Re: Some feedback
 

You are forgetting nature 3, which you can´t get and which is a huge jump in power because it lets you access gift of health and mother oak with boosters.
Also air 3 which is very important considering it lets you forge boosters. You can get it from CMs, but the chances are only one in 160.
Additionally he gets earth 2, CMs only get earth one and earth 2 is another milestone for earth boosters.
Well and s3 as well, which is another 1 in 160 chance.

So maybe he doesn´t add a lot of diversity, but he significantly increases the maximum realistically attainable magic level of Tien´chi in 5 paths right from the start of the game. If he lost one in every magic path he would be comparable to the worthy heroes version of tien´chi´s heroes. And those are generally considered to be among the best heroes in the game.

Re: Some feedback
 

I certainly wouldn't argue that Li Bo is useless. HOWEVER, if you were to take away his +1 on all paths, he'd be an EA celestial master. That's quite nice to have but hardly epic.

If you gave this guy to MA Ermor I agree, he'd be completely frickin' nuts

Put another way - most of the epic heroes are inferior pretenders. Some of them are inferior SC pretenders, some of them are inferior magic-diversity pretenders, and some of them mainly spawn troops (which more pretenders should do, IMO, some of them can but it's pretty useless.)

Li Bo, on the other hand, is an inferior rainbow pretender. If you think rainbow pretenders are backflips of better than SC or magic diversity pretenders, yeah, he's unbalanced. Otherwise he's not.

Re: Some feedback
 

Ok if EA Celestial masters get a total of 10 magic picks you are right, but last I checked they get only 7 to 8, aren´t immortal and are old.

As for inferior rainbow pretender, creating him with a the cheapest rainbow chassis for the paths he has would be the frost father, which costs 255 points. Add at least another 100 for immortality, the holy levels, blessability and the low dominion a standard rainbow brings. I don´t think inferior applies here. Are any of the other heroes worth even close to 350 design points?

Re: Some feedback
 

Let's compare him to the Abductor that EA Niefelheim gets in the basic game (who is also a sacred priest, so that's a wash.)

To get WWWDDDAAA off of a destroyer of worlds (a roughly equivalent chassis, and the only giant IIRC that starts with two of WDA) costs 247 points.

I think you greatly overestimate immortality - if you really think that's worth as much as 6 magic picks, strip the immortality off, but on a unit that can't actually fight, it's only a big deal because of the recuperation, and *all* the heroes get that. Also, rainbow pretenders are penalized for their flexibility by lowering their starting dom - and since Li Bo *doesn't* take paths which T'ien Ch'i doesn't already get (except for two fire) it's really unfair to penalize him in that respect.

If you really must give him fewer magic picks, give him magic picks in other categories instead of what he gets now, otherwise he's just a researcher.

Totally design points, by the way, is a much better comparison than totalling picks since, as has been pointed out, more picks in one category is generally better (up to a point) than a few picks in many categories.

Re: Some feedback
 

Edit: Just noticed that Xietor has toned the tien´chi hero down reasonably, so the stuff below doesn´t really apply anymore. I´ll leave it here, because it´s fun arguing with Dr. Praet.


Umm why not use the Son of Niefel, which is actually a far better chassis than the hero in question, costs only 213 points, spawns units and has one point higher dominion than a rainbow chassis.
Considering that the abductor is probably the best hero in the base game that should tell you something about li bo.

And immortality on a high level mage hero with access to teleport spells is incredibly useful for suicide tactics like porting, summon earth power and casting rain of stones. Later on you can use him as a wrathful skies caster together with a retreating staff of storm wielder and the only thing you risk is an air booster.
He also is the bane of any SC, you can simply teleport in and then try to charm/curse/horrormark with no risk at all.

The immortality gets even better when you consider that you can easily take a high dom thug pretender, since libo covers virtually all your magic needs with the exception of death magic.

In addition Li bo gives you easy access to the following important globals, items and spells which tien´chi usually doesn´t get/would need to design a pretender for:
Mother oak
gift of health
flaming arrows
dwarven hammers
air boosters
earth boosters
treelords staff
gaia´s blessing
golem construction
army of gold

etc

Re: Some feedback
 

You greatly overestimate the importance of the nature - you can summon that off of a Naiad at conjuration 5, not exactly science fiction level stuff. Those combat spells (of which you forgot arrow fend) can be cast pretty easily through a communion (except gaia's blessing) - one of the few things MA T'ien Ch'i actually can do well is build communion matrices.

Yeah, he enables MA T'ien Ch'i to cast somecool stuff which it can't otherwise do. The real question is: why can't MA T'ien Ch'i do any cool stuff?

Is it because it's a MA nation that only gets one 3, and that's in water which is easy to boost? All you've done is drive home the point that MA T'ien Ch'i can get a really good hero without unbalancing anything.

If you were concerned about his total points cost or total number of picks, you could pull off an air, drop the water entirely and he'd be much cheaper, no less powerful, but less thematic. He's a master of the way, he has to have water magic even though you don't even want it. Likewise the nature; that's more useful than the water but still hardly where you'd invest points if you were designing a T'ien Ch'i pretender. It's a small research bonus mainly included for thematic purposes, which is also why he's immortal.

Re: Some feedback
 

How big of a research bonus did you give the Medium, Xietor? I'd like to keep my version on line with yours. Also, have you changed Monkey King any further? I didn't notice anything on that.

Re: Some feedback
 

I did not touch the monkey king, and the research bonus was a modest "researchbonus 5"

Stoneguard Question
 

Question about Man's Hero (Beowulf) summoned Allies, the Geata Stoneguards:
Those thoug guys carry a throwing axe, a shield AND a battleaxe (dam 9, length 3) into combat. Is a battleaxe with those stats not a 2-handed weapon ?
I suggest removing the shield, (or replacing it with an buckler) or giving the stoneguards a shorter weapon instead of the battleaxe.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Good point on the battleaxe.

While i am not an expert on weapons from the middle ages, the fact they can wield a longer weapon in one hand is an attestment to their combat skill and strength.

I know the normal 1h weapon is length 2, and the battleaxe is length 3, and the longer weapons 4,5 , and 6.

It was not an oversight on my part, as it is specifically mentioned in their descr. that they can wield a large battleaxe in one hand. They are a hardy race of warriors, and the stoneguard are the elite of that warlike race.

I envision the throwing axes being carried in belt loops, not in their hands while traveling. And in battle, I think the battleaxe would be carried in the offhand, shield slung on their back, and throwing axe in their main hand.

In the end, it is a fantasy game, and i would not try and get too realistic.

I played defensive end in college. In my 20's(i am now old) I benched well over 400 pounds. If you put my stats on a DnD stat sheet, the str, size etc would be much greater than your average guy who never trained with weights, and was not 6'2 230 lbs. And I was not the biggest and strongest
athlete. Pro football players are commonly 6'6 350 lbs.

Many of your bigger football players are twice as strong as the average guy. In the days when the biggest and strongest guys were warriors, I do not think it is a stretch that they could carry and effectively wield a battleaxe in 1 hand that the average guy needed 2 hands to swing. Especially a length 3 weapon, where weight, not length would be the crucial factor.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

So it seem you just invented the Bastard Battleaxe (TM) some ~700 years too late ;-P

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

I wouldn't worry about the handedness too much. The Abysian Warmaster (prophetized Warlord) wields twin battleaxes and war shamblers and mournful use a glaive AND a shield, even though a glaive is a two-handed weapon.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Exactly Edi.

I am not having them dual wield 2 long weapons. A battle axe to a big strong man may handle the same as a broad sword to a smaller man. Exactly the same.

Of course if you feel guilty using the tough bastards, especially if you are at war with the peace dwelling forest people, feel free to have Beowulf not summon any of them!

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Actually, i built all of my strategys around turning Beowulf into an summoning factory and conquering the world with Longbowmen and Geata Stoneguards.

Those flying throwing axes are my favorite sight. Have to try them out with wind guide...

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Version 1.4 is in the works.

More improvements to the descr. and some tweaks/bug fixes

1. Ctis and Pangaea getting 3rd misc slot

2. Pangaea getting poisonres 100(oversight)

3. humans that have night vision will have the appropriate "dark vision" tag rather than blind. Treants, starspawn etc, will continue to be blind

4. Vanheim hero, besides getting a cute "Red Pointy Hat"
and a "Ceremonial Robe" will also get 2a to go with the 2e 2n.

Additionally the Forest survival and 25 stealth that disappeared with the dark vision copystats fix, will be back, as well as his illusion. This will make the gnome the most stealthy unit in the game.

Clockworks will come in greater numbers.

Lastly, he will get a Tinker's Hammer(forge bonus).

The cute little gnome will continue to have only 6 hps, but his utility is unmatched.


5. Elephantarch of Arcos grand Elephants will have their size corrected to 6.

6 Ctis-major changes. While she loses spy/assassinate, she is tougher in melee, and her precision with her special poison spit attack is lethal.

Her Croaker dominion summons loses 1 set of sleeping vines arracks, and has another replaced with something less lethal. So the Croaker only has 2 attacks now, one of which remains sleeping vines. Att skill also lowered to 10.

7. Ancient Master loses his dominion summon, but had his makemonster ability increased from 3 to 5. He also gets Darkvision 100, and a few slight combat boosts.

8. Tien Chi's hero will undergo some more changes, but they are still pending, as input from the good Dr. and the Epic Heroes mp game provides information about balance.

9. ulm-the Black order soldier summons has been reduced from 4 to 3, they got 1 enc added to their stats, and 2 enc and -2 defense was added to the black duke's plate.

A mp game using Epic Heroes is starting, and when it is complete, 1.5 will likely have more fine tuning based on gameplay.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Epic Heroes Mod 1.4 can be downloaded here:

http://www.mediafire.com/?e99ud3xxhng

A good many changes were made, both for polish, with the descriptions, and new armor and weapons, and for balance. The changes were made after more gameplay, and from suggestions from players that have used the mod.

A complete list of the changes will follow, but the short of it is this:

1. Heroes that had limited slots, like the Treants, Ancient ophidian, Black Phoenix got a 3rd misc slot.

2. Tein Chi's hero, created and monitored by Dr. P, was changed again at his suggestion. Less of a rainbow now, but more power in particular paths.

3. Black Phoenix received an additional fire magic, and fire imps come in greater numbers.

4. Sacred Yeti lost its stealth, and the aoe fear from its Yeti Slam. Testing showed that the yeti's high base fear, combined with a aoe fear attack, was overpowering.

The Yeti's makemonster was increased from 1 to 2(winter wolves).

5. The Tithe Collector received some armor

6. Mad Tinker received 2a, forge ability, awesome weapon and thematic armor(pointy red hat and elememental robe).
The tinker's inadvertent loss of illusion, stealth, and forest survival was restored. Mad Tinker now has 8 hps!

7. All units that should have dark vision have that now rather than blind. There are issues modding dark vision, which was what caused the oversight with the mad tinker's stats.

8. The Black Duke's armor now has enc and def penalties, reflecting the fact that it is plate, regardless of how well it was crafted. The black duke can only train 3 rahter than 4 black order soldiers per turn.

9. Pythium's angel has 3a now. This was from popular demand, and i remain convinced pythium is an over powered race that deserves a 6 hp gnome, but i was influenced by peer pressure.

10. Ancient Master lost his dominion summons, but can make 5 lions a turn now instead of 3. He regenerates now, and received some combat tweaks(made slightly tougher). He also has 100 percent dark vision.

11. mr was lowered on some heroes slightly, from 18 to 16.

12. Arcos summoned elephants are now size 6, and their attack was lowered.

13. water races remained unchanged, as did agartha, bandar log, machaka, man, jotunheim, eriu, and ermor.

14. Ctis hero's precision was boosted a good bit, making her ranged attack quite lethal. Her combat abilities were tweaked slightly upward, but she cannot spy or assassinate now. Her dominion summon "Croaker" now has 1 rather than 3 sleep vines, but it did get a 2nd useful melee attack.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

After playing Shin. a lot the past few days, I decided to give the Ancient Master the ability to make one of these thematic Japanese Mythical Lions each turn. Obviously the Ancient Master has other needs for his time, but if he is ever in desperate need, he can sit in a province and use a "summon allies" command to get 1 of these per turn:

http://img66.imageshack.us/img66/3268/shishivs6.th.jpg


These will only be available when version 1.5 comes out, which is not for a couple weeks at earliest. For the curious, it is a berserk 1 skill. Originally I had the Ancient Master making 2 of these per turn, hence the description they always come in pairs, but they are too tough to allow 2 per turn-even with Shin. who is not one of the top end Mp races.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

This is a great mod. I've only extensively played the R'lyeh, Jotunheim, and Ulm epic heroes but all three of them are very power and appropriate to their nation.

The R'lyeh hero I think is more powerful than some might realize, he's a pretty brutal assassin, and with his enslave mind ability and overall toughness most commanders will be in bad shape against him, even with body guards (who are often turned against the commander they are protecting!)

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Coming in version 1.5:

Pythium: Fallen Angel size increased from 2 to 4.

Shinuyama:

I feel my knowledge of Shinuyama has increased a ton since I first made the Ancient Master. For mp purposes, I find Shinuyama's situation similar to Machaka, with a vulnerability to a dominion 10 wyrm bum rush, or aggressive expansion from races with low resource highly blessed troops. To alleviate this disparity:

Ancient Master is getting a hp boost from 18 to 27,
100 percent shock resistance, whirling fists are getting improved(defensive), Amphibian(to reflect a monk's total body control and ability to hold breath a very long time. In Dungeons and Dragons they were immune to asphyxiation, immune to mind control spells, and took 1/2 damage from spells.

Ancient Master is not getting any resistance to fire or cold, but he is getting shock res. Shock resist, high mr, and increase in hps from 18 to 27 should prevent him from getting 1 shotted by a level 3 priest casting smite-which is what happens currently.

In fact the Ancient Master is getting an insanely high MR of 40, yes 40, to reflect that he is immune to mind control spells. Unfortunately there is no way to mod immunity from mind control, so i will achieve the same affect with the off the chart mr. This will also have the intended effect of making him immune to mind hunts.

He only has 27 hps, so he is still vulnerable to numerous methods of death, but he will not be subjected to smite, mind hunt, enslave mind, charm, or lightning based attacks.

Gift from heaven, incinerate, frozen heart, trample, wind ride, and skelly spam are all obvious ways to kill him.

The makemonster ability of a Shishi, though only at a rate of 1 per turn, gives shin some necessary tough units early on that can face a hydra, vans etc. Though they fare poorly in tests against size 6 tramplers.

It is hard to believe Shin has no unit that has a shield(:, no cavalry, no sacred units, and national summons that are really nothing special until conj 8. Their best mage has severe old age.

They do get a tough longbow unit, but at 38 resources a pop, you cannot amass enough of them early to fight off an early blitz.

Kappas get fatigued too fast, and have no shield. Adding a shield and give them a normal fatigue, and you may have something. Make them capital only.

Shin. pd post 20 is nice, and that is a strong point. Good research is another strength. But those strengths do not help early.

So shin. is getting a boost to its epic hero, and Shishi, though few in number, will give pause to all but elephant and mammoth races.

Maragon:

One of the 4 races I unfairly penalized(vanheim, pythium and ermor are the other 3) with less than epic heroes because i felt they were too tough already in mp. This issue was discussed, and I have since been convinced I erred in not giving every race a truly Epic Hero. It is not the goal of this mod to balance the races through epic heroes. Vanheim and Pythium were boosted in 1.4 as those races were to be used in the Epic Hero MP game.

Marignon's Tithe Collector is becoming an Epic Hero. His priestly skills were reinstated, he was given 2 air magic, armor, and some extra hps. He can now melee a bit. Since he received major boosts in melee ability his awe was removed.

A tithe collector is feared, not held in awe. And he would have been overpowered with his melee boosts, priest boosts, 2a boost, if he had the double whammy of awe and fear.

Here is 1.5 version of the Tithe Collector:

http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/2...ctorrv3.th.jpg

Ulm: Black Duke of Ulm's makemonster ability of Black Order Soldiers reduced to 2 per turn.

Ermor will receive an entirely new Epic hero., the Angel of Death, whose screenshot is 2 posts below.


Abysia Black Phoenix fire resistance increased to 200 percent. Some items make a unit susceptible to fire, and the thought of a Black Pheonix taking damage from fire is an alien concept, even with barkskin.

Black Phoenix prot increased from 3 to 8, and he was given a fireshield.

Atlantis- Early expansion and lack of ranged units on land plague Atlantis, thus a makemonster ability of 2 silver orangs was added. They are sacred, immune to cold, and are ok in water. More of a boon is they have a cold based ranged attack on land.

Atlantis leadership skills are boosted, and he loses his slow domsummon of a ghost-that is replaced with a silver orang.

Atlantis' Epic Hero now attracts skeletons in great numbers.

The Silver Orang is pictured here:

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/2...rangwr4.th.jpg



Rlyeh's epic hero is looking a bit too tough in the Epic Heroes MP game, and will be toned down a bit in a yet to be determined manner.

Very good feedback from the Epic Heroes MP game.

Machaka: The fear of the immortal assassin is overpowered. Instead of having to kill bodyguards, he injures 1 and the rest run. This ability was inadvertently added when i had to use the copystat command to add his dark vision.

Vanheim: the little gnome is being accused of being a sc

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/redface.gif. While I may not agree that an 8 hp epic hero makes a good sc, I did remove the aoe1 effect from the Tinker's Hammer. It does still have the 2ndary effect of small area fire damage. For crying out loud, he has 8 hps! Kill him already. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...es/biggrin.gif


The Sacred Yeti: New Description and body slot added


http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/7...yetiww9.th.jpg

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

I was just going to start doing the angel graphic you wanted for Ermor, when I noticed unit graphic 626 - fallen angel.

Isn't that basically what you wanted? You could just use that sprite.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

no, that is actually a caelum scarab sprite that i presently use for Ermor's misshapen Angel. If you load epic heroes and select ermor, you will see that sprite.

What I actually wanted was a size 4 undead angel, sort of like the sprite i sent you, but blacker and undead looking if that makes any sense.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

...?

Unit # 626 - fallen angel is size4. It isn't for Caelum. It looks like the angel you sent me, only black and with a burning green sword.

Try adding #addrecunit "fallen angel" to a nation and you'll see it.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

You are 100 percent correct on all accounts. I had the current version 1.4 mod set as my preferences, rather than the upcoming 1.5, so I was seeing the wrong sprite.

Out of curiosity, what nation uses the Fallen Angel? My original idea may once again be shot(:

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Epic Heroes 1.5 will have changes made with the benefit of much play testing in sp games, plus a big mp game involving 12 of the heroes. Changes that are planned thus far:


Pythium: Fallen Angel size increased from 2 to 4.

Shinuyama:

I feel my knowledge of Shinuyama has increased a ton since I first made the Ancient Master. For mp purposes, I find Shinuyama's situation similar to Machaka, with a vulnerability to a dominion 10 wyrm bum rush, or aggressive expansion from races with low resource highly blessed troops. To alleviate this disparity:

Ancient Master is getting a hp boost from 18 to 27,
100 percent shock resistance, whirling fists are getting improved(defensive), Amphibian(to reflect a monk's total body control and ability to hold breath a very long time. In Dungeons and Dragons they were immune to asphyxiation, immune to mind control spells, and took 1/2 damage from spells. Ancient Master will be losing his fear ability. With the boosts and summon, there is no justification for the fear/awe combo.

Ancient Master is not getting any resistance to fire or cold, but he is getting shock res. Shock resist, high mr, and increase in hps from 18 to 27 should prevent him from getting 1 shotted by a level 3 priest casting smite-which is what happens currently.

In fact the Ancient Master is getting an insanely high MR of 40, yes 40, to reflect that he is immune to mind control spells. Unfortunately there is no way to mod immunity from mind control, so i will achieve the same affect with the off the chart mr. This will also have the intended effect of making him immune to mind hunts.

He only has 27 hps, so he is still vulnerable to numerous methods of death, but he will not be subjected to smite, mind hunt, enslave mind, charm, or lightning based attacks.

Gift from heaven, incinerate, frozen heart, trample, wind ride, and skelly spam are all obvious ways to kill him.

The makemonster ability of a Shishi, though only at a rate of 1 per turn, gives shin some necessary tough units early on that can face a hydra, vans etc. Though they fare poorly in tests against size 6 tramplers.

It is hard to believe Shin has no unit that has a shield(:, no cavalry, no sacred units, and national summons that are really nothing special until conj 8. Their best mage has severe old age.

They do get a tough longbow unit, but at 38 resources a pop, you cannot amass enough of them early to fight off an early blitz.

Kappas get fatigued too fast, and have no shield. Adding a shield and give them a normal fatigue, and you may have something. Make them capital only.

Shin. pd post 20 is nice, and that is a strong point. Good research is another strength. But those strengths do not help early.

So shin. is getting a boost to its epic hero, and Shishi, though few in number, will give pause to all but elephant and mammoth races.

Maragon:

One of the 4 races I unfairly penalized(vanheim, pythium and ermor are the other 3) with less than epic heroes because i felt they were too tough already in mp. This issue was discussed, and I have since been convinced I erred in not giving every race a truly Epic Hero. It is not the goal of this mod to balance the races through epic heroes. Vanheim and Pythium were boosted in 1.4 as those races were to be used in the Epic Hero MP game.

Marignon's Tithe Collector is becoming an Epic Hero. His priestly skills were reinstated, he was given 2 air magic, armor, and some extra hps. He can now melee a bit. Since he received major boosts in melee ability his awe was removed.

A tithe collector is feared, not held in awe. And he would have been overpowered with his melee boosts, priest boosts, 2a boost, if he had the double whammy of awe and fear.

Here is 1.5 version of the Tithe Collector:

http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/2...ctorrv3.th.jpg



Ulm: Black Duke of Ulm's makemonster ability of Black Order Soldiers reduced to 2 per turn.

Ermor will receive an entirely new Epic hero., the Angel of Death, whose screenshot is 2 posts below.


Abysia Black Phoenix fire resistance increased to 200 percent. Some items make a unit susceptible to fire, and the thought of a Black Pheonix taking damage from fire is an alien concept, even with barkskin.

Black Phoenix prot increased from 3 to 8, and he was given a fireshield.

Atlantis- Early expansion and lack of ranged units on land plague Atlantis, thus a makemonster ability of 2 silver orangs was added. They are sacred, immune to cold, and are ok in water. More of a boon is they have a cold based ranged attack on land.

Atlantis leadership skills are boosted, and he loses his slow domsummon of a ghost-that is replaced with a silver orang.

Atlantis' Epic Hero now attracts skeletons in great numbers.

The Silver Orang is pictured here:

http://img440.imageshack.us/img440/2...rangwr4.th.jpg



Very good feedback from the Epic Heroes MP game:


Rlyeh's epic hero

Loses fear,life drain, entanglement. As a slight positive to offset the losses, he is no longer susceptible to fire, and his stealth was increased from 25 to 35.


Machaka: The fear of the immortal assassin is overpowered. Instead of having to kill bodyguards, he injures 1 and the rest run. This ability was inadvertently added when i had to use the copystat command to add his dark vision.

Vanheim: the little gnome is being accused of being a sc

. While I may not agree that an 8 hp epic hero makes a good sc, I did remove the aoe1 effect from the Tinker's Hammer. It does still have the 2ndary effect of small area fire damage. For crying out loud, he has 8 hps! Kill him already.

Caelum: The Sacred Yeti gets a retooled descr and a body slot!

http://img253.imageshack.us/img253/7...yetiww9.th.jpg

Ermor's Epic Hero in 1.5(not coming soon):

http://img76.imageshack.us/img76/594...eathjp9.th.jpg

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

I am bumping the thread, to answer questions about the changes in 1.5. The changes are listed in the above post. 1.5 will not be released until the completion of the epic heroes mp game.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

just lost the epic heroes test game, playing Man. I think that my hero (the guy who can summon axe-throwers) was not overpowered. I let him summon axe-throwers all the time, but it made no big impact against human players. The axe-throwers were fine against indys.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

I think that this mod going into 'unreal' territory. This's pointless. Ancient master can wipe the floor with a NATION, you don't get it? Two level 0 rings, garanteed at turn 5, ancient master is immune to most everything, including many other Epic heroes. I need Gift of Heaven to kill him!? Other 'methods' you suggest are a joke - are worthless at construction 4, and little effective even before that.

Why don't you name mod Epic Heroes: Arena, and attach a map with one center and 17 capitals around?

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

There is an actual game ongoing to test the balance of the various heroes. To my knowledge, none has had much of an impact.

The Ancient Master in 1.4, the mod's present version, can be killed by 2 smites.

Really the one who has had the biggest impact is Ryleh Epic Hero who can make laying siege under water a nightmare by assassinating underwater commanders. But with star child's magic duel and mind hunt combo, it is already painful to siege Rlyeh's capital.

But Rlyeh Epic Hero is being toned down a bit in the next version.

The game is now in the late stages and angels and tartarian gates rule the world, not epic heroes.

Nikolai-you do make a good point about the Ancient Master in 1.5. And he will likely not get the shock resist. He will be immune to spells that check mr though, such as mind hunt.
Monks are supposed to be immune to mind control spells. thematic. And at 27 hps, he will be easy enough to kill. Much easier than a 310 hp tartarian gate!

Rigor Mortis can kill all Epic Heroes that are not undead-and it is easy for most nations to cast. Drain life is not resistible. Life for a life.

At 27 hps an Epic Hero should not be able to kill a Nation, though, if the player has a good understanding of the game mechanics.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

I will respond to a pm.

Yes the Epic Heroes Mod does have a fundamental change on the game in some respects. It does allow for sleeping pretenders for races who otherwise would never dare take a sleeping or imprisoned pretender.

It does allow some races that are weak out of the gate a fighting chance to survive until mid game. But I do not view that as a bad thing.

So yes, it adds new options in strategy and gameplay for existing races.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Epic Heroes Mod just finished a 12 person mp game.

Some tweaking will be done to the Epic Heroes Mod, and then there will be a Epic Heroes Mod II mp game for a final Heroes test before the final mod version is released.

Anyone that has any thoughts on the relative power of the Heroes, especially players in the game, this is your chance to have some input.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Once you're done with the MA nations, do you think there'd be any chance of you making an epic heroes mod for EA or LA?

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Sure. Here's an epic hero for LA Jomon.

#name "Senshi no Shin"
#descr "A void being from the distant future in the form of a young girl."
#size 1
#hp 35
#mr 20
#prot 9
#str 12
#att 14
#def 17
#mapmove 3
#ap 20
#magicbeing
#ethereal
#illusion
#holy
#fear 2
#awe 1
#weapon "Silence Glaive"
#armor "Sailor Fuku"
#magicskill 5 4
#magicskill 4 2
#magicskill 2 1
#magicskill 8 1
#end

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Epic Heroes version 1.5 released.

http://www.mediafire.com/?5qynuxwshci

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

This link appears to have problems. It will send you to mediafire properly but it won't start the download.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Ah, so it's not just me.

Re: Stoneguard Question
 

Not sure why it was not working but this link does.

http://www.mediafire.com/?5qynuxwshci