Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

By magic sites, of course.
Also, if the map has no specified province names, the capitals will be named after nation

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

yeah, I guess this is the only way. The method is somewhat annoying, well unless the winner makes it easier for rdonj by giving the province numbers of the 9 capitals he controls.

It also means that the players will not be able to know who controls more VPs or is closer to victory by the score graphs.
Are you sure you want to give up on this indication?- The alternative is relying on scouting and speculation. Theoretically, a player could go very close to victory undetected.
I'm not sure I like this side effect of going that route.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

It would be ok in a game with diplomacy where a player who scouts well could tell the others "Guys, watch up!". In a game like this it may not be good, I agree with you, WL

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

You could have the admin post in-thread when a cap is taken or lost with the appropriate information, it would be the same as a graph.

Edit: Any player getting a cap should notify the admin so that the admin wouldn't have to check in constantly, of course. Since VPs aren't exchanged too often in most games this shouldn't be too much of a burden for anyone, though some sort of sanctions should probably be enacted for failure to notify the admin. (If you don't notify the admin the turn you get the capital then your VP doesn't count until 5 turns after the notification, perhaps? If you have 2 late notifications it takes 10 for them to count, etc.)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

Hm, in my experience it's almost always obvious when someone takes a capital from another player by income/gems graphs, and I don't think it's such a good idea with these "capture notifications", it's quite easy to forget this when game situation requires much attention, as in the case with your/neighbor capital owner changed.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

When it's obvious for you it doesn't automatically mean that it is obvious for everyone and in no-diplo game you can't just cry "Guy! XXX is going to won!"

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

Trust me it's not that obvious to see who's winning, if you remember what happened in Beer with Vanheim Ano.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

I 2nd ano here.
Micah's suggestion is good - however I don't see why we have to go to all this hassle just to defend players from early rush. Take an awake SC if you are afraid to be rushed. Rushing is part of the game and while I wouldn't have minded hiding the capitals I don't think it's a good idea given the consequences on end game (the original suggestion) or annoyance/overhead (the obvious draw back of Micah's otherwise excellent suggestion).

I say we go as planned.
Micah, now that you've made a visit here - care to join us as the 19h player?- (Although this will probably significantly drop everybody's chance of victory ;) )

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

No, thank you. I do not care for the settings (I doubt I will play another open-ended gem-gen game at any point) or large map size (especially with gem-gens active), nor the large volume of inexperienced players. I find that it skews the game heavily when there are so many soft targets available.

Plus I'm still spending hours on arti and am going out of town tomorrow. Just waiting on llama now though, I'm hoping to be done with the first problem soon, though it's almost tempting to wait until the anniversary of the game at this point, it's so close...

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

Oh, and 9-indies is a further kick in the nuts to some already-weak nations (I pity whoever gets Jomon...have fun never leaving your cap.)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

Hey RAND gamers. Count me in on this one. Sounds like a lot of fun. Yarg! I vote no on mods.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

Good luck guys, I will attempt to learn the game playing in a more newbie friendly environment. I will see you all in a couple of months, when my green colours have reduced.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Huh, stupid PM system. Sent 4 nations, will send the rest in the evening - can't wait 20 mins to do all that now. I'm in a hurry. And it forces me to wait 60 secs between PMs.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [open 18/19]
 

Hey StrictlyRockers, good to have you back :)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

hurray :D Got my nation.

Zeldor, thank you for being so prompt about this. I'm sure the unassigned players are itching to know what the lottery got them. No pressure on you though ;)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

So just to make sure I know this right, when/if you get eliminated you can reveal who you are/who you were playing? I didn't think so, but it looks like wraithlord did in the other RAND game...? i assume its ok then

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

In RAND games, I think's it's usually ok to say which nation you played once you are knocked out, but you shouldn't give any info with regards which nation(s) killed you. And you should especially not mention anything about what intel you have about other nations.

So, "I played XXX, congrats to the nation that killed me. Well played" is ok, while....

"I played XXX, and just got steamrolled by YYY. A warning to all to watch out for YYY's nasty ZYX bless. Plus I noticed ZZZ has all the Elemental Royalty, so they are a threat as well."
.... is way out of line.

Plus when you are defeated, you are not allowed to hand out your gold/gems/items like mostly happens in non-RAND games.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Yes. And please give your pretenders a generic name, preferably the nation's name.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

I think everyone should name their pretender WraithLord :D

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Great idea!

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

I'm curious, how do you prevent "in-game" diplomacy, using the game's messaging? Is it being disabled through a mod? Or the "honor" system (if so, sounds like there could be plenty of room for abuse there)?

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

In my opinion, if you send an in-game message, and the recipient of that message reports it to the admin (rdonj) then the sender should be kicked out of the game no questions asked.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

It can't be disabled, however it takes two player to cheat this system and there's always the possibility of the other player reporting you.

And as long as there is no talk about treaties and trading it's all good.
Sending insults and such messages without disclosing anything is ok.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

I don't think it's ok when you send insults or such. There's not that much difference between insult and treaty if you think of it...
I think that all messaging should be disallowed. Am not sure how about just sending items without notification though. Gifts or such.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

I'd like a screenshot of the reported abuse though at least.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Sending any sort of 'gift' can be seen as wanting 'friendship' in my opinion. There should be no sending of anything allowed.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Yeah, I meant it more in a way, Prepare to die you bastard!!!
Or, that was a good battle. That sort of little talk.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Or maybe it's just a useless trash...:)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Messages show up in games logs if its turned on.
Who sends to who, and if its text or equip or gold or gems etc.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Hey Calahan, thanks, it's good to be back.

I think I understand the rules. I think that any sort of message that you send is a form of communication and should be disallowed. In my opinion, the only messaging that should be allowed is the "Send Message to All" function. At least, that's how I would play it.

I have not gotten a nation assignment. I checked my email. For admin reference, my email is cjpurdin at yahoo

I am looking forward to making my pretender and starting in a week.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

I think no messages at all, of any kind, is the safe way to play this. Send message to all lets you say plenty

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Then it sounds like we should have game logs turned on, and then we won't have to rely upon the "honor" system. If that is not the case, then we should be encouraged to report in-game PMs?

"Gift-giving" I don't like, in this RAND format, then. Just another way of trying to engage in diplomacy ("I like you and/or I'm afraid of you - have some stuff, and hopefully understand it as a request not to attack me!").

I think in-game PMs should only be OK if they're sent to everyone? "Pangaean Dog, I'll kill you! Signed, Mictlan", and everyone sees it.

Or is even that too much information, knowing who else is at war (outside of what you can discover with scouts) and such?

I guess that begs the question - what's the point of RAND? To get rid of all diplomacy, or to get rid of the meta-gaming diplomacy? Honestly, I'm not sure what my opinion is on that, or even if there's a way to allow "real, in-game" diplomacy while avoiding meta-gaming.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Personaly I feel meaningless messages are ok, since it is hardly diplomatic to say "I kicked your ars in that last battle!".

The admin log may be turned on, but I doubt the admin will be checking it every turn for messages anyway, so what's the point either way? It's not like the admin will kick anyone out just for sending an "Micheal Jordan is the best" message or anything as stupid as that.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

I doubt people gathered here have signed into this the game to cheat. I beleive title says "no diplomacy and anonymous", obeying this rules is enough for me.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

I know, I'm not really worried about cheating, I just want to know what, if anything (and if it's nothing, I just would like to know), the in-game PM can or can't be used for.

You know, I guess I think a game with some diplomacy would be OK, as long as it was totally anonymous (in real life terms), and totally in-game (what with the two-turn turnaround in conversations), if that could be done. You know, as long as it wasn't a "hey, C'tis here, and I'm 'Bob', email me at 'Bob.com', and we'll totally coordinate and trade, etc." kind of deal.

But hey, this is not the first RAND game as far as I can tell (except for me, that is), and I'm sure this entire subject has likely been discussed ad-nauseam before, so I guess I'll shut up, and leave it to the more experienced players to figure out.

Guess I just wanted some clarification on how this kind of game would play out :)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

TwoBits

No diplomacy is the the very point of RANDY games, and that's why most of the people including me joined it.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Yeah I have enough faith in this community to be fine with the honor system on cheating.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Me too.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Didn't read what people said, but:

- sending remaining assignments now, all rolls based on karma, so 100% fair
- there is a tool that can check .2h and/or .trn files for diplomacy, so it can be checked if someone cheats [and it could be probably added as llamaserver option - checking for diplomacy]

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Strabo has turned off PM receiving, so pls turn that on and contact me about nation.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Excellent, thanks Zeldof. So now that we're all excited to get going, we're going to cool our jets for a week and think about pretender design before actually starting the game?

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Woohoo, I hate my nation...:mad:

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Perhaps, most of us do:)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Ok, everyone got nations except Strabo. If you didn't contact me.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Thanks, Zeldor.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Thanks, Zeldor.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

I've changed my mind, I like my nation now.:)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Oh, I haven't noticed that my user option are messed up and PM are disabled.
Zeldor, now you can send me my nation (sorry, I'm a bit late)

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Please refrain from sending any in-game messages. Also, don't post here anything that can reveal information regarding you or other nations. No diplomacy or communications of any kind is allowed between players.

If you lose your identity is revealed. This is part of the fun in the game, guessing and 2nd guessing who is who until ppl start falling. If you do lose, please also refrain from posting anything with information on the game.

It is possible to exploit the in-game PM system or communicate outside the game (duh). But we are all grown-ups here and I for one, fully trust that the rules would be respected by all.

I'll create the game tomorrow evening, so you can start uploading your pretenders at your leisure.

I suggest each of you PM rdonj with his email address and assigned nation. Please don't post your emails here.
Accept for procedural messages let's maintain radio silence until the game is over.

Re: YARG - Yet Another RAND Game [full, rolling nations]
 

Could you please explain why rdonj needs our emails? We can perfectly communicate through forum, can't we?
I don't hide my email, just want to understand the reasons.

And one more clarification issue: did I understand it right that when someone is eliminated he posts his nation here?