DESPAIR!
 

I have reawoken the Rimtursar, securing the rapid demise of all the wretched peoples of the world, as well as their petty idols. Your end will be painful; I offer the prospect that it may be swift or lingering. The end of days is upon you! Naught but blood and icy damnation awaits the whole of the world!

p.s. abandon all hope, also, for it is a delusion.
p.p.s. bend over, the lords of the icy north come for you.

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Dr., thanks for this cold winter. We like it.

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Let's see how your precious Rimtursar fare when they've got more crossbow quarrels than flesh in their bodies.

Re: DESPAIR!
 

No diplomacy includes no NAP. Just in case that anyone has tought of doing so.

[img]/threads/images/Graemlins/Grenade.gif[/img]

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Wouldn't it be sorta hard to make a NAP without communication? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Here's a couple of moves that would be technically ok but very un-sportsman-like:
-Name your god 'Machaka! NAP until 30!' or similar.
-Name your prophet 'Send gold first: slaves sold 15g per' or in the same vein. Kill your prophet and you can do it again.
-Rename scouts with diplomatic messages and suicide them on the receiver of choice. (Heck, I could name my scouts Entente Cordiale and most wouldn't even blink... But Alneyan would sure know what I want when the scout comes trashing! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif)

Here's another, not as severe:
-Send gems for somebody. What would you do if Mictlan sent you 5 fire gems? If he sent you 1 gem a turn? I would think twice before attacking him, since then he presumably wouldn't send the gem. Also, quite possibly if Mictlan sent me gems out of the blue I might send him back gems or money, in the hopes of it happening again. This could of course not work, too http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif.

Combine the two: Name your prophet 'Send me slaves for these gems!' and send Abysia a couple piles of gems. Gets the message through, undoubtedly.

...yeah. I wouldn't appreciate tricks such as these, although the house rule doesn't strictly speaking ban them: after all, sending stuff is hardly diplomacy if no reason is given, right? And if you have a burning need to name your prophet 'Everyone dogpile Mictlan!', that's your business, no?

I play this one with the thought that you are all AIs to me.* Makes for a good attitude in many ways, since whoever complained when AIs banged him seemingly in concert, and who did ever want to send anything to AIs? (Aside from Gandalf who if memory serves sends herald lances to enemies of Ermor... Now don't anyone get any funny ideas! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif)

*Top that as a slur! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Re: DESPAIR!
 

You cannot give a specific name to your Pretender, as everyone else will see it, and they would probably complain. The same goes for the Prophet, though the idea about the scout is nice enough. Next time, switch renaming off. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Note, however, that naming your scout "Entente Cordiale" is unlikely to work: anyone from England would likely get the meaning of the name, and both entente and cordial can be used in English. Naming your scouts "Auld" should work better though... but it is not good enough. You should just look up examples appropriate to the history of the receiver, slightly alter the name, and that ought to work well... perhaps too well though.

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Not the complaints, but the resulting dogpile... Since if it's not against the rules complaints are but hot air for one who uses such tricks, right? It's against the spirit nevertheless, even with the scout and coded message.

What's entente cordiale called in French, then? Is there an expression for it? And what's 'Auld' http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif (Oh, the shame... I deserve laughs and worse!)

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Me no get the point; I cannot figure out what you mean, and even if you paid me real well... I still wouldn't get it. Must be the heat.

Entente cordiale is the same name in French, but I think it may be a bit less common. The Auld Alliance is the name given to the alliance made by Scotland and France against the perfidious Albion. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif (Auld is a Scottish word which should mean... well, "old, ancient")

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Aha, isn't this nice, two dudes, neither of which is a native English speaker discussing stuff. Learn Finnish, you, so I can express myself with more clarity! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

What I tried to do is point out the dichotomy between playing by the rules and playing by the spirit of game. Arguably anything not banned by the rules is allowed (within the framework of the game, of course), so for a true hard-core player intent on taking advantage of this loop-hole the problem is not in the complaints that follow, but in the dogpile that follows the complaints (this assuming the other players are willing put their foot to where their mouth is, err, their money I mean.) Yeah, real relevant...

Ach, you shamed me with a fond abbreviation! Dude, that's DIRTY! (And funny, if you can get the meaning from just 'Auld'. Well, me not getting it only proves your point, I guess. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif Do they use that abbreviation in France a lot?)

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Auld Alliance is, near as I can tell, a strictly English term. I do not know how the alliance is labelled in French... though I seem to recall reading a literal translation of the phrase.

It is not an abbreviation however, but merely a cunning way of getting a point accross with limited odds of being caught doing diplomacy. See, if you used the full name "Auld Alliance", everybody would see it is an alliance; on the other hand, a spy name like Auld might be mistaken as a genuine scout name, or even a name like "Mauldarie" (Marignon), "Mauldaska" (Machaka), and so on.

Of course, it might be such an effective way of hiding your schemes that nobody will get the point... including the intended recipient. I guess we will have to develop scouts named "Roger" (a proper Marignonese name) just to avoid that.

The only Finnish I know of is Suomi; everything besides that is beyond my understanding. I find that Finnish is quite different from most European languages too: while Välkommen till Sverige can be understood easily, the similar sentence in Finnish is another matter. I cannot find it again though... *Curses Google*

Re: DESPAIR!
 

AI surely would have cast Burden of Time by now. Anybody? Anybody?

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Ah, C'tis always does that. Reverend, get to it! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I think, if Auld Alliance isn't generally referred to as Auld within the target audience it would be lost to others than me. The first thing that comes to mind is invariably Auld Lang Syne. If you named your prophet Auld Alliance, you might get a funny look or two but I don't think many would consider it a breach. If going by the scout route there's little need for code... In theory someone could spy the battle but that's about it. That, too, could be avoided by using assassins instead http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif There's also the problem of getting the recipient to check the name of the scout, come to think of it...

Finnish is one of the most difficult languages in the world. It's part of the Fenno-Ugrian family, whereas most European languages are Germanic or Romanic, which explains in part why it's so freaky. Oh, and y'all: Tervetuloa Suomeen!

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Erm... How, precisely, does one kill Niefel Giants? I'm kind of at a loss here.

Re: DESPAIR!
 

I was playing Niefelheim once and made the mistake of attacking Machaka. They get flaming arrows as a national spell. I was massacred.
Also you could just hide and hope they go away.

[edit]
Whoops. They get "Blindness" for free. They had researched the arrows. In any case, the result was the same: Niefel Kabobs.

Re: DESPAIR!
 

A Scot should have no problem understanding the meaning of Auld, coming from a Frenchman. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif It needs to be tailored to the nationality of the receiver, however. I don't know what I would tell you to let you know I want an alliance with you... the only Finnish word that springs to mind is Koskenkorva, and that isn't exactly synonymous with alliance. Granted, if I offer you a drink, it means I want to be friendly, but still... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

From where comes Finnish? Germanic and Roman languages are usually grouped under the "Indo-European" label, along with other languages, and Finnish is not part of that vast family. Is there a similar "grandfather" for Finnish? I cannot say I have checked those Indo-European roots though: I can only go back as far as Greek.

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Finnish is a Uralic language. You know, the Language tree with Fenno-Ugrian (or is it Ugric? it eludes me) and Samoyed branches. (Samoyed languages being used by certain minorities in Russia. Fenno-Ugrian languages are mostly encountered in Russia, too. The main exceptions being Finland, the Baltic countries and Hungary.)

Re: DESPAIR!
 

Ugric, I think. But then I learned it "Finno-Ugric" and the Finn says Fenn, so my sources may be suspect.
Is it all the Baltic countries, or just Estonia?
Also, Turkish is related.
I think they originated in East Asia, maybe somewhere around Mongolia, and migrated westward.

Postpone request
 

I will not be able to take turns on the next Saturday (June, 4).
Can you please postpone the hosting to Sunday?

Re: Postpone request
 

There are small minorities in the other baltic countries that speak such languages, but the Baltic languages (incl Lithuanian and Lettish) are indo-european, although not quite slavic - about as closely related to Russian as German and Latin.

Re: Postpone request
 

I see that the game is scheduled to host in 133h.
don't know if it's on my behalf, but surely it's better then staling...

I will do the turn in the next few hours anyway.

thanks.

Re: Postpone request
 

I wasn't sure if you needed it paused from now until the fifth, or just on the fourth to the fifth. I figured I'd stick it on a slow quickhost and either way it would be fine. If everyone's okay with it, I'll return it to a 24-hour quickhost on Sunday.

Re: Postpone request
 

Actually, could we go back to a 24 hr quickhost on Monday evening (eastern time, US)?

Re: Postpone request
 

No problem, Doctor.

Re: Postpone request
 

I'll take your word for it being Finno-Ugric, Ygorl. I learned this stuff in Finnish, and my construction is just conjencture. Fenno- is the usual prefix, as in Fenno-American.

Altaic languages (like Turkish) are in some ways similar to the Uralic ones, but they are not part of the same family. Indeed, Turkish and Japanese are probably closer to each other than Finnish and Turkish. The Uralic-Altaic family was never generally accepted, if memory serves.

For the Uralic family the origin is unclear, apparently it was West of the Ural mountain range, in any case.

Re: Postpone request
 

I just did a bunch of reading about the history of languages. It's nifty how educational this game is!
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Postpone request
 

So what's with 'Moses? I don't see him being the one asking for more time. It's been three days already since last turn.

Re: Postpone request
 

What about me, now? I thought we were waiting on izaqyos and Dr. Praetorius. Am I supposed to be doing something?

Oh, I guess the turn ran after all. Sorry about that.

Re: Postpone request
 

I am back http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

The game is heating up I'd say (or rather cooling down...)

The agenda item for today is: Despair.
 

I have also returned, just in time to violate your corpses.

nightmare
 

It's like twenty turns or something that Pythium is skirmishing with Vanheim.
Each of the last turns seems to me like an endless cycle, a macabre ritual of death and destruction that gains absolutely nothing.
I'm not posting this message to suggest in anyway that this stop. This war will continue till one side is conquered, or forever for all I know http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
I just wanted to cry out in frustration http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif, mixed with the joy of facing such a worthy adevrsary.

quero saludarte, en tu propia lengua, oh dios de vanheim http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: nightmare
 

gracias izaqyos te saludaria en tu lengua

but i dont have a clue.

regarding the game i hardly have a chance. But i sure have a lot of frags. (sneaky spells you are playing).

Re: nightmare
 

Good game. you have a strong army and im besieged by undead too. With this victory you have won it, Izaqyos.

its you and ermor

Re: nightmare
 

You faced impossible odds in this two fronted, yet you gave a great fight. At the end I think it was just a matter of attrition that decided matters.

If I'm not mistaken Atlantis, Marignon and Jotunheim are still in the game. So it's probably going to be a fun end game http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

BTW
I still didn't understand what was your reasoning for attacking me after you've conquered tien chi. Had I been in your place I'd probably find a weaker nation to conquer and hope that Pythium and Ermor fight each other.

Re: nightmare
 

Hey, Izaq, let's not go down that route just yet. I'm sure after the game is a more appropriate time for a discussion on that; We wouldn't want anyone gleaning information from an analysis.

Also, it's easy to be influenced by any sort of evaluations, so why not let everyone decide for themselves whether they 'are' or not?

That said, I completely detest quitting a nation that's about the fourth or so in most graphs. Very poor manners, no matter how big a battle you lost. (Indeed, I didn't even know you had a big battle; see how this is already turning into something with diplomatical value.) When I said that you're like AIs to me, I certainly didn't mean that I will quit whenever I damn well please!

Re: nightmare
 

Moses seems to be stale-ing http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Re: nightmare
 

I just sent a PM to ask what the story is...

Re: nightmare
 

Jurri, shut up

Re: nightmare
 

You are correct of course. Habits are a hard thing to break though.
I will keep what you said in mind and avoid such discussions for now.

Re: nightmare
 

I'm quite the killjoy, ain't I? Sorry guys!

'Moses says here that he doesn't have a net connection. Beats me why he doesn't bother to inform us!

Re: nightmare
 

So, for those who are left... Should we wait (an unknown amount) for him, or put him AI?

Re: nightmare
 

Apparently he's not interested enough to even inform us of his absence, so I see no point in waiting. Hence I vote for summary AIzation.

Re: nightmare
 

Heya, folks. Sorry I didn't have a chance to post about my absence here as well, but the library closed right after I posted in the Faerun thread. At any rate, I'm hoping to be back up shortly, but can't guarantee it. If the game could be paused for a couple days, that would be much appreciated. I'll send Ygorl my password for in case anyone would care to substitute for me for a bit.

Re: nightmare
 

I sure don't mind waiting a couple days. I'll put it on a slow timer for you. Hope you get things worked out soon!

Re: nightmare
 

So what should we do about Moses? Find a temporary or permanent replacement? Stick him on AI?
Moses, if you happen to see this, what do you think?

Re: nightmare
 

All right, it doesn't look like I'll be back online quickly enough to keep from holding up the game unreasonably; if someone would like to step in to replace me, that might be best. My apologies for the difficulty, everyone.

Re: nightmare
 

That's too bad.

I would much prefer if we can find a sub for moses instead of turning to AI.
I want to state what I think is obvious:
The AI is a non factor in MP, it will be exactly as handing over marignon to it's enemies. Which will benefit them and hurt the other nations...

Re: nightmare
 

Wouldn't that just compensate for Van going AI? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: nightmare
 

Van going AI? when did that happen??
Manuk, did you go AI?
I wasn't aware of that or else I would have gobbled up all van lands in one or two turns http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Besides two wrongs don't make one right, don't you think? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Re: nightmare
 

Hehe, Manuk even told me to shut up when I complained, it's on the page before this one... I guess it's only one turn ago, considering that we've been almost a week waiting on Marignon.

I'm not opposed to a sub, of course, but I'd like to get the game going again soon. It's very interesting!

Re: nightmare
 

In that case it's fine by me to switch Marignon to AI.