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Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
It isn't hard to pat each other on the shoulders here and say that we're all big pals and great guys, and everything is wonderful. That's not only quite easy, but also very reassuring and condescending. Lots of room for doing so, too. But I don't really see why that would be needed.
Newbies, yes, those will receive a lot of good will and encouragement. Unless they come here with a bad attitude. But apart from a few examples of know-alls, that started on the wrong foot, most people come here with questions, or they say "I want to do X", or "I have made X, here it is". Quote:
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There's lots of obvious applications that come to mind, and I'm not the only one who can come up with "Wouldn't it be nice if..." / "Wouldn't ... be cool?", but as long as there's no indication that it isn't more than a fantasy, claiming credit for those things seem preposterous, even though the achiever in question could honor it out of his good will, of course. If somebody gives even a half-assed attempt at realizing the ideas that he brought forward, this would become a better world. It could entice others to try and make something similar, or do better, to enhance that effort in some areas, or to pick up where that person stopped later. That's what leads to progress. Quote:
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Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
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As an example, I fill a productive role here. I am far less likely to catch that one good idea (a mythical beast) which is better than any ideas I personally have (or I wouldn't work on it, obviously) if it comes from the source of 99 previous useless ideas. Bottom line is coming up with ideas (even good, well thought out ones) is much, much easier than actually realising them. I know people don't want to hear that, but it's true. On top of that the people who are actually productive seem to have /better/ ideas in the first place, since they actually know what can be done. If I'm out of ideas for mods I know who I'll ask first - they're all modders. |
Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
I really don't see your point(s).
Yes, actually modding things in is more productive and harder to do than just having ideas. So? There is no need for being productive here, everything said or done on this forum is just for fun (or at least it should be). If someone steps up to do anything that he or someone else proposed that's nice, but in no way compulsory. Neither is it neccessary to know what cannot be done (besides that's a relative term). If the thread somehow annoys you just don't read it (and I don't buy it that the 99 unimplementable ideas hinder you implementing a good one, when you make pretty clear that you wouldn't dare think of ever doing something that came up on threads like this). If it is against forum rules the mods can close it. Problem solved. Besides I don't view all of these ideas as just some hints about what should be implemented into dom. They might start a train of thought going somewhere else, or show preferences, point out problems, etc (which might be useful if someone else would be making his own game). And yes, even in that context 99% are useless - but then, it's everyone's own decision if he tries to make something out of it. |
Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
Yeah Im not sure either.
Its not as if slowing the idea threads would increase modding. Maybe its commentary on the quality of the ideas being posted? Or how they are posted (daybream, discussion, request, wishlist, whine)? I would consider CBM to be the top example of a popular mod that sprung from requests and has been fueled by discussion of desired improvements in the game. Or maybe no_indie maps. Llamaserver? The various save-game utilities? Im guessing that something like MegaGame (all nations in one game) is an example of one that got done but not the right way? Or SemiRand? |
Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
I'm not complaining about this thread. If people want to talk about this stuff they're welcome of course. The only time it's irritating is when it comes up in threads where it probably shouldn't (such as in many mod threads) or it is coupled with this whole "someone else should do this" "my job is to provide the ideas" attitude. Having been at this forum a couple of years, I've gotten a little tired of people posting about things they want in the game and how someone should add them, then not listening when they are told how easy it would be for them to add them, or contribute something useful.
Obviously when I say 'productive' I mean I contribute something to this community, for fun, which lengthens the lifespan of the game and leads to more people having fun with it. It's not work, I don't need thanks and I don't expect people to do it if they don't find it fun. But I will continue to roll my eyes at people who consistently talk big and do nothing, while asking others to do what they want. The 99 bad ideas have already caused me to stop listening. That's the whole point. I started out trying to help people realise their ideas with mod commands, play options and so on, but after a certain amount of time you learn to recognise when people are just jabbering away about nothing. That's worth criticising, frankly. If everyone did it we would barely have a community. |
Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
It annoys me Gandalf when you say (as you frequently do) that the LlamaServer arose from a community discussion, or from one of your suggestions, because unless my memory has failed me it didn't. It was just an obvious opportunity for useful automation (I could never imagine having the patience of the people who ran PBEM games by hand), and I thought it would be fun to try. You did help me with a command line command for starting new games which has proved quite invaluable (and which I appreciate), but that is different. Sorry to say that, but it annoys me - unlike Sombre I don't really mind people saying a lot of stuff and not doing it, but it is somewhat grating people taking implied credit for ideas they didn't even suggest.
If my memory has failed me of course, which it sometimes does, I apologise. |
Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
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Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
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NI maps were conceptually created by edi who mentiond offhand what setting the poptype too high would do. I shared a couple of map files I'd applied this theory to, because I personally found them enjoyable, not as a response to other people talking pie in the sky. A couple of other guys made scripts to NI any map in response to the map files I'd put out. llamaserver is basically Llama's hard work. Like cbm it probably benefits from tweaks suggested by people who actually know what they're talking about. I assume llama ignores people who make silly requests and describe fantasyland ideal utilities. SemiRand I'm not very familiar with, but I'd say once again it didn't benefit from half baked ideas with no grounding in what's possible. Frankly I think you're just being ridiculous with those examples. None of them were born from the kind of useless brainstorming I'm talking about. You act as if I'm saying there can be no ideas from discussion, no tweaks suggested by users of mods and utilities, no response to a perceived want or need of the community. |
Re: Some thoughts on improvements to the game
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