Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

If you're out Gurdge, Diana Ross would not turn down and resources you have remaining.

I would pledge to avenge you if you did ^.^

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Why can't we be friends, why can't we be friiieeennnds?

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Signed by Fomoria!

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Actually I'm not Japanese and while not my first language, my English is passable.

However I do have some Japanese friends who are into these types of games and are technically very good strategists but the need for complex diplomacy would put them at a severe disadvantage.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Non-Aggression pact between Mictlan and R'lyeh

-No attacking provinces owned by one another.

-No pushing Dominion into each other's territories.

-No casting harmful rituals at each other's provinces.



Signed by Mictlan

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

So I have not received the turn 10 file, even after requesting a resend...

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I had to request resend for #9 - try to request again, I think it is not entirely reliable atm...

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I will try and send turn 10 to you Eldanesh..PM Frozen Lama if it doesn't work.:up:

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I resent Ermor turn just now, let me know if you don't get it...If I remember right Frozen Lama is out of town which might be the reason.

I still in the game so while I have turned the Admin over to him I still have the password and will help out to keep the game running smooth until.....the last Myrmidon bites the dust.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I'm still here!!! i will be watching the hosting time, and if someone is about to stale because of this, i'll delay for them no worries ;)

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Ahhhhh, sorry for stepping in, I thought you where gone for 3 days...Must have been Trumanator.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

A couple notes about formal treaties posted in the forum. According to game rules, they are binding, so we need to all be on the same page about what they mean.

The treaties that I have with Abysia, Marverni, and Fomoria, all specify

forces of parties will not enter provinces owned by each other


Note that there is no exception made for stealthy units, so according to these treaties stealthers are blocked.

Also, the agreement between Mictlan and Rlyeh has no termination clause, this means it is permanent and can not be gotten rid of by any means.

Which just goes to show that sometimes what is not there matters as much as what is there.

- Alex, Helheim

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Don't mistake these for legal contracts. Also, don't presume to tell other nations what they can/can't do in their treaties unrelated to you. If Mictlan and R'lyeh decide to end their treaty, they are completely within their rights to do so. Noone should have the right to complain about a nation's conduct except those directly involved. Any loopholes, exceptions, etc. should be dealt with between the parties, preferably in private.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

R'Lyeh has not signed any formal treaty with Mictlan or any other nation.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

My take (and my take won't matter for long...

Treaties whether in private or public consist of what IS said rather than what isn't said.

There are SOME norms though, Nothing can be sent into your Provinces that can cause harm to the province nor Dominion as this is counted as an act of war.

Since most of the treaties I have seen are very specific and complicated, I have a couple of words for you...SIMPLIFY THEM.

Say Trumanator and I had a treaty negotiation and he played a stealth Nation.

It might go something like this: I (Arco) propose a 3 turn nap to begin on turn 11.

No stealth armies may pass thru my territories unless permission is granted and nothing other than regular scouts can enter each others territory.

He might reply with " I would like province #23,45,and 55 and you take #29,45,52 as our territorial line.

DONE.

We know: How Long, Boundaries, and Special considerations.

If we put it public we run the risk of other Nations knowing where we are..BUT we will have to hold to it.

If we don't put it public, we run the risk of it being broken when convienient by one of the parties and NO whining is allowed.

KNOW WHO YOU ARE DEALING WITH, and that only comes from expieriance.

Don't get caught up with what is not said...if in doubt ASK.

Trumanator is correct, ALL these negotiations should be done in privite as we don't need to know any more than you want us to.

We all form reputations, there are 4 or 5 in here that I would trust if they just said "you want a Nap 3" and I would know they would never break it and would not abuse it.

THATS a good feeling in these games.

My opinion of course:up:

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Anyhow, having an unbreakable agreement in a game where at some point you likely will have to go to war is silly. Dominions isn't a game for polytheists, this is Highlander rules.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Treaty of Nigh-Eternal Friendship and Cooperation
between Niefelheim and Helheim

- forces of parties will not enter provinces owned by each other, or independent provinces in the defined sphere of influence of the counterparty.
- parties will not deliberately attempt to push dominion into one anothers territory
- parties will not cast deleterious ritual spells upon one another

Spheres of influence: Niefelheim's sphere of influence includes provinces 207, 180, and 168 and areas east. Helheim's sphere of influence is the provinces west and north of those. Provinces south of this border are not defined to lie in either sphere of influence.

Termination:
After two (2) pretenders have been eliminated, either party may announce the treaty's termination. Three (3) turns from this announcement, the treaty shall be null and void.

Signed by Helheim

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Confirmed by Nief.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

one thing i'd like to say- in general, most games with binding diplo that i've seen, the policy towards stealth armies is a little looser. if the other person doesn't know that you are stealthing into his lands, its ok. if you have a NAP-3, and stealth a ton of raiders into their lands, and then leagally end the agreement, wait 3 turns, then attack all of his provs, this is perfectly legal in most games with "binding diplo" of course if you get caught, its another matter.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Way too many public treaties - now where's the fun in that.

Hmm... i should PM some people...

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

By doing all these public treaties, Helheim is buying him some time so that he can benefit from all the provinces he conquered during the expansion phase without taking the risk of an early war

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

That's because he doesn't expect the Spanish Inquisition!

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Helheim, Niefell, Abysia... just a bunch of pansies who are trying to pick on weaker ones and are terrified of each other. I say.. southern ferries and northern monkies! ;)

Ulm is still fighting and forging. For any allies against the powerhouses above I offer good trade and loyalty.

Feel free to PM

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Hence the reason in my example that I stated that there would be no stealth armies either IN or going thru my lands during the NAP.

IF, the want to go in and sit there ready to stab you in the back there is not much you can do about it whether they are caught or not.

Like I said, you need to KNOW the players you nap with.

Remember a NAP isn't a Bullet Proof Vest in this game.

But I disagree with a number of folks that say they DON'T use or discuss Naps, they just do it in private.:p

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I've never said I don't use them. I don't use them *publicly*.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

What's probelm with Kailasa?
He only have 2 provinces.Maybe he's under attack.
Shall we turn him to ai because he have 2 stales?

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Re:Kailasa
Hasn't responded to attempts to contact by PM either. Honestly hadn't noticed he was staling.

If he's turning AI, i think i want to know before i submit my turn. (Vastly different expectations of the AI as compared to human players).

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Report it to Frozen Lama and see if he wants to set it to AI or just someone take the last 2 provinces.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Re kailasa- with just 2 provs, the difference it can make is marginal. i'm more inclined to just set it AI. i can get someone to do that i'm pretty sure

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Do it next turn so I don't have to redo my turn for this turn? (I'm not even attacking him this turn!)

Alternately, He'll be dead shortly, so don't worry about it?

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

ok, once this turn hosts, i will have him set AI

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I'm going to be moving this friday to my university. I've asked chrispedersen to cover for me until I can get my things in order and get back online. I'll have him send you his email Lama and if you could switch them over on friday that'd be super.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

will do

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Treaty between Helheim and Marverni:

The territory of influence stands as defined before by proximity to the capitals, except as may be negotiated between the parties.

1) No movements of troops through each other's territories without permission.

2) No casting of spells in each other's territories without permission.

Lasts until turn 21.

If Helheim agrees to these terms, Marverni also agrees.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I talked to Marverni by email, here is the new version, this should include everything so no need to refer to earlier posts.

Treaty of Friendship between Helheim and Marverni:

- forces of parties will not enter provinces owned by each other, or independent provinces in the defined sphere of influence of the counterparty, except with the permission of the counterparty.

- Spheres of influence are defined by province-count-distance to capitals. A province closer to one nation's capital than the other is in that nation's sphere of influence. Provinces equidistant from both capitals is in neither sphere of influence; in effect they are first come first served.

- parties will not deliberately attempt to push dominion into one anothers territory

- parties will not cast ritual spells upon one another, except with the permission of the counterparty

Termination:
After four (4) pretenders have been eliminated, either party may announce the treaty's termination. Three (3) turns from this announcement, the treaty shall be null and void.

Signed by Helheim

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I want a more precise definition of "dominion push." How about:

1) No preaching in border provinces with positive dominion, and obviously no stealth preaching in the counterparty's territory.
2) Building temples on the border is fine. (One or the other of us may need to recruit units that require a temple, etc.)
3) Gods and prophets can move into border provinces, but shouldn't stay for more than three turns without permission from the other counterparty. (Which should be liberal if there's a reason for it, e.g. your god or prophet is defending a choke or some such.)
4) No stealth prophets in counterparty's territory, obviously.

With this definition, signed by Marverni.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

as amended, signed by Helheim

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Guys, the negotiations and changes to the wording etc should be done in privite.

The Completed Nap should go on the Forum page as to not confuse anyone IF you guys have a problem later,

No one is going to want to hear "On page 11, Paragraph 3, of the first dratft you said this or that and it never changed etc.

It makes for 4 page arguments that we don't need.

So if this is the final draft, so be it,,,after all this you BOTH better live up to it:p

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

I am still trying to continue my losing struggle agianst the mighty Hinnom.

I am asking for ANY money (no matter how small) or Death, Air, Astral gems (even 1 will help) to keep my Guerilla war going.

I have managed to slow him down some but he is a VERY powerful nation and for you close by...even 2 or 3 turns might make a difference.

I hate to have to ask for help but know that you are contributing to the GOOD FIGHT in this game!!!

Thanks Arco:up:

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

HA, oh it always makes me laugh when I lose a battle because of something as silly as that. Anyhow, glad you're making it fun Shard, interesting use of the skeletons though I'm not exactly sure what you were going for there.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

tis GOD'S WILL
that you be punished for conspiring with the Frozen Lama of Tir na Nog

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

first of all- he will be punished because big bad Niefel consipired WITH little Tir? got it backwards i think. i just did what the big guy said to do, or he'll kill me. :cry:

real reason for posting- Bandar Lover has annoyingly put a password on his pretender before he went AWOL, so he cannot be set AI without bugging Llamabeast, so against my usual principles, i think it best to let him stale. he seems to have an ok army, which i'm assuming will be in his cap, and thus will make it at least not be a free castle.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

That's right Lama, make me out to be the bad guy.

Also, make sure you switch over the emails tomorrow. I should be back online by tuesday at the latest.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Will do. he hasn't emailed me yet, so i guess i will send him a PM. I'm guessing it will be the turn after next that he needs, unless your leaving in the next 4 hours or so right?

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

hummmm...

Looks like there're many warfares at this time.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

with the prov-player ratio in this game, the first 25 or so turns should see a wave of early deaths..... don't be one of them

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Well that was weird? Somehow my Gorgon refused to heal between turns?

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Wanna trade your Gorgon for My POD...he doesn't plan on staying around much longer anyway...:eek:

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

Was thinking...you can force host if Kalisia is the only nation left to submit its turn.

Re: Vicious Circle2 Upload pretenders
 

yeah, i did that last turn, i just so happened to be away when the last other turn got in.