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-   -   Most Usefull Research Path... (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=36105)

AreaOfEffect September 9th, 2008 11:46 AM
Re: Most Usefull Research Path...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epaminondas (Post 637306)
Area,

Could you tell me what SC-assassination spell you are referring to?
Vengeance of the Dead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sector24 (Post 637309)
Mind Hunt I think.
Mind Hunt is evocation. Vengeance is just as good if not better as Mind Hunt backlashes when the enemy has an astral mage present. Besides, Mind Hunt would be useless if you couldn't research Mind Burn or Soul Slay.

Epaminondas September 9th, 2008 11:51 AM
Re: Most Usefull Research Path...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect (Post 637380)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epaminondas (Post 637306)
Area,

Could you tell me what SC-assassination spell you are referring to?
Vengeance of the Dead.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sector24 (Post 637309)
Mind Hunt I think.
Mind Hunt is evocation. Vengeance is just as good if not better as Mind Hunt backlashes when the enemy has an astral mage present. Besides, Mind Hunt would be useless if you couldn't research Mind Burn or Soul Slay.
Hmmm. I thought Vengeance of the Dead won't kill a really high-powered SC, as long as his Endurance holds out...

AreaOfEffect September 9th, 2008 11:59 AM
Re: Most Usefull Research Path...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epaminondas (Post 637383)
Hmmm. I thought Vengeance of the Dead won't kill a really high-powered SC, as long as his Endurance holds out...
I've seen a lot of complaints about this spell as it can force a SC to retreat by reaching the 50 turn limit. Retreat from an assassination attempt is always death. Therefore you could somehow kill the SC without putting a scratch on him.

I'm unsure, but I believe that the units killed in the attempt adds to the units encountered in a follow-up casting. The only real defense is high MR, but damn that spell is so cheap to research.

Epaminondas September 9th, 2008 12:02 PM
Re: Most Usefull Research Path...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect (Post 637384)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epaminondas (Post 637383)
Hmmm. I thought Vengeance of the Dead won't kill a really high-powered SC, as long as his Endurance holds out...
I've seen a lot of complaints about this spell as it can force a SC to retreat by reaching the 50 turn limit. Retreat from an assassination attempt is always death. Therefore you could somehow kill the SC without putting a scratch on him.

I'm unsure, but I believe that the units killed in the attempt adds to the units encountered in a follow-up casting. The only real defense is high MR, but damn that spell is so cheap to research.
I see. I will have to mod out the spell then :)

Tifone September 9th, 2008 12:08 PM
Re: Most Usefull Research Path...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect (Post 637384)
I'm unsure, but I believe that the units killed in the attempt adds to the units encountered in a follow-up casting. The only real defense is high MR, but damn that spell is so cheap to research.
Yes they do, I believe it has been deeply discussed around in past threads, as it's quite controversial if this feature of the spell is thematic... :)
The spell itself seems quite balanced in power nonetheless to most people IIRC - a good counter to SCs and a nicely thematic idea. To counter it you surely need high MR on your SCs (and it is necessary anyway), a special care in using SCs where the enemy can spot them, and b*astard Domes when possible ;) -(sorry 4 the OT)

Epaminondas September 9th, 2008 12:12 PM
Re: Most Usefull Research Path...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect (Post 637384)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Epaminondas (Post 637383)
Hmmm. I thought Vengeance of the Dead won't kill a really high-powered SC, as long as his Endurance holds out...
I've seen a lot of complaints about this spell as it can force a SC to retreat by reaching the 50 turn limit. Retreat from an assassination attempt is always death. Therefore you could somehow kill the SC without putting a scratch on him.

I'm unsure, but I believe that the units killed in the attempt adds to the units encountered in a follow-up casting. The only real defense is high MR, but damn that spell is so cheap to research.
Now I recall being puzzled over losing several uber-Niefel Jarls to this spell v. the AI, even though my Jarl was unhurt. Now I know!

chrispedersen September 9th, 2008 03:49 PM
Re: Most Usefull Research Path...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tifone (Post 637392)
Quote:
Originally Posted by AreaOfEffect (Post 637384)
I'm unsure, but I believe that the units killed in the attempt adds to the units encountered in a follow-up casting. The only real defense is high MR, but damn that spell is so cheap to research.
Yes they do, I believe it has been deeply discussed around in past threads, as it's quite controversial if this feature of the spell is thematic... :)
The spell itself seems quite balanced in power nonetheless to most people IIRC - a good counter to SCs and a nicely thematic idea. To counter it you surely need high MR on your SCs (and it is necessary anyway), a special care in using SCs where the enemy can spot them, and b*astard Domes when possible ;) -(sorry 4 the OT)

High MR doesn't actually seem to help. At least, I have lost several SC's with MR's in the 27-28 range. Despite what the spell says.

Agema September 10th, 2008 10:39 AM
Re: Most Usefull Research Path...
 
Assassination spells like Mind Hunt and Vengeance of the Dead will get past MR in the mid-20s rarely, but often enough to make your SCs vulnerable.

The biggest problem with Vengeance of the Dead is that the casting requirements in S/D mean it isn't readily available to many nations.


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