Derlicts
 

Ever gotten annoyed at having a ship that is all but destroyed, but you're still paying full price for it?

I found a way to fix that problem. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I'll put out a small mod soon. If you give each component a positive Maintance Reduction value, that component will increase the cost of the ship's maintance. But if its destroyed, the maintance 'reduction' no longer applies, and the maintance cost goes down.

The tricky part is assigning the right values, so a player doesn't get shafted by maintance OR build a maintance-free (or negative maintance!) ship..

Re: Derlicts
 

I just send a rescue fleet with a repair ship, supply tanker and an escort wing of warships.

Of course, if I were a ruthlessly efficient dictator, I'd just have the nearest ship make a detour and destroy the ship with its guns.

Re: Derlicts
 

This is going to be tricky..

SJ: yep, those are options. Still odd to be paying to maintain a piece of useless wreckage though.

Re: Derlicts
 

***Startled abruptly from deep slobbery sleep***

Harumph! What? Hm? Where? Oh...ahem.

***Wipes drool from chin and strikes dramatic pose***

Ahh...but it does inspire some particularly spiteful tactics doesn't it old boy? There is nothing more soothing than watching the lifeless, rusting hulks of an enemy's ships drift through space...while gloating over the expense that they are incurring.

***Shuffles off in search of fuzzy slippers***

Re: Derlicts
 

ah, that could make a good mod to get people to use smaller ships. just remove the mounts, and have every 25kt count for 1% maintanence or something...

Re: Derlicts
 

Hmm. Going to have to limit it to control components and the most valuable parts of the ship.

Bridge (+5)
Life Support (+2 each)
Crew Quarters (+1 each)
MC (+15)
Engines (+1 each)
Solar Sail (+3- its delicate)
Space Yard (+5)
repair bays (+1)
stellar manip (+4)

So a LC would cost 5+2+1+6+3 = 17% maintance with the required stuff, engines, and a sail. With a MC, it would cost 15+6+3 = 24%

A battle cruiser? 5+3+2+6+3 = 19% or 24%.

A baseship? 5+10+5+2+3 = 25% or 15+2+3 20%

Those numbers look reasonable? The MC % may need some tweaking..

Re: Derlicts
 

Wow... +4 for a stellar manip comp... those are going to be some expensive ships to maintain! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

Have you considered how this affects the Maintenance Aptitude trait?

Re: Derlicts
 

The (base 25% minus Maintenance aptitude) multiplies with (the sum of those modifiers). Should be good.
A ship with just a bridge will cost 5% more than normal, while a base with a bridge will cost 10% more than normal.

Re: Derlicts
 

SJ, I'm not completely sure I follow that. Care to give an example?

Also, I'll probably use have base maintance at 100%, with appropriate subtrations for ships and bases.

EDIT: Fryon, I'll probably reduce the stellar manip costs to compensate..except for warp openers, which IMO are powerful enough to deserve the extra cost.

[ August 22, 2003, 01:54: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: Derlicts
 

4% doesn't seem like alot for stellar manip. i mean, 15% for MC? why'd a MC be that much?

ok, humor aside, i do have a point.

Re: Derlicts
 

Its 15% because it replaces three different components. Check out the numbers for the baseship..

Re: Derlicts
 

yeah, i was saying that a stellar manip component should take more mantainence than a computer.

Re: Derlicts
 

It does; 15% of a MCs cost isn't anywhere near 4% of what a stellar manipulation component costs.

EDIT: Also rememeber that these have to be applied to the cost of the -entire ship-, not just a single component.

[ August 22, 2003, 03:14: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: Derlicts
 

Ok, with maintenace set that way, add all the modifiers including the -75%/-88% for ships and bases.

EG: basic ship + MC = -60% for a total of 40% maintenance.

Then multiply by your racial characteristics. 110% reduction ability means 10% off so x0.9

So, (100-75+15)x0.9 = 36% maintenance per turn for that ship with just the MC

Re: Derlicts
 

Ok, makes more sense now. I'll probably reduce the base maintance cost a little too; the idea is to keep the average ship around 25%.

Hmm. Maybe a increase for sensors, ECM, and the Talisman too. Definitely not weapons, or shields.

Re: Derlicts
 

I'd upload my Version to Shrapnel but..it doesn't seem to work. So I'll tweak it a bit more. Current list of changes:

Maintence base set to 100% in settings.txt.
All ships have 100% maintence reduction, bases 110%
Same numbers for the componts as below, more or less, and all stellar maip components except the warp openers/closers had their prices reduced by their maintence increase.
The Talisman adds 10% to maintence, sensors, ECM, quantum reactors, stealth/scattering armor 1% each.

Misc changes:
Ripper beams and Incinerators moved to their own families
Drasticlly cut cost of storm makers and destroyers
Moved components into a more logical order (drone computers are at the FRONT of the list now, etc)

EDIT: Also, aside from cost changes none of the changes require updating AIs.

[ August 24, 2003, 02:38: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: Derlicts
 

You can upload it to PBW and post a link here to the file.

Re: Derlicts
 

Or I could just use my own web space. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I will actually..same time I update the image mod, probably tommarow.

Re: Derlicts
 

Posted!
http://members.cox.net/phoenix-d/Derlicts.zip

The image mod mirror is also updated.

Re: Derlicts
 

well, there's two ways of looking at it: one, that this is a very important project, so it's going to be made as efficient as possible, or that i's a very large project and will take a lot more mantanence because there's a lot more things that could go wrong.

just commenting.

Re: Derlicts
 

this is a really great idea. I have always wanted to make a mod that used a Zero damage capacity component, so that ships could not be completely destroyed in combat.

that way, whomever controlled the field when all was said and done, could bring in slavage ships to re-assemble the pieces. or there might be a race between one person bringing in a ship to "fire on" the wreckage, and another coming to capture it. Or perhaps if you just narrowly succeeded in defending a planet, you could re-assemble some of those lost ships in a few turns.

repair abilities would have to be reduced, and maybe ships would have to be more expensive to initially build (reduced construction abilities would take care of this).

The idea has never been possible to implement, because of you would be forced to pay maintenance on wrecked ships. now with this fantastic mod, it can finally be done.

the downside is that you can never finally destroy an enemies ship, without capturing it. you can always "fire on" or "scrap" your own ship, but you dont have the option of easily disposing of a destroyed fleet that you dont have time to salvage, but wish to prevent its re-capture. the up side to the down side, is that it forces you to guard things you destroy untill something can be done about it, adding a different element of strategy to the game that players cant ignore simply by blowing stuff up.