Originally Posted by DRG (Post 833445)

Don't think so. If they had been in a postion to use it becasue the war was dragging on and there were no allied troops inside Germany borders I don't belive there is any doubt it would have been used there first.

Originally Posted by IronDuke99 (Post 833417)

I hope that RecruitMonty will be happy to see his interesting mod generating discussion and interest on here. I very strongly suspect the more interest and discussion the more people might take a look at and use the mod...

Originally Posted by IronDuke99 (Post 833449)

Agreed, if allied troops were outside Germany.

I don't think captured German scientists had all that much affect on the early A bombs. Germans who left because of Nazi religious and racial policy did though...

Originally Posted by IronDuke99 (Post 833399)

I should perhaps say I am not against this mod in any way (I have even downloaded it). I am just against the idea Hitler could have invaded Britain, or have forced her to make peace.

If I were going to do the -alternative- history I might base it on UK and France calling Hitlers bluff at Munich and the German General Staff removing Hitler at that point - as a good many of them planned, had war broken out in 1938- and then producing what would have been a right wing, but rather more democratic German Government, perhaps even including a return of a Kaiser (but perhaps in a more constitutional form) as many German soldiers desired, and coupled with an end to the vile, evil, and totally stupid, Nazi race laws.

In 1938 Germany, by then including Austria, certainly could have got peace on the removal of Hitler, and the other Nazis, from power.

Germany could continue to expand her military. Britain and France would have done likewise. Czechoslovakia and Poland would continue in the game, as would Great Britain and the Empire, France and Stalin's USSR, the USA, Japan and Italy.

Germany might still want to expand, but without a madman and a group of vile, evil, thugs leading the country and minus the racial/religious genocide and cold blooded deliberate, industrial, murder of millions of men, women and children.

Now on that basis it might make some sort of sense and in a German-Soviet war -without racial/religious genocide or the deliberate killing of civilians and POW's by Germany, Germany might even get allies not just within the USSR but outside it, since prior to 1939 Stalin had killed a lot more civilians than Germany had and the USSR was hardly popular in Western Europe.

What you have to give up on is Germany building a fleet. If she tries to then the British Empire becomes her enemy -because it has to to survive- and Germany cannot win that naval war as 1914-18 and 1939-45 proved beyond any doubt.

Germany, in the 1930's, minus Hitler and the Nazis, can make the British Empire and the USA, more or less, genuinely neutral, in the East, if she either avoids commitments to Japan or gets Japan to also look East and north and not South.

Mind you the USA had a fairly odd commitment to China in those days, that I have never seen much sense in, beyond the awful Japanese atrocities like their vile behaviour in Nanking in 1937.

Still food for thought I hope...

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 833467)

Likely prospects Post War: The Big Four (Junkers, Messerschmidt, Focke-Wulf and Heinkel) are likely to swallow up smaller competitors as the cost of military aircraft gets bigger and bigger with the coming of the Late Jet Age (1950s), then the first airborne computers (late 1950s, early 1960s).

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 833441)

There is no question it would have been used there first if the war had dragged on. Germany was lucky it ended there in May[/color]

Don

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 833483)

Here's some splash screen(s) for the next release:

Originally Posted by FASTBOAT TOUGH (Post 833415)

I'm just a "straight up" baseline game player, though this mod has intrigued me over the years. That being said, does this mod have and build onto the ARADO 234 BLITZ? The 234B-2 being the definitive operational model to see combat before the wars end. it was classified as a single seat reconnaissance bomber and would have been operational around Sep/Oct 1944 with 214 total models built.

Some quick facts: Powerplant: 2 Junkers Jumo 109-004B-1 Orkan (Hurricane) turbojets. Speed: 461mph@19,685ft./438mph@sea level. Armament: 2 Defensive aft firing fuselage mounted 15.1mm MG 151 or 20mm MG151/20 cannons with 250/200 rounds per gun respectively. Offensive bomb load 2,204lbs/3,307lbs with rocket assist "drop" motors. Range: based on previous corresponding bomb loads 1,013 miles/684 miles. It had a high ceiling and was a very advanced plane to include a fully functional pilot ejection seat system. If needed or wanted I have all the rest of the specs as well. It's just you never hear about this one because it wasn't as "exciting" as the Me-163 KOMET (COMET) or the Me-262 SCHWALBE (SWALLOW).

Let me know in the meantime I think I'll check into something elsewhere. ;)

Regards,
Pat
:capt:

It's more fun with Pics:
Attachment 14153 Attachment 14154

Attachment 14155 Attachment 14156

Attachment 14157

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 833483)

Here's some splash screen(s) for the next release:

They go in your DAS_REICH\Game Data\Graphics folder.

LINK to 1.4~ MB ZIP on my server

For those of you who don't feel like downloading a file just to see what it looks like; see attachment to this post.

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 833490)

The problem with this is neither Shrapnel Games nor Camo Workshop are "presenting" this mod in any way other than providing a space for discussions about it in our mods sub forum, so it is both inaccurate and misleading to suggest we are "presenting" it

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 833490)

The problem with this is neither Shrapnel Games nor Camo Workshop are "presenting" this mod in any way other than providing a space for discussions about it in our mods sub forum, so it is both inaccurate and misleading to suggest we are "presenting" it


Don

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 833498)

Then there's the FA 283 an apparent jet powered gyrodyne, which could be used as the basis for a series of German light utility/attack helicopters in the 1960s.

Originally Posted by RecruitMonty (Post 833499)

I had seen that too. What an interesting design. I wonder if it is feasible? It screams attack helicopter. Only problem is it is jet powered and in the mid 1940s that meant high fuel consumption.

Originally Posted by IronDuke99 (Post 833527)

The problem I can see with this, if you will forgive me, is if you allow almost every German Prototype, let alone drawing board idea, to become a real weapons system, then you have to do more or less the same for other nations too, or you are giving the Germans an advantage they never actually had or could have had.

So to do this, with any realism, you also need to look at Allied paper projects or, at least Prototypes, and turn the best of them into real weapons...

Originally Posted by IronDuke99 (Post 833530)

To give an example of what I mean: In a alternate world where Germany is still a very powerful, agressive, nation then projects like the US Sabre F86, Russian Mig 15 and British Hawker Hunter all need to be moved up in time. Germany would never have the field to itself.

Originally Posted by RecruitMonty (Post 833533)

I had a really detailed and good reply to this but my ****ing mouse decided to click on the wrong damn button (one of these Microsoft super mice with too much technology and piss poor interface).

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 833538)

And here's something for when you do the vassal states of Neu Europe: some Hetzer variants I chopped out using the stock SPCAMO icons as a base.

Originally Posted by MarkSheppard (Post 833537)

Monty, I love it when I find surprises.

I was about to suggest the Ka-22 LINK and Ka-34 LINK as an analogue for German heavy rotorcraft; and I was going to build the icon, and while looking for something else, I found an icon you did in 2007 as a Christmas present. :p

Originally Posted by Warhero (Post 833551)

Btw, Pionierpanzer 1 icon is "empty" in battle generator. Can anyone tell me it's number (I can fix it myself w/ Mobhack)? And why Mobhack don't show icons at all (I can't "roll" them and search right icon)?

Warhero

Originally Posted by RecruitMonty (Post 833547)

I guess so. I take it the Atlanteans are luke-warm towards the Reich?

Originally Posted by DRG (Post 833445)

Don't think so. If they had been in a postion to use it becasue the war was dragging on and there were no allied troops inside Germany borders I don't belive there is any doubt it would have been used there first.

Originally Posted by Warhero (Post 833583)

I installed mod just as instructions said. But I got finally that icon converted with "new" icon (2466). Ok it's just summer icon but enough for me;)... I had to make one "trick" to search/find it;).

Warhero

Originally Posted by IronDuke99 (Post 833568)

I have been thinking about this and I wonder if the Western Allies would have used an A Bomb on Nazi Germany all that easily, unless they thought Germany was at all close to developing her own -when they most certainly would have, merely to get in before Hitler used his.

Germany had millions of slave workers, many from western nations, not to mention large numbers of Western Allied POWS, so I think the war has to be going very badly for the Western Allies, and very well for Germany, for an A bomb, or bombs get to be dropped there. Especially since conventional raids on Germany were devarstating city, after city (as they were also doing in Japan). There were not many Atomic bombs available in 1945-46 and no one much wanted to invade Japan...

Originally Posted by RecruitMonty (Post 833587)

It is said they only figured out the dangers posed by radiation much later.