Guess I should have put it here:
 

I was looking at Patala, and it seems to have bugged morale for the Yogi, the S1 mage. His morale is 7. Seven????? Is there any mage in the game with a morale of 7 besides him? Also, the Brahmin priest, who I know is useless, also seems to have a morale of 7. It doesn't matter, but shouldn't a priest have a higher morale?

A morale of 7 is lower than militia! Is an S1 mage really more of a coward than an untrained farmer? I guess he really doesn't care what he is 'reborn' as, because given his courage, it's going to be a Markata.

Re: Guess I should have put it here:
 

[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif[/img]
When casting the spell "Rain" everything works as expected with the spell, however when highlighting the icon on the top right there's a TYPO.
It reads: Natuaral Rain

Should be: Natural Rain

Re: Guess I should have put it here:
 

Shouldn't it be "Magical Rain", actually?

Re: Guess I should have put it here:
 

Rain typo is known, I've been collecting a list of things which have typos. May not be fixed for the 3.17/3.18 patch that is due out soon but the one after that.

Re: Guess I should have put it here:
 

Burden of Time

Mages with twiceborn killed by the unnatural aging (note youth items don't work to stop BoT aging, but it may be WAD) come back as diseased wight mages with 1hp.

Wight mages and other diseased undeads seem to suffer when BoT is in effect, they gain new afflictions and never heal (but don't lose their last hp at least)

Re: Abysian Commander
 

Abysian Commander (M992) is armed with an Axe, although the sprite shows the commander using a Battleaxe.

Re: Abysian Commander
 

Contrary to KO's specifications, spellcasters can blow more than one "extra" gem to reduce fatigue. This is almost invariably uneconomical. Example here.

-Max

Re: Guess I should have put it here:
 

It's even stranger than that.
turn x -> my mage (who had already never healing wound) dies due to BoT effect and become a 1hp wight (with disease +nhw)
turn x+1 -> the wight still has 1hp and gain crippled affliction (no battle nor event so BoT can be the only cause)
turn x+2 -> the wight suddenly has 18hp, no new affliction

My best guess is : each time an unit is selected to take the extra aging from BoT, disease cause afflictions even affecting undeads, and natural healing doesn't occur (but the last hp isn't lost by undeads). But only a limited number of units are affected by BoT (number shown in BoT messsage) each turn, and the others will heal if undead.

EDIT : in fact any twiceborned mage dying from disease (even when BoT isn't in effect) become a wight mage with 1hp (but heal the next turn).

BoT seem to make undeads continue to suffer from their disease and not heal in some cases (not always).

Re: Abysian Commander
 

KO just didn't understand how it works then. It's all in the manual. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif A mage can use as many gems for a spell as his magic level is. This includes the gem cost for the spell. If he has a magic level of 5, then he can use 5 gems. If the spell costs 3 gems, then he can use 2 gems to reduce fatigue. Additionally, he can use exactly one (1) gem to increase his magic level to cast a spell that's higher than his current level. Since he'll be casting a spell over his magic level, he'll receive additional fatigue by this, it's exactly the reverse to using gems for reducing fatigue. Here are a couple of examples how it works:

Magic level 1, wants to cast spell level 2 which takes no gems: works with 1 additional gem
Magic level 2, wants to cast spell level 3 which takes 2 gems: doesn't work, since he needs 2 gems for the spell, nothing left to raise his path
Magic level 1, wants to cast spell level 2 which takes 1+ gems: doesn't work, since he can only use one gem and needs at least two
Magic level 5, wants to cast spell level 7: doesn't work, since he can only use one gem to raise his path
Magic level 0, wants to cast spell level 1 which takes no gems: doesn't work, since he can only use 0 gems = no gems
Magic level 5, wants to cast spell with level <= 5 which takes 2 gems: works, and he has 3 gems left to reduce fatigue

Seduction / retreat
 

This is marked as fixed in the manual, but it still isn't done properly. Attached is a game where I tested it. The proper test should work like this: If seducer and seduced can enter UW provinces (because they're both amphibian/low amphib/aquatic or have items which give that to them, or the global is up etc.) then include UW provinces as viable retreat targets for the seduction. Otherwise don't. So, just apply the same logic as during movement for this. Or only check for the attribute on the seducer and let the damn idiot that got seduced drown. But not the other way around. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Abysian Commander
 

IMHO, KO sounded pretty definitive there, which means there's a bug and Bruce documented it in the manual. I don't know whether it's a coding bug or a design/specification bug, but something got messed up somewhere along the way.

-Max

Re: Abysian Commander
 

That mechanic was made for Dom:PPP, and I doubt it has been changed since. The game was out 2001. That means it's been at least 7 years since that mechanic was made, and furthermore it was coded by Johan, not Kristoffer. While I'm sure that they discuss things they want to have and what kind of results they want to be achievable in the game, I doubt they iron out every mechanic on paper and only code it afterwards. I expect that JK does most of the mechanics-work himself, relying on his and Kristoffer's ideas about the results they want to achieve.

Kristoffer is a great guy, and I certainly listen to him, but he's far from omniscient. He's working on that, though.

Re: Abysian Commander
 

Endoperez,

Since Dom:PPP you say? Okay, I think you've made your case. I stand corrected.

-Max

Re: Abysian Commander
 

Should Fossilized Sword (w512) be length 1?

Re: Seduction / retreat
 

Ah, and I was just a patch level too early to test it. The new patch seems to have this working right like it should. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Seduction / retreat
 

I mark bugs fixed as soon as IW reports them fixed. If there is green stuff mixed in with the black/purple/red, it means those will be working properly when the next patch comes out, but not before. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Bug thread
 

Hinnom Ammi can be recruited without a lab.

Re: Bug thread
 

Don't think it's a bug. Any mage with no primary path (i.e. only a "?" on the info screen) can be recruited without a lab.

Re: Bug thread
 

It's not a bug, it's a feature.

Shortlist has been updated to reflect the starting situation with v3.17. Need to check the forts issue, as Citadel should be fixed, but it's way too late in the evening for that today.

Re: Bug thread
 

Bone Grinding is supposed to be MR+ to avoid receiving the "Crippled" affliction, according to the manual. I used the following plus Shift + U to test w/ a D9 Vampire Queen, and got 100 Kuro-Onis with various afflictions (limp, blind, mute) but no Crippled (although I didn't check every single Oni). Either the manual is wrong about the "Crippled" affliction or it's a bug.

#selectspell "Bone Grinding"
#fatiguecost 10
#researchlevel 0
#end

#selectmonster 1274 -- Kuro Oni
#mr 2 -- to make sure they fail the MR+ check
#end

-Max

Re: Bug thread
 

I couldn't find any previous reports of this with the search function.

In a v1.15 SP game, I got an event in which an independent assassin attacked one of my commanders. In Messages, this was listed as "There was a battle in Cimri (special)." The commander had bodyguards, but they did not take part in the battle. After the commander died, the bodyguards were back in the province's garrison.

Unfortunately, I don't have the previous turn saved to prove that the bodyguards were assigned to the commander before the assassination.

Re: Bug thread
 

Huh. I had that indy assassin event in my most recent game, too, on turn 2. I hadn't assigned any bodyguards though (in fact it attacked a commander who was recruited on turn 2).

-Max

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 

A smallish bug: Darkness penalties are not listed properly in the most detailed stat views for units with darkvision 50. More specifically:

I'm playing as MA Abysia, and Utterdark has been cast. When I click a humanbred's Attack Skill value, I see:

Basic Attack Skill: 10
Darkness: -5
Current Attack Skill: 5

But when I click an Abysian Infantry's Attack Skill value, I see:

Basic Attack Skill: 10
Current Attack Skill: 7

So there's a penalty of 3 points that's applied but not listed.

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 

Oh, I see. It should say "Darkness: -3".

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 

Just in case you forgot this (not added in the short list yet).

Units are :

U1652
U1653

Re: Bug Thread: Discussion
 

Nope, didn't forget. Wasn't around during the weekend and yesterday. I'll add those when I get home later this evening.

Re: Bug thread
 

Patch 3.17: Mid age Man commanders cannot build any temples!!!

Re: Bug thread
 

Normal commanders and even sacred commanders cannot and are not supposed to be able to. Commanders with holy magic (e.g. monks) can build temples. Unless you're telling me units with holy magic can't build temples, this is WAD.

Re: Bug thread
 

Daughters of avalon and mothers of avalon cannot build the temple. Although they are priests level 1. What is a WAD?

Re: Bug thread
 

Wrong. Look again more closely. They are sacred units but they do NOT have holy magic of any kind. In fact the only unit in MA Man that does have holy magic is the Monk. The sacred tag looks a bit like holy magic, but not too much. Take a look at the monk to see what I mean.

WAD.

Re: Bug thread
 

Youre right Edi, im sorry for taking your time, if you want, you can delete these posts.

Re: Bug thread
 

It's okay. We all make mistakes. Don't worry. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Oh, and WAD = Working As Designed. I had to come up with something to shorten that to because when the I began compiling the bug shortlist, there was a lot of stuff that was being reported as a bug when it was either a feature request or it was, as the acronym says, working as it was supposed to.

Take a look at the shortlist (sticky thread) to get an idea of what we know about and how to report bugs. It is always better to have too much detail than too little when getting bug reports, because extra can be cut out but you can't make information out of nothing. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Small Bug - maybe reported
 

when you save hinnom pretenders from game tools.. they report as early_gath.

Chris

Re: Small Bug - maybe reported
 

Yes, and it's WAD. That's likely because Gath was the first one of the three to be done. The pretender saving and nation description, brief and summary assignment in the actual game code is severely suboptimal for purposes of managing mods and other similar things.

That section should, in my opinion, be revamped, but whether Illwinter feels the same way is a different thing entirely. It is going to come up for discussion once I finish the 3.17 Dom3 DB and start working on the modding shortlist.

Re: Small Bug - maybe reported
 

From the description of "Enliven Marble Oracle" spell:
"...these telestic animates lumber to and fro in the..."
Should be:
"...these telestic animates lumber to and from in the..."

Re: Small Bug - maybe reported
 

That's not a bug nor is it a typo. To move to and fro is a saying, it is grammatically correct.

Re: Small Bug - maybe reported
 

Yes, it means "back and forth."

Re: Small Bug - maybe reported
 

Actually "to and fro" is perfectly acceptable. Not sure if it is intentional though http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/to-and-fro

EDIT: Oops, didn't notice there was an extra page http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif

Major modding bug
 

This is a serious bug which pretty much prevents new mod nations from working.

It appears that #custommagic and #magicskill don't work or have been changed somehow by the new patch. No modded magic users or priests have any paths. Holy, blood, 100% FEW random, doesn't matter - none of it shows up any more.

Re: Major modding bug
 

That bug is peculiar to your system, Sombre. I don't have any problems with my Ermor mod working exactly as it should, whether I make the Shadow Priestess a completely new unit with a new monster number or whether I use an existing unused monster that I replace. I'd need more confirmation of this before I shortlist it.

Re: Major modding bug
 

I think the bug Sombre has bumped into is using #custommagic with HOLY magic... I recall hearing someone else claiming "#custommagic with HOLY magic" doesn't work.


====

Edit Update: Tested and Confirmed Bug [img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Bug.gif[/img]

"#custommagic with HOLY magic" doesn't work.

Re: Major modding bug
 

Probably. Did not consider that instance, as I did not read it that way.

Re: Major modding bug
 

I can confirm the existance of the bug. Try it with my Debug mod and Worthy Heroes mod.

If the Worthy Heroes mod is first enabled, and then Debug mod, the Debug Sensei summoned will have no magic skills.

If the Debug mod is first enabled and then Worth Heroes mod, the Debug Sensei will have his magic skills. I did not check if the Worthy Heroes got affected.

Re: Major modding bug
 

What's the overlap? Because holy magic cannot be assigned randomly. We have that from KO himself. So that's a known issue, but is it other magics disappearing too, independent of H randoms?

Re: Major modding bug
 

Holy causes other magic paths to fail.
Also, you can not make 10 20% chances; for example it will just come out as a 200% chance.

Re: Major modding bug
 

What Sombre said,

"It appears that #custommagic and #magicskill don't work or have been changed somehow by the new patch. No modded magic users or priests have any paths. Holy, blood, 100% FEW random, doesn't matter - none of it shows up any more."

In my case, I used #magicskill and tried to tweak with #magicboost. No magic shows up. Enabling and disabling mod as I mentioned works.

Someone did mention about an absolute numeric limitation on #magicskill.

Magic path limitation

Re: Major modding bug
 

It may or may not be peculiar to my system, but other people are reporting something which sounds the same. Amhazair for example in a couple of threads on the mod forum, he also mentions Lolomo was seeing the same bug.

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...=&fpart=13

And no, I'm not confused about #custommagic for the holy path. I'm aware that's never worked. I'm saying all of my mod nations have lost all magic paths on all recruitables, both those using the straightforward #magicskill and those using #custommagic. I haven't changed anything about any of them - this has occured purely with the patch being applied.

I just tested it now and things appeared to be working normally,.. at firzt,...

First I tried just Skaven - worked fine.
Then Skaven + Ogres - worked fine.
Skaven + Ogres + Avernum - fine.
Arga + Skaven + Ogres + Avernum - fine.
Arga + Skaven + Ogres + Avernum + CBM - fine.


But when loaded in this order,...

CBM
Skaven
Streamers and standards
arga dis
ogres
avernum


Then vanilla nation mages have magic, but none of the mod nation mages do. It therefore appears to be another overflow bug of some kind.

Re: Major modding bug
 

Well, I never claimed to understand about modding. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

After reading this I tried to load the different nations without other mods, and they did indeed work well for me too, so I'm guessing (but it's only guessing) that Sombre appears to be arriving to a plausible conclusion.

Re: Major modding bug
 

If there is a hard limit, then what probably triggers this is all the new mages in the patch, because there are quite a few. It may also have something to do with vanilla unit numbers stretching into space that used to be available to modding.

Can you get me a count of #magicskill and #custommagic commands from those mods? Having numbers could help solve this problem faster.

Re: Major modding bug
 

I doubt it's anything like a unit ID conflict. Those look completely different and probably wouldn't change depending on what order the mods were loaded in.

I find it hard to believe there's a hard limit on the number of different unit types with magic. It seems more like some other limit is being reached (like the description or sprite limits we often used to run into) and this is somehow causing mage paths to vanish.

I don't have time to make a count right now, someone else is welcome to though.