Re: The Great Northern War
 

I fear that I won't be able to play between friday 15h GMT and sunday 18h GMT. Is it possible to wait for me?

Re: The Great Northern War
 

Ok, I'll reset the timer tomorrow, that should buy you enough time. Unless it's hosting tomorrow instead of today, anyway.

Re: Back on shinuyama
 

Ouch.

Another of those battles I could do without. Thankfully, the losses are mainly maenads and militia...

Another question for you though, who put that crazy amount of PD everywhere ?

Re: Back on shinuyama
 

I'll bleed you out, Pangea. If you want to negotiate a truce, pm me.

Crazy PD? Me?

The Great Northern War comes to a middle
 

Oh, Caelum, you fools. After giving you a second chance at survival, this is the payment I receive in return? I don't know what Ulm has promised you. I don't know how you intend to escape from Ulm's suffocating grasp when I am gone, or perhaps Ulm has agreed that they would destroy you last? But it doesn't matter. I gave you a chance for peace. I went out of my way to try to establish friendly relations with you. But you were never a friend; you only wanted a few turns to rebuild so you could drag both of our empires into the abyss.

What do you hope to gain, Caelum? Territory? Do you think I can't defend against you because I'm off fighting Ulm? Do you think that because I spared you the first time, I would spare you again?

You are wrong, Caelum, utterly wrong. I declare unending holy crusade against you, Caelum. All the forces of heaven itself hereby declare war on you. Your people may have been created in the images of angels, but they have fallen further than the lowliest markata; they are more contemptible than the basest bakemono. Marignon's days may be numbered, but we still have strength enough to fight you. From my demise you shall win nothing.

To Ulm, I apologise that I will not have the chance to spill much more of your blood. You deserved a better fight. Thank you for that golem, though! Trading a grand master and a couple of pearls for all those goodies was well worth it.

To the uncivilised nations of the south, may you settle your disputes as quickly as you can, lest Ulm come to dominate the world.

Re: The Great Northern War comes to a middle
 

You know, Marignon, I don't think it was you that gave Caelum a second chance of survival; if I had just sat on the border after ridding Primea of the Scourge of the Vans, I somehow doubt you would've offered Caelum peace out of the goodness of your heart.

I was excited about the golem at first, but in retrospect maybe not my best option for raiding an astral power.

As soon as this war is over and I have plenty of Pearls to spare I'm dispelling Shinuyama's global. It doesn't impact me much, but for the good of Primea, it needs to be done. It's frustrating our trading partners in the south, and irritating basically everyone.

Re: The Great Northern War comes to a middle
 

You're absolutely right, of course. Though in retrospect, I shouldn't have offered them a truce at all.

In any case, I don't know what they expect to gain from Round Two. Sure, you saved them in a way, but now they'll be trapped as an enclave of Greater Ulm. What are they going to do, wait for an opportune moment to backstab you?

I must have stared at that golem and went flipping through the manual for maybe thirty minutes before hitting on that solution.

Re: The Great Northern War comes to a middle
 

You're Barbarian nation has definitely no idea of diplomacy. You erased you're first neighbor without any dialog, then you attack me in the same way, and now that Ulm is attacking you i'am supposed to consider you as an ally ?

Go on distract me you're heretic.

What's fun is that you were hoping me to attack Ulm, so you'll probably ask him then for a non aggression pact, as you did to me. Thinking that an entire nation can be bought with a couple of gold coin, how arrogant !

Caelum is a nation which has true words, and as i said to you, we were agreed for stopping the war for the next few month.

Concerning the future, just think of yours.

Re: The Great Northern War comes to a middle
 

I'm happy. See the graph for details...

Re: The Great Northern War comes to a middle
 

... what? Eriu attacked me. And then you attacked me. I never wanted either war. I did not start either war. In both cases I was invaded the very turn after our borders touched. What dialog were you expecting? Neither of you said anything.

As for considering me an ally, no, you shouldn't do that. (In a game where only one can win, how could you?) But I would have been a useful tool for escaping from the dead end you will soon find yourself in.

I wouldn't have done that, and even if I had, Ulm wouldn't have given it. If Ulm wanted peace with Marignon and war with Caelum, they could have had it from the beginning by attacking you.

Arrogant? Alas, you have me there. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif (Also, to be fair, it was more than just a couple of gold coins!)

Indeed, you have broken no agreement. Let it not be said otherwise.

I already know I have none. And now neither do you.

(By the way, don't take any of this personally, and don't take any of it seriously. I'm actually having a grand time. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif)

Extension
 

The internet in my apartment is dead =(, and won't be restored until Wednesday. I'd like to ask for a turn extension until then.

Re: Extension
 

Alright, I'll reset the timer in a few hours.

Re: Extension
 

I'm back! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
@Ich: thanks again, I should be able to play the next turn.

Re: Extension
 

Don't you go and change my orders for this turn! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Re: Extension
 

Did I really change your orders? I made it by mistake when I looked at my turn. If that's the case, please change them back.

Re: Extension
 

Yeah, you cleared them when you connected. Please do not connect again unless you get the email message from the server.

The Promised Land
 

Tomaso del Monferrada stood outside Baldr's Gate and peered down the road that wove through the forests of Eriu towards the Marignon plain to the southwest. By now, he knew, the hordes of Ulm would be occupying Marignon City, and that it was only a matter of time before they would be marching up that road, slowly but unstoppably. Perhaps our exodus is not yet ended, Tomaso thought to himself, and turned to the east where the sun was just rising, hanging cold above the lands of the Caelians. Fighting the Caelians was bad enough before, but now the very grip of winter follows them into battle. Tomaso was reluctant to lead another mortal army into that frozen hell, but what choice was left?

It was true that for every province lost to the dragon god and his host, the angels of Heaven would liberate three, but Garcimor's army yet remained, and Tomaso's ragged army could do little about it.

"Father Tomaso! Father Tomaso!" yelled a messenger as he hurriedly approached the prophet. Tomaso's heart sunk. What had happened now?

The messenger reached Tomaso and fell to his knees panting, holding up a parchment. "Great news, sir," the messenger choked out between breaths.

Tomaso gingerly accepted the message and broke the seal.

Tomaso dropped the message unfinished. Garcimor has fallen? And not only that, but to a mere provincial garrison? Tomaso took a moment to recover. "Is this... is this true?" he hesitantly asked the messenger.

"I saw the beast myself," said the messenger. "It must have been Garcimor. How many other blue dragons can there be?"

Tomaso stared unbelievingly at the messenger, then again at the parchment. Then he started laughing. "Glory be to Heaven, this is a miracle!" Tomaso gleefully shouted to the sky.

Re: The Promised Land
 

My internet is working again, I appreciate everyone's flexibility.

Ulm is currently willing to trade gems of any type for Earth 1:1.

(Also, I could SWEAR House of Just Fires gave more than just one Astral Pearl...)

Re: The Promised Land
 

I have to go away until sunday evening. I just found out, work stuff. I sent in the current turn so it can host another time. Is it too much to wait for me with the next one? The delay would be something like 24 hours.

You do as you please, I won´t have internet so I can´t post anymore until I come back.

Re: The Promised Land
 

Damn, i missed a turn :s

Anyway it's almost over for me. And even if i love that game, it's hard for me to follow you guys, one turn per day is too much for me, i should start another game when i'll have less work ( even if i finished a big one yesterday, but i don't think i can get back one more time, specially with the lateness i have now in research ):s

Just a question for marignon, where did that army came from ? I didn't see it coming ^^
And damn, how is it possible to lose a god on province with few or maybe even no defense ? :/

Re: The Promised Land
 

I'm fine with waiting for Ylvali, everyone waited for me, after all.

Having seen that battle where Garcimor died, I would say a big part of it had to do with being in high hostile dominion; he only had like 30 hps in Dragon Form.

Re: The Promised Land
 

Sounds like I'll just have to reset the game timer once, then.

Holy_bricklayer, we've been on a 48 hours timer from the start, not 24 hours. That's up to two days per turn, not one. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif Anyway, if you're in a really hopeless position then feel free to set yourself to AI. Hope you had fun in this game.

Re: The Promised Land
 

Usually it isn't. Unless you got particularly unlucky on a morale roll or didn't see a thug or SC on the other side (I doubt that...).

Re: The Promised Land
 

The one in Pholothras, now standing around in Alman? They were inside the fort biding their time. I wanted to break the siege many turns ago but I was worried that the dragon and his army would move back to help the siege along.

As for the god, as ComTrav said it was the hostile dominion that did you in -- I had 8 or 9 candles in that province, which translated into an 80% hitpoint reduction for your god. Also both the dragon and your army stayed back, allowing my crossbowmen a dozen or so turns to fire on you unmolested. Apart from that there were no tricks -- I had no troops or commanders there, only a provincial defence of 20.

By the way, how do you like those angels? Though your surprisingly massive PD got my harbinger this turn. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Re: The Promised Land
 

Going to add nature gems to the list of gems I want.

So the Forge of Ulm (TM) are now in need of Earth and Nature gems. We will trade gems of any other type for Earth/Nature. We'll also take these as payment in kind for other gems for any forging. (And I can forge almost every path except blood, though I only have air-1 and my numbers of forgers in certain areas may be limited...incidentally, will also consider trading for air boosters)

As to Marignon, I'll catch Tomaso sooner or later. I'm still a little surprised you decided to put all your effort into attacking Caelum rather than stand and defend your capital. Your angels are rather impressive, but I remind you you are not the only one in Primea capable of outfitting (or countering) Thugs.

Finally, it's good to see that Pan has lifted Shinuyama's siege on the castle on our borders.

Anyone have news of the Atlantis/Agartha conflict? Agartha seems to have taken back some territory in the past few turns.

Re: The Promised Land
 

You're in luck. Eriu has a bunch. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

I'm sure you will. I have nowhere to run, after all. My goal at this point is to grab as much territory as I can and then set it on fire. (Though I haven't been fully effective at that; if I was thinking straight, I would have dismantled my forts as you approached them. It only takes you a turn to crack them open, anyway.)

After the battles at Solian, my capital became indefensible. Even without the eastern distraction, I probably would have lost it at least temporarily. (I'm surprised you assaulted my other fortress first, by the way; I was expecting you to go straight for the capital.)

In any case, I had basically three choices: attack you and ignore Caelum, attack Caelum and ignore you, and attack both of you. For the first, if I was really lucky I might have been able to fight you to a standstill... until the resurgent Caelum destroys me. The third would almost certainly lead to defeat in detail to no effect. That left the second option, which also leads to my destruction but it also drags one of you down with me. If there was a route to victory that I overlooked I'd sure like to hear about it.

I assure you, I am fully aware of your capabilities. (Also, due to the loss of gem income, I am no longer particularly capable of outfitting thugs. I don't suppose you could port in another one of those golem gift packages? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif )

Atlantis took one of Agartha's forts a couple turns back, and is now sieging the capital.

Re: The Promised Land
 

After Solian you still had two decent-sized armies, and sieging one of your fortresses kept you from combining them. Mainly, though, I expected you to fight more for your capital. Although now I have plenty of fire gems for fire fend.

You could probably hold out for more than a turn with your massive force of barbarians, but then they wouldn't be able to continue looting and pillaging the countryside. (Which I assume is why you built so many). At least I won't need to work too hard to change the scales in your territory (Vanheim's turmoil/sloth/cold was pretty frustrating, although I didn't mind the Drain so much).

Re: The Promised Land
 

- Haaz! dem gozzipping buggerz can nae proof notting!

Re: The Promised Land
 

The reason is much more sad than that. Namely, that Caelum keeps thunderstriking my heavy infantry and cavalry dead, and storming my crossbowmen useless... and that's pretty much the entire Marignon roster. I've been training flagellants -- unblessed flagellants -- and barbarians. ... I hate fighting Caelum. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

(And, of course, those are exactly the worst possible units to use against blade winding Ulm.)

If I understand rightly, you don't gain any bonus from positive scales in hostile dominion. But yes, apart from the heat I didn't take any bad scales.

Above the waterline, here the Heavens shine directly upon the world, knowing all, revealing all with its holy light. On the land there can be no secrets!

Re: The Promised Land
 

Oh Pangea and Bandar Log, why are you harrassing me like that! Pangea is bleeding to death and Bandar will face the same fate after we strangeld the Pans. All you achieve is to dig the grave for all three of us.

Re: The Promised Land
 

You are correct, I don't get a bonus from your positive scales, but since you don't have negative scales, I don't get a penalty. (And, when I get around to spreading my dominion, I won't have to work hard to change scales).

Promised land ?
 

"Shinuyama should not go on with that harmless banter. You had in hands one of the main powers in the world, and couldn't beat any of us in a much too long war.

I must add that I didn't get more than 200 gold / month worth reinforcements for 20 month now (maybe even more), and still for those months you failed to beat me. You turned (unlike your predecessor) your attention to me, and let bandar log take your territory, and build an army so strong that he doesn't need me anymore to beat you.

Bleed me out ? Let me laugh. I'd already dead, left behind in research, left behind in magic, left behind in income, and only through sheer skills and willpower did I manage to survive for so long. There was nothing to bleed in the swamp that make my land to begin with. I accepted the fact that I'm going to be crushed as soon as this war is over about 20 turns ago, as I started it ! I even know the name of my future killers, for there is but 3 neighbours left to me now.

You, however, should do the same and start accepting the reality of your situation. I will remind you that you had half of your loss against my army, the other half against bandar log (which had at the start of this war the smallest military of all nations). You, my opponent, have been fighting a losing war for ages and after all that time, you still somehow fail to see it.

This may be a bit too much information to say, but, my dear opponent, I have to tell you this. You have been fighting against me, neither of us has an advantage on the battleground, and the weapons given to us where :
- 3 times more gold and gem income for you,
- my beloved maenads.

I look forward to even more wailing on your part. Go on ranting about my bleeding ! For I am a master of blood magic and not afraid of a few drinks ! Especially when my opponent doesn't realize that the blood he sees is his own. I'm just sad that I'll be thirsty soon..."
Lady lover, God of Pangaea.

Re: Promised land ?
 

i can't believe you can anything out of those maenads, even in SP they just die for me...if I ever play ma Pan in mp, I'm so rocking order/prod for those centaurs, satyr hoplites and heavily armored minotaurs. (I like the minotaurs for some reason). All with recuperation...nothing makes me more sad than to look at some of my veteran troops, some with me since the beginning, with 4 XP, but blind, crippled, and diseased. Even Erkeborn, the Prophet of Makita, the God of Ulm, will unfortunately succumb to disease soon, after a series of legendary campaigns, including crushing the feared Vans and the enormous battles of the Solian.

(Also, has anyone noticed Shinuyama's research has STOPPED the past two turns? Did a Lab burn down, has he decided he's "done" with research, or has every bakemono sorcerer needed for the campaign?)

Re: Promised land ?
 

I use meneads all the time. They die, yes. They die INSTEAD of your other troops, mages, thugs etc. In when MP your opponents rain evocations over you it is often cruical to have disposable chaff to lure the damage away from your other troops. Also meneads don´t rout easily so they are great combined with panic and fear spells in early to mid game. In late game when you combine them with army of gold, mass regeneration and stuff they are actually awesome armies to overwhelm your foes. Dont underestimate them.

Re: Promised land ?
 

My use of them is exactly as Ylvali said.

I'd rather build 10 centaurs and have 20 maenads die than building 15 centaurs and losing 5 centaurs every fight.

Re: Promised land ?
 

My bakemonos take more joy in torturing you to death than simply crush you. That's the way of the Bakemonos...

Re: Promised land ?
 

Well, it's over for me, thanks for playing everyone, i learned a lot on that game.

Specially about diplomacy, i just can't believe that ulm was so honest.
How could he be the first one and fair ? ^^

I should attack you in the first round i think, but more the game advance, the more you were a strong and honest ally. Maybe i should wait more to attack again marignon, so both of you have been weaker.
But anyway i didn't plan a real good strategy, too short, i never play so far even against the computer ^^

Again thanks everyone see ya in other lands http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif

Re: Promised land ?
 

Farewell, Holy bricklayer, and good luck in future games.

I admit, I was worried you would attack me when we first ran into each other. Mammoths are not fun for MA Ulm, and there's definitely some posters on this forum that insist MA Ulm MUST take a size 6 SC pretender. But you still had Vanheim waiting to bless rush SOMEONE, and an aggressive Marignon on your border.

Re: Promised land ?
 

So far from the deeps of Atlantis, both in distance and culture. The caelinan people were all but unknown to the deep kings. Still the news of their demise cause tears amongst the sensitive atlantians. Forever lost the chance to befriend such a wild and free species.

The humans are like grasshoppers. Ever****ing rabbits, multiplying and crushing the old races beneath them. It is a bitter irony that we and the agarthans shall serve their cause by fighting each other.

Request for a brief pause
 

I have played my current turn, but would like a delay on the next turn until at least Sunday, as I will be out of town.

Re: Request for a brief pause
 

I don't think ComTrav would really need the extra time, but I am resetting the timer now.

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

Thanks, Ich, I've played my turns.

And AI Caelum has besieged Marignon's largest army with ten Holburg militia! Surely they mean to reclaim the capital. The Great Northern War continues. (It's fortunate that the AI tries to break sieges, as over a hundred fliers could hold up a fort extremely well.) I can't believe your pikeman downed my Bane Lord. Maybe Marble Armor was a better choice than Ethereal Robe.

Meanwhile, the Atlantis/Agartha war seems to be drawing to a decisive close.

The Forges of Ulm (TM) are now interested in nature gems, and will trade gems/forging of any other type for them.

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

I would be quite careful about giving Ulm nature gems, I smell tartarians.

No offense meant by that, just dont want them around yet.

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

...why would I need nature gems for Tartarians? (And certainly, research for some people is high enough that they could be running around with Tartarans now, as well.) There are certain nature items that are good for a thug/sc, but there are lots of other, less-impressive options than Tartarans.

Besides, Tartarians are getting nerfed soon anyway, although how much shattered soul will reduce their viability as an endgame tactic isn't clear yet. And we're certainly approaching the 'endgame', with several nations with very high levels of research.

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

I was thinking of gift of health, which combos with tartarians. But if you say it ain´t the plan I appologize.

EDIT: you´d also need nature gems for gift of reason, actually tartarians reqire much more nature than death gems. I thought that was the reason you wanted them.

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

Your point on GoR is well taken, although my dominion's really not strong enough to take full advantage of Gift of Health. (Many, many turns ago I thought about casting it, but I spent my nature gems on other things.) Although, of course, healing afflictions is always nice.

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

What a mess of a battle in Pangea! And I'm glad as hell I took those trolls with me. Why did Pangea rout? I'm not sure I deserve that victory.

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

The 75% hp limit killed me.

That's another "victory" because of a stupidly fixed limit.

Simply the maenads have too much HP and that made me rout. Your god and trolls have enough HP and the fleeing bandits don't seem to count since they don't die, so you didn't rout. Despite my thugs just starting to get to kill your trolls and mages. I know another thing that I shouldn't have done : I should have made those thugs berserk. This way I would have taken much more of your troops. Well, it's a newbie game, I'm here to learn...

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

I don't know how I won this one. I must remember to use centaur archers to attack regular troops more often.

But the good comes here : Beer gut, the God of Shinuyama, the caster of Wrath of God passed away, along with his prophet and the army that took Pangaea last month. That's what happens when you retreat into allied territory.

Re: Create your pretenders then
 

Oh-oh... don't want to see that battle..

Ugh. No. It's ok I lost that one. I wanted to force the decision. I havn't had enough regular troops, one or two imprecise lava bursts, weird scripting (as always) and some laziness summed up to that loss.