Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Gloink! That's going to change the nature of weapon choices significantly. I'm fairly sure it will be for the better.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yes I do Geo. Just because you keep saying that doesn't make it true. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't realize you had seen the code and knew exactly how complicated a change it is. The only thing I can't figure out is why you don't just do that change yourself?

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I don't see why not. You have no trouble bugging us continually about it.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif Sarcastic assery aside, I think the problem here stems from you misinterpreting the term "minor." You obviously use the term for a much smaller degree than I do. Compared to a lot of potential improvements, this is a minor one.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Hmm... one question is bugging you continuously? How so?

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

hehehehe
I love sarcasm.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Version 1.88:
1. Changed - Added in Imperator Fyron's smoothed population modifiers.
2. Fixed - A ship would clear its remaining orders if it tried to load cargo and
it had no cargo space available.
3. Fixed - A colonizer ship will still be counted as available for colonization
even if it has low supplies (but not if it has zero supplies).
4. Fixed - Sometimes an attack force would invade an ally's planet if it was in the
same sector as an enemy planet.
5. Fixed - Occasional Access Violation or Range Check Error from the Combat Replay.
6. Fixed - Component mounts were not being used in retrofit change comparisons.
7. Changed - You must have movement remaining on your ship to create a storm.
8. Fixed - "Remove All" in the Fleet Transfer window would break up other player's fleets.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

That is a nice list of fixes. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

ah, you just like the first one on the list. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Actually I like most of the others more than number one. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif And number one is not a "fix" anyways, but a change.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

I like the second one off that list. It will make a real difference to order queueing and repeating orders. It will finally be possible to set up proper cargo relays.

Question is, will the final release be Version 1.99? That would mean we have another 11 of these change/fix lists to go (drool) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

When you give a ship a move-to order to an unexplored system, the system name is revealed in the ship's order queue.

Cloaked planets still reveal their name.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yup forgot that. Even worse: In the ship´s order queue, a colony ship given colonize orders into a sector of an unexplored system reveals the planet's name if there is one. And, if there are several planets in that unexplored sector, even the dialogue with the planet choice comes up, revealing the number and their pictures.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Oh, my.

This does not work on systems for which you do not have a warp point, no?

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Works on every system, you just have to click it in the small map to bring up the area with "unexplored" over it in the main window.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Well, well, well. It's a poor man's Ancient Race.

Of course, you don't get the stats, or if it's occupied, or even what type of world it is. But you're poor, obviously, and you can deal.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

I don't think it's worth any effort, except maybe in a few special cases I cannot think of now. Would be really bad if you could get data like owner or population. You only can get the layout of the system before officially exploring it, and this with a lot of mouseclicks. If I would have that much time, I would rather start another PBW game http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Still, it should be fixed.

[ January 30, 2004, 21:44: Message edited by: Roanon ]

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Yes, that is a sweetheart list of changes. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Say, Fyron, I've never seen your smoothed pop modifiers. Where can I get a look at it?

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Its been up on SE.net since August. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Smoothed Pop Settings

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Thanks Fyron. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Apparently my brain is too complex to think of something so obvious. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/blush.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Wow, I didn't know that you could use that trick to view unexplored systems... I tried it just now, but I very quickly got tired of clicking the mouse in every sector of the system. So I didn't systematically click across in a nice row or column, I just randomly clicked around rapidly, and I didn't hit any planets. Figuring that I might have picked a nebula or black hole or something, I tried a few other systems but I still didn't catch any planets. It will take a lot of patience to take advantage of this method...

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

This patch looks very good. When we are gonna have it? If it's said somewhere, I didin't find it...

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I liked it then and I still like it.
I am happy for you and this type recognition Fyron. Outstanding job, keep up the good works http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ January 31, 2004, 13:56: Message edited by: JLS ]

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

I actually think it is his second mention in the file, at one point he contributed some formations for large fleets. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

So i wonder if any other features will be added to it and can we expect it soon ?

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Hey, just find little things that can be changed for the better by a few modifications to the data files, and send them in! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif No need to be jealous. Other people have had things they sent in added to the game. Several of the older formations are from fan submissions, for example.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">That's true - I've seen a couple original ideas I've sent in added!

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Version 1.88:
1. Changed - Added in Imperator Fyron's smoothed population modifiers.

I am so jealus now. That is twice now that Fyron has been mentioned. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

Seiously, good work. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

I'm still waiting for the "Puke's Victory Parade" formation to be added in stock... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif At least your emails get through. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

I am sure yours do too. MM does not always have time to respond to every single email (they do get a lot of them!) if it is not something that requires a response.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

To get listen to create a catchy immediate response type headline - then they are more likley to read and act i guess than some bland email ! works with me with customer complaints.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

MM reads every email that they recieve, and tabulates every suggestion into some form of document, so as to keep them around and try to impement the more popular ones and such.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Version 1.89:
1. Changed - The Create and Destroy Storm components are now destroyed on use.
2. Changed - Mineral Scanner I, II, III have had their modifiers increased to 15%, 30%, 45%.
3. Changed - Hybrid Eco - Farms I, II, III have had their modifiers increased to 15%, 30%, 45%.
4. Changed - Radioactives Collider I, II, III have had their modifiers increased to 15%, 30%, 45%.
5. Changed - System Mineral Scanner I, II, III have had their modifiers increased to 15%, 30%, 45%.
6. Changed - System Eco - Farms I, II, III have had their modifiers increased to 15%, 30%, 45%.
7. Changed - System Radioactives Collider I, II, III have had their modifiers increased to 15%, 30%, 45%.
8. Fixed - The owner of a minefield would not get a log message if the minefield was completely
sweeped.
9. Added - Added "Race Directory" to the Empire/Race Report.
10. Fixed - When you replied to a demand for a gift or tribute, you were unable to view the package
of the gift or tribute that was demanded.
11. Fixed - Range Check Error upon loading a turn where massive numbers of units were launched the
previous turn.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">About time! Yay! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

That's good.. Now it's not so easy to create hundreds of storms all over the place ... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Now I will wait until someone makes conclusive tests over scanner use and robotic factories and provides us them http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

Or at least mathematical calculations. Hmm... perhaps I should do them myself. Actually, now that I think of it, it could be done by using a little program which counts amount of planets, their sizes (ie. amount of buildings), percentual amounts of every resources/planet and then concludes them with the multiplier when using scanners or factories (also considering the effect of converting excess resources to other resources). I have to think about this little more...

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Well... Monolith makes 900 of each resource. Lets say you have 10 monoliths, so 9000 of each. Now, you have two options: Planet Robotoid III and 2 Monoliths, or one of each of the planet single resource increasers. The first option gives 1800 more of each resource base production, or 10800. 30% increase gives 14040. So it is a 56% increase to production. The second option gives only a 45% increase to production.

Now lets say you have 15 Monoliths. 13500 base production. 2 more and a robotoid provides 19890, a 47% increase in resources. 3 separate resource enhancers still provide only provide 45%. So with 18 facilities, it is better to have 17 Monoliths and a Robotoid.

Now lets look at 17 Monoliths. They make 15300. 2 more and a robotoid provide 22230, a 45.29% increase. So with 20 facilities, it is better to have 19 monoliths and a robotoid.

21 facilities is where it becomes better to have the 3 resource enhancers than the robotoid. 20 Monolith + Robotoid = 23400. 18 Monolith + 3 enhancers = 23490.

Now, if you have an all minerals planet, it is definitely better to have a Mineral Scanner than a Robotoid at much lower facility numbers, since they both take just 1 facility slot. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Note: all figures are of each resource type. Since 3 is a factor of both the base resource production and the figures after adding more facilities, it drops out and does not make a difference.

[ February 05, 2004, 06:50: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Good to see they react to our suggestions. The overhaul of the modifers with the resource gathers is good.

ANother thing i would like to see emailed is a more dynamic AI trading system ie techs planets etc.

And also is more map choices on startup in terms of sizes at the core of the game. Ie instead of small medium and large

How about extra small, small, average, medium, large, extra large and huge.

ES = up to 20 systems
S = 21-35 systems
A = 36-70 systems
M = 70-100 systems
L = 100-150 systems
EL = 150-200 systems
H = 200 - 255 systems

Just for a bit more variety.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

I general it is like you say Fyron, but you also have to calculate the effect of lackin g2 monoliths (when using scanners) at the system level. There comes the probplem that I don't know how system level resources are calculated. I believe it is either one of these (planet value 90% and 10 facilities):

A) System production of one resource of one planet = (basic facilities output)*(planet resource percent)*(scanner percentual increase)*(system scanner percentual increase) = (10*900)*0,9*1,45*1,45= 17030,25

B) System production of one resource of one planet = (basic facilities output)*(planet resource percent)*(scanner percentual increase) + ((basic facilities output)*((planet resource percent)*(system scanner percentual increase) -1)) = (10*900)*0,9*1,45 + (10*900)*(0,9*1,45 -1) = 11745 + 1570,5 = 13315,5

In the first example the system collector bonus is cumulative with planet collector (1,45^2) and in the second example the system bonus is calculated only from planet output (excluding planet scanner bonus from that).

Now the difference I mean, is that if system scanner bonus is calculated like choise A) it does not matter if there are less monoliths because system bonus is calculated from planet output including planet scanner bonus (total output). The amount of monoliths is significant, if the system bonus is calculated from only monolith output exluding planet scanner bonus like in choise B).

I am not in front of my computer (and game) and I don't remember how this is. Could someone confirm this?

[ February 05, 2004, 07:49: Message edited by: Karibu ]

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

The base production is total facility production * planet value. You then add all bonuses/penalties up from modifying facilities, population, happiness, racial characteristics, etc., then multiply the base value by that sum. So say you have a planet with 102% organics value and one Organic Farm Facility. It has 30% bonus from pop and 10% from happinss. It makes (1000 * 1.02) * (1.0 + 0.30 + 0.10) = 1020 * 1.40 = 1428. Throw a Robotoid III on there, it now will make (1000 * 1.02) * (1.0 + 0.30 + 0.10 + 0.30) = 1020 * 1.70 = 1734. You get the best planet affecting enhancement abiltiy that affects the planet, and the best system affecting enhancement ability that affects the planet. So if you have a Robotoid III (30%) on the planet and a System Robotoid III (30%) in the system, you get a total of 60% bonus from the two facilities.

System resource enhancers have the exact same threshhold as planetary ones, as they provide the same bonus and have the same space tradeoff against robotoids. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Now, when you start to throw in build costs, it just gets messy and I will let someone else spend their time on that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

[ February 05, 2004, 08:02: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I wonder what that one could mean... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Maybe a set of little tabs that let you quickly switch between the various races when you're viewing the detailed stats for one race?

Or is it a listing of all the known assets of the selected empire?

Or am I just giving too many new ideas that would be cool to see but aren't really absolutely necessary? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I wonder what that one could mean... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

Maybe a set of little tabs that let you quickly switch between the various races when you're viewing the detailed stats for one race?
</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Nope, nothing that spectacular, but it's a very useful little addition. In the race report that comes up when you right click a race pic or flag in the game, the little screen that tells you their empire information, a new line has been added called "Race directory". This directory is the actual directory name that the empire file was pointing too when it was created, regardless of whether or not you actually have that race directory on your machine. So no more pulling your hair out trying to figure out what custom shipset that guy is using in your PBW game that didn't mark his race properly when he joined. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Geoschmo

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

So I set a chain reaction... LOL http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The fighter bug has been fixed finally. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Good to see the fighter bug fixed

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Is it possible to cloak fighteres - perhaps a scaled down fighter cloaking device. Or the ability to cloak mines ?

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

Mines get cloaked automatically. They have the cloaking abilities built-in. You could remove them and then add varying levels of cloaking devices capable of being placed on mines if you want to.

You can add cloaking devices able to be placed on fighters.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Mines are already cloaked. No ship/scanner can see mines until either a) you run into them and go boom or b) you have a minesweeping ship and you get the notification in the log saying you swept a mine field.

Edit: Fyron beat me be a nose. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ February 06, 2004, 18:47: Message edited by: Ragnarok ]

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

No im talking about the following i have mentioned before

Mines that when cloaked
a) cant be detected - only by advanced mine cloaking detector
b) related to above cant be detected by sweepers
c) if a enemy ship passes through the sector they dont active
d) they when cloaked arent active so to speak
e) only when deactivation do they opearte like normal mines

What i am trying to say is if you are being attacked and driven out of a system - you could leave a few of these claoked or stealthed mines and say 10 turns down the track once the enemy has the system and is moving ships thorugh to the next attack you deactive the cloaking - they operate like normal mines and the next ship to come along gets zapped.

I hope that sounds right ? if cloaked they dont do anything but cant be detected, once decloaked they are like normal mines and need to be swept as such or the ships run into them. Could be used on sabotague missions ie fly into a system leave a cloaked minefield and fly out leave it 10 turns wait for fun to come along decloak and hope they dont get sweap but take out some ships.

Re: Post 1.84 beta history
 

No that is not possible. Mines always detonate against any enemy ship that passes by (or get swept), regardless of who is cloaked or not.

[ February 06, 2004, 18:58: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]