammount per year. perhaps premium service would be restricted to paying Users. for instance, you can play the stock game for free, but you have to pay to play with mods. or you have to pay to play with GOLD, or with patches http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

or you have to pay to play on the ladder, or in sponsored tourneys. PBW could host events, that are pay events. make some tourney games, with turn limits so they will end within 2 or 3 months, charge a buck a seat, kick 50% back to the winner. have a higher stakes game at $5 a seat.

combine this with the existing donation method, so that the people who want to give more than $5 a year for premium service and mods, still can.

when i measure the ammount of time i have been entertained by this game, and by the community, and the PBW service, and the quality of that entertainment compared to other games or other forms of amusement that i have paid for, and then compare the costs. even considering the copies of the game that i have bought for myself, and the copies that i have bought for others, and what i have given to PBW, im still coming out on top.

hell, having played this game for about 3 years now, im practically STEALING all the entertainment its given me.

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

I am not terribly keen on the idea of charging extra to use mods. It's hard enough as it is to get people to sign up for mod games.

What we are considering as a long term solution is to charge a yearly fee, along the lines of the 5 dollars you and others have suggested. The fee would not be mandatory to play however. We would start selling a limited amount of ad space on the website (Not popups. Yeech!) and by paying the 5 dollar yearly fee you would not have to see the ads. Of course this would be "grandfathered" so that anybody that has already made a donation would be paid up already. For those of you that made large donations you would be paid up for several years. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

What do you all think about this?

Geoschmo

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I think you guys should have some "profit" to all this, to compensate for the money and time put into all this.

Also, the "profit" could be used to hold more contests http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif , improve the server (lesser downs), but more money in the emergency coffers, improve the site, send some cheese or fruit baskets for those who contribute more than 50 dollars http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif and other expenditures.

Monthly fees would generate too much revenue, and most of it will go to geo's grubby hands http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif , and a yearly fee would generate not much to do this, although it would barely keep PBW alive, IMHO, and leave coffers bare in dire times.

So what I propose is bi-annualy, or quarter-annually (forget the Proper words for both) fees of about 3-5 American dollars, which should generate enough to not just keep it flying, but rather to keep it flying and attach another couple of rolls royce engines on it http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: PBW Needs you!
 

If 300 people paid the 5 dollars a year that would totally cover the expenses plus leave enough to replace the motherboard or another critical part in the event of a failure.

If we go with the ads as well that will make up for anyone that doesn't contribute their five bucks. And they w1oiuld not be seen by those that do.

We of course would still accept larger donations if anyone feels so motivated, and those can be used for upgrades or additional sevices that seem like they might be a good idea.

Geoschmo