Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Oh and I'm working on another main quest right now, and I also have a partial fix for the vanishing cambrian woes. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Oh and if anyone wants to ensure that it pops up every time, you can do the following:

Duplicate game.ini. Take the original file, and delete the quest names kawangi, damocles, and brood2 which come right after tutorial. (when you're sick of it, you can delete game.ini and rename your copy to game.ini). YOu'll also need to chance the mainquest frequency number from 4 to 1 in numbers.ini.

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

No dice on the new, new, new attempt at coming up with a unique quest for the corrupted Tan Ru. I was counting on that "misbehavior" of reinitializing a planet mentioned in the Mod Maker's guide, but it either wasn't there, or just didn't work like I was hoping.

But here was the idea: The corrupted tan ru start offmap and attack the tan ru. Then I have a second copy of the tan ru homeworld that hasn't been initialized with a corrupted fleet set to attack the zorg. So when they arrive, they destroy the tan ru fleet and appear to move on to the zorg. In this way I was hoping to apparently give a ship a changing trajectory.

It doesn't work.

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

This is a really terrific mod Phlagm! and i love the newest updates, especially the Sphyrna. Looking good and keep up the good work!

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Hi Phlagm!

Great work. Keep it coming. I notice that in the haven.ini file you have a 4th and fifth STAR command. However, the Modmaker's Guide to the Galaxy suggests that there can only be four STAR commands numbered 0-3.

Thoughts?

Lexicat

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Hey thanks guys, and to lexicat, doh! I was doing some tinkering, and I thought I had cleared that out. It has no effect anyway. I think they updated the limits so that you can have up to 8 stars (0-7) in a quest now.I just look on the page that tells the limits.

I think those didn't evaluate because it just won't do ITEM random tech in a STAR block.

If you can tell me why a quest having only this in it:

FLAG
KEYS

STAR 0
FLAG
FLET cambrian -5
END STAR

won't evaluate, please tell me. I can't figure it out.

-Jeremy

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Just found a crash bug associated with your new main quest (which I found legitimately, FYI). Part of explaining this gives away a spoiler but I can't explain it otherwise, so spoiler ahead:

__________________________________________________ _________
I had just gotten the third object from the Netherglades. I had a full inventory of objects in my cargo space, so I switched out an object for the new object (Golden Statue I believe.) When I placed the replacement object into the "planet inventory" suddenly a duplicate of the Statue appeared in the planet inventory. Without doing anything else more duplicates of the Stutue popped up under the planet inventory until after about 15 or so duplicates popped, then the game crashed out to Windows.

Just wanted you to be aware if you haven't seen this yet. FYI, I had already received the plea for help from Glory at this point.

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Yo Phlagm!

The ModMaker's Guide is a little outdated, but I wonder if those ITEM commands should be ITMS commands?

Lexicat

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

Hey Phlagm,

I have an idea for the recombobulator. It might suffer from memory issues with the game engine, BUT:

instead of trying to remove a random object, remove _all_ objects by name:

REMV it_torc.ini
etc...

then, follow this with some number of new items:
ITMS 2 tech
ITMS 1 loot
etc...

just an idea.

You could probably fiddle with conditionals and a few different versions of the quest page that remove/add different items. For example, one page might remove all weapons, and add a bunch of life forms. You get the drift. . .

Lexicat

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

The problem is that REMV has to have a specific item name. It won't take a random thing. If you do THIF or SABT, the item will pop up elsewhere inexplicably.

What ends up happening, is that none of these things are too terrible in and of themselves, but by the time you get to soemthign that will work, it practically resembles my idea in no way, and no longer seems fun or useful.

I just wanted an item that would remove an item, and give you another, and occaisionally do additional quirky things. i think it could be done extremely simply, but it'd have to be in the coding.

I've actually gotten a little disillusioned because there is this bizarre roof I've hit with the races. Now when I add one, I kill another, and that means that I'm never actually adding any races.

Seen the Cambrians lately?

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

right, i noticed the cambrians' absence. i reshuffled the names of all the races in quest.ini to alphabetical order (except for terran which cam first), now cambrians show up, but other races are acting weird (i don't actually encounter urluquai or zorg, and automatically conquer their homeworlds when i stumble across them).

grumble.

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

I haven't done much with it but become exasperated. If i dramatically increase the numbers that should be showing up, nothing happens. I started experimenting with making small quests that have nothing but a planet with an item on it and a cambrian fleet so that you can occasionally see one or two in the game, but those planets end up just having the item and no fleet 90% of the time. Clearly there is some cap there, but it won't respond to anything I do.

I'll post a spoiler here about something I have half-done, but probably won't finish.

I was never able to get a decent mainquest working for the corrupted Tan Ru. Every trick I tried to make it not look like a Ravian, Kawangi, or Primordius clone failed spectacularly. I am somewhat proud of my later Osiris mainquest, which is a blatant kawangi/Ravian clone, but with a catch on the beginning. Killing the thing is just a formality. Plus, I get a kick out of how well the locust swarm worked out.

My other quest was going to be related to the sphyrna. I actually have 2 more ships completed for that race, and something that I thought was pretty nifty. I made each of those ships with great blobs of alien flesh growing on them. The mainquest was to be where you encounter either the lone sphyrna ship that got away from this infestation and then they set about trying to kill you even as they absorb other races. (I was even thinking about making the klakar captain/homeworld become corrupted, the 2nd in command kills him, takes control of the ship and joins you. So you'd be fighting these infested fleets and trying to save the Glory system from this spreading menace.

The cool part was that to destroy one of these ships, you first blow off the goo (which attacks in its own way), which leaves splatters and scorch marks on the ship, and then it tries to kill you with whatever conventional weapons you just freed up.

But I don't want to invest any more time if there's a good chance it's just going to not work. It really sucks too, because I had plans to reintroduce 3 more races from ESAIS also: Wraiths, Silikites, and Dolomar. I mean I could add them all in the combat simulator, but that just makes me want to cry. The worst part is that having to cook up weapons for alien races is my main motivation for putting weird not weapons in the game.

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

I've been looking forward to updates and I can understand your frustration. Have you tried sending email to the developers about these issues?

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

Phlagm: I know little about programming and etc so sorry if it is dumm what I say, but I have an idea (or question). If you can not throw everything in at the same time in the game is it possible to put them in in packs?
Explanation: If there would be a mod called Even Weirder PARALELL Worlds :-D could you you put All the races, thingies, weapons, quests in the database BUT only use randomly as much as the cap allows? And at some time in the game you would jump into a special Black Hole and whooss! There is a another but paralell universe. For fun and continuation you could keep those races where you have some quests but all the others would be different (again: as much as the cap allows).
So whaddayasay?

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

If the core of this game just changed a little or included a few more options, it could open so many more possibilities.

I will wait.

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

Phlagm,

Well you are really inspiring in what you have provided so far. I myself have been frustrated, but have produced nothing nearly as much as you.

Ok, cat out of bag: I have been writing extra Esmerelda quests. I noticed that she was (a) really annoying to encounter, and (b) that it became really important to take her showing up into account. So I made a few quests that really make her dangerous (and have ideas for more). (and I confess that while I hacked WW, I usually just hack EWW… heh).

I've got the basic skeleton of of the quests working, but there's important subtleties that just fail with the quest engine (inconsistencies in break and endquest, in order of evaluation of page blocks, in sequential popups, etc.).

I really hope that you do write Fingers and Ripcord and (respectfully) persuade them that their excellent game could be improved.

Cheerio,
Lexicat

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

Keep going w. the awesome content Phlagm! Your stuff was one of the main reason why I decided to buy WW. You could, albeit painfully, rip out some of the standard races to make room for yours; or perhaps make the sequel, where you focus more on the stories of fewer (but more expanded/developed) races.

Either way is not optimal, and so much more could be done if more of the code was accesable. In the meantime, hang in there!

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

I'm not sure how likely it is that there will be another major patch. My problems with the modding are significant enough that I don't think they are readily fixable with a small patch. My primary issue is with the evaluation of conditions. So many just don't evaluate except in one particular circumstance, and that is what makes this game difficult to mod. I find that if you do a total conversion, things work out well because you can reuse the same quests in different clothes, but you often can't easily get conditions to evaluate under circumstances other than how they already show up in the standard game. There are also issues with inconsistency in how rules are applied as well. Finally, there are a things that just aren't exhaustive. For example, you can't take an enemy and make them neutral. You can THIF or SABT a random item, but you just can't remove one.

While the ship and weapons modding present their own difficulties--You would not believe the amount of effort that went into getting the minefield thing up to about 80% of where I really wanted it--they're mostly pretty good and flexible. The quest system is much more complex, and that's the place where you find the most holes. That's also the place where you have the opportunity to truly come up with something unique.

I would be happy to work with other modders here to develop a more comprehensive list of these kinds of stumbling blocks. I can imagine that making a game complex and yet moddable isn't something that can be done flawlessly without some kind of input from the community. You just never know what kind of nutty things people are going to try to bend over backward to do. I am realistic and know that there may be a significant portion that just can't readily be addressed in a financially feasible way. On the other hand, if we could fix a bunch of those things, I think the modding community would explode. If I could figure out why the hell races won't load beyond a number much smaller than what is listed as the max, I would have at least 4 more in the game.

These grumblings aside, it's a spectacular game, and I would love the opportunity to work on some more mods for it.

Re: Mod: EWW: Recombobulator
 

I'm up for some collaborating. It's true that there's a ton of oddities, particularly with the quest system, that make things frustrating. It could be really useful for everyone to expand the quest section of the modder's guide with some more explainations as to why some things have to be set up the way they are, maybe a step-by-step how-to for a couple of the complex ones, etc.

I would love to see a more open version of WW (where more of the internals are stored as editable external files), or even a sequal to WW. But while WW is still making money I doubt it'll ever be open source http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds 0.85
 

I really love this mod :-) Hope for another update in the future.

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds 1.02
 

Thanks. I've actually been kicking around the idea for a little while. I probably will make another at some point in the near future.

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

I already played a lot this mod but until now nothing special quests came up- UNTIL NOW !!! This "Osiris" quest is fun!
Keep it going, I hope there will be updates...

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Hey Phlagm,

I wonder if your problem with the Cambrians has anything to do with the Tan Ru being set to both "random" and "always". Like, maybe they're either taking up two slots out of the number of possible badguys, or confusing the game's randomization function in some non-obvious way. Just a thought...

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

You, my friend, are a genius. I still have my issues with modding this particular game, but I am now suddenly jazzed. The flag thing seems to have fixed it. I'm going to play a little more to make sure, but if it goes well, then I'm going to add a couple of races and a few more ships really fast.

-Phlagm

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

That is great news! I'm really looking forward to your next release.

I nearly didn't post that Tan Ru code error when I noticed it, because I wasn't sure you'd ever see my comment. It had been, what, nearly two years since your last update? If that fixed one of your major troubles, though, then I'm really glad I mentioned it.

I'm very excited to see your next version. I've always really liked your ships, races, weapons, and really all of your work.

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

/squeal of delight/ @ Phlagm

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

I'm still getting a little bit of downright bizarre behavior, but I'll live with it. That "always" flag is a dangerous thing.

Anyway, I've spent the weekend adding a couple of spiffy new things, nothing huge and amazing yet, but that's coming. I also think I'll give up on trying fruitlessly to make all the mainquests supremely original, and settle for some very similar ones with certain unique aspects.

-Phlagm

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

yay!

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Our friendly neighbourhood UFO

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/pictu...&pictureid=485

taken 26.06.10

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

Portal?

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/pictu...&pictureid=486

Re: Mod: Even Weirder Worlds *** Now 1.02
 

A well designed and stable mod that adds that little extra jazz to the game :)

Thanks!