Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I don't think you need to have map file, just the map image.

Anyway, we've hit the start button about an hour ago and the game has not yet started, it has rather disappeared from the Llamaserver.
This has never happened to me before, but than again it just might be the Llamserver taking it's time, I don't know
If the game doesn't appear soon I will PM Llamabeast for help, hopefully the game won't have to be recreated.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Shouldn't we switch to CBM 1.7 (just released) while it's still time?

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I don't know if I'd agree. I've only given it a breif review, but some of the changes could be pretty significant since folks have already designed their pretenders. I'd hate to see the start delayed for all the tweaking that might follow.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

This happened for another game I am in. We had to remake the game.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Well, this game could last many months. It is not too late to change our pretenders accordingly in order to benefit from the up to date mod.
No big deal going with 1.6 as planned, though. Executor?

I don't know, I go off the scene for a few days and the entire game disappears :shock:

My understanding is that the 'llamaserver disappearing game' trick is connected to the map naming somehow, and the options for fixing it are to either PM llama and wait until he can fit sorting it out into his busy schedule. Or take the initiative and just re-create the game.

I'm disappearing again now for a few days (only here now as I had to come into work for a few hours). Should be back before the weekend to resume admin duties here.


I would strongly advise against using CBM 1.7 as well. It seems to me to need a fair bit of testing due to some of the major changes it has made, and a game this size with this many players is not the place for testing, as some nations could be seriously disadvantaged due to the changes, and have their chances ruined due to no fault of the player(s). (and basic beta testing can be done in small quick throw-away games)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I don't think switching to CBM 1.7 is a good idea, it is still in beta and it has a far too big impact on some of the nations. I dislike the idea of adding a mod that hasn't been tested and used yet. And not to mention it would take additional time to test and recreate some nations pretenders.

I've PM'd Llama yesterday and from the likes of it he still hasn't seen the PM. I understand he's a busy man and given the fact we could be waiting for him for a while it might be better to just recreate the game and resend all pretenders?
Quick thoughts everyone? Recreate or wait for Llama?

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Can't we do both ? If llama pipes up before all pretenders are up on the new game, good. If not, we roll with the new game. Either way, we get going as fast as possible and the workload is roughly the same for llama.

Or did I miss something ?

(oh, and count me out too on the new CBM. Too many untested changes, balance could be all wonky and we'd find out in two months. No thanks.)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Kobal2 has recreated the game for us since I can't access Llamaserver's map browser for some reason.
While we wait for Llama to respond, you should all resend pretenders, the new game name is 'No_Wankers_Allowed', and we'll see which way is faster.

Cheers.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Well I think this answers the question why the game vanished.
I'll get someone to upload the map under a different name and I guess it should work this time.

Please send pretenders.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Hello! Was going to look into it tonight, but yes, sounds like that was the problem. Sorry about that.

Maybe I will use the time I would have spent following this up on finally fixing the bug once and for all (i.e. making it refuse to accept such maps rather than allowing people to spend time uploading pretenders etc before disappearing).

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Actually Llama, I just noticed that the map had an underscore not a space in between, does that matter? 'Alexander_NWA'
In any case, should we precede sending pretenders or can it be fixed?

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Well, resending pretenders is not a big deal, is it ? ^^

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Executor: In that case, I'm not sure why it failed. I didn't look into it in the end last night (accidentally played Minecraft till 1am instead!).

I'd suggest continuing with the plan of:
- You guys start re-uploading pretenders
- I will try to look into what happened before. I'm not very reliable at the moment though, as I rarely seem to get much computer time what with one thing and another.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I am sending this message for someone else so his identity will be kept secret.

He has tried to resend in his pretender He deleted his old one from his file to change some things (wanted to see if that was the problem), and resent new one to....pretenders@llamaserver.net and subject line NoWankersAllowed.

It won't take it...with the problems llamaserver is having he is wondering if that is the problem. I believe he is about the last pretender to be sent in and doesn't want to miss the game so any help would be appreciated.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Hopefully problem solved and Pretender sent in....forgot the _ between names on the subject line....Sorry to bother you

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

One pretender still missing, Yomi, you better get your ars in within 24 hours or I'm starting the game without you, 3 days to resend pretenders is more than generous.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Ok all, I'm sort of back from dealing with my unexpected RL affairs. I likely won't be fully back to normal running until I clear the backlog of RL and work stuff that built up during my unexpected absence, but I'm back enough to resume admin duties here.

I have contacted the guilty party (with regards holding the start up), so hopefully that player won't keep everyone waiting too long now. I haven't gone through the thread yet, but can whoever created the game please PM me the password. Since my admin powers could be pretty limited without it :)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I'll give the missing player another ~12 hours (to allow for timezones) to report in, otherwise I'll get this show on the road with 18 players.

The various problems have already seen the start of this game delayed too long, and the missing player has had plenty of time already to re-upload for take2. Plus if the player hasn't checked this thread at all, and so doesn't know a re-upload is needed, then that player's attention and interest in this game can't be too high to start with IMO. So better out than in.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

@ All - I'm out of the office for the rest of the day now, but I will be starting this game once I get home with or without the missing player. I should be home by around 22:00 GMT, so expect the game to start around that time. (I've just PM-ed the missing player to tell them it's last chance saloon for their Pretender submission)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Ok everyone, I've just started the game for the second time, and once again it appears to have disappeared :( :(

I think there is a problem with the llamaserver, as the map selection and browser page isn't working correctly, as it's not updating the info displays when you select different maps. Although the old browser seems to be working fine. (maybe we broke it when we uploaded the map?!??)

I contacted llamabeast regarding this earlier this afternoon (when I thought it was just a map browsing problem) but I'll contact him again now as it appears to be a more fundamental problem with the server that is preventing games from starting. Although having said that, I have noticed other games starting recently, so maybe the problem is with using new uploaded maps.

Either way I'll contact llama, as I don't think this game is going to get started without his help.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Right, I have PM-ed llama to let him know the situation. I have also tried creating another test game using a recently uploaded map, and that vanished the moment I started it as well. So there is definitely a kink in the system somewhere.

I need to get some sleep now, but while I'm waiting to hear back from llama, I might try and create test games with a few different maps until I find one that can be used to both start the game, and is suitable to our needs (there are several versions of both the Alexander and Asia Twist maps on the server, some uploaded long ago. So I'm hoping one of them will work. Although llama sprinkling some of his magic dust in our direction is still likely the prefered solution.)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Maybe llamaserver has a profanity filter and erases games with bad words? (Just joking bro. Good luck with launching the game.)

Ok everyone, I've done some testing this morning (many apologies to llamabeast for spamming his server with fake games :() and it appears the Alexander map has vanished. As I tried starting games with 3 different version of it, and all went up in smoke the moment I started them. (but then I tried starting a game with the recently added Land of Legends map as well, and that also vanished when I started it. But another game recently started using it with (it seems) no problems. Just odd all round basically ?!?!)

But I just tried starting a game with the Asia Twist map, and that started just fine.

So my next course of action is to try re-uploading our version of the Alexander map, and the original version, and then trying to create games with those two maps. If that works, then we should be good to go for another start attempt. If it fails, then I guess other than waiting for llama (which I never like doing as he's a busy guy, and I like to see people trying to solve their own problems first), we will just have to go for the Asia Twist map that is already on the server. It apparantly has fixed starts for 16+3.

Will keep you all informed of my progress as best I can.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I will hesitantly say that I think we're in business. I just re-uploaded our map for this game (changing all the file names), and tried starting a game with it (MapTester4 for those interested), and this time it did start correctly, and sent out turns files like it did in the good old days :)

I will test it again to make sure, but if that test goes ok as well, then I think we are on safer ground to go for a third attempt by re-uploading Pretenders again. (as we've sent some scouts out this time to test the land :))

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Calahan, we all owe you a big "thank you!" for working so hard to get this game up and running.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Don't thank me yet as you might jink things ;)

---------------------------------------------

@ All - Further update

I have created a clone of our game on the llamaserver (MapTester5) which did successfully start, has appeared on the running games list as it should, and it sent out the turn files for turn 1 as expected. (I got properly spammed with new turn files :))

I will now go through the process of checking each turn to ensure the starts match the province #'s intended, to make sure the map uploaded correctly more than anything. If all that checks out, then I will re-create the game again for you to all upload Pretenders to.

(I will leave the MapTester5 game on the server until the game starts though, as if all else fails, I'll just un-start that game and in theory we can use that as the chassis. I think :confused:)

Will post another update soon.

----------------------------------

Edit - Not a Welcome Update

Houston, we have a problem. Just checked the starts, and two of them are right next to each other :( But they do match the starts in the .map file, which means the map needs to be re-done :( :( (provinces 258+264 are the culprits for those who downloaded the .map file). I hoped someone would have spotted or troubleshooted that while I was away. Oh well.

So the game starting problems seem to be solved for the moment, but I will have to examine the map file closer and see if the error is just a typo or not. If it is, then it's likely an easy fix. If not, someone (or me basically) will need to balance all the starts again. Which will sadly push the start ETA back a fair bit :(


This has already taken too much of my time this morning though, so I likely won't be able to get on the problem until much later today.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I've had a chance to look closely at the map, and the starts at 290+269 are adjacent as well. So the problem with the starts at 264+258 wasn't just a typo. (so even if the previous attempts to start the game had started, neither would have been any use to us)

This means the map is unusable in it's current form, so it will basically have to be re-done from scratch for 17+2. I personally won't have time to do this until Sunday at the earliest, so if someone wants to volunteer to get it done before then, please be my guest and step forward :)

Or

The Yomi player did not report-in in time for the start of the most recent attempt to get this game going. So I am starting to edge strongly towards booting the Yomi player and going with just 18 players. This has the huge advantage (I hope*) of allowing us to use the July 2008 version of the Alexander map, as that has pre-set starts for 16+3 (which I'll edit slightly for 16+2). Or the Asia Twist map which also has pre-sets for 16+3. (again it should be another easy edit job for 16+2)


* I say I hope, as this will mean uploading another map + image file, when we are back in the lap of fate with regards how happy the llamserver will be.


I'm also slightly unsure about creating the game (to allow Pretender uploads) until the map is sorted, as maybe changing the map after the initial game creation is what is causing the problem (and haven't got time right now to test this theory)


I'll hopefully get back to you a little later with a decision. (although I must admit the more I think of it, the more attractive the option of starting with 18 is looking. Since the Yomi player did use up all of their credit by not uploading their Pretender in the three days the 2nd game was in the waiting for Pretenders stage)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I am in that Land of Legends Map game and they modified it a bit to have 9 fixed starts (1 Water). All starts have 4 provinces, 1 farmland 1 mountain etc except 2 nations (and they got 1 extra province).

I know that map is too small for your game but you mentioned it and I thought I would just give you some info on it.

The guy who did the mod (we may have a new budding mod maker among us)is attackdrone if you need some info.

The name of the game is Kindanew.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

@Calahan, Executor : would it be a dick move for me to drop out at this point ? A fat load of work landed on my lap more or less unexpectedly and I'm not sure I can make time to play 4 games at once in the short term, least not with much attention.

I obviously don't want to take a steaming dump on a game you guys have put so much effort in to get going, so if my dropping'd cheese you off I'll figure something out.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I wouldn't say that's the biggest disaster in the world. And I think it's certainly better for you to drop out now rather than have problems submitting turns and start staling later in the game due to RL time constraints (plus the affect it will have on your commitments to other games if you take too many on)


There is still the issue with the Yomi player (Mr/Mrs. Yomi player, if you are reading this, then please contact me asap, and please do not post in the thread regarding whether or not you are playing for obvious reasons.) so if you do wish to drop out, your 'life' will likely be used to save that of the Yomi player.

--------------------------

@ All

I'm currently in the middle of testing the map I uploaded, and submitting 18 Pretenders to see if the llamaerver is happy to use it. If all goes well, then I'll un-create the game, after which it should be all systems go for a third attempt at starting.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Ok everyone, I have re-created the game. The name of the game is now StillNoWankersAllowed (had to rename it since you can't use names of previous games due to how the llamaserver archives work).

I have also tested the game by submitting 18 Pretenders (16L + 2W) and starting the game. I checked all the starts, and they were all correct, and there was no Houdini tricks pulled this time either. I then uncreated the game, and deleted all the Pretenders. (and that is where the game currently stands)


So, can I please ask everyone to once again upload their Pretenders for a third attempt at getting this game started. Taking note of the new game name StillNoWankersAllowed (no spaces or underscores).

Thank you all for your patience while the problems with the map and llamaserver were being ironed out.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Just one Pretender to go for the game to start (already PM-ed the missing player), so hopefully this game will get going before the end of the day (I have a back-up plan if the player doesn't show)


Also, I forgot to mention that you will all need to make a duplicate copy of the Alexander.tga file, and rename it AlexanderNWA.tga, in order to access the turns. I haven't made any changes to the image file, but the Alexander.tga image file on the llamaserver seems to be bugged (which is possibly why the starts failed) so I had to upload a new one. And had to rename it for the llamaserver to accept it.

For the computer challenged, I've attached a renamed image file that you should unzip into your map folder.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Calahan, when I try to unzip the file I get two error messages: 1) "no fles to extract"; and 2) "Unknown method in AlexanderNWA.tga. :confused:

Suggestions?

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Hhmmmm indeed, I just tried unpacking it myself with regular compression programs, and I get errors as well.

I think the problem is basically that I use 7-zip for archiving stuff, and it has a lot of unique compression methods that only 7-zip can identify. The last time I attached a large file (the map for YARG2) I attached it as a .7zp file, and some people asked "what's that". So this time I used 7-zip again but told it to create a .zip file instead. But didn't realise that this also uses the unique compression methods that you still need 7-zip to unpack.

So, to cut a long ramble short, to unpack the attachment you will need the 7-zip program, which can be found....

here

http://www.7-zip.org/

or here (in case you are one of the people who only trust programs on filehippo)

http://www.filehippo.com/download_7zip/


Let me know if you (or anyone) is still having problems.


ps. I'm still waiting to hear from the missing player, but I have already initiated my backup plan should it be needed.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

would just renaming the alexander.tga file work as well?

i mean an existing one.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I think you can go into the Dominions/maps folder, find the one name Alexander_NoSites.tga (that you have installed before), rename it into AlexanderNWA.tga and you should be fine. :)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Or that. (although if you rename the actual Alexander image file, you won't be able to use it for other games that might need it. Which is why I suggested making a duplicate first, and then renaming that)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

OK, used 7-zip. It appears that the AlexanderNWA.tga was unpacked, but with a file size of zero (expected?), and one message: "unsupported compression method for AlexanderNWA.tga."

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Hhhmmm, odd. Not sure why it's not working to be honest.

As an alternative, maybe just download the original Alexander map from the OP of this thread.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=37295

Unzip it to somewhere that isn't the map folder. Rename the Alexander.tga file to AlexanderNWA.tga and then copy that file into the map folder.

If that is no good either, then PM me your email address, and I will send you the image file in uncompressed format. As long as your email account can accept 40mb files that is. (I can't attach the file to a fourm post uncompressed, as it's above the file size limit.)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

OK, that seems to have done the trick. One last question, this is just the image, so I should not expect to see a Map Named AlexanderNWA in the "in game" map list, right?

Thanks!

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Correct. A .map file is needed for it to appear in the map selection list (when creating a new game).

-------------------------------------

@ All - I hope the game will be starting in the next hour or so, with or without the missing player.

-------------------------------------

Edit - Ok everyone, the missing player has uploaded their Pretender, so I have just started the game.

Fingers crossed that it's third time lucky (as it'll be tough to handle another failed start)


Edit 2 - I think we're in business. AT LAST!!! :)

Please let me know if you spot any mistakes or weirdness with the starts or map. Otherwise it's time for me to slip away into the background until I'm needed again.

So enjoy the game folks, and shout if you need me. And please notify me (by PM, not forum post) if anyone stales so I can look into the matter, as it's more difficult for me to spot stales in games I'm not playing in.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

It seems Calahan managed what I couldn't, thanks for starting the game.
Good luck all, and remember the game rules.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I've uploaded the uncompressed image file to a file hosting site, as some of you still seem to be having problems obtaining it from the links I provided.

http://www.megaupload.com/?d=I6ZS6743

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

@ All - Due to my sudden RL problems two weeks ago, and a fairly busy week since getting back, I appear to have forgotten to clarify some of the rules and player commitments / expectations for this game. So I will mention them now. (I will also be sending all players a PM about these rules just in case some don't check the thread. And as per Real Life, ignorance of the rules is not an excuse for breaking them)

---------------------------------

Some admin requests.

Not sure how clear some of the rules and conditions for this game currently are, but I thought I'd take this opportunity to spell out a few of them as clearly as possible so that there is no room for ambiguity later on. And I want every player to know what is expected of them as a player. Since all the players in a game are responsible for making it a good game, and it sometimes only takes one faulty spotlight to spoil the whole show for everyone.


Calahan's Admin Requests to all players in the 'NWA' game.

1 - Nobody is to reveal their nation at any time until their nation has been defeated in-game. You must do everything you can to keep your nation identity a secret until your nation is defeated in game. You must also be very careful about anything you post on the thread that could reveal your identity. Even the slightest clue can often be enough for others to guess which nation you are playing. If a player has to sub-out of the game, then I still want that player to keep his identity a secret. As my stance as admin is that a player subbing-out should not have their identity revealed until their nation is actually defeated in-game. (Which is different from the current norm of anonymous games.)

1a - There is to be no sending of anything in game. That means no messages, gems, items, slaves, gold. Nothing can be sent in game at all. If your nation is defeated then whatever resources you had at the end are lost with your nation. You are certainly not to send out 'gift' baskets to anyone upon your defeat. That only happens in regular games. Never forget that this is not a regular game.

1b - No messages are to be sent to any other player in this game. Be they in-game, PM, email, IRC, whatever. It does not matter. You must not communicate in any way with any other player in this game regarding this game. If you want to chat about the game, then chat with the admin :)


2 - Everyone is expected to fight until the last man, and to at least put some effort into making a last stand in the defence of their empire, should that situation arise for a player in-game. I do not want to see or hear about lazy playing such as capitals being stormed with all defending mages and troops on default scripts and positioning. Or going out with a treasury full of gems that could have been used to summon defenders. I expect everyone to have some pride in their play and their nation, and to put some effort into making sure their nation goes out fighting rather than cowering.


3. There is to be no turning AI by any player at any point in the game.

This is a golden set-in-stone rule for games I admin. I do not care who you are, or who you think you are. You could be the God of this community, or the God of this world for all I care. It is I and I alone who will decide when and if any nation gets turned AI in this game. Nobody else, and I mean absolutely nobody else, gets to decide whether or not a nation gets turned AI.


4 - Leaving the game.

4a - You leave the game when you receive the in-game message from the game telling you that your nation has been defeated.

4b - If you need to leave the game for out-of-game reasons, then you can certainly do so without the slightest problem, and this is not even an issue, as real life is real life. But be aware I will not be impressed if you decide to leave this game for RL reasons, but then still continue playing in your other games. I hate selective bailing.

4c - If RL does force you to leave the game though, then please give notice if you can. Or if you are unable to for whatever reason, then please just go AWOL, as that really is preferable most of the time rather than a player setting their nation to AI first. As AWOL means a chance of subbing the nation and minimum imbalance to the game. While going AI means either varying degrees of game imbalance, or a dreaded rollback to solve the problem. And I want to see neither of these things happening in this game. And I want rollbacks strictly limited to solving things like hosting problems and/or corrupted turn files. (and even then I don't want to rollback unless it's the only possible solution to the problem)

4d - If you want to leave the game for in-game reasons, rather than sticking it out and fighting until the very end, then Executor and I will be very disappointed given that we expect all players to fight until their last man. And it is unlikely you will be allowed to play in any of our future games. But you can reduce our disappointment slightly if you at least have the common decency to inform the admin first about wanting to leave, so that the admin can assess your position, and try to find a sub if possible. And see rule 3 for very specific clarity on turning AI.


5 - Be careful with that renaming, as it could give your identity away if you are known for using certain naming habits. Plus I don't want to hear about anyone using lame arse naming tactics to mislead opponents or convey messages etc. This is not a regular game, it is an anonymous game. So renaming is to be used strictly to help with the micro management of your empire.


6 - Basically, don't be a wanker. No lame arse tactics like copying Bogus orders, sending items to overfill labs, or probing with lone scouts and commanders to block the movement of enemy armies. If you are not sure if what you are doing, or what you are about to do is the action of a wanker, then I highly recommend checking with the admin first so he can tell you.


"Thank You" for your time in reading this. Happy gaming everyone :)

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Read it, remember it, don't break it, or else the one true Admin will ban you!
Seriously, I expect all players to be committed to the fullest. Lead your nations as if Yourselves are sitting on the throne.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

??? Interesting...

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

Just posting a quick heads-up for you all that there will likely be some extended turns towards the end of the coming week. (quite surprised I haven't had/seen any 48h requests yet given the game is quickly closing in on turn 30)

Will let you all know more about the delays nearer the time.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

I'm going to be on the road for two weeks starting on the 15th, so I would appreciate if we could go to 48 hours before then.

Re: No Diplo EA Game - No Wankers Allowed - Closed
 

@ All

I've started having some requests for a 48 hour schedule. And since the game is approaching turn 30, and likely well into mid-game by now, I suspect a few more players would also likely appreciate a bit more time for their turns.

So unless there are any serious objections, I will be increasing the hosting schedule to 48 hours from turn 30 onwards.