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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Great footage from inside a (possible) Alligator strafing (kind of) targets and then doing an emergency landing.
Not sure if there were real targets or of they actually hit anything, but interesting footage no matter what. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oLa3fZD1vXs |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60767454
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Even if Putin is removed as a threat, in some way, I am afraid he is going to be a small problem compared to PRC.
The PRC is one of the most undemocratic countries, which still has under occupation Tibet, constantly threatens Taiwan who they don't even see as a separate country (remind you of something?) and they keep improving their economy and their military with (in large parts) Western money. The same way the West has looked the other way because Russia was providing with raw materials, the same way and even worse the West looks the other way with PRC by having what at times feels like 110% of world industry located there. HUGE mistake which no one seems to care about. Imagine if the "good old" USSR instead of forcing it to call it quits, the West was providing her money to keep developing and getting rich. |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Any idea what the second vehicle is? I can't see clearly if it is some type of MBT or BMP.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-nzaRHecoGU EDIT: OK it clearly is some type of MBT. Not sure what type, but it looks to me like it gets penned from the side and catches fire. |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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I found the clearest section of that and straighten it
https://forum.shrapnelgames.com/atta...1&d=1647952203 Thinking a T72. Note that it does not have the bag mounted ERA on the sides That's a very short clip but at no time does the Tank do anything so we don't know what happened before. Note the gunner has plenty of time to pick his target low on the hull ( and that guy to the left of the aim point must have just loved having those 30mm rounds whistle passed his head) The bottom line is what goes into the game is based on what we learn or just sometimes guess based on "official" information and Russia has a LOT of T-72's and ***betting*** they are not all upgraded to the same standard even though outwardly they look similar. If that was an early 72 that was given ERA blocks on the turret it * may * only have the original side armour and those "plates" on the side may just be re-enforced rubber as a RPG deflector. They certainly don't appear to have ERA By the stats used by the game the "best" Pen for the SABOT rounds used by the 30mm autocannon on a BTR-4 has a Pen of 15 and that could theoretically pen the side hull steel armour of a T-72 BTW.. the recorded sound of that autocannon firing is now in the game for Ukrainian vehicles using that weapon |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
I am investigating a number of avenues none of which is making my life any easier ATM
IF some of the info I have is correct (IF) many of the "new" upgrades to the T-72 ( and T-80 ) are on old hulls given new ERA, and a host of other items I have not found any info that the hull sides were given extra armour and IF THAT is the case then these upgraded T-72's while having a number of better bells and whistles still have a side hull in the 8-9 range IF these are old T-72's with the new gadgets added which would mean that yes indeed they would be vulnerable to a 30mm autocannon from the side which is a "really big deal" in RL and the game, especially in an urban setting. That said there is still much we don't know because the info is not readily available and I am still digging for info' We did discover a little "oopsie" in the code that has now been corrected in both games. When Country training is turned off and players can dial in a single value the display on the purchase screen only shows the changed EXP rating while MOR does not change but it actually does and that can be seen using the Roster screen in the game..... MOR does change along with EXP ( a couple of lines of code were // commented out that should not have been and it now shows the correct values entered for both) As well, we are looking into a way to make that a two-part question that will allow EXP and MOR to be adjusted individually but the code for that is less than straightforward so no promises on that but we still remain "hopeful" |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Apparently, the HE found in Russian ERA blocks is quite the valuable trading commodity, often being sold off by units to "fishermen" for cash or booze. Thus the HE part is often not routinely fitted, also for peacetime safety reasons of course. Those things are after all live munitions like hand grenades so should not be filled until the baloon goes up.
As the invading units were "on excercises" before they got the orders to go into Ukraine, I wonder how many units went in with unfilled ERA blocks due to having no HE charges to fill them on hand (whether traded or routinely kept unloaded by safety policies), or insufficient time to load them while also bombing up the tanks with live war loads when they pivoted to actual war status? |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Not sure if it is real or not, but interesting dialogue.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b2mlqC-c6Cw Carrying 100s of bodies not being able to take them back. Not having proper equipment. Friendly fire. Russian humor too. A bit of everything. Again, no idea if it is real or not. |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
I believe it was last Thur./or Fri. from either a CBS or CNN reporter and camera crew were interviewing a Ukrainian soldier (Rank unknown.) about Russian losses. They were by some railroad tracks with at least 3 or maybe 4 box cars. He took them inside of one of them and their appeared to be about 25 or 30 bodies he identified as Russian soldiers.
So much for "leaving no man behind" but it seems some of the conflicts are swift in nature. Regards, Pat :capt: |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
This video posted on YouTube describes the various letter identifiers used on Russian vehicles.
https://youtu.be/gMh6Ml329VU <Br> |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Given the reckless statements coming out of Washington over the past several days; in particular language alluding to a regime change in Moscow is frightening. Furthermore, words signalling a change of policy where US forces will employ chemical weapons if Russian forces do is borne out by Biden saying something akin to responding in kind.
Given, these two statements alone, I hope the CNO knows where each Russian boomer is located. <br> |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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Russian tank losses so far in Ukraine for help in designing scenarios.
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
RETAC21 on TankNet posted the following writeup on UKR forces:
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Tossed these "notes" together -- some of the information is from Wikipedia which had some fairly generic 2018 or so era OBATs for various Ukranian brigade formations.
Some of the numbers may be off from reality - e.g. some people use a 10 tank company, the US uses a 14 tank company, etc etc; but in the end all the numbers come out in the wash; due to "non runners". This will get you "close enough" for realistic scenarios. ================ Generic Artillery Units 6 to 12 make up a battery 18 to 36 make up a battalion ================ Generic Mechanized (Tank/IFV/etc) Unit 1 company = 12 vehicles + 2 vehicle command element (14 vehicles total) 3 companies = battalion (36 combat vehicles + 6 command = 42 vehicles total) 3 battalions = brigade (108 combat vehicles + 18 command = 126 vehicles total) ================ Basic US doctrine in WWII was Two Up / One Back; i.e. while two elements attack, the third is held in reserve. ================ Tank Brigade (Ukraine) -- 93 tanks 3 x Tank Battalions (31 tanks per battalion; 9 tank companies total) 1 x Mechanized Battalion (3 mech companies total) 1 x Brigade Artillery (2 x SPA Battalions, 1 x MRL Battalion) 1 x SAM Battalion 1 x Engineer Battalion 1 x Recon Company 1 x Sniper Company ================ Motorized Brigade (Ukraine) 3 x Motorized Infantry Battalions (9 mot inf companies total) 1 x Brigade Artillery (1 x Howitzer Bn with D-20, 1 x Anti-Tank Battalion with MT-12) 1 x SAM Battalion 1 x Recon Company 1 x Tank Company (10 tanks?) 1 x Engineer Company 1 x Sniper Platoon ============ Mechanized Brigade (Ukraine) 3 x Mechanized Battalions (9 Mech companies total) 1 x Tank Battalion (3 tank companies total) 1 x Brigade Artillery (2 x SPA Battalions, 1 x MRL Battalion, 1 x AT Bn with MT-12) 1 x SAM Battalion 1 x Engineer Battalion 1 x Recon Company 1 x Sniper Company |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
On the Ukrainian tanks numbers for that period those numbrs aren't out of line with some I've seen either up or down.
What is clear and reported by many "respectable" sources is that they have both replenished their loses and have more tanks then when the war started on 24 Feb. 2022. Of the Russian captured tanks, I'm working on (More on this elsewhere.) for submission which are only 10 types (But have become a headache.) the total comes to 441 as of last Thur./Fri. Unsubmitted to avoid duplication on tanks that are essentially equal to existing ones from both countries are left out, HOWEVER, it well known that the Ukraine are using them as well. That number is around 70 captured other types including approximately the same falling into the unidentified T-72/80 & 90 series tanks. Total verified from the same last week is... Tanks (1610, of which destroyed: 944, damaged: 73, abandoned: 60, captured: 533) Total all categories is... Russia - 8634, of which: destroyed: 5408, damaged: 219, abandoned: 298, captured: 2709. I'm supplying the reference I'm NOT going to debate the merits of this information as I've even seen JANE's mention it and not in a bad way. Use it as you wish and before you judge it, I would suggest you read the opening paragraph of this ref. https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/0...equipment.html Mark that was some good "Dope" you put out there. ;) As I was about to leave the ORNX site I came across this by accident "so the road appears to go both ways" which makes me even more comfortable. https://www.oryxspioenkop.com/2022/0...ukrainian.html Regards, Pat :capt: |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Also, many T-90S export tanks have been found destroyed in Ukraine. Seems the Russians are diverting tanks meant for export from their final customers for internal use. Bet that's winning them friends.
So if you want to simulate this; just set Indian T-90S to captured lol when picking Russian tanks! |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
That (Perhaps.......) should be done with any Russian vehicle rather than trying to add everything that's been captured to the Ukrainian OOB ( As I have been doing since the last release.) It would save the increasingly few weapons slots left in the Ukrainian OOB. It's a nearly safe bet that any vehicle currently in the Russian OOB for 2022 has had at least one of them captured and re-used by Ukraine
Many weapons are duplicated between the Russian and Ukrainian OOB but many are not and every new vehicle added from "western" stocks uses up to 4 weapon slots HINDSIGHT is always 20/20 but when we expanded the units and Formations in the OOB's we didn't increase weapons because 2 decades ago the idea that 249 weapon slots could be used up seemed ridiculous ( as would have the idea that we'd still doing this in 2023 and that Russia and Ukraine would fight a major war....) |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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1.) Enough actually show up in large numbers -- i.e. 12 Challenger IIs, no; 200 M2A2 Bradleys, yes. and/or 2.) Do the Ukrainians modify it enough during refurbishment to make it unique enough to include? I think that perhaps it might be worth including a HTML file listing all the weapons that have ended up in Ukraine and the suggested OOBs to buy them from. Quote:
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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As for the other issue. Donated or purchased vehicles are definitely going in so all the T-72/ T-55 variants from neighbouring former Warsaw pact nations for sure are being added. it's the captured Russian tanks that are under review and no decision has been made. I have been adding them as they are reported but the allied/captured button allows this without cluttering up the Ukrainian OOB so pulling the former Russian captures out is under consideration because that is what the allied/captured button was intended for. Another issue in regards to weapons is in the majority of cases the secondary weapons used by donated or purchased vehicles can mostly be found already in the Ukrainian OOB but adding each, named light calibre weapon for things like the AMX or Bradley rapidly uses slots and all the 7.62 and 12.7s do the same thing in the same way so I have set up "generic" 7.62 CMG etc for vehicles arriving in Ukraine from non-former WP nations. That simplifies adding them with no effect on gameplay and saves the remaining weapons slots for any potentially more major weapons systems that might one day arrive. A "generic" 7.62 AAMG or CMG does the same thing in the game as a "named" one but even with that 80% of the weapons slots have already been used in the Ukrainian OOB and I would like to keep those for something other than MG's |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
I'm just spitballing, but I'm wondering whether it might be worth creating a OOB just for this war?
I.e., activate the unused OOB94 "For R&D only" and make it so that when you hold the SHIFT key, OOB94 replaces GREEN on the various encyclopedia/battle editing screens. No AI, no picklists, etc; because you've got the main Ukrainian and Russian OOBs for that; it's only purpose is to hold all the one-offs and stuff coming from this war to be bought as captured equipment. |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
With what's already available to players using the captured button a " War in Ukraine" OOB is not needed
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
The main problem with the use of "set captured" is that the stuff from a forign OOB cannot be used for campaign cores. So only of use for scenarios or stand-alone battles.
However, I intend to see if there is a way to "set as core" for "foreign" stuff - fingers crossed:)! |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
This could be helpful but OTOH "captures" like this are rarely an "en masse" event that would allow full formations.... ones and twos are much more probable so having them outside the core is not at all unrealistic
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
.......and in related news.......( FWIW)
https://www.forbes.com/sites/davidax...h=65c7b6585562 Quote:
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
According to recent news there have been a number of Russian vehicles captured in "pristine" (for used vehicles) condition as some Russian units are abandoning significant quantities of vehicles (presumably due to limited fuel availability).
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
If this is happening widespread it is significant. Localized not so much
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Just a reminder, if it isn't already implemented, that the heavy use od mines in Ukraine means it might be best if they're taken off the Ottawa convention list.
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
I found this interesting.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_7ykSuCWK8 |
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This was "supposed" to be over quickly. Guessing Putin was assured 2-3 weeks tops.... again speculation but guessing it was supposed to be all done and dusted around the time they pulled back from Bucha which was the end of March |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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Just because there is "heavy use of mines in Ukraine" does NOT mean Ukraine is using them The Ottawa treaty was a "wonderful" virtue signalling idea for nations that knew they would never be put into a situation where they would need to lay mines for defence. The rest quietly put them into storage or at least keep all the machinery needed to make them well-maintained in storage THAT SAID I can find LOTS of reports that Russia is using them ( but they didn't sign )... https://foreignpolicy.com/2022/09/15...ne-land-mines/ https://www.wired.com/story/russian-...gical-warfare/ ...... but I have not read anything about their being used BY Ukraine but that doesn't mean anything ,,, the info that they are could be suppressed... or the info could be coming from Russia which means nothing much really..... it's easy to say the other side is doing exactly what you are doing to justify what you are doing.... so what sources do you have that support this ??? |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Human Rights Watch has accused Ukraine of using rocket delivered FASCAM AP mines.
https://www.hrw.org/news/2023/01/31/...harm-civilians Quote:
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
And the critical word there is "accused". Human Rights Watch go on to say the Ukraine military " appear to have" used them
It's established fact that Russia is using them but Russia didn't sign the treaty It's also interesting that all the mines are Russian in Origin but given the past connection between Ukraine and Russia that's not a surprise The really important point is this is a GAME forum and in this GAME Ukraine cannot place mines in 2022-2023. If THE GAME was allowing that then there would be an issue. The game does not so maybe this need to be taken up in the Human Rights Watch forum but I am NOT going to restore Ukraines ability to place mines based on accusations originating with the Russians who are known to use mines |
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
POTUS's virtue has gone above and beyond then because we are sending Taiwan the VOLCANO battlefield mining system.
We didn't sign all parts of the OTTAWA Treaty, and this is an example of how we got around it (As we do have the anti-personnel canisters for ourselves.) on the non-proliferation issue by NOT sending Taiwan the anti-personal canisters we'll instead we'll be sending them ONLY the anti-tank ones. Which fulfills our obligations. You can read the rest for yourselves. https://www.popsci.com/technology/us...enser-systems/ https://www.taipeitimes.com/News/tai.../17/2003792745 So, with that in mind, we could send the same system to the Ukraine, and nobody would be offended or bothered. Russia used them to open the Campaign and they were dropping anti-personnel as well. There is a "tingling sensation" on the web that they may try to slip it into the most recent $2+ Billion-dollar aid package. All I'm saying there are loopholes and we're exploiting them on the "non-proliferation" side. I would not be surprised if we send them there by Spring or early Summer. Don't kind yourselves if we're doing for Taiwan (And pissing China for it.) Ukraine isn't a reach either. Whether you like "Uncle Joe" or not and I don't care either way, he's done more than the last two Presidents combined to get weapons to the Ukraine and align NATO plus the same can be said about Taiwan going even further back. For China systems like VOLCANO, F-16V and ABRAMS were "Redlines" WELL we've made them, "GREENLINES" You have to remember he had 40 years in the Senate through the Cold War and beyond. In Putin he sees Stalin and the Soviet Union, with Xi Ping it's Mao and Communist China. and he's "spitting in their eyes" right now. Just food for thought in a neutral biased way. ;) Regards, Pat :capt: |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
While we are on the subject of mines I invite comments in regards to this POSSIBLE swap file addition to the games ( similar to the swastika flag swap file in SPww2
https://i.imgur.com/o84FeQR.png |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Is so you better see where your mines are placed so your guys don't get killed by them? If so, looks great as those signs were posted in battlefields going back to WWI.
If otherwise a planning tool while working on a scenario or other, then I did that kind of thing I would use it so I would put a building or some such on top of the mine. Regards, Pat :capt: |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Dang! Those look freaking good!
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
They would be a minor "game changer" in that they are impossible to overlook by either side, unlike the old mine icons that could be missed on a cluttered map.
OTOH.... nothing at all is changed in the code so an undetected minefield remains Icon free until it is detected I did try a red/black version and white/blue/black/red versions as well which are less eye-catching than the yellow https://i.imgur.com/GuSSGAm.png White skull on red OTOH works like the yellow on black in a K.I.S.S way https://i.imgur.com/6I529Qj.png And there are alternates to that.... the word MINES added in white https://i.imgur.com/eathW0T.png and alternates to the alternates .. the word MINES added in Yellow https://i.imgur.com/03oyKUd.png And alternatives to that .. the word MINES added in white with a yellow skull https://i.imgur.com/LMzLpjc.png |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Looks great but looks like there is no any international standard sign for mines
for inspiration Ukraine since 2014 https://www.unicef.org/sites/default...?itok=Tx9oMjqC German WW2 times https://i.ebayimg.com/images/g/n04AA...SK4/s-l500.jpg British army sign https://live.staticflickr.com/508/20...dd0f76e6_b.jpg |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
From Twitter/Telegram -- how a typical "Wagner" assault is executed for Scenario designers:
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
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Leaning towards these but I have weeks to make up my mind https://forum.shrapnelgames.com/atta...1&d=1675383170 Or Perhaps Roman Numerals https://forum.shrapnelgames.com/atta...1&d=1675383731 |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
So from this, you could simulate a Wagner attack by:
1.) Having each "wave" of Wagner (2 units, each of 4 men to enable some maneuvering) appear on a timed reinforcement schedule, to prevent the RU player from "gamey" use of all the squads at once in mass. 2.) The units are appropriately low cost -- instead of a total cost of 34 for a typical 8 man Russian Rifle Section (Unit 831); you'd use the scenario editor to reduce total unit cost to something like 5. |
Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
Apologies for causing a brief argument in chat! My sleep-deprived brain clearly forgot that the Ottawa convention deals with personnel mines, not anti-armor mines. Also, in reference to the claimed Wagner wave assaults, didn't folks spend literal decades trying to dispel the myth of the 'Great Russian Horde' that defeated Germany in WWII? At least back then they had a proper population advantage..
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Re: Ukraine 2021(?)
This is an example of how an idea progresses.
I tried a slightly different version based on the "Ukraine since 2014" sign Blazoes posted https://i.imgur.com/hh5GiKc.png Rather than use 1,2,3,4 which only ever represented a general idea of the quantity of mines in a hex, not their actual number this just includes a bar scale at the top to indicate density The one issue I have with them is how much of the hex the triangular version occupied So I tried a square version https://i.imgur.com/Gx2CSoB.png I still felt it was too large and it was the word MINES that was making it that way so tried and even more minimalist version https://i.imgur.com/KgUnOUj.png and that lead to this which is even smaller https://i.imgur.com/d2J2VuK.png which lead back to a yellow alternative https://i.imgur.com/9gNT9cS.png .........and that lead back to an alternate yellow triangle which brings us back to size https://i.imgur.com/G4AIOOR.png Then we get to three versions of full minimalist https://i.imgur.com/BmCfuiZ.png But with full minimalist the word MINES can be added back https://i.imgur.com/pyJYsN8.png and yet another..... it works for summer and winter which means it will work for desert too https://i.imgur.com/o31J7wQ.png AND FINALLY............. A revised version on the right, of the first one with the first attempt on the left https://i.imgur.com/t51AeVc.png it's a bit smaller than the sixth one....a couple of pixels makes a big difference sometimes at this scale ...and in red https://i.imgur.com/ERrHHi7.png Feedback welcome |
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