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Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

Yes. The traits/facilities do not prevent events from happening, they just shift the targets around. I am not sure if a system protected by a 100% facility can be hit by a random event or not if there are open systems elsewhere with appropriate targets. But, if all systems have the same level of protection (even 100%), it all evens out and gets you back to the starting chance of each system being hit by an event. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif This does not make your Epic facilities useless, of course. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Edit:
Beat to post, for once. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

[ October 01, 2003, 21:48: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

Quote:

Originally posted by Alneyan:
The event will almost always hit the second system with such an event, but if there were a facility giving -99% chances for an event in this system as well, then the odds would be roughly equal. However, what happens if an event cannot occur in a given system is still unknown. (If it is a Star Destroyed event where there are no stars in thsi system for instance)

Either the system is chosen before the event type (and then, when the event isn't comptabible, the program chooses another event or cancel the event) , or the event type is chosen before the targeted system, meaning a system without ships cannot suffer from a "Ship Moved" event. The second would seem the most likely and the easier to use, but who knows?[/QB]

I belive he stated in that post.

"
Unless, of course, there is no valid target for the event, such as a ship bomb when there are 0 ships in the game. I do not know what happens then; the game either cans the event for that turn or it picks a new event type."

I belive it will be CANED...

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

Quote:

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
Yes. The traits/facilities do not prevent events from happening, they just shift the targets around. I am not sure if a system protected by a 100% facility can be hit by a random event or not if there are open systems elsewhere with appropriate targets. But, if all systems have the same level of protection (even 100%), it all evens out and gets you back to the starting chance of each system being hit by an event. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif This does not make your Epic facilities useless, of course. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Edit:
Beat to post, for once. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

If what you say is true and I do not beleive it is correct, then how is the MM fix really fixed http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Reference
Version History for Space Empires IV
Version 1.66:
8. Fixed - "Lucky" racial trait was not always working.
9. Fixed - Abilities "Change Bad Event Chance - System" and "Change Bad Intelligence
Chance - System" were not always working.

[ October 01, 2003, 21:52: Message edited by: JLS ]

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

Those just mean that the code for that was glitchy and was not always taken into account when selecting a target system. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Go run some tests. I might do the same. But, I must leave now, so bye. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Just make 2 systems, 2 human players. Mod a free facility (no tech, no resources) that does 100% fate shrine ability, increase chance of events, see what happens.

Oh, and if you want to email MM about this, feel free to. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ October 01, 2003, 21:56: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

Quote:

Quote:

Originally posted by Imperator Fyron:
Those just mean that the code for that was glitchy and was not always taken into account when selecting a target system. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif Go run some tests. I might do the same. But, I must leave now, so bye. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Just make 2 systems, 2 human players. Mod a free facility (no tech, no resources) that does 100% fate shrine ability, increase chance of events, see what happens.

Oh, and if you want to email MM about this, feel free to. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

OK, thanks http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Here is some published and recent data in regards to Traits effecting Events; to get your test started with: http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Half of what I believe to be true, I based on this, in regards to the modifying of the the Base setting sum.
Please note the Lucky race: Absolutely no event

PTF's Events tests

=============================
Originally posted by PsychoTechFreak :

Quote:

PsychoTechFreak
First Lieutenant
Member # 1289

posted September 10, 2003 18:15
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Don't forget, I only have listed high/catastrophic events. But probably we get this answered.

Setup:
2 Races (no-AI mod), one race is cursed (+100), the other is lucky (-100)
events chance 100
I modified the events.txt to ONE low event (planet value change +1), bad planet start (settings modified to 0).

After 20 years I can stop already:
Cursed race: 181 events
Lucky race: Absolutely no event

So I guess, MM's fix about event chances has been successful. But I will try some other values lower than +/- 100 with Medium severities.

With High/Catastrophic I might change to 10 planet start to see if the assumption about the master planet comes true. Another reason is the no-ai races can not colonize, so there would be no comparison between homeworlds, masterplanet and colonized worlds.

EDIT:
Changed setup to 1 medium event, same as above but with lucky -50, cursed +50 and swapped player slots (to exclude this).

After 20 years:
Cursed race: 181 events
Lucky race: Absolutely no event

This is not a copy/paste error, the event count has been the same.

Now I have got a High events game running, NO events for both races after 10 years, one on one, 1planet start. I think I could switch over to 10 planet start with a very long run soon (500 years or more).

NO events after 53 years, process time seems to be more than with low/med events. Probably the program tries to bring up an event, but is not allowed to do so?

BTW, Fyron is correct with 100% chance and one event per turn:
There are no events from 2400.0 through 2401.9. If you count the turns/events from 2402.0 through 2420.0 what is it? 181 events, correct.

[ September 10, 2003, 19:46: Message edited by: PsychoTechFreak ]

Quote:

PsychoTechFreak
First Lieutenant
Member # 1289

posted September 10, 2003 20:13
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Interim test for medium events:
Cursed is set to 0 event chance modifier (racial trait)
Lucky is -10

2407.0 Cursed race has got 51 events (one each turn from 2402.0 through 2407.0.

Lucky race is still on zero events. I think about a 3rd race with another event chance modifier for the next test run.
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[ October 01, 2003, 22:39: Message edited by: JLS ]

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

Originally posted by JLS:

Quote:

Correct, the Settings Data File will have the overall BASE numbers at these proposed percentages for all Systems in the Quad.

Low Chance = 10% as was AIC v3.02 settings with many good events added (no harm here)
Medium = 30% up 10% from AIC v3.02
High = Undecided but most likely this will be around 55% Chance
= = =

The AIC v4.0 Default Events file Severity Categories:
Low won�t even have -5 Planet Condition or �20 PV events they moved up to medium events but low also will have many low end good events.

Medium will have (NO) scalding events and many good events. The Rebel, -10 PC etc. and Warp Close are or have been gone. Warp Close/Open and Rebel is now just in High and Cat as it was. -10 PC and -40 PV is out of the game for now.

High will have most the usual AIC 3.02 Events with a few GREAT new good events.

CAT will have most the usual AIC v3.02 Events with 2 Spectacular and new good EVENTS.
- - -

Lets say the Settings file is set for medium 30% and the Human Player choices Medium Event Frequency at the pre-new game settings EVENTS menu.

Therefore, the base is now 30% Chance that an event will be called from the se4 hardcode protocols.

Please note, the Players Can alter this if he/she desire up or down for each system.
By the Epic Facility that if or when be built in that System.

For example the Home System may want the �40% Chance Facility
Where none may be wanted in another established System.
However there WILL be a strong desire to increase the CHANCE for a Friendly roll or that deadly roll for the Random GREAT to Spectacular Event with a +Epic of 20% in that newly Colonized system.

Or the MED 30% base may be to boring at that point in there game for some players and they may desire to increase the Systems chance with a +Epic.

Players in the game may realize that the High setting of 55% was fine and very exciting for 15 Players. But now its down to 7 survivors and they are worried about the increasing frequency of events being dispersed now only over 7 players instead of the full 15 starting Players. I believe they will definitely want the -CBEC and start building the �40 Epics in almost every system, to be sure as the survivors get even fewer and the Event dispersements are handed out to you and a few.
- - - -

Lucky (under another title and will be FREE in AIC) may be desired by a Player and it will represent 50% fewer events, this is good for a Multiplayer game and the Majority want the pre-game Event setting higher then you would like them to be.

Cursed (under another title in AIC) may be desired, if the majorities in a Multiplayer game want the Events LOW and then this will be FREE to you if you want a possibility of increased events for your Character Race.
- - - -

Bottom line, and to resume posted information and to recap my perceived resulted overall Event actions.

If a player starts a game in default LOW 10% or even Medium 30% Frequency Setting as there option it should NEVER be critical for that player build a Heroes Epic Facility or a Faith Shrine as I posted.

Some MODS have Event Percent Chance L=15 - Med =30 and High =45 and that file works very fine at default.

AIC will be 10% higher then that High setting.

= = = =

Quote:

However, the new AIC events file will have MORE good events and less bad events then the past.
- - - -
In regards to the Event modifiers and with respect of the -CBEC Epic this is Identical to the existing FATE Shrine but will be in play by all races

However, others do not want this expanded on. So there will be 3 quick and easy overwrite ZIP file folders for the alternative so that ALL players will have what they want�
A: se4 Classic Events,
B: (new Default AIC good & bad)and
C: my favorite; AIC good and very bad Events. All to include Settings overwrites as well to reflect the appropriate chance settings.

The AI Players WILL be programmed to deal with any Event File option that is listed above, this has been completed and tested at 90% Chance with 8 Players and 2 Ntrls with good results to insure fun and enjoyment for the Human Player.

One issue that we need to really put behind us; is whether se4 will critical error overtime with multiple plus CBEC readings.

[ October 02, 2003, 00:51: Message edited by: JLS ]

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

JLS, http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

I ran a test, here is a log file:

test.txt

I am not convinced that the change bad event chance ability and the traits were ever fixed... again, you should run some tests. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

I have a zwheihander handy (heh) to thwack anyone that wants to complain about using non-default files. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

Thanks Fyron, will do http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I will test at a default setting of Chance 25% Event; not "changed event chance in Settings.txt to 100"% as this MAX and unrealistic setting may counteract with the -CBEC. And with a -30 Fate Shrine as we discussed in the earlier Posts http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
Probaly with a few other AI Players, 1 ntrl and myself for 5 Players in total.
Counting manually and loging the events that Hit me with out the Fate Shrine, and then the count with the default -30% Fate Shrine III.

Any and all may join with this test, but please use all se4 DEFAULT FILES. To include stock se4 events file. Game event freq HIGH and stock -30 Fate Shrine III Facility and about 4 to 6 total players. This will insure all files are of indentical benchmark. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Also note: You will be hit with more frequant events as the other Players die or removed form game. And the added builds of a -30% Fate Shrine may reduce these hits providing there are three or more Races Total. At 2 Races it may hard to count the minus effects of your new Fate Shrine.

= = =

In additon Fyron, do you feel the trait lucky also has not been fixed; by reducing in game overall events?

[ October 02, 2003, 00:46: Message edited by: JLS ]

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

Quote:

Originally posted by Alneyan:
I do like this Veneration tree, the players will know be able to choose between being protected against events (but not having good events), or suffering from these events and having a good event from time to time. I wonder if there will be players that won't build these facilities though. As for the events chances, I would second you on increasing the odds for the High setting. When you pick this setting, you do want events to occur, don't you? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif (And of course, 90 is supposed to mean almost an event each turn, but all these events should not target a single Empire.)

When testing AI Campaigns next release, as the AI Players die and removed from the game the Event frequency to hit the ALIVE players is increased, for example game started with 10 Players there are now 4. With the events, chance set greater then 50% percent I was being hit by events quite frequent. By building the �40% Heroes Epic the Events was reduced significantly� If a MOD is set for Event chance percent to be greater then 30 or 60% depending on MOD, then there will need to be access to -CBEC for ALL Players http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ October 01, 2003, 12:50: Message edited by: JLS ]

Re: AI Campaign => For a Challenging AI opponent

JLS, my question was, would there be players who will NOT build the facilities reducing the chances for events? (Or players who will build the Shrines improving the odds of an event that is) I can see fairly easily why I would like to reduce the events in a given system/all systems, but not the contrary.