Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Just curious - how did you guess it was calmon other than the fact he was winning? While the sad story of Caelum is best left unmentioned, it was basically a lesson in why I should have taken an awake SC pretender instead of a rainbow when diplomacy is not an option. Sandwiched between a dual Ashdod and Jotunheim rush IIRC - it ended before it even started. Hehe, thanks Pasha. :)

Congrats Calmon!

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Intuition I guess, but I had this strong feeling that Calmon is leading Ashdod for a long time.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I was neighbors with Ashdod the entire game. We never came to blows until the next to last turn, when he beat my Angels sieging the Ermor cap. That was the cap that won him the game.

In retropsect, I guess I should have attacked Ashdod, but Machaka and Ermor were seemingly such easy targets. I lost a lot of troops to Fundikira, and my Cylcops got killed and horribly afflicted fighting him.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I have learned from bitter experience that in RAND games, when there is a top dog and you see a weak target, you need to resist the temptation and attack the top dog . Blindly, no questions asked no expectation made (of other nations to join).

I was TC in previous RAND, had a solid position, could have made a move to stop Micah, but instead I attacked what I thought was a weak target (Jomon or Yomi) and thus did a double wrong, for not only did I not help stop Micah - I had also prevented my target from doing that.

Same in this game. Had Pythium not attacked me, I could have been in a much stronger position to help against Ashdod. Pythium, alive, would have made a great difference what with his astral dominance. He could have MHed most of Ashdod's teleporting SCs. Now, I did my best to convey to Pythium that I don't want to fight him. At first when he attacked me I didn't retaliate, I let him capture and keep my provinces in hopes that he'll understand that the greater threat was Ashdod but he kept attacking (probably took my reaction as a sign of weakness) and after sometime I had to respond which led to a bitter war that spent both of us (me coming victories wasn't such a blessing since by then I was depleted).
Also, had R'lyeh not attacked Ctis and instead attacked Ashdod the smaller neighbors of Ashdod (Ulm, TC) might have had more courage in joining the attack and so on and so forth.

But that's all part of the fun in RAND, Its much more a practice in psychology than the diplomacy games. Bottom line, ppl were either afraid to attack Ashdod, or they had chosen weaker targets instead, or couldn't do nothing about it since were chosen as said weaker targets (like Aby who got jumped by Pythium).

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

WraithLord:

You should have attacked my Ermor early on. I lost my whole initial army to you. You had heat aura troops and I had F9 bles for my vestals. Your troops owned my vestals and I think it was really big mistake on your side not to pursue. I don't know what I'd have to do to stop you.

I had so many bad things happen to me that I launched suicide attack on Machaka, which turned much better than I expected [but spider webs own ethereality], but then came Marignon and mopped everything :)

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

:lol

The army that beat you was my starting and only army :)
I had no gold with which to even recruit more units. I didn't know whether or not you has an awake SC (unlikely seeing your bless but possible nonetheless). I was in truth dismayed by my horrible economy and hence switched to an extra timid modus operandi.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I almost panicked when I lost my army there, I expected your invasion to be imminent, considering that situation. Huh :P What a lame part of the world :D

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Assuming total knowledge of geography and easy access to everywhere. At the point I could've attacked Ashdod TC (for example) could have done the same only through me. So it was a move that most probably would have resulted in me being pushed into the sea, TC fighting Ashdod in my former lands and C'tis growing vast on my northern border. In the long run it might've been the right thing to do but it would have also meant that I'd be out of the game for leader position.

I hoped TC would have seen me attacking in other direction and thus become confident enough to go against Ulm et al and in the end Ashdod, but it really seemed that the nations in the west were locked into a stalemate staring at each other angrily until Ashdod came in and wiped the board.

Heh, hindsight is fun. :p

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I think the nations were missing a leader, I know I was expecting you to take that role :)

Most of the game you were in the leading position with Ashdod and when he cast the FotA and started growing exponentially I was sure you'd confront him. What would have bought time for Marignon to wipe off Ermor (And secure his VP) and for me to recover from my losses and setback caused by war with Pythium.

I am confident that had Abysia been given 4-5 more turns to summon forge and research it could have made some difference. I had huge stockpiles of gems and was just bootstrapping my summon/forge/research machine as evident by the battle at 128. Of course this was not meant to happen :)

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Heh, anyone who's played with me can tell you I need a kick into pants to start any sort of leading business. With this no-names-don't-ask-don't-tell regulation no kicking and thus no leading. ;)

I was really hurting for income (R'lyeh upkeep is nuts) and gems that I just didn't find any of, guess my major motivation was not to go into a war where I didn't know for certain whether I'd get anything out of. My bad, can't promise it won't happen again.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Thanks all! :)

I really like the RAND games! Its a lot of fun to set/understand the signs in a correct way.

Ashdod was the nation i got and i've to say its a really strong one. Like other giant races you can easely play with imprissoned pretender, fair bless, really good scales and nonetheless get a very good early expansion. With early wizards and some later animists i got access into all categories of sitesearching (besides blood).

I really like the adon, 3 misc slots + magic diversity (some can use teleport). This capital only commanders + fire/air royality were my only SCs in the game. I build them nearly from the start on (+ some talmai elder) with the plan to equip them later.

With my globals up and after r'lyeh decided to attack c'tis i was quite happy to have the whole north in war.

This gave me the chance to act by myself by attacking the peaceful south in form of niefelheim. I luckily didn't share a border to the research strong TC at this time. Instead ulm reacted and attacked me with some smaller forces. Because i was really happy with TC's position in the corner only neighboured with ulm and r'lyeh i decided not to go into ulmish lands and just killed his expanding troops.

Maybe TC tried to get a border with me or just wanted more lands, however he decided to go in war with ulm. This leads to a war between both without my presence. I just cast some damaging army spells against TC to slow him down.

This was the perferct time to attack r'lyeh...

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I have backups of all turns, in case anybody wants some with the master password. :)

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Great game, calmon. I was Ulm, stuck between Jotunheim and TC. When I saw you take on the giants I figured I'd try to grab some of the territory you were taking of his, but as soon as I did I was attacked by TC. I was just prolonging my downfall to TC the last 10-15 turns, or I would have tried to go at you... and get defeated easily, I was not prepared for a battle against Ashdod.

Gotta love RAND games, thanks for hosting Pasha!!

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Umm, please don't share any that show Mari's Cyclops' battles against the Machakan Fetish pretender. Those are kind of embarrasing. ;)

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Pasha, I would much like to see the turns. Can you please send some to me?

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I was dealt Jotunheim for this game, and for the first time ever in my dominions career I went for a heavy bless strategy. (Though even now I went with E9/N8 over dual 9's in favor of squeezing 3S on my pretender in order to be able to eventually forge the rings with boosters. Due to circumstances I never even got around to forging them, but I still think that in order to actually challenge for the win - as opposed to just hang around in early game and then slowly peter out - the S was worth it. )

Expansion with blessed giants was a breeze, and I was right along with the leading nations early on. When expanding towards the richer middle part of the map though, I started to get worried about leaving my flanks unguarded, and when I noticed that Caelum was completely surrounded by me and Gath, leaving them with no way out except through one of us, I decided to attack them, slowing down my expansion in the middle. Looking back this probably was a mistake, and by the time I looked to resume my expansion again Ashdod had me surounded.

So I was then faced with the choice between attacking Ulm, (who I thought I should be able to beat, but only with difficulty) turning my back on the already powerful Ashdod, or attacking Ashdod (who I knew to be stronger than me) in the hope that his other neighbours had also identified the threat and would join me against him.

Not having much faith in my fellow men - and shortly afterwards starting to see many other nations at war with each other - I instead sat around twiddling my thumbs, seeing my early game advantage quickly disappear. I did keep watching for the slightest sign of others gathering forces to attack Ashdod, ready to throw my full weight at them too, but didn't see anything of the kind untill Ashdod attacked me, conquering every single one of my provinces in one single turn, leaving me with nothing more than a last stand or two in my castles, which I organised as well as I could, but didn't really hurt him badly. (even though I managed to win one)

So, very well done Calmon. Even though I had my full attention focused on you from the beginning of the game, I never even managed to be a speed bump. Nice play.

Pasha thanks once more for the smooth hosting, it was a pleasure, as it was the last time.

A final word on the map: It felt really weird, having two enemy capitals so close by on either side, while at the same time having enormous amounts of space to expand towards in the middle. While certainly not a 'standard' setup, I kinda liked the change of pace of having to mentally juggle beween expanding as far as possible and not leaving your flanks uncovered. Even though I probably didn't deal with it as well as I could have.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Oh the inhumanity!!!!
:)

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Pasha, thanks again for hosting this game. You know, your RAND games are actually my favorite and I'm really looking forward to them, but I hope the next one will be after asia twist since this poor slob would hate to miss it.
I don't want to nag or something but I'd really like to see the game turns. Thanks! Sorry. For I did nag.

Amhazair, you know we are very alike in respect to bless strat -- I have never used a bless strat. in MP. Its not that I have something against bless strat. but b/c everyone uses them I kinda prefer to "work" harder coming up with non bless game plans. I guess sometime I'll break my personal record and use a heavy bless and by then I'd probably go for crap scales and triple bless :D

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I will plan to host another RAND game in a few months. :) Of course, others are welcome to host them, too, if someone cannot wait.

Wraith: turns sent!

Pasha

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

If you plan to host another one Pasha, I hope you invite me to again play in it. This was one of the most interesting games I have played, and I think I learned quite a lot from it.

Thanks for hosting, and everyone, beware of Ashdod. Not that Calmon did not play an awesome game... he did. But they do seem overpowered to me. After all, every other nation in this game quailed at attacking them. That does say something about the power of Ashdod.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

The northern nations didn't quail at attacking Marignon. They were too busy spending each other. When the north started all these little wars Ashdod was yet to be in such a leading position. Abysia would have attacked Ashdod w/o a second thought had the war with Pythium coupled with its terrible scales not put it in an ineffectual position.

That of course doesn't change the fact that Ashdod is very strong. Some toning down may indeed be required.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I just hope Pasha uses a bit bigger map next time :) I don't like huge crowds...

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

I have watched the replays. Turn 40 was the turning point. Ashdod really took all of Jotun's lands in one turn.

The significance of this occurrence was apparently lost on Ashdod's neighbors.

Nice play Calmon, you made the right calls all along the way.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Congrats to Calmon from me aswell, very well played. :up:

I was TC in this game and I must say it really wasn't my kind of nation. All their stuff was just way to much all over the place and I felt they didn't have good access to anything good, most notably thug chassises. Flaming arrows/arrow fend was the only solid strategy I could figure out for them but I did the fatal mistake of taking sloth 3 scale and thus accumulating any meaningful force took more time than forever. I reckon TC is potentially monstrous with all their magic diversity but I prefer nations with more focus.

As for game turning point, I felt it was when Ashdod cast the gem globals in consecutive turns and nobody was able to anything about it in form of dispelling or attacking.

Thanks to Pasha for excellent hosting and I really liked the RAND game concept, it was awesome to just play for a change. I would certainly be willing to participate this sort of game again sometime.

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Time for a LA RAND, isn't it?

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

Hi Calmon:

Maybe! I could start organizing it.

Pasha

Re: RAND REDUX - ASHDOD WINS (Calmon)
 

That would be great pasha! :)