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-   -   Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=46912)

Doo February 20th, 2011 06:01 AM

Turns 17-23

Refresh: Up to this point I can say I'm happy with where I'm at, which is easy to say when you have very little idea how everyone else is doing, graphs are turned off ;)

No real contact yet made with the enemy, its been an indie bashing extravaganza.

Our pretender Chris the Sheep has awoken and the hero Lugh joined our worthy cause. So had the mercenaries Dagan the Renegade Sage and the Archers in White.

Or they were with us, on turn 18..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...8Daganlost.jpg

and

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...rcherslost.jpg

Losing Dagan is a blow as apart from Chris the Sheep no other Tir na n'Og character has native Astral access. I simply forgot to bid on him.

However on turn 19..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...ganreturns.jpg

Seems everyone else is forgetting to bid too :)

In a fit of role-playing frenzy I lock Dagan in the magical workshop to forge items, never to be released again.

Has anyone wondered why he is the "Renegade" sage? I googled him and found he is actually a hip hop artist who aims to be able to cast Master Enslave. A challenge to any reader, at a base Astral level of 1S, what would Dagan have to do to be able to cast Master Enslave?

Bet you can make me love you? Dagan I already do :p

On turn 20..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...battlevsTC.jpg

Neither Tien Chi or myself wanted this, we both targeted the same indie province.

The Tien Chi force..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...rcescouted.jpg

As a benevolent human I sent Tien Chi a message stating that we hoped humans and AI's could live in peace.

Elsewhere scouts report on an indie province..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...diedefence.jpg

Their leader..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...ssolmindie.jpg

:up: A little bit of SemiRand magic.

On turn 23 Tien Chi reveals the treachery of the cold electronic heart..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...fightsback.jpg

A totally unprovoked attack on the hapless PD..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t.../t23poorpd.jpg

There are thesis's to be written on the economics of PD, I'll sum it all up by saying that the game has it wrong. Basically that first person to sign up would actually be the most expensive and every other PD recruit would cost less. Why? Because when your god only hires three of you to defend against that you really should have a pension put away for your loved ones, and a 1gp sign-on fee is going to get your widow diddly-squat.

Conversely due to the magic ability of all PD to miraculously resurrect upon victory the wise PD recruit would price themselves to allow their god to recruit as many as possible to ensure victory, especially given that once a critical mass is reached victory is almost a certainty, thus a widows pay-out is not needed and employment is ensured.

I digress..

This is where we are at. Here is my research..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...23research.jpg

You will notice Alt-3 is almost done, the big spell there is Mistform.

Switching to Evocation my aim is Evo-5 for Orb Lightning and Storm. These spells are for my Tuatha Sorceress's, Storm allows us to eliminate 50% of non-magical ranged attacks (note our armies have zero ranged units while Tien Chi seems to be largely horse archers), allows our Air mages to cast Summon Storm Power for a +1 to Air magic and finally Orb Lightning casts one Lightning Bolt per level of Air magic per turn.

For my Ri and Sidhe Lords I've been forging Pendants of Luck, Vine Shields, Rainbow Armors and Frost Brands. Coupled with Mistform and Mirror Image my guys are going to be kicking. I may need to add a secondary Reinvigorating item but lets see how they go first, I don't want to be having to invest too much per thug, because as Stalin said "Quantity has a quality of its own". To this end Chris the Sheep is forging the third Dwarven Hammer this turn.

Our Gem income..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...3gemincome.jpg

Only one extra Air and Astral per turn since last update. This is mainly due to Chris the Sheep having other duties than site searching. I am reminded to invest some more effort into finding more sites.

The map..

http://i608.photobucket.com/albums/t...ame/t23end.jpg

Its a bit hard to read, I'm trying to conserve peoples bandwidth by shrinking the image, but if you squint you can see Tien Chi's and our border to the west. That Tien Chi province to my north is cut off from my lands by two rather tough indie provinces, I will need to pay attention to ensure I'm not surprised. To my east I have just found Caelum, I'm sending through scouts to find Abysia, and through diplomacy I know Caelum is also to my north. Caelum is of course human and thus an ally.

Lastly another challenge, keen eyed readers may notice one picture in this post does not belong in the context it is presented in. Which one is it?

Gandalf Parker February 21st, 2011 10:07 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
More and more Im getting requests for game-check links on private games.
So we now have two.

One for ALL games (private and public)
http://game.dom3minions.com/bin/games_chk.cgi

And a smaller list of just the private games (like this one)
http://game.dom3minions.com/bin/privategames.cgi

Gandalf Parker

Doo February 21st, 2011 10:26 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Cheers for this Gandalf, I've book-marked that page.

Hrum February 22nd, 2011 02:08 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Thanks Gandalf! That's really helpful. And, since I don't think I've said it already, thanks for hosting this game and dom3minions in general. :)

Turn 25 is up.

(Probably less necessary for me to begin my posts with this now that we have that status link from Gandalf, but I am a creature of habit.)

The fishmen look to be winning the war on the northern provinces of the frost giants. Atlantis is now sieging both of the indie forts along the coast, having kicked Niefelheim off of the eastern one in prov 60. In the southwest, Niefelheim is also at war with our friends C'Tis, but I am not sure how that is going - it does not yet look conclusive.

And Kailasa has decided to join the fray - sacred troops and human infantry have marched into Niefelheim territory and taken a couple of provinces! We now march on the southern fort of the frost giants!

Unfortunately, some foolish monkey forgot to bring along the bags of endless sustenance. After offering our flying friends in the north our counsel to avoid starvation at all costs, the troops of Kailasa have fallen prey to this very thing in the barren mountain passes that the monkeys must pass through on their way to Niefelheim. :doh: Endless bags of ghee and gulab jamun syrup are being rushed to the front.

A monkey scout has spotted an Abysian expansion force in the south. That isolated fort has finally managed to start expanding. It appears that they have only that one additional province so far, but perhaps they will continue to conquer their neighbors now.

A chittering monkey runner eager to deliver a message to our mages knocked over some volatile substances in a magickal research lab and the whole building went up in flame. This is the 2nd time Kailasa has lost a lab to fire in recent memory. Some discussion with the Yogi researchers about safety precautions may be in order. The markata who caused this has been demoted from runner to mango picker - he now spends his days attached to a long pole that is used by a bandar retired-military-officer-now-gardener who wields the markata-pole for pruning mango trees and picking the harder to reach fruit. If he ever stops chittering excuses and looking to place blame elsewhere perhaps this markata will be allowed to return to his previous profession, but he is currently far from attaining even a modicum of enlightenment. :re:

Hrum February 22nd, 2011 02:45 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doo (Post 771461)
Lastly another challenge, keen eyed readers may notice one picture in this post does not belong in the context it is presented in. Which one is it?

How about a hint? :)

Here's the map situation on the southern continent as it looks to Kailasa currently:

http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/3...overvie.th.jpg

I've been fairly conservative these last several turns. I was trying to catch up some in research before tackling Niefelheim, and I've been avoiding expanding into contact with Atlantis. I expect Atlantis to be the tough fight in this game.

Any news from TC up north?

endomorphious February 22nd, 2011 03:09 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Alrighty, this was a devastating turn for C'tis. Had hunkered down in province 12 after taking it from Niefel. I bumped up the local PD to 25. Had a nice number of troops there and either due to my poor scripting or just Niefels superiority he destroyed me with minimal losses to himself. Lost my god about 10 magic items. He was fighting in my Dominion too and the heat didn't seem to matter to him one bit. He now has serious ability to continue deep into my few territories and obliterate me. I'm 1 point away from having Alt 5, already have const4 and conj 1. Mayhap I can limp along long enough to get my darkness/skellispam up and running.

Atlantis is a MONSTER this game. With all the activity being reported by the other players I was hoping to not see him down my way. But, he took a province at 73. Not sure what he's got there yet. Maybe next turn.

Good luck.

Anyone looking to trade for gems? I need death gems primarily right now. Would also trade for blood slaves at say 1 gem to 10 slaves. Can you trade military units in this game?

Doo February 22nd, 2011 03:45 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
No, you can't trade military units. I have heaps of Air gems to spare, I suspect that won't help you much..

Have you a thug chassis? I can forge Vine Shields and Lucky Pendants if you want them.

A clue as to the picture is that the numbers don't add up. A better clue is that Tir na n'Og doesn't have Blood access.

I'm officially at war with Tien Chi, our border is currently a narrow strip of single provinces in a sea of indies. I've kitted out some thugs and hope that I can push him back to his castle. From my scouting I'm going at his second castle, his main castle and surrounds are pretty much all Tien Chi.

How you going Thanatus Del Dragos? I see you have a fort bordering Tien Chi.

Congrats to Mauxe on busting the Wraith Lord, although I wonder how much harder it would have been had it not fallen unconscious due to skelli-spamming? :)

Thanatus del Dragos February 22nd, 2011 03:49 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I'm preparing for a war on two fronts right now. Hasn't started yet, but Atlantis is creeping north and Tien Chi has an Army of Horsemen ready to pounce on my northern fort. My Southern Borders have two indie provinces, one filled with trolls and another with a Tarasque SC that I can't think of a way to defeat he regens about 50hp a turn, so that might stay as a border for now. Might send an Army toward Tien Chi's Northern Fort at 210. At least see what kind of resistance I will meet.

Doo February 22nd, 2011 04:01 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Towards Tiens northern fort is where I'm going too, my scouts suggest Tien doesn't have much up that way so lets kick down the door :)

Thanatus del Dragos February 22nd, 2011 04:02 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Sounds good to me :)

Mauxe February 23rd, 2011 04:14 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
ooh.. sorry if I stole that wraith lord province from you.
I was watching it for a few turns and didn't see any activity from you and I had regrouped enough to swoop in :(

Abysia is putting up a bit of a fight now. I really need to bring my site searching pretender home to craft a few items for me. Supply is greatly needed. I am just bolstering my southern border at this point until I can mount a better attack...

Doo February 23rd, 2011 05:15 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mauxe (Post 771735)
ooh.. sorry if I stole that wraith lord province from you.
I was watching it for a few turns and didn't see any activity from you and I had regrouped enough to swoop in :(

No worries. I hope you gained some of its items after the fight.

Hrum February 24th, 2011 12:15 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Turn 26 (Late Spring Yr3).

The fishmen have built 2 new land forts along the coast of the southern continent (61 & 58). They also continue to siege the 2 independent forts, and the siege force on the western one that houses the port (77) has grown quite large - they will probably crack the walls of that fort soon. The scouts of Kailasa can only see 3 remaining provinces held by the frost giants in the north, and one of those is their northern capital.

In the southern mountains, Kailasa continues to move forward. The southern capital is under siege and the monkey forces hope to have it cut-off from reinforcement / rescue before summer ends.

BTW, best magic site I've found so far: The Council of Sages. It's an astral site that gives income of 1 each: Astral, Air, Earth, Water. It also allows recruitment of Lore Masters for 300 gold (ouch!). OK, so they're expensive old guys, but they get 3 random picks of any (yes, any) path of magic. Magic diversity, here we come! :D

http://dom3.servegame.com/wiki/The_Council_of_Sages
http://dom3.servegame.com/wiki/Lore_Master

The monkey who found this site turned to his commander and screeched, "Mmmm, doughnuts!". I don't know where he got the doughnuts, or the weird metagame pop-cultural reference, but his furry face is all glazed and sticky now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-4P1WPE-Qg

Endo, if you have some troops you want to use to grab some land from Niefelheim in the south that would be cool, but I don't think the big frosties will be a threat much longer. I think in a few turns the threat is really going to be coming from your north. Any ideas about how you want to tackle the fishmen?

I'm glad to hear you guys are moving on TC in the north. Atlantis is definitely shaping up to be the guy to worry about, so the sooner we sort these other guys out the sooner we can turn our attention to the things that lurk in the deeps (and keep making forts up on land!). :eek: Who wants to cast Thetis' Blessing? :)

Mauxe, if you need 'em, I can forge you some bags of endless gulab jamun syrup* (ie. bags of endless wine). If that's the only reason you're diverting your pretender from site searching, then how about I make those for you instead? Each one feeds 50 men (reduces supply needs by 50) - How many do you think you'll need?

*(Bags of endless coriander chutney? Dal? Chicken curry, but without the chicken because it clogs up the spout?)

Doo February 24th, 2011 04:59 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hrum (Post 771768)
BTW, best magic site I've found so far: The Council of Sages. It's an astral site that gives income of 1 each: Astral, Air, Earth, Water. It also allows recruitment of Lore Masters for 300 gold (ouch!). OK, so they're expensive old guys, but they get 3 random picks of any (yes, any) path of magic. Magic diversity, here we come! :D

Nice site! I hope you have Growth dominion ;)

Mauxe February 24th, 2011 12:07 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
The extra supply would be nice. I could use at least 2 of them if possible. What gems/items could you use in return?

Hrum February 24th, 2011 07:02 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doo (Post 771785)
Nice site! I hope you have Growth dominion ;)

I wish. Who has the points for such things?! :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mauxe (Post 771805)
The extra supply would be nice. I could use at least 2 of them if possible. What gems/items could you use in return?

I made 3 of them preemptively - I figured if you didn't want them my armies would always find a use for them (already have a few in service). I'll send all 3 to you; if that's too many send one back or whatever.

I've got a few hammers made, so I can pump them out for 3 nature gems apiece (total of 9 gems for the 3 bags I'm sending you). Nature gems are always welcome, or a like number of something else (water and astral are especially prized by me).

Thanatus del Dragos February 24th, 2011 07:14 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I have brought War to the Tien Chi on two fronts!

Hrum February 25th, 2011 12:40 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Turn 28 is up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanatus del Dragos (Post 771856)
I have brought War to the Tien Chi on two fronts!

Huzzah! Death to T'ien Ch'i! We in the south are eager for any news of your exploits in the north. Your messengers are always welcome here if they bring the latest word on the campaign against our enemies.

Strangely, Abysia managed to get a force of crazy men and fanatical flaggelants to the port province that Atlantis sieges (77). This is on the far NW coast of the southern continent. The attack was trifling and Atlantis did not appear to take any casualties, but it puzzles us how Abysia got troops to this spot, so far from their homelands. Our scouts tell me that Abysia does not possess any of the neighboring land.

Abysia's bless: f9 s4

In the south, month 3 of Kailasa's siege of the frost giants southern capital - we continue to choke the life out of Niefelheim.

Last month they sallied with a large force of hurlers and militia, supported by a random assortment of independent archers and led by a Niefel Jarl and a Skratti. They lost 3/4 of their army and the Niefel Jarl did not escape the battlefield. Losses on our side were 8/60, but 5 of those were sacred Yavana lost when they raced ahead of their arrow screen in their eagerness to join battle and were met with a hail of arrows and boulders. They are mourned.

This month a smaller force of theirs met a larger force of Yavana and light infantry. The frost giants were chased from the field, but sadly, their Niefel Jarl leader escaped this time. No Yavana were lost, though there were 10 casualties in the archer screen. Reinforcements continue to move up.

The provinces surrounding the southern Niefel capital continue to fall. This fort will be isolated and reduced shortly.

Doo February 25th, 2011 02:28 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Hrum (Post 771853)
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doo (Post 771785)
Nice site! I hope you have Growth dominion ;)

I wish. Who has the points for such things?! :)

Ha! I guess the answer is nations that have half decent troops and don't need their pretender to cover areas lacking..

Monkeys!

:)

Tien Chi, at least in the northern part of his domain, is in trouble. Fomoria and I will take his northern lands leaving the rest sandwiched between us and Atlantis.

Thanatus del Dragos February 25th, 2011 10:07 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I crushed a Tien Chi army of 100 to the North, they did not kill a single one of my men. They have another fortress between me and their base at 210, I will begin the siege next turn. They cannot defeat me.

Mauxe February 25th, 2011 07:56 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Abysia has some type of powerful magic at its ddisposal.
I was attacked in two provinces by them.. one in the heart of my territories and the other was my Northern Vanguard - both impossible to reach without some form of teleportation (for them).

The supply is much appreciated and I have sent gems as payment :)

endomorphious February 26th, 2011 01:41 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
need some advice. I will have researched alteration 6 the end of this turn and can finally start planning on using darkness/skellispam in my expansion. What should I focus on now? Conjuration? I could definitely use the extra deathgems. I need to build up my mages I think. Their my biggest strength from what I can see. I could push on up in. Hmmm. Must. Plan. Sooner.

Ugh Kailasa keep your dang monkeys on your side of the map. One of the little buggers burnt down a lab.

Doo February 26th, 2011 05:55 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
New turn up...

I'd save the death gems and just site search on foot. If your short on death gems, they cost 3 per province to search and you have access to 4D mages I'd say send one or two mages out on foot. You might also turn up some other sites, such as water sites for Frost Brands or extra nature for Vine Shields.

If your going the darkness route, I'd try and maximise it, thus go Conj to get Banes as thugs to back up the Skeli-chaff in the dark. Any tougher undead in the dark are going to add bang to your buck.

endomorphious February 27th, 2011 04:06 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Yeah what few provinces I have have been manually searched by my pretender. Kailasa is doing well against neifel, but I'm fast running out of directions to try and expand into except for the water. I plan on researching Alt up to 7 or 8 for destruction spam along with the skellispam then move on to const 6 for water bracelets and gear to move into the water.

Overall asessment of performance is: poor.

Doo February 27th, 2011 07:51 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
If you need you can ask Hrum if you can create a path through his lands so you can participate. Or research and gear up to try going underwater.

Whatever you do will be good, it forces an AI to respond and invest against you rather than elsewhere. I have great Air access so I can forge you some good items to get your mages underwater. We are allies so there is no need to make any payment in return.

Your Darkness spam tactic will be good, make sure the caster has greater than 4D or it costs 400 fatigue and I suppose instant death. Kit your armies with some quality undead and in the dark they will do well.

Jarkko February 27th, 2011 08:55 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doo (Post 771998)
Your Darkness spam tactic will be good, make sure the caster has greater than 4D or it costs 400 fatigue and I suppose instant death.

No it doesn't. A mage casting a spell never goes above 200 fatigue hmiself. Effectively it thus does not matter if you cast a spell that causes 400 fatigue with a mage that is just able to cast it, or with a mage that has one higher than the required path; the difference starts to show after you have a mage that is at least 2 levels higher than what the spell requires. Thus, if you have both a D4 and D5 mage in a combat, it makes sense to cast Darkness with the D4 mage, and let the D5 mage do all the other cool spells :)

Doo February 27th, 2011 09:41 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
If a mage has 200 fatigue they die don't they? So its still insta-death for a poor D4-5 mage? Or do they just collapse?

I could test this....

Thanatus del Dragos February 27th, 2011 01:31 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I think Tien Chi is going to fall, and fall fairly fast. Three of their forts are now being seiged by the Irish Alliance (Firbolg Federation?).

Hrum February 27th, 2011 08:47 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Turn 31 is up. I think you guys all noticed this already. :)

Quote:

Originally Posted by endomorphious (Post 771946)
Ugh Kailasa keep your dang monkeys on your side of the map. One of the little buggers burnt down a lab.

Dude, sorry about that. I didn't think they liked your swampy lizard lands, but I guess monkeys can pop up anywhere. ;) They are cheeky little buggers aren't they? I recommend keeping them out of your labs if you can manage it, but that's probably easier said than done.

Quote:

Originally Posted by endomorphious (Post 771946)
need some advice. I will have researched alteration 6 the end of this turn and can finally start planning on using darkness/skellispam in my expansion. What should I focus on now?

I agree with Doo about the thug summons (banes and whatnot). You may need to kit them out a bit, but I think it'll be worth it (not sure they're amphibious natively). Vine shields w/ fire/shadow brands are always nice too. If you can't forge these I can make fire brands for you (they're better than frost brands against a guy that has either some resistances or high prot - fire brands are AP, frost brands aren't so even if the splash isn't helping much at least someone gets hit with a damaging AP attack).

I have some other thoughts on stuff you might want to do as well. Basically, it sounds like you really went full bore for the darkness thing, which may or may not be super useful against Atlantis (would've worked great against Niefelheim, but there isn't much left of him). The reason it may only be partially useful against Atlantis is (and I hadn't really looked at Atlantis before or I would've mentioned this earlier):

Atlantis has troops that have darkvision natively! :doh: And yes, in scouting reports watching the fights between Atlantis and Niefel I've seen him using troop mixes including these guys a fair bit:

-Deep Ones / #Deep One Spearmen (Dv 100; Fire & Cold Resist 50%)
-Atlantian Spearmen (DV 50)
-Shambler of the Deep / #Warrior of the Deep (DV 100; Fre & Cold Resist 50%)

#(These dudes have scary basalt spears, which defeat etherealness.)

I guess it's pretty dark down in the deeps and the Atlantian troops have adapted to that. So, using darkness on Atlantis won't be as overwhelming as it would be against many other nations. I think it'll still be somewhat useful, as I bet the AI mixes in some guys who don't have awesome DV with most of his armies, but in an MP game against a human Atlantis opponent you'd probably be facing nothing but DV100 guys as soon as he saw that you were sending undead at him (apparently those Deep One Spearmen are highly prized Atlantian chaff in general because they're cheap / low resource, and can be cranked out like mad). They ain't none of 'em poison resistant though...


So, other than darkness what do you have? I looked at the EA C'Tis mages on the wiki and it looks like you've got your share of:

-D
-more D
-N
-some S
-some W

Bearing your paths in mind, I looked over the list of spells and it looks like you've got all of the following available to you at a not terribly high research level (I tried not to look above research 5 in any school).

I know you may not have some of those at high enough levels that you can cast all the spells below right out of the box, but for some of these spells it may be worth forging a path booster and sending a path boosted mage out to the front lines. Nature boosters (thistle mace) and water boosters (Water Bracelet, Robe of the Sea) are relatively cheap / easy to make.


Rituals - prep for combat by summoning dudes:
conj2 d2 summon shades (5d gems 4x shades) [amph]
conj3 d2 revive bane (8d gems - commander) [no amph - needs gear?]
conj4 d3 summon shade beasts (20d gems 15x shade beasts) [pr amph]
conj5 d4 revive bane lord (12d gems - commander) [no amph - needs gear?]
ench5 d3 pale riders (10d gems 20x skel horsemen) [pr amph]


Buff your dudes:
evo2 w2 rain (1w gem) [OK, not a buff per se, but nice to have on land if enemy has F mages]
alt3 s1 **body ethereal (*do this to your bane/bane lord thugs)
alt5 n2 wooden warriors (do this to your undead chaff)

*For some reason I thought the banes were ethereal, but the wiki suggests not. Seems I was misremembering - maybe people tend to make them ethereal so often I just thought they were natively..? In any case, why not make the banes/bane lords ethereal if you can swing it? Great against some opponents, not so much against others...
**Ethereal may actually be less useful against Atlantis. Some of his troops have basalt spears that are magic / defeat the ethereal effect.


Kill enemy dudes w/ poison & death kaboom (supposedly only 1 of these doesn't work underwater):
alt1 n1 eagle eyes (improve mages' precision before firing evos)
evo4 n2 breath of the dragon (NUW)
evo5 n3 poison cloud
evo5 d2 shadow blast (1d gem)
ench5 n3w1 foul vapors (1n gem - whole BF)


Sleepify / Scare remaining enemy dudes:
evo3 n2 sleep cloud (the manual doesn't say NUW, so this might work for water fighting)
thau3 n2 panic
thau4 d3 terror


Bonus underwater combat spell (for Conj6 w3):
Shark Attack (3w gems)

Here's a useful thread on underwater fighting:
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=43042

The great thing about using poison & death magic along with undead is that your undead are immune. No worries about collateral damage. Fear spam same. I think the same is true of sleep effects / fatigue effects as well (undead don't get fatigued and don't sleep?).

Is any of that useful at all?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Doo (Post 771998)
If you need you can ask Hrum if you can create a path through his lands so you can participate. Or research and gear up to try going underwater.

C'Tis has 2 AI neighbors he can make war with to his north (the dwindling Niefelheim, incl his northern capital, and Atlantis who is heavily on land at this point). C'Tis shouldn't need a path through me to expand (he would to go after Abysia, but seems a bad idea to leave a scary submerged enemy who is now on land on your door step while going off to fight on the far removed eastern continent).

Fighting through Atlantis will even give C'Tis access to port provinces that will (ultimately) allow access to the NW and the E continents. The biggest obstacle to hopping to the other continents that way is Atlantis, who will raid mercilessly along the coast once war is begun with him (since he's the one who holds those port provinces). IMO, the solution is to get in the water and put an end to the fishmen.

Sorry for another long $%^&ing post. :P

Jarkko February 28th, 2011 02:26 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Doo (Post 772005)
If a mage has 200 fatigue they die don't they? So its still insta-death for a poor D4-5 mage? Or do they just collapse?

No, a toon takes damage for each point over 200 points of fatigue. So being at fatigue 200 does no damage.

Thanatus del Dragos February 28th, 2011 10:30 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Tien Chi fought off one of my sieging forces. I had 50 troops and he had his God and 250 troops. It was a bad loss, I lost 35 of my troops, but I did take out 115 of his and I have a large reinforcement team coming. I am going to send a stealth unit to the south to see what Atlantis is up too.

Hrum February 28th, 2011 12:28 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Turn 33 is up.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Thanatus del Dragos (Post 772094)
Tien Chi fought off one of my sieging forces. I had 50 troops and he had his God and 250 troops. It was a bad loss, I lost 35 of my troops, but I did take out 115 of his and I have a large reinforcement team coming. I am going to send a stealth unit to the south to see what Atlantis is up too.

Ouch. That's a rough one. What's TC's pretender like?

Endo, I wasn't thinking about those tough indie provs boxing you in when I posted earlier. Would it make it easier if you had a path through those formerly Niefel provinces in the south?

Also, maybe we should re-visit those tough indie provinces. We've all got higher research now and there might be some options for taking those down. One of them has a dragon leading a bunch of militia, right? I'm going to have to go back through this thread to check about the other one, but maybe you can get us some up to date scouting on those..?

---------
Edit:

Quote:

Originally Posted by endomorphious (Post 770278)
On of the choke points near me has 210+ Ryleh troops...I can't take it but doubt anyone else will be anytime soon :}.

Is this the other tough indie province?

Thanatus del Dragos February 28th, 2011 01:10 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
TC has a Jade Emporer stacked in uber gear, but not super powerful magic paths. Can't remmeber off the top of my head, but I will take him next time.

endomorphious February 28th, 2011 02:59 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Took province 28, the one with the red dragon, militia, and fairies. What a waste of good meatshields :{ sigh. But, realistically, me being able to charm someone is less likely than Quasimodo trying to score Lady Gaga in a 89 Fiesta.

Will be attacking province 32 next turn. The Southern Toad Tribes are about to become snake food. (I hope) my scripting seemed to do very well against the dragon. The level 4 priest spell word of power(??) hit him several times and then a few soul vortex's and life drains and he went down fairly easily. The only thing was my mage did not cast Darkness as ordered. Very irksome.

I NEEEEED gold. Anyone want to buy some gems for gold? I have spare fire, air, and water. Could scrimp and weasel out some death gems instead of skull mentor. A smattering of nature and earth gems too.

My goal is to march my big god/prophet/mage force up through, 32, 40 (if unowned-can't see it), then siege 55. Mop up left over forces and then focus on Atlantis.

Doo February 28th, 2011 04:46 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Endomorphious, I will shoot you through some gold this turn.

Bugger on Tien Chi busting the siege. Still I have one and I'm sure Thanatus del Dragos you still have another under siege. I suspect your one will be hit by his god force first.

Thanatus del Dragos February 28th, 2011 05:33 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I siege and took one fort from him already, that one is no longer under dispute, he has no force near it. I will tke him in the south, I have no fear. I now have storms and thunder at my disposal with Evo 5, I will crush him!

Hrum March 1st, 2011 01:56 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by endomorphious (Post 772121)
Took province 28, the one with the red dragon, militia, and fairies.

Quote:

...my scripting seemed to do very well against the dragon. The level 4 priest spell word of power(??) hit him several times and then a few soul vortex's and life drains and he went down fairly easily. The only thing was my mage did not cast Darkness as ordered. Very irksome.
Nice work! I'm only sad my scout wasn't in position to watch. :)

Word of power is nice. More than one Soul Vortex? Did you have multiple guys cast it and then run into melee? Soul Vortex is typically used as a thug/SC buffing spell rather than as a killing spell (it works for killing chaff, but doesn't necessarily have much effect on big guys w/ high MR).

You had D gems with the Darkness mage I take it? Was it the first spell that mage was casting (ie. was he at zero fatigue when he would've been casting)? Sometimes the Dom3 spellcasting AI just decides it knows better and won't cast a spell. In the case of darkness it might've happened if you had too many troops present that didn't have DV (I don't know this for a fact; just pulling stuff out of a monkey's nether regions - uhh, yeah. Gross.).

Quote:

But, realistically, me being able to charm someone is less likely than Quasimodo trying to score Lady Gaga in a 89 Fiesta.
LOL! Nice. Seriously, charming and seducing and whatnot is not easy. As I understand it, you need a whole sack of seducers / charmers all decked out in penetration gear (you play the percentages game by sending a bunch of mages and having 'em spam it), and they still won't succeed against anyone with high enough MR. Mid to high teens is the highest you're likely to succeed on.

Quote:

My goal is to march my big god/prophet/mage force up through, 32, 40 (if unowned-can't see it), then siege 55. Mop up left over forces and then focus on Atlantis.
/Kailasa scout finds vantage high above the next battlefield and settles in with cold rice and a little rat meat...

Sent what gold I could spare your way. If you can spare some water gems I won't refuse 'em (I can't get enough!), but no worries if you got better uses for 'em.

endomorphious March 1st, 2011 09:41 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Thanks for the gold guys. Big help. those sauromancers are greedy little buggers! About time to send em out working for their gold. Their shall be a tide of risen dead drowning the remnants of Niefels dreams. HAH water gems on the way...I've been stockpiling as Ive not researced Cons 6 yet :{ which I will have to do once i finish Alt 8, in like 3 turns. I'm hoping disintegrate is worth the push that high up.

Thanatus del Dragos March 1st, 2011 10:17 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Storming the castle, they might fight me off, or they might just die, we'll see.

Doo March 1st, 2011 04:43 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I'll see, I have a scout in that province :)

Mauxe March 2nd, 2011 12:18 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I am in the middle of an all out Abyssia blitz!
They have teleported into two main provinces now and a vampire lord is laying siege to my capital...

I am about to break the siege this turn and hopefully get my southern force moving through what appears to be a relatively undefended series of provinces.

Not cool.

Thanatus del Dragos March 2nd, 2011 01:20 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I crushed them.

Finalgenesis March 2nd, 2011 04:35 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Apologies Doo for an unrelated intrusion into your game.

Hi Mauxe, you may have noted a PM sent to you before you made your most recent post in this thread regarding the game Gluttony, inquiring as to if everything is alright and confirming that you plan to keep playing.

Perhaps it won't be too much trouble to ask for 15 seconds of your time to clarify your intent in Gluttony for us? Think of it as minimal consideration to the other players there, where 15 seconds from you to make a short post can save all the other players there the suspense and delay in starting the sub finding process, or any further unneeded stales that impacts the game.

If you want out and need a sub, just say so, I think that's a really low bar to achieve actually, and I never hold anything against people that put in this minimal consideration to fellow players.

If you do intend to stay, we would of course welcome you back.

Let us know.

-Co. Admin, Gluttony

Doo March 2nd, 2011 04:53 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I could Cloud Trapeze some thugs at the provinces Abysia are at, give me some province numbers and I'll send in the clowns on those jesters ;)

Cheers for the goodies Endomorphious :)

endomorphious March 2nd, 2011 08:00 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Arggh! The last two provinces I've taken had an income of 5 and 7 gold each. Still about 4 turns away from reaching Disintegrate. I feel somewhat like the hard focus on this spell at level 8 could be crippling me somewhat. Especially since there is nothing I can effectively use in level 9 of Alt and few spells other than Disintegrate in level 8. Still all in all I've read its very useful in combat and I have many available spammers for it.

Thanks again guys for the gold. I really heavily underestimated the burden a couple dozen sauromancers would be on the economy. If this wasn't an ally game, I'd die from gold-lack alone. Thank heavens for at least the luck 3 scales.

I really need to refine my scripting skills. I handily conquered the last indie but it seemed very inefficient and i think my fire shielded PoD killed his own undead retainers. Ahhh, well thats why I'm playing :}

Thanatus del Dragos March 2nd, 2011 10:26 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I think TC is hurt. I am going to really put the pain on them in the south over the next few turns. I have moved my stealth army toward their direction. 40 Nemedians can really bring the pain.

Thanatus del Dragos March 4th, 2011 03:27 PM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
I've decided to engage TC's God in battle again. What could go wrong...

Mauxe March 5th, 2011 12:19 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
This random popping Abysia thing is really starting to get annoying...

Also - I started to make push south and suddenly a force of 200 showed up in a lightly defended fort....

Doo March 5th, 2011 01:34 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Hmmm... I broke down the walls and attacked the castle, only to be repulsed by a giant stone head and Demons of Heavenly Rivers.

Back to the drawing board. I've been having some fun but I think I'll need to start being serious.

Endomorphious, I've sent some death gems to assist summoning that undead army.

Thanatus del Dragos March 5th, 2011 02:01 AM

Re: Turbocharged AI vs Humanities Last Hope - Running
 
Yea, TC thumped me too...I guess I underestimated them, lol.


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