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Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Many Indie units are quite useful :
* Amazons are great
* Shamans are very useful : you can use them for Communions with non Astral nations - just have to build some Matrixes
* Scouts !
* Longbowmen and Crossbowmen are better missile troops than most the "national" ones
* Even Hvy Inf (the 15-prot type) can be used by "non heavy" nations that have no "cheap" high-prot units (Mictlan, or Jotun that have very hvy troops, but only giants)

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Quote:

Originally posted by Arryn:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by AhhhFresh:
[qb]Vine Ogres, I'm not sure about... they can't be summoned underwater, and can only be summoned one at a time... and nature magic isn't exactly R'yleh strong suit.

Vine Ogres can be summoned 2x with an Ivy Crown, 3x by Crown of the Ivy King, and 4x by an Ivy King himself. That's 4 ogres for just a single gem. A real bargain.

EDIT: PS - Knights cannot be bought underwater either, nor can most indies. The ogres are a suggestion for a tough, cheap unit that DOES NOT EAT, and is not a magic troop.

EDIT 2: Given that illithids are giant-sized, and expensive, you need to develop some nature strength anyway so that you can make supply-boost items (feed 'em) and also cast Gift of Health (keep 'em alive) ... <hr /></blockquote>I certainly work towards 5 nature with the squidies for Gift of Health... but it's relatively slow going. It's gonna take two empowerments plus a couple items (Thistle Mace + Moovine Bracelet?) to get there with a Starspawn who has a random in Nature.

To deftly tie that back into independent units topic... Druids(2N) or Jade Sorceresses(2N + 2?) could help a great deal in that regard...

I'm looking more for semi-quick ways... convievably cavalry could be brought in if your first above water fort is cleverly placed.

I have yet to make a pretender for R'yleh with any skill in nature... a Monlith would be a natural fit for that since he has a point in nature and astral already, but he's stuck underwater... at least early... and he doesn't have head or hands slots anyway (so only 1 vine ogre a turn). Same deal for the Void Lurker, but he's even worse since he's immobile and aquatic....

So what are you left with that can be a nature pretender for R'yleh at a reasonable price (I really like good scales)?

Arch Mage? He's aquatic... but at least has a bunch of slots...

Hmmm...

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Quote:

Originally posted by AhhhFresh:

So what are you left with that can be a nature pretender for R'yleh at a reasonable price

I like giving an ancient kraken nature magic, all those HP go great with regeneration.

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Quote:

Originally posted by quantum_mechani:
I like giving an ancient kraken nature magic, all those HP go great with regeneration.

Alas, the Kraken is composed primarily of squishy bits, and has no real protection. He's gonna NEED that regeneration, and a LOT of it, as all those damnable Tritons and Ichytids go about poking his soft squishy parts with sharp things. Barkskin can help, but that's still an entire round of Tritons surrounding you and poking you.

[ March 18, 2004, 01:50: Message edited by: Norfleet ]

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Quote:

Originally posted by AhhhFresh:
I certainly work towards 5 nature with the squidies for Gift of Health... but it's relatively slow going. It's gonna take two empowerments plus a couple items (Thistle Mace + Moovine Bracelet?) to get there with a Starspawn who has a random in Nature.

No empowerments are required at all. You just need an Astral-4 mage (easy with R'leyh). The process is:

forge Ring of Sorcery, give it to a N1 Starspawn mage (who's now N2)
forge Thistle Mace (mage is now N3)
forge Moonvine Bracelet (mage is now N4)
forge Treelord's Staff (swap for Mace, mage is now N5 and can cast Gift of Health!)

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Quote:

Originally posted by Arryn:
<blockquote>quote:<hr />Originally posted by AhhhFresh:
I certainly work towards 5 nature with the squidies for Gift of Health... but it's relatively slow going. It's gonna take two empowerments plus a couple items (Thistle Mace + Moovine Bracelet?) to get there with a Starspawn who has a random in Nature.

No empowerments are required at all. You just need an Astral-4 mage (easy with R'leyh). The process is:

forge Ring of Sorcery, give it to a N1 Starspawn mage (who's now N2)

forge Thistle Mace (mage is now N3)

forge Moonvine Bracelet (mage is now N4)

forge Treelord's Staff (swap for Mace, mage is now N5 and can cast Gift of Health!)

<hr /></blockquote>Thanks for the tips... I never even thought about the Ring of Sorcery (duh!)...

I'm starting to play around with a Ghost King, who handles additional paths with relative ease (relative to other R'yleh pretenders anyway)... I'm diggin' him.

I was able to make him with 0 points to spare - which always gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Quote:

Originally posted by AhhhFresh:

I'm starting to play around with a Ghost King, who handles additional paths with relative ease (relative to other R'yleh pretenders anyway)... I'm diggin' him.

Ahem. Firstly, it's R'lyeh. For some bizarre reason, everyone spells it wrong. I don't get it. It's really starting to bug me, like that "turrent" thing that was going around a few years back. I declared it a bannable offense on my site.

And yeah, I agree: The Ghost King is THE R'lyeh pretender of choice. He's stealthy, he's ethereal, he has zero encumberance....well, he lacks the flight and immortality options of the VQ, but he's also only a 90-point chassis. On the other hand, his paths are cheaper, which is handy for a nation that lacks as many loose points as Ermor. Not quite as potent in early expansion as the Vampire Queen, but you make up for it with the very handy Star Children assassins.

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

I would think that one would pick the void lord if you want an early game SC with R'Lyeh. A ghost king doesn't have the hitpoints to be really effective.

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Quote:

Originally posted by Graeme Dice:
I would think that one would pick the void lord if you want an early game SC with R'Lyeh. A ghost king doesn't have the hitpoints to be really effective.

Depends on what effect he intends. AhhhFresh never mentioned an intent to use an SC chassis. As a matter of fact, reading his Posts one gets the impression he might be leaning towards a rainbow concept. But even if that were not the case, the stealth and ethereal tags, free ghosts in positive dom, plus being 35DP cheaper (AhhhFresh specifically mentioned he prefers spending points on scales) makes the ghost king a chassis that should not be so cavalierly dismissed.

Re: Uses of Indie Soldiers?

Quote:

Originally posted by Arryn:
Depends on what effect he intends. AhhhFresh never mentioned an intent to use an SC chassis.

AhhhFresh did not mention an intent to use the GK as an SC chassis, but *I* did. I believe Graeme might have been responding to my take on the matter, suggesting a Void Lord might make a better chassis. I stand by my decision, however, for reasons I'm not going to repeat again here. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Besides, 125 points for the Void Lord chassis is robbery. That's more than a Vampire Queen, and Vampire Queens are far more nifty.