Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I was asked to make sure no one staled during the Holidays....

I apologize but I let you all down and 2 people staled because I said it would not host until Jan 2ND.

I know there are people at war and I know this may not be fair to everyone but I am rolling the turn back as of 7:19 CST US time ( I 'Think' that's about 12:20 GMT).

I have included the directions from llamaserver on how to do it and what not to do...

Any comments should be directed at me as I am soley to blame as I had /have relatives in town and have had a winter storm and computer access was unavailable for a short time.

Not am excuse...just an explanation, sorry folks:

(Read this next bit carefully. I seem to be having difficulties explaining it coherently:

Note that once the game is rolled back, it will appear that the game is waiting for 2h files from all players. However, the 2h files from last time the turn was played will in fact be there, and will be used if the game hosts without them being overwritten. This can be useful; often, a game is rehosted in order for only one or two players to retake their turns, while everyone else is expected to make no changes. The game admin can therefore wait till just those players have submitted, and then force hosting. None of the other players will stale (assuming they actually submitted a 2h file last time the turn was played).

I hope all that makes sense!

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

No problem for me, and I am in contact with one player who staled, and at war with the other :)

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Now, I have a question on this turn back...

I am not sure if it means this...Say you don't see the turn has been rolled back (no one has submitted a turn yet) and you go ahead and overwrite the files but don't send it in.

Will you automatically have the previous turn sent in when it force hosts?

OR, do you have to do something because you have overwritten the files but didn't send them in?

Anyone experienced with this as I certainly am not):confused:

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I'm unsure what you mean by "Will you automatically have the previous turn sent in when it force hosts?"
Turns are sent in by email. The llamaserver does not know what you've done on your home computer, unless you email the 2h file. It cannot make you send in a turn.

The only weirdness I know of is that if you have played the new turn before it gets rolled back, you may need to delete the 2h file since it doesn't match the new turn information. Try this if dominions starts crashing when you open the turn.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

So I can't just 'overwrite' the new turn with the rolled back turn I just received and mail it in?

Brcause like an idiot I just went ahead and overwrote the turn without paying attention (I am in 4 games) and then started freaking..

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Without looking at my turn I will say that I won't be redoing my turn. The last time this happened, I did not redo the turn, nor did I send in the same turn again. I did nothing. It worked. Please only the two nations who staled (I'm not even sure who they were, was Caelum one?) send in turns. The rest of us should do nothing. Let's hear from anyone who disagrees on this point.

GB - I think if you just delete your new 2h file and retrieve the old one from your sent emails you should be fine.:)

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

You can overwrite the new turn with the rolled back one.

Assuming you're not one of the 2 who staled, there's no need to. Or are you saying you sent in orders for the new turn that was then rolled back? If so, then you can and should send in another 2h file for turn 27. It's simplest to use the one you sent before if your email program saved a copy. If not you can just overwrite the trn file for 28 with the rolled back trn file for 27 and try to duplicate your old turn. You may need to delete the 2h file first.

Did that make any sense?

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

OK, I looked at the new turn...I then got the rolled back turn overwrote the new turn. I haven't sent in anything so am I ok or do I need to redo the turn and send it in...

I guess what people don't understand is ...Do we need to do anything? I mean do we need to send in the same turn or just let it go when it hosts and it will pick up the old turn.

And then there is someone like me that loaded the new turn and then the rolled back turn...do I need to redo the turn or will it pick up the rolled back turn IF I didn't send in the new turn.

IF I/someone would need to delete the old 2h file do we just go in the turn file and delete it and then redo the old turn which would put a new 2h file in the folder.

Thanks for taking the time to help us J:up:eff

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

You don't need to do anything. The last 2h file you sent to the llamaserver will be used.

Except, of course, for the 2 who staled.

Or if you sent in the new turn before it was rolled back. Then you need to send the old 2h file back in, or play the rolled back turn and send a 2h file for that.

Don't worry about deleting the 2h file unless dominions crashes when we finally get a new turn. If it does, just delete the old 2h file and then play the new turn as normal.

The llamaserver knows nothing about what you've done, just what you've sent in. And your local dominions only knows what's in the trn file from the llamaserver and what it's written to the 2h. The only problem is when they don't match.

What I believe happens there is that dominions stores the turn number in both the trn and 2h files. If you have a 2h file for a different turn it just gets deleted. If you have one from the same turn it gives you the "continue or redo" option. If they are the same turn number, but the turn was rolled back it gets confused. Maybe there are orders for dead commanders or new recruits have different id numbers, whatever. Something has changed and it can't make sense of it. I don't know if this always happens in this situation or not.
You might even get to the Continue or Redo prompt and be able to pick Redo, I can't remember when it crashed.
If that confused you, ignore it unless dominions crashes when we get a new turn.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I staled because I was abroad and for some reason llama decided to host. But I think I can send in the turn still due to the rollback? No real trouble if I can't we'll just continue from there. :)

I hope everybody had a nice christmas!

EDIT: Apparently I did stale twice as the game tells me that I did not turn in a 2h file.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Welcome back Y. Hope you had a merry Xmas yourself. :)

Who was the other stale btw? Ulm & Niefelheim are the only two who have resubmitted turns, but I don't think it was either of them.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Currently llamaserver is not showing a recent stale by Caelum so I think the rollback will keep you current.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I think Nifleheims turn is in, I hadn't updated to the newer turn when I saw that it had staled, so I merely resent in my own turn that time, should work, no? Llamaserver gave me the OK.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I'm confused. You had troops moving. Are you saying you were the other stale?

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

No, for the rerolled turn. I had seen the rerolled turn and resubmitted that turn file before reading the forums and also before getting the new turn file for the turn we didnt do (due to the reroll) so im still good, right? since I never changed turn files?

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Yes he was the other stale...

He mentioned that he saw the turn bit before he could load it he saw the roll back that I caught.

He insists that he only loaded the rollback turn and if thats the case (as thejeff) thinks, then there is no reason to wait and to go ahead and force host.

The only other (public) potential problem is ME...

I loaded the other turn but never turned it in, thejeff says that also is ok as it will oNLY pick up stuff that was turned in.

soooooooooooo, If the 2 that turned their turn in, DIDN'T turn in the new turn and then tried to turn in the rolled back turn we should be OK.

Guess we will know soon.

Should we force host NOW and see if its screwed up we can get it fixed?:doh:

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Yeah, my understanding is you should be fine.

I get that we rolled back because two people staled, but are we waiting til sunday just so they can stale again? Maybe I misunderstood, but I thought Yskonen and Caelum were back a couple of days ago. When he gets his turn in we are only waiting for one more and then force host, right?

I guess what I'm asking is - does that player, whoever he or she is, even realize we're waiting for only two players, and not the whole lot of us?

Or did I get into someone's crazy pills? :crazy:

Happy New Year!

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

ugh yes please, I would hate to stale, ive been submitting my turns within an hour or two of each new turn going out usually.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Maybe I'm not picking this stuff up as well as I thought I was.

Niefelheim (Xanatos) had troops moving, so he could not have been one of the stales, right?

And he should be fine doing nothing or sending the same turn again, right?

GB, you rolled back because you said two people staled, right?

Caelum (Yskonen) was one, right?

I don't suggest force hosting until the two who staled send in turns, but if someone looks at llamaserver only, they might think we're all just waiting to do our turns on sunday, right?

So if you force host now, we will still have two stales, right?

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Yes Calem was one tat staled.

And YES you make sense, It seems he should submit his turn so the game has his records.

Hell, I don't know....PM thejeff, he knows how this thing works better than I do.:eek:

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I've completely lost track of who's done what and who needs to do what.
Who originally staled?

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

This is what I know for SURE...Yskonyn Caelem) Staled.

I 'Thought' I saw a second nation.

I KNOW that there where 2 nations when I realized that Caelem was not back in town and the turn had hosted that has sent in turns.

Niefl and Caelem.

I rolled the turn back.

Niefl says he saw both turns and only sent in the rolled back turn and did NOT send in a turn with the new information.

I have not talked to the other team so have no idea what he has or hasn't done.

I (Arco) did load the new turn and complete it but had something to do so didn't send it in and when I came back the new turn had hosted and we had the stales. SO, I also did not send in any NEW information to llamaserver.

That's what I KNOW for certain.

ANYBODY with any other info please copy this and paste it along with your info (NOT SUPPOSITION) that you know to be true so thejeff can get a handle on it and we can move forward.

Thanks:up:

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

If you want to see who has staled on Llamaserver, then you just need to check that option under the admin options.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

But not once you've rolled back. You can only see who staled in the previous turn. Since the current turn hasn't run, you can't tell who staled when it did run.
(This is like time travel, the worst problem is the tenses.)

I'd say at this point, Caelum is the only one we know needs to submit a turn. If there is someone else who staled originally, they have until Caelum plays to either get their turn in or speak up. Once Caelum is in, force host it.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

aye i never staled ..yet - nifle

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Alright, I'm officially confused...


For what it might be worth, here are my details:

I sent in turn 27 for the original turn.

I received a message that that .2h had been received by the server.

I next received a message that turn 28 had begun.

Before I had gotten around to overwriting my .2h with the new one, I received the email that the turn was rolled back to 27.

I then simply sent the EXACT SAME .2h that I had sent originally.


Hope this helps...

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Hi guys, it has been stormy over here I see. :) That's what happens when daddy leaves I guess. ;) :D

Anyway we're at turn 27, and I was the only one who staled so it seems. Weird, because my turn has been sent in anyway. I forces hosting so we'll continue from here with turn 28, which many should already have on standby, right?

I hope everyone had a nice x-mas and a great newyear?? All the best wishes to everyone and their close ones! :up:

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I'm confused as well - I seem to have the same turn, including all my previous moves (was given the continue option) when I had already replaced teh turn file with the new one. I suppose this means I staled, but it also told me no stale message.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I think it staled me.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

You didn't stale. You didn't get a stale turn message. The llamaserver doesn't show you as staling. My scouts saw your troops attacking.

What probably happened is that you'd saved some orders under the old turn, before the rollback, so you had a valid 2h file. When you opened the new turn, those orders were for the correct turn and still made sense so they were loaded.

Ermor and Caelum did stale, though I'm not quite sure how.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

hmm, gnarly. So we rollin back again?

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

ok false alarm - apparently the folder it was saving to had changed, i was saving the turn file in my music folder.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I will not be able to play dominions after january 7th. I will need a replacement substitute. I will post in the appropriate thread to advertise for one.
Sorry.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Maybe someone could tell to Mictlan player that it would be the best for the game and for the other players to put his nation under the IA command. He is about to be eliminated but if we have to wait always till the end of the next turn due it's a waste of time. It's clear that Mictlan is not going to send the turn because he hasn't provinces, troops and anything, only his god (I guess). We can improve the frequency of the turns if players about to be eliminated respect the others and put their nations under the IA before quitting the game.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Mictlan is out. We'll only have to wait on him this turn. After that he'll be gone. The game sends out one last turn, so the player can see his defeat.

It would be nice if he sent the last turn in, but it's only an hour or so at this point.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

i wonder if he could take over for me...?

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Sorry, I saw that llamaserver still expected a turn from me but with no units, no castles, no provinces, I thought an "empty" orders file might create some problems.
But I saw your posts and just sent one. Sorry about that, it's my first MP ending so I didn't know you still had to send a turn after you were defeated.:doh:

To Immaculate : I wonder if it would be ok, from a diplomatic point of view, as I was already in this game before, with allies and ennemies, etc... But if no other "impartial" sub is found, sure, I will do it :)

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Hi. Something very strange has happened to me this turn and I would be interested in knowing if someone else has had similar problems in this turn.

One of my units has mysteriously lost all its magical items (4 items) without any explanation or event that could be related with it. The unit had orders to move one province but now is placed in the same province than the turn before but without the items and they're not in the laboratory either.

Please, all these magical items were very important to me and I want to know if it's possible that something wrong happened with Llamaserver when processing the turn.

BTW, my unit has also lost its research points and its magical paths. WTF???

PD: Yes, something has happened. The name of some of my units has changed mysterously (?????). Please, report if anyone has experimented something similar or strange things (units or armies not moving, not researching, etc.). There're also 2 host messages about a suspicious increase in the income of two nations (it's not the first time I see these messages but what happened to me IS inexplicable).

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Possibly one of your immortals dying, maybe of disease, and coming back feebleminded?

Edit:
Or something did go wrong. I got 2 maenads as commanders. Not sure how that happened, probably some kind of unit ID screw up? Which might explain your renames and mysterious unit.

Not sure what to do about it. We could rollback again, but there's no guarantee that'll work.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

No, it was an unit summoned a turn before. No problems with old age, no message, no event, no explanation.

I will try to explain myself better. I summoned one unit two turns before. In the last turn the unit summoned was available. I gave them a lot of magical items and I ordered to it to move to an adjacent province. So far so god.

In the last turn I gave orders to summon another unit of the same kind. So in this turn I should have two units: yes. Of the same type/kind: yes. But the unit summoned two turns before and with the magical items has disappeared (I don't find the name of the unit and I didn't rename it, I'm sure because I never rename them).

Well, I open the current turn and check the province where my first summoned unit should be. But it's not there. Ummm, what happened?

I check my nation briefing and find the two units summoned in the previous turns. One is the summoned the last turn but the other is not the unit I had previously. Its name has changed and it hasn't magical paths, no research points and no magical items. Nothing. Who has changed the name of my unit and why it has lost all his items and RP and magical paths?

WTF???

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Clearly something has broken and it would be better if we try to rollback again. We can wait what the other player has to say but i'm sure something has broken and could be worse in the next turns.

My magical items were very important, I have spent a lot of gems to forge them and I don't want to lost them without any reasonable explanation.:rolleyes:

Cheers

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I have no problem with Dark Kitty taking sauro's place as long as he agreesthat it is a different nation with different allies and friends and acts accordingly.

Don't want to unbalance the game bu having someone go to war with a Nap mate who has no troops on the border ect.

No Grudges (LoL, no pun intended) carried over.:D

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I agree that a rollback is probably worth trying.

Until we rollback or decide not to, no one else should send their turns in.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Sorry to lose you. Hope all's well with the family. Good game - maybe we'll play again. Good luck. :cool:

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

oK, now we have 2 people that have sent there turns in...

We have our Admin who has to withdraw (he will pick someone to take his place as admin) and Dark kitty may take his nation if everyone feels OK with it..I have no problem with it.

We have this roll back problem that now has perhaps produced a bug and we have people sending in their new turns.

What do we want to do with all this....we need to make a decision and all get on the same page.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I have no objection to Dark Kitty taking over for Immaculate. Our alliance was with Mictlan and the dead god Huehueteotl, not with Helheim. :fight:

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I suppose you're talking about Immaculate, admin of casual ea, not our admin. Unless something's happened to Yskonen?

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

I lost 10 summoned units without explanation. They had already been summoned and were part of a company of 30 under 1 commander. They were part of a larger army sent out to break a siege. Only 20 of them took the field - no reason given.

I also got the message about 2 nations with unexplainable increases in wealth. Let me say now that I don't believe there was any form of cheating, I just want to know if we all got the same messages. Mine said Caelum & Pangaea. If this is a bug, one of them may have gotten your items and my troops. :smash:

I would have liked to keep the good luck event of much needed cash, but fixing the problem is paramount. I support a rollback. I also support GB's call for us to all get on the same page or it won't help. Speak up!

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

Rollbacks require that you redo the next turn from scratch. If you don't, then weirdness happens every single time.

Re: RUNNING: First Newbie game, let's discuss how we proceed here
 

We can use Llamaserver to send an email to all players and inform them that we're rolling back one turn. I prefer to redo the last turn because the current one is a mess.