Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

I added Ctis's normal units and ran a little test. This is what I got:

Deathmatch Power Ratings for 10000 rounds:

CT Militia ------------------ Wins: 7.1% Power: 109 Overall: 223
CT Light Inf ---------------- Wins: 35.7% Power: 636 Overall: 692
CT City Guard --------------- Wins: 59.8% Power: 1341 Overall: 1243
CT Heavy Inf ---------------- Wins: 67.3% Power: 1703 Overall: 1577
CT Falchioneer -------------- Wins: 47.8% Power: 936 Overall: 913
CT Slave Warrior ------------ Wins: 38.9% Power: 708 Overall: 732
CT Elite Warrior ------------ Wins: 57.3% Power: 1243 Overall: 1116
CT Runner ------------------- Wins: 27.8% Power: 471 Overall: 541
CT Swamp Guard -------------- Wins: 81.5% Power: 3011 Overall: 2275
CT Serpent Dancer ----------- Wins: 76.2% Power: 2359 Overall: 1657
CT Sacred Serpent ----------- Wins: 50.6% Power: 1019 Overall: 1000

Average --------------------- Wins: 49.9% Power: 1230 Overall: 1088
Median ---------------------- Wins: 50.6% Power: 1019 Overall: 1000
...........

Gauntlet Power Ratings for 10000 rounds:

CT Militia ------------------ Wins: 21.8% Power: 358 Overall: 560
CT Light Inf ---------------- Wins: 44.2% Power: 837 Overall: 913
CT City Guard --------------- Wins: 56.2% Power: 1203 Overall: 1134
CT Heavy Inf ---------------- Wins: 59.4% Power: 1326 Overall: 1201
CT Falchioneer -------------- Wins: 49.2% Power: 977 Overall: 1000
CT Slave Warrior ------------ Wins: 45.4% Power: 870 Overall: 933
CT Elite Warrior ------------ Wins: 55.9% Power: 1193 Overall: 1133
CT Runner ------------------- Wins: 38.0% Power: 687 Overall: 809
CT Swamp Guard -------------- Wins: 66.0% Power: 1629 Overall: 1354
CT Serpent Dancer ----------- Wins: 66.4% Power: 1653 Overall: 1378
CT Sacred Serpent ----------- Wins: 47.4% Power: 925 Overall: 972

Average --------------------- Wins: 50.0% Power: 1059 Overall: 1035
Median ---------------------- Wins: 49.2% Power: 977 Overall: 1000


As far as I can tell, Falchioneers are simply no darn good because their ambidextrity was set too low - I'd give them 3, minimum. They don't hit enough.

I also added hit rate, evade rate, and repel rate statistics. For example:


'CT Elite Warrior' versus 'CT Falchioneer' in 40000 bouts.

~ Attacker's Deathmatch Statistics ~

Score: ---------------------- 576
Wins: ----------------------- 57.68%
Losses: --------------------- 42.33%
Kills per battle: ----------- .58
Kills per round: ------------ .32
Deaths per battle: ---------- .43
Life expectancy (rounds): --- 3.80
Life expectancy (battles): -- 2.09
Avg. Rounds Elapsed: -------- 1.82
Avg. Rounds to Win: --------- 1.86
Avg. Rounds to Lose: -------- 1.77
Hit Rate: ------------------- 66.97%
Evade Rate: ----------------- 41.75%
Repel Rate: ----------------- 41.19%
Damage done per swing: ------ 3.81
Damage done per hit: -------- 5.69
Damage taken per hit: ------- 8.26
Hit damage taken per life: -- 22.38
Total damage taken per life: 22.91

The repel rate people had it right http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif 41% repels is pretty severe. In the reverse case (not shown), the Falchioneer gets a 7% repel rate because of his lousy attack, and because the Elite Warrior has much higher morale. Repels and long weapons are very important to Ctis because of their low morale.

These stats are only for Ctis against Ctis, and thus a bit misleading. But I don't think Falchioneers hold up well to Swamp Guard / City Guard / Elites.

Sacred Serpents, on the other hand, are bad, bad bad. Except for the standard - I'd only use them for morale. I think they should be given poison immunity... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif

Regarding the usefulness of 10 devils -

They don't rout. The only time I had trouble with Devils in Doms I was when they got hit by Control Dead, and that doesn't affect Devils anymore. In Dom II I have not used them yet (harder to get into blood) but the sim indicates they are worth 7 heavy infantry... and that's without the heat effect. A squad of 10 devils should annihilate most standing armies... In Doms I, I even liked to use them against Ermor, since Banishment doesn't bother them much, so they were safe from friendly fire.

[ January 12, 2004, 05:39: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

I think that pretty much anyone knows that Elite Warriors/Swamp Guard are superior to other C'tis infantry (especially falchioneers who pretty much suck unboosted, imo). But what we are discussing is Alex's Growing Fury -scenario. So, in other words both parties would be berserking so mrl and repelling wouldn't be _such_ big issues plus the falchioneers would get the needed boost to their attack skill. Considering that they're cheaper goldwise I'd really appreciate if someone ran the simulation with these changes.

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Hmmm... morale changes. Attack does not, since magical berserks give berserk level 0. Thus, they would no longer be repelled, but they'd still miss a lot.

I reran it with morale maxxed for all units:

Deathmatch Power Ratings for 10000 rounds:

CT Militia ------------------ Wins: 6.4% Power: 99 Overall: 191
CT Light Inf ---------------- Wins: 32.7% Power: 570 Overall: 588
CT City Guard --------------- Wins: 56.4% Power: 1209 Overall: 1080
CT Heavy Inf ---------------- Wins: 64.4% Power: 1549 Overall: 1341
CT Falchioneer -------------- Wins: 54.0% Power: 1125 Overall: 987
CT Slave Warrior ------------ Wins: 37.3% Power: 671 Overall: 652
CT Elite Warrior ------------ Wins: 55.2% Power: 1166 Overall: 1000
CT Runner ------------------- Wins: 27.4% Power: 463 Overall: 494
CT Swamp Guard -------------- Wins: 87.7% Power: 4421 Overall: 2947
CT Serpent Dancer ----------- Wins: 73.5% Power: 2120 Overall: 1461
CT Sacred Serpent ----------- Wins: 55.1% Power: 1164 Overall: 1045

Average --------------------- Wins: 50.0% Power: 1323 Overall: 1071
Median ---------------------- Wins: 55.1% Power: 1164 Overall: 1000
...........

Gauntlet Power Ratings for 10000 rounds:

CT Militia ------------------ Wins: 20.6% Power: 337 Overall: 506
CT Light Inf ---------------- Wins: 42.5% Power: 794 Overall: 828
CT City Guard --------------- Wins: 54.9% Power: 1157 Overall: 1039
CT Heavy Inf ---------------- Wins: 58.5% Power: 1289 Overall: 1107
CT Falchioneer -------------- Wins: 52.8% Power: 1087 Overall: 1000
CT Slave Warrior ------------ Wins: 43.8% Power: 827 Overall: 848
CT Elite Warrior ------------ Wins: 54.7% Power: 1150 Overall: 1040
CT Runner ------------------- Wins: 37.4% Power: 672 Overall: 747
CT Swamp Guard -------------- Wins: 70.2% Power: 1876 Overall: 1386
CT Serpent Dancer ----------- Wins: 64.8% Power: 1570 Overall: 1254
CT Sacred Serpent ----------- Wins: 49.9% Power: 997 Overall: 952

Average --------------------- Wins: 49.9% Power: 1068 Overall: 973
Median ---------------------- Wins: 52.8% Power: 1087 Overall: 1000

Not much different - both Falchion units improve a bit. Spear and Trident units drop slightly. But still, City Guard beats Elite Warriors and Falchioneers, plus is more durable (prot=14) and arrow-resistant (shield). And cheaper in gold then either of them (midway in resources).

Here's the new 1-on-1:

'CT Elite Warrior' versus 'CT Falchioneer' in 40000 bouts.

~ Attacker's Deathmatch Statistics ~

Score: ---------------------- 468
Wins: ----------------------- 46.86%
Losses: --------------------- 53.15%
Kills per battle: ----------- .47
Kills per round: ------------ .31
Deaths per battle: ---------- .54
Life expectancy (rounds): --- 2.44
Life expectancy (battles): -- 1.57
Avg. Rounds Elapsed: -------- 1.57
Avg. Rounds to Win: --------- 1.58
Avg. Rounds to Lose: -------- 1.55
Hit Rate: ------------------- 66.63%
Evade Rate: ----------------- 40.98%
Damage done per swing: ------ 3.66
Damage done per hit: -------- 5.49
Damage taken per hit: ------- 8.26
Hit damage taken per life: -- 20.98
Total damage taken per life: 21.48

Note that statistics are not shown if they are 0% (in this case, repels, ties, timeouts, and poison deaths).

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Hm, who hit who first? I.e. Did the EW or F get her attacks in first? There's a good probability that this means game'n'match in these kind of statistics.

Can the tests be run like F vs. EW?

- Humer

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

Actually, I have it flip a coin before each battle to see who goes first. With an average battle Lasting 1.57 rounds, going first is very important=) This way each goes first about half the time. In a real (Dominions) battle you never know who will get the first hit.

In other words, the results are always symmetric, though some results (like repel rate) only apply to the attacker, and you have to run the reverse battle for it to show up. But win% becomes lose%, and hit% becomes evade%, etc.

[ January 12, 2004, 08:12: Message edited by: Saber Cherry ]

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

I'm pretty surprised you didn't throw in the "Way too many skeletons" for the C'tis.

Since Sauromancers have 1 Nature, 3 Death, 1 Random they can chain summon undead. You can even have 1 use relief with a nature stick and the random in Nature. If you don't have your Communion lizards ready.

Or the Eagle Eye, Shadow Bolt which hoses everything but undead in a bad way, especially SCs.

Or the ever fun Rigor Mortis/Relief fest.

C'tis has alot of goodies. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

>I'm pretty surprised you didn't throw in the "Way too many skeletons" for the C'tis.

>C'tis has alot of goodies.


Heh, I'll get to it. I have about 200 more topics to get to eventually. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

>But still, City Guard beats Elite Warriors and Falchioneers, plus is more durable (prot=14) and arrow-resistant (shield). And cheaper in gold then either of them (midway in resources).


This is why you must be careful with the combat program. The City Guard really isn't a very good unit in practice.

#1 Their weapon doesn't do enough damage versus heavy armor, which many players will choose.

#2 The 9 morale is a disaster until you have Growing Fury.

Most players would be better off massing C'tis light infantry, which look horrible under the stats, but have javalins and have an easier time with morale do to large numbers (from low production costs).

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

A SHOCKING DEVELOPMENT (was: THE REAL WRATHFUL SKIES)

Vanjarls have godly defence and a builtin Mirror Image, and thus are rarely hit. You can use that feature to your advantage to use an effect similar to Wrathful Skies, except this one kills things much faster if you have half a dozen Vanjarls in the battle. And you only need to research Evocation 2 to use it - for Shock Wave, a close-range (therefore high precision) AoE armor-negating spell that can kill a fair number of troops each round.

Script your Vanjarls like this:
(Resist Lightning)(attack one turn)(Shock Wave)x3(cast spells)

If you have researched Alteration 3 you can insert (Mistform) at the beginning of the list, and don't forget (Air Shield) if you see missilemen.

If you have researched Construction 4, you can forge a Staff of Storms and use the cheaper Vanherses instead, just remember to start with (Summon Storm Power). Or you can have a Vanjarl to cast the Storm spell.

Also, remember both Vanjarls and Vanherses are sacred, so always have one bless the others, it will at least boost their morale. If your god provides bless effects, then all the better - although nature blessing doesn't really fit in that strategy.

A pack on Vanjarls/herses sneaking near your border can setup deadly ambushes for approaching enemy armies. All Vans have a strategic move of 3 and thus can react to unexpected threats in very short time.

Even Vanjarls aren't invulnerable, so a pack of Vanjarls/herses operating deep in enemy territory may be lost if any of them is slain. So it's always a good idea to have an extra Vanjarl or 2 sneaking nearby to claim lightly defended provinces at the same moment your main group attacks, so if things go bad your Vanjarls/herses have a place to retreat to. Or use Cloud Trapeze once you learned it.

Giving Main gauches to your Vanjarls/herses will improve their defense to stratospheric levels, and high defense is a key component for this strat to work. Vanjarls are expensive, and Main gauches are cheap, so build some.

Once you learn Orb Lightning, you can have Vanjarls with MGoPs use the Shock Wave routine, while unequipped Vanherses fire Orb Lighnings from behind. Once you learn Wrathful Skies, use it for even more damage.

A few Vanjarls/herses can wreak a lot of havoc with the low-level Shock Wave, so don't be afraid to hunt down big armies and don't lose time with the small fry.

[ January 12, 2004, 16:16: Message edited by: Nagot Gick Fel ]

Re: Alexander\'s ever-expanding Tome of Knowledge
 

>THE REAL WRATHFUL SKIES

This is an outstanding way to use Vanjarls as thugs.

However the title is somewhat misleading, this isn't a really a replacement for Wrathful Skies.