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-   -   Babylon 5 Mod (http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/showthread.php?t=4494)

pathfinder January 18th, 2005 10:51 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Quote:
Ragnarok-X said:
Oh, while im at it. I came up with a few new things, racial based facilites. I can just post them here, maybe someone is interested and offers his/her opinion. Unfortunally i dont know a lot about the Narn, except they are prasing ONE god, G`Quan, while the Centauri offer more gods, like the old romans, they have gods for each sin and stuff.



Racial-specific Facilites


Earth Alliance Psy-Chor Outpost
Replaces standart intelligence centers and offers ~ 10% more intel output. In addition has a research outpot of 10% the value of intel generation

Earth Alliance Psy-Chor Center
Replaces the planet-intel-output facility and offers 10% more intel output. Increases planet-wide intel production by 20% more than standart planet-intel facility.

Earth Alliance Psy-Chor Systen Headquarters
Replaces the system-intel-output facility and offers 10% more intel output. Increases system-wide intel production by 20% more than standart system-intel facility.

Earth Alliance crew academie
Replaces standart ship and fleet training facility. Trains with the same rate but has a slightly higher cap. Does ship and fleet traning all in one.

Minbari Worker Caste Emmigration
Facility which is available from the start and increases mineral, organic, radioactive output by 6% +3%. Is made obsolete later on.

Minbari Warrior Caste Emmigration
Facility which is available early on. Increases spacecombat system-wide by 4/7/10%.

Minbari Religous Caste Emmigration
Facility which is available early on. Increases population happiness planetwide (not possible -> systemwide) by 5/8/11%.

Minbari Grey Council
One on each homeworld. Generates alot of research and intel, and has several abilites to make intel and events appear less often in those homesystems. Not rebuildable at all.

Minbari An‘la-Shoc Training Grounds
Replaces standart ship and fleet training facilites. Has the same rate per turn but has higher cap. Does ship and fleet training all in one

Centauri Imperial PaLast
One on each homeworld. Generates alot of research and especially intel. It greatly increases the populations happiness. Needs to incorporate the resupply depot or space port ability in order to work ?!

Centauri Imperial Shipyard
Replaces standart construction yard. Highly efficient shipyard, work supported by slaves or war refugees, something like that. Construction output 15/25/30% higher.

Centauri Intelligence Complex
Centauri are sneaky and treacherous. They are superior at backstabbing with a bomb or a dagger. Centauri Intelligence Complexes replaces standart intel centers and generate more intel. That, or they cost less. Whatever.

Interesting! Don't know how they would pan out but worth atry.

Fyron January 18th, 2005 10:53 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Quote:
Ragnarok-X said:
Interesting. i really didnt knew that. So i suppose it wasnt shown in the series, since i own all 5 seasons. Where did you got that information from ?! Tim, can you confirm this, maybe some bit is written in the AoG`s ?!
I am not sure why you would need confirmation... I feel mildly insulted by that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

It was mentioned in the series in several different episodes during the Shadow war. I forget which season exactly... There was an episode where G'Kar bought some experimental drugs designed to enhance telepathic abilities and a few later on where G'Kar explained it to some people, probably Sheridan.

Timstone January 19th, 2005 05:53 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
No comment... hehe... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

Ragnarok-X January 19th, 2005 03:02 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Quote:
Imperator Fyron said:
I am not sure why you would need confirmation... I feel mildly insulted by that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif
I didnt meant to insult you in anyway. I was just confused because i actually thought i know a lot about the B5 Universe. Sorry.

grumbler January 19th, 2005 08:44 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Quote:
Imperator Fyron said:
I am not sure why you would need confirmation... I feel mildly insulted by that. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

It was mentioned in the series in several different episodes during the Shadow war. I forget which season exactly... There was an episode where G'Kar bought some experimental drugs designed to enhance telepathic abilities and a few later on where G'Kar explained it to some people, probably Sheridan.
The ep you are looking for (the one in which Garibaldi, ironically, is the one who explains what happened to G'Qon and "the mindwalkers") is Ship of Tears.

grumbler January 21st, 2005 09:48 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
One of the things to keep in mind as you design facilities is that you need the AI to use them sensibly. Creating a large production facility, for example, does not work if the AI ends up spending a huge percentage of resources and time building it on planets where it will not do any real good.

The AI cannot tell what size planet (and therefor how many facilities and how much total pop is possible) it is building on. Therefor, the key is creating a build queue that makes sense.

My solution was to create a "spoke and hub" plan for colonies. Every colony would build, as the first thing, a "colony hub" that had a spaceport, resupply center, shipyard, and some storage. No specialization here, and the shipyard in fact had the same build rate as the colony without one (just the ability to build ships and bases).

After building the colony hub, the colony specializes in mining, research, etc. Only on the larger planets does it bother with medical centers, training facilities, depots, and the like. When well-designed, the facilities system results in AI colonies that are as efficient (or very nearly) as human-made colonies.

The key to successful facility design, then, is to always keep in mind how you want the AI to "blindly" use them. Know the AI_C_F well,and know what effect any change in facilities has on it.

Fyron January 22nd, 2005 03:29 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
You can also just use AI tags to control which facilities the AI builds exactly.

Timstone January 22nd, 2005 02:01 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Good to hear you again Grumbler.
It's really cool to read all the Messages from the veterans and sense they are all eager to play this mod again. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon14.gifhttp://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon14.gif

Ragnarok-X January 22nd, 2005 03:49 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
The facilites already work. I setup a basic Narn AI, and yes, i did it like Fyron suggested, with the help of various AI tags. I hope the 20 of them will be enough if more stuff comes up http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/laugh.gif

Ragnarok-X January 26th, 2005 04:14 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Just to let everyone know, work is progressing nicely. Fighters and Bombers have been incorporated into the mod and they actually have a use, with bombers being able to hit big ships with damage-increasing mounts and fighters being able to easily hit and destroy bombers and seekers, while far less effective against capships. If anyone wants to participate as a betatester, let me know. AI has been set up, so betatesting is actually possible.

ironman January 26th, 2005 07:12 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
I'll give it a try

Timstone January 27th, 2005 05:18 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Work on the weapons is progressing nicely too. I've processed half the general weapons and the Narns are next in line. I've already chosen weapons for the Abbai and the Minbari. They are next in oline after the Narn.

BTW, what is the plural of Narn; Narn or Narns?
And what about Minbari and Abbai?
Just a random thought...

Ragnarok-X January 27th, 2005 01:51 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Hm they i think Minbari resemblers both the singular and plural. Not sure about Abbai though, but i think it goes the same way. Same with Narn i think http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Timstone January 28th, 2005 05:05 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
RagsX:
I received your e-mail, but due to familystuff I haven't send you an answer yet. I will do that when time p[ermits me. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Ragnarok-X January 28th, 2005 02:16 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
No big deal. Hopefully you will be able to answer me this weekend, though early next week is okay as well. Im looking forward to it.

grumbler January 28th, 2005 08:25 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Quote:
Imperator Fyron said:
You can also just use AI tags to control which facilities the AI builds exactly.
Yes, of course (especially in this mod) but you need to set up the facilities and planetary build queues to make sense. Remember that the AI does not know how large the planet is before it starts to build, so the precise order of construction is very important so that you have the right total facilities for each planet when it runs out of "slots."

grumbler January 28th, 2005 08:27 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Fighters and bombers? Where in the B5 universe did this distinction arise?

Ragnarok-X January 28th, 2005 09:51 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
It just makes sense. Starfuries arent meant to bombard capitalships, thats work for the Thunderbolts. The Minbari have different classes of fighters as well, with the Nial being the superior fighter. There is the Tishat as well, which is some kind of precessor of the Nial. They have some kind of bomber as well, i just dont remember its name. I think the narn have the Frazi and something which is called Gorith or something.
In addition, its not necesarry to go canon all the way. Lastly, there is one major B5 mod, for a game called Armada 2. The mod took several years to complete, and they have included different "kinds" of fighters as well. I dont see a reason why our mod should include that feature as well. Look at modern fighters, we have specialized fighters and bombers as well.

Nomor January 28th, 2005 11:07 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
BTW, what is the plural of Narn; Narn or Narns?
Think Fish and Sheep..

My, that's a lovely looking sheep you have under your arm. (Singular)
My that's a lovely looking Narn; Minbari; Abbai .. blah ..blah

Hey, look at them fish shagging in that tank. (Plural)
Hey look at them Abbai, Minabari, Narns or Narn ..blah.. blah,

Although Abbaians might work it does not stop you using Abbai http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...ies/tongue.gif

grumbler February 2nd, 2005 08:00 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Quote:
Ragnarok-X said:
It just makes sense. Starfuries arent meant to bombard capitalships, thats work for the Thunderbolts.
Ah, but Ivanova didn't know that when she attacked the capital ships in Severed Dreams in a Starfury. Thunderbolts were replacements for Starfuries, they were not a different type of fighter. If you look at the Mod as is, you will see that it has different types of fighter hulls, and players can put weapons in each that are optimized against ships, generalized, or optimized against planets. Thunderbolts would be larger versions of Starfuries, not a different breed of animal.

Quote:
The Minbari have different classes of fighters as well, with the Nial being the superior fighter. There is the Tishat as well, which is some kind of precessor of the Nial. They have some kind of bomber as well, i just dont remember its name.
Again, you have a source for this? I have been looking through all of JMS's posts for "Tishat" and come up blank. And no mention of "Minbari bombers" either.

Quote:
In addition, its not necesarry to go canon all the way. Lastly, there is one major B5 mod, for a game called Armada 2. The mod took several years to complete, and they have included different "kinds" of fighters as well. I dont see a reason why our mod should include that feature as well. Look at modern fighters, we have specialized fighters and bombers as well.
I begin to see. This isn't a mod about adapting Space Empires IV to the Babylon 5 universe, it is about adapting the game to what you think the B5 universe should have been, had JMS had a clue.

Homie don't play that game. Be seeing you.

Timstone February 9th, 2005 05:48 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Nomor:
Hahaha... LOL!!! That's very funny. I like your answer.

Grumbler:
Come on Grumbler, don't say that. The Mod can work out just fine. Look at it this way:
Starfuries can be given a different loadout, missiles to hunt fighters and bombers or heavy missiles and bombs to attack capital ships.
Please stick with us and try the finished mod aty least one time. You know your opinion has always been respected, don't quit on us now.

RagsX:
Last night I send you an e-mail about the fighter issue. I misread about the Frazi fighter, I mistook it for the Drazi race. The name you gave (Golgath or something), you acctually meant the Gorith. That's correct, the Narn used them as a bomber sort of fighter. Ah well, my e-mail is understandable nonthe less.

Ragnarok-X February 9th, 2005 01:04 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Yes indeed i got your email and understood it. I didnt noticed grumblers latest post, thats the reason i didnt started arguing yet.
At any rate, i dont feel like argueing right now.

Simply said, i expect the "new" mod to reach more players than the old revision, i for one dont really care about grumbler that much, since he already told me on several occasions that *his* b5 mod is the right one and the one *i* work on is literally crap. Simply as it is, i dont care. May sounds insulting, but i guess its okay to say that.

Just on a random note, grumbler, if you the time and will, check the AoG miniatures, check b5tech.coms links libary and you will be sure stumble across the Tishat minbary bomber. Maybe it was even called Tishiat or something, but im pretty sure i read about a bomber sometime ago somewhere. Lastly, check the armada 2 babylon 5 mod i mentioned. Up to now, it is the most complete and best babylon 5 mod/game reference you will find anywhere. It IS okay to include things not definitly mentioned by *JMS*.

Onyx February 11th, 2005 11:25 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Quote:
Ragnarok-X said:
It just makes sense. Starfuries arent meant to bombard capitalships, thats work for the Thunderbolts. The Minbari have different classes of fighters as well, with the Nial being the superior fighter. There is the Tishat as well, which is some kind of precessor of the Nial. They have some kind of bomber as well, i just dont remember its name. I think the narn have the Frazi and something which is called Gorith or something.
In addition, its not necesarry to go canon all the way. Lastly, there is one major B5 mod, for a game called Armada 2. The mod took several years to complete, and they have included different "kinds" of fighters as well. I dont see a reason why our mod should include that feature as well. Look at modern fighters, we have specialized fighters and bombers as well.
In the B5 Fleet Action Supplement,My Enemy... My Ally, the TISHAT MEDIUM FIGHTER came into service in 2050. It has Interceptor level 1, which makes it a Dogfighter, not a ship killer (bomber).
It is a 200+ year old design as of 'present day' B5 (2260ish).
Starfuries are actually multi-role fighters. Fighter and ship killers equally. Thunderbolts are also multi-role but slightly better at dogfighting than Starfuries. These statements are based on the stats in the above mentioned supplement. I guess the upshot is that these fighters show a development line. Once a new design comes out, it totally replaces the previous design. They are not meant to complement each other but to replace the previous shotcomings.
It would be better to stay as close to canon as possible.
I am in favour of streamlining the original mod but not at the expence of losing the character of B5 as we have seen it on our TV's. We want to fight wars in that universe.
I would think finding a simple answer for problems would make for a more rewarding game.
I dont mean to compare but I have to say that Atrocities Star Trek mod is simple, elegant and accurate enough to make you feel like you are playing a Star Trek game. Not so complicated that you have to guess what type of armour is best for my battleship! The KISS theory has always been the best IMHO. (Keep It Simple Silly)

Nomor February 12th, 2005 12:29 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Exactly

grumbler February 13th, 2005 10:38 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
If anyone needs more race images, there is a nice website http://www.hot.ee/b5races/B5races.htm that I just ran across that has a great number of them, many unnamed (at least in the episode).

Captain Kwok February 13th, 2005 11:02 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
In times like this, it's always a good idea to use the canon cannon.

grumbler February 13th, 2005 11:32 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
All I care about at this point is to see a components mod with decent specialized weapons for each race and some racialized facilities. Other than that, I play right now with a very workable mod, in which i have to work to be a top 5 (points-wise) race by turn 200. Worst case for me is the time it takes to recreate existing weapons in a systematic fashion. And right now, in my version of the mod, everyone but the EA is actually quite competitive until turn 200 or so.

There are some AI-research issues with what I have posted so far, but as they cannot be found except by playing a variable-human game to turn 200 or so, I will wait until I have something comprehensive (or Se-V comes out, whichever happens first).

Nothing I come up with will apply to the Ragnarok-X mod, of course. His mod will have to use his AI. But maybe I can update the version that precedes his. Time will tell.

grumbler February 13th, 2005 11:34 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Oh, and Pathfinder, if you still follow this thread: the more I muck about in your AI mods to the files, the more impressed I am with your work. How did you find the patience?

Timstone February 14th, 2005 09:30 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Pfhew, a little break during this period of hell.

Thanks everybody for the feedback. It's always a good thing to hear other opinions. I don't know how far they will be implemented, if at all, but it's good nontheless to hear everybody's voice.

Grumbler:
Thanks for sticking around anyway, I appreciate it. Thumbs up!

Ragnarok-X February 14th, 2005 02:03 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Nice, opinions at last !

Nomor February 16th, 2005 05:47 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Just incase I missed something...

Has anyone heard from Val?

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/fear.gif

pathfinder February 16th, 2005 08:38 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Quote:
Nomor said:
Just incase I missed something...

Has anyone heard from Val?

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/fear.gif
Nope, not in like well over a year. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Timstone February 17th, 2005 06:39 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Okay, this might come as shock to the people who haven't been here that often.
The general consensus is that Val dissapeared permanently from our midst and maybe be even dead.
I have his adres (I think I got it from Nomor) and I wanted to send a letter his way, but because of my eternal lazyness and now my graduation, I haven got around to it.
I'm also afraid that, might Val be dead, his wife moved and can't be traced again. Also the reminder to someone lost could be... less pleasant.

Atrocities February 17th, 2005 08:00 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
I did not know that Richard Biggs died last year. That is so sad that he did, and that I did not know about it until today. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif Man what a blow. Thats like really really sad. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/frown.gif

Atrocities February 17th, 2005 08:18 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
1 Attachment(s)
Shadow Concept Ships

http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...2712-shad0.PNGhttp://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...2713-shad1.PNGhttp://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...2714-shad2.PNG

Atrocities February 17th, 2005 08:18 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
1 Attachment(s)
ship2

Atrocities February 17th, 2005 08:19 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
1 Attachment(s)
ship3

Atrocities February 17th, 2005 08:23 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
There really is not much you can do with the textures of Shadow ships. I had a *****'in texture but it made the ships so dark you could not see them. This alternative color makes the ships visiable. Sorry guys, but it is a nessassary evil, no pun intended.

Ragnarok-X February 17th, 2005 01:42 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
I like them a lot. Indeed you are right, without very good texturing skills is pretty difficult to make the crabs even "darker" since they wont be noticed due to the space background http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif
Maybe make the extremities to the back right and left more longer http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif

Atrocities February 17th, 2005 06:40 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
1 Attachment(s)
http://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...32966-test.PNGhttp://www.shrapnelcommunity.com/thr...2967-testm.PNG

Changed the texture a bit. This darker look is great, but in game at 36x36 you cannot see it. The mini images will have to be lightened a bit in order to be seen. Copy the image and add it to a black back ground to see what I mean.

Atrocities February 17th, 2005 06:44 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
1 Attachment(s)
test2

Atrocities February 17th, 2005 06:47 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
I guess the question is do you want me to continue working on the set?

I cannot make the apendages in the rear any longer, it will make the ship smaller. (Sizing is an issue the longer they are)

Ragnarok-X February 17th, 2005 07:04 PM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Im fine with it. If you like to continue/end the shipset, do it, it would be appreciated http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/happy.gif More important is you enjoying what you do http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/wink.gif I would like to hear which texture other people more like, the upper or lower one ?!

EaX February 18th, 2005 01:02 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Yes continue atrocities!!!!!!!!!!!, i would love that ship set being finished, i can't wait!!!!

Captain Kwok February 18th, 2005 01:09 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
I thought the first texture was nicer...

EaX February 18th, 2005 01:12 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
me too i like the first texture (sorry i forgot to mention it on my last post)

Timstone February 18th, 2005 05:40 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
AT:
That's just great! Awesome! Bis, bis!!
I really like the second texture. I have a texture included in 3ds max (called organic) which duplicates the almost exact texture used for the original Lightwave models of the show. Absolutely gorgeous! Please continue.

RagsX:
Sorry for this long break in my work, I very very busy with some experiments. I'm nearing the end of my graduation period, so pretty soon I have to hand in my concept and soon after that my final report. After that It's a cakewalk and I can devote more time to our mod. I do hope you can continue ith things. If not, please mail me and I'll try and do some work. Don't be shy to say I must work a bit faster. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/smilies/cool.gif

Atrocities February 18th, 2005 06:18 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
I would hate to have to render the set twice, so please pick a texture guys.

Onyx February 18th, 2005 06:31 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
I like the second set best.

Atrocities February 18th, 2005 10:24 AM
Re: Babylon 5 Mod
 
Shadow Concept set A work in Progress.

Comments:


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