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Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
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Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
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Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
Want something really nasty? Try a f9d9w9 helhiem, sure your scales a really poor but with f9w9 killing everything and d9 wearing out SCs/Thugs/Niefels ect even 4 of then can conquer lvl 7 indies without loses.
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Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
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If you add explicit counters/spells against blessed/holy units, you'll see a disturbing trend: people will either use bless9, or no bless at all. Because mildly strong bless will just invite hard counters. You could refine these explicit counters by making them proportionally strong depending on bless effect strenght, but I still don't like the idea. I'd prefer counters come naturally, or prerably - bless is switched on when pretender arrives, but I already said I like it. About bless dispel: it would be a 'who-has-more-priests' fight. It would look very silly. |
Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
About adjusting the game (IF heavy blesses are proven unbalanced even in long games on big maps -IMO a good awaken SC taking provinces since turn 2, a rainbow mage able to complete the nation ability to find/use all gems, an imprisoned pretender with very good scales, may all qualify for an equal long term utility-) another idea : in most cases heavy blesses are only problematic with uber units. Nobody had a problem with a bless strat using subpar cheap units like sacred serpents of C'tis or flagellants, nor with a capital only, slow and ressource heavy unit like heart companions.
So... Why not giving a different holy cost to some units ? If a van is proven 3 times more useful than most sacred units, just give him a holy cost of 3. Then rushes with the best sacred would become impossible (as even with dominion 10 you can recruit only 3 sacred / turn before making a second castle or 10 temples), but an heavy blesses strat stay possible, to give some interessant capacities to weak/ressource heavy sacred (and eventually try a rush strat with them... with good chances of failure) or for mid/long term (if you can spend 3x more time making an army of uber sacred, or if you have access to sacred summons not restricted by dominion). |
Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
I really like the idea of holy cost, even better then switching bless on when pretender arrives.
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Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
I'd dislike having bless only when the pretender arrives as it would essentially make Awakening functions useless. But variable Holy costs would be good.
Or then tweaking the uber units themselves like Vans. They'd own even if blesses were toned down because Glamour is amazingly powerful. |
Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
I like variable Holy costs as well.
From my standpoint, I'm still experimenting before deciding what is and isn't useless. I do know that heavy bless strategies have been decidedly effective, much moreso than my rainbow mage or beautiful scales strategy. I haven't tried an Awake SC/rainbow Pretender strategy (and wouldn't go with an Awake blessing strategy) but my sense is that they just wouldn't be as effective as leaving the Pretender out of it for the 24 or so turns and getting the 150 points. After all, breaking down the math, a rainbow mage will only get about 12 searches, probably more like 10 depending on map layout, before the dormant gods awake. Even on a high settings map, that's not going to mean a huge gem income difference. A SC pretender might grab a few provinces at indy setting 5, but I'm again not sure that they're worth passing up on the scales or having an army of super-blesses that will be more effective than he will come the mid-game. I don't know. My concern is that I'd probably take bless strats about 90% of the time from my current experience and I'd probably take Dormant/Imprisoned about 95% of the time. To me, those ratios are too high. |
Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
I'm not uber enough to tell whether Hellheim is "overpowered"; they're extreme easy to use, it's true.
However, as capital only, the number of sacred troops you can produce as part of your army starts to get smaller and smaller in proportion to the number of troops in your empire as the game progresses - and they have to come from your capital to the front lines. Also, many bless nations have some fairly junky magic skills. Hellheim has a hard time researching now that sages have all but disappeared. This doesn't mean, though, you can't rush a human player and have completley conquered him in less than 10 turns, which rather sucks for the receiving player. EA nations are generally much more powerful than their LA counterparts and other nations can use things like Body Etherial ect to improve their own Sacred troops, as well as have (probably) a much more robust research base. But i'd agree with the observation that Hellheim is one of the - if not the - most powerful EA nation w/re to it's national troops. |
Re: High Bless rush strategy :(
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This, combined, is why I think Helheim is so good for a bless - they have two great sacred units, and one of them can be recruited en masse. |
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