Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Woot!

Sammual

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The AI thread isnt pointless, if nothing else it has moved form: the AI sucks, it must be improved, to a list of specific complaints. The list is actually helpfull and much less irritating than the orginal the AI sucks Posts. Without promising anything making the AI favourably wieght sacred or armored troops when recruiting might be a candidate for an improvement, for example. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">johan many of us are trying to help to you guys, I have made that list after 15 games with the demo. All of those were played for 40 turns, and I've posted my experience.

Hopefully the AI scripter can make improvements in those things on the list. We don't need any promises, we won't demand anything..at least me.
I love this game, and I want to help to you to make it even lot better, via a lot better strategic AI.

better strategic AI -> better, more enjoyable SP -> happier players & fans.

I think this is all clear. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

Yup, trollish Posts are gone (the ai sucks etc.), and very good suggestions can be found now in the AI thread.
Just check them out and try to solve the problems with it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif Where did you read about this? I am kinda shocked by this statement.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Actually that was KO, not JO, and he wrote:

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">That was in the "What did I missed from Dom I.? -> DIPLOMACY!" thread, page #5.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Simple: there are still many bugs and balance issues in the game that need to be solved, these affect both SP and MP play, and should be solved first. Improving the AI will certainly require more much time than the bug/balance fixes and will mainly benefit to the SP players. How is it so difficult to understand?

Quote:

You are constantly flaming the people, who trying to make suggestions about the strategic AI.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I apologize to anyone who got the impression I flamed him, as that wasn't my intent. BTW, I spent 30 minutes to locate the post by KO that I quoted above, so please return the favor and point the threads where I did flame these persons. I doubt you'll find any, bar this one, to support your "constantly" claim. Also note the order of events in this very thread that led to the present discussion:

Someone: it's so easy to abuse the AI with an SC pretender in SP, fix this asap.

Me: it's not that important, there are workarounds to this:
(1) if you don't want to abuse the AI, just don't abuse the AI - IOW, don't field a SC pretender.
(2) edit the map files to improve the AI starting position.
(Note: no flames)

Someone: Improving the AI is VERY important. Nagot you're selfish. Angry smileys.
(Note: no argument. First flame)

Me: but there are workarounds! Try them out.
(Note: still no flames from me)

Someone: Nagot you're wrong. AI is very important regardless of your suggestion. You're living in the past.
(Note: More flames)

Me: replying (with arguments) in the same sarcastic tone (past -> future), so flame for flame. But note I wrote "I truly hope IW will prove me wrong".

So, who's to blame for the flames?

Quote:

I think that at least 60% of the players would be lot happier with a better strategical AI.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I sure would. I'd love to see a really good AI. But again, I think there are higher priorities. I explained the why and the how.

Quote:

I haven't seen a constructive post from you about the strategical AI,

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">You're kidding, right? I explained how to script the map files to provide easy workarounds to a deficient AI, and these workarounds are available NOW! The AI doesn't equip his pretender? Script. He doesn't build havy troops? Script. He always pick a crappy dominion? Script. He doesn't build fortresses? Script. Has anyone ever given a more constructive contribution that that? Than something that works NOW, as opposed to an improved AI that we may probably not see in a foreseeable future? I doubt it.

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

Hey Nagot, can't you stop plz?
IMHO improving the strategic AI. should be the #1. on the priority list. It is very important, and no I won't and can't script.
Scripts wont raise the quality of the AI. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Some AIs (at least some of them, I don't know for sure about Dominions) are mostly made of scripts, so they will definitively raise the quality of the AI. (If done right that is) However, you do need to know how to use them, which is another matter altogether. And Nagot can very well say what he thinks, especially as he explains why he things so and even gives ways to improve the situation in the current state. I, for one, won't ask you more Nagot. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Not quite though. I do have a question for you: how would you write a script to make the AI build more heavy troops? I mean, what file would you tweak? I don't ask you to explain how you would write the script though. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Or did I miss this part?

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

Alas to be fair, you can only script initial starting positions for the AI. Sure, it dont differs from 99% of our so called strategy games, where the AI is given numerical advantages, but thats all.

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Some AIs (at least some of them, I don't know for sure about Dominions) are mostly made of scripts, so they will definitively raise the quality of the AI. (If done right that is) However, you do need to know how to use them, which is another matter altogether. And Nagot can very well say what he thinks, especially as he explains why he things so and even gives ways to improve the situation in the current state. I, for one, won't ask you more Nagot. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Not quite though. I do have a question for you: how would you write a script to make the AI build more heavy troops? I mean, what file would you tweak? I don't ask you to explain how you would write the script though. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Or did I miss this part? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">This is ridicolous. Let the devs to upgrade the AI plz. Scripting map files won't help. The AI will be the same. Yes it will offer a bigger challange, but the core of the AI won't change.

also WHO CAN SCRIPT LIKE THAT? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

I dunno about the rest of you, but it seems to me that bugs and balance will be the first things addressed, mostly becasue they are easier to tackle from a codeing standpoint (or in the case of difficult bugs, more important to fix).

Something that is lost in this discussion is that in the process of fixing these bugs, and redoing some balance issues the AI may get a boost from no longer suffereing due to an erronious or poor initial design. That said, improving the AI (*not simply making difficult maps) should always be in the mind of the players and developers, and I'd guess that Illwinter is interested in continuing to improve the entire game, including the AI.

Besides, the fact remains that the majority of game time is going to be SP, I'd estimate it at 80%. And while its nice to say things like 'don't cheese the AI if you don't want to' what I really want is for the AI to be able to 'cheese' me.

Re: Supercombattant pretenders....what about...
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yup. Bug fixing is always on the top of the list. Balancing as well. In our case the strat. AI is very important, as you've said most of the games will be SP. That is why upgrading the AI is on the top of the list in Doms II.