OT: Books, Books, Books.
 

ran into a 'short takes' thing for DW. i like their one for 'The Armaggedon Inheritance'.
http://electronictiger.com/shorts/dw2.htm

a bit of a typo from the amazon.com editer review: 'Restoring the empire that had been destroyed >forty-five< years earlier, Emperor Colin finds problems in the genocidal Achuutani and in his children Sean and Harriet, who have been marooned on a hostile planet. '

[ January 05, 2004, 17:27: Message edited by: narf poit chez BOOM ]

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The Apocalypse Troll was great, I read it on bain free libary, I have to get that book...

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I red "In Death Ground" so many times it fell apart, I glue it back and it is breaking up now anyway... Every single page gives me an urge to play SEIV again and again http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

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hm. my take on "A Book That Makes Me Wanna Play SE" was Allan Dean Foster's Founding of the Commonwealth trilogy. I reccommend it to anyone.

Gotta reread it sometime...

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I don't know...call me an old fart (again), but I still think the old Asimov books are the best, i.e. the "Foundation Trilogy," "We Claim These Stars," etc.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I wouldn't call you an old fart. I spent my teenage years reading the "masters": Heinlein, Bradbury, Clarke and of course Asimov. But I was more into Heinlein and Bradbury than the other two. Maybe it's because I read The Foundation trilogy then that it really didn't do anything for me. maybe if I read it again, it might be different.

[ December 30, 2003, 13:24: Message edited by: gregebowman ]

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Hey Greg,

When you get to it, don't stop with the first Honor book, I really think DW matured as a writer the further he went into the series.

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Point taken Bug, my bug. Although I find the stuff that Weber wrote for the Starfire mini games before they boxed the lot can do it for me. Remember those? They still got the ships names Duke of Hazard and Duke of Wayne... Oh the good old days!

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I recently bought the first book in the Honor Harrington series, but haven't had the chance to read it yet. I'm reading Tad Williams Otherland books, and it's taking me forever. Then I have the supposedly Last 2 Star Wars books involving the Yuzan Vong, then I got Stephen King's latest book for Christmas, then after that I have several books I want to read. I'll try to read that book then.

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the battle in OBS always seemed a bit improbable to me. it's been a while since i read it, though.

i like some of Asimov and Clarke, but for some reason i don't like what might be called the three big classics of sf, foundation, space oddysey or dune. well, i didn't exactly not like them, i just didn't find them to interesting, and i think dune 1 is about all i ever read of Heinlein.

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I have read all of Asimov's Foundation books, and they are great! The story of a big dying galactic empire, and the 1000-year period in which the new galactic empire is formed, starting from only one planet... The many challenges and crises faced by the Foundation as it slowly gained power and territory over the centuries, is fascinating.

It's too bad Asimov did not live long enough to complete the series. I haven't read any of the three sequels written by the other authors yet.

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Of course, I don't know this for sure, but I tend to believe that in his own mind, Asimov did finish the Foundation series. Anyone else wanting to take the ball and run with it certainly had a heck of a start to build on. Actually, I didn't know that another author(s) had done so. Can you name them, or the titles? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif


addendem: narf, Dune was written by Frank Herbert.

[ December 31, 2003, 14:04: Message edited by: Cipher7071 ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I do try to get the whole series before I start reading the first book, but not knowing what order the books come in is difficult when I go to this used book store and then try to decide which is the next book I need to read.

The only series I didn't enjoy reading the whole way through was The Horseclans books. By the time I read the 18th and final book, I was sick and tired of it. I didn't even read the two anthology books written by different authors. And it took my about 10 years to find all of the books, and I think I traded them at my comic book store for credit.

I've read Dune 2 or 3 times, and probably need to read it again a time or two to really understand it. I've read most of the Frank Herbert books. Haven't read any of them done by his son.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The original Foundation Trilogy by Isaac Asimov consisted of:
1. Foundation
2. Foundation and Empire
3. Second Foundation

Asimov then wrote four more Foundation books:
4. Foundation's Edge
5. Foundation and Earth
6. Prelude to Foundation
7. Forward the Foundation

The second trilogy was written by other authors after Asimov died:
1. Foundation's Fear by Gregory Benford
2. Foundation and Chaos by Greg Bear
3. Foundation's Triumph by David Brin

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">well, i havn't read any more of his books either. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The major storyline goes like this :
On Basilisk Station
The Honor of the Queen
The Short Victorious War
Field of Dishonor
Flag in Exile
Honor Among Enemies
In Enemy Hands
Echoes of Honor
Ashes of Victory
War of Honor

Other books are short stories in Honorverse.

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you can also read OBS in the baen library www.baen.com/library and read previews of the books on http://www.webscription.net/

[ December 31, 2003, 18:52: Message edited by: narf poit chez BOOM ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">The major storyline goes like this :
On Basilisk Station
The Honor of the Queen
The Short Victorious War
Field of Dishonor
Flag in Exile
Honor Among Enemies
In Enemy Hands
Echoes of Honor
Ashes of Victory
War of Honor

Other books are short stories in Honorverse. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Ok, thanks for the info. I'll have to print this out the next time I go there.

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I usually dont like anthologies (probably since I can't spell it) but the World of Honor books are very good, the stories tie into the series very well, and some chars behind the scenes come out into the light. I have been very pleased with the Anthologies and some stories clear up some info from his books.

As others have said, one of my recent hardbacks had a CD with all the Honor books on it, kind of neat if you have a reader so you dont have to sit in front of a comp while reading.

Have fun, receives the Narrew's "Good Read" Award

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Just bought Cordelia's Honor/Young Miles by Bujold and Drakes 'With the Lightning'. Hope they will quench my thirst for military Sci-Fi as I'm almost done my 2nd read thru the Honor series.

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Though I never got hooked by the Honor Harrington series, I found the Starfire books by Weber and White (Insurrection, Crusade, In Death Ground, and The Shiva Option) to be great fun. The characters are a bit two-dimensional, but the space battles are great. As someone else said, these books never fail to get me in the mood to play SE4.

BTW, a couple years ago a poster talked about creating a Starfire mod for SE4 - does anyone know if this was ever done?

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">ohh, you will like Bujold's Miles series, damn, I just LOVE reading

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Now this is truly Ouruborous! Starfire begat Space Empires begats SE4G - Starfire! And I thought this year would lack wierdness!

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Hmm, I don't recall those. I read all of the Flinx books, but the Commonwealth was already in existence by then, IIRC. Do you know the titles of this "Founding" trilogy?

SpaceBadger

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Which stories are in Young Miles? Warrior's Apprentice and The Vor Game, I would guess? Is Mountains of Mourning also included?

I just found The Vor Game on a shelf a couple of nights ago, made the mistake of opening it up to a favorite scene, stayed up til 2am re-reading the whole book.

SpaceBadger

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Stafire Mod Thread
http://www.shrapnelgames.com/cgi-bin...=006205#000000

No more information...

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Cordelia has the first two books in the series, then Young Miles has the next two IIRC. Thats the ONE thing I hate about book stores (even Chapters does it), you go in and look at a book, it seems interesting and then you find out its part 45 of 68 and part 1 is nowhere to be seen. ARGH. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif Luckily our local chapters seems to be ok at stocking titles and we have several good 2nd hand book shops.

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this is the order I suggest, I found it on the web when I found out about the Bujold series...(from some web site) The best place to start the Vorkosigan saga is, IMHO, with Young Miles. It collects the novels The Warrior's Apprentice and The Vor Game, along with the novella "The Mountains of Mourning" (from Borders of Infinity). After you read that, you'll probably want to read Cordelia's Honor (which collects Shards of Honor and Barrayar)-- this tells the tale of Miles' parents and Miles' birth. Or you might want to just keep on keeping on with Miles. His adventures continue in Cetaganda, Borders of Infinity, Brothers In Arms, Mirror Dance, Memory, Komarr, and A Civil Campaign....

I hope that helps

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not to mention Diplomatic Immunity.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">ohh yea, that came out as I was reading those others

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Deathstalker, that's the most frustrating thing for me too. I don't usually go the to the book stores. Usually I'll see a book at Wal-Mart or some similar store and buy it there. But it is frustrating to see a book in a series you've never heard of before and then find out it's book 2 or 3 of a trilogy, or maybe book 5 of a series of 8. So I know what you mean.

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i read series in whatever order i find them.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I did that one time. Bought book 3 of the Donald Stephenson first trilogy (White Gold Wielder?), then read the second trilogy, then read the first 2 books of the original trilogy. Talk about being confused.

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heh, I got the Last book of Athur C clarke's rama series for christmass. dont know whether to read it or find all the others first...

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Ya know I hate to admit this, but I have not read any of these books.

I tried once to read Dune, got a nose bleed and shelved it. I tried to read a Tom Clancy book, the one about Clark, and same thing.

I don't have the interest to read overtly stuffy, long worded, drawn out, boring material. I would rather wait for the movie.

Sorry guys.

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I've just become a dinosaur.....

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">how so?

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Actually, I'd prefer that one not be mentioned - the =only= thing Bujold has written that I just didn't like. Every other Vorkosigan book has left me wanting more more more - not this one. I'm glad she seems to be moving on to the Chalion books now.

BTW, on the matter of where to start reading the Vorkosigan books, I suggest one of the following: (A) Shards of Honor (first chronologically, and also first written), followed by the rest in chronological order (check the timeline in the back of one of the books); (B) Warrior's Apprentice (first "Miles" book, for those people who may not get into a book with a female main character), followed by others in chronological order except for a detour at some point to pick up Shards and Barrayar; or (C) Brothers in Arms (most exciting one that doesn't rely too much on backstory from other books, recommended for getting someone hooked on the series, after which they can read the rest chronlogically). Mirror Dance and Memory are my own Favorites, but I don't think I would recommend them for someone who hadn't read any of the others first.

I used method C with my brother-in-law (and it got him quite firmly addicted), but that was only because I could not find a copy of Shards or Warrior's Apprentice anywhere at the time, and did not want to lend him my copies since he lives in another state (this was before Cordelia's Honor and Young Miles came out, so Shards and WA were not readily available as they are now).

SpaceBadger

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aside from it not having the general looniness of the other books, i don't really see the problem. the books more serious tone reflects the more serious and experienced miles. he was in his twenty's during his adventure's and now that he's thirty, his starting to run his thinking from his brain, not his glands. and is naturally appalled at some of the risks he took.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I did that one time. Bought book 3 of the Donald Stephenson first trilogy (White Gold Wielder?), then read the second trilogy, then read the first 2 books of the original trilogy. Talk about being confused. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yes, that would just about confuse anyone... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Deathstalker, that's the most frustrating thing for me too. I don't usually go the to the book stores. Usually I'll see a book at Wal-Mart or some similar store and buy it there. But it is frustrating to see a book in a series you've never heard of before and then find out it's book 2 or 3 of a trilogy, or maybe book 5 of a series of 8. So I know what you mean. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Ok, I have to ask: Did you try your local public library system? Even if they do not have a book, they usually can get it via inter-library loan at no cost to the patron. Most libraries have put their catalogs on-line, i.e. you can search for books from any web browser. I have borrowed every SF book I wanted from the library. I could never afford to buy the hundreds of books that I have read over the years...

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Bah, I'm talking about the plot and the writing - just not up to Bujold's usual high standards. I mean, seriously, look at the ending - all of the action happens offstage and is described second-hand afterward! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif

Miles is no more of a stick in this one than he was in Civil Campaign, and I =loved= Civil Campaign. I just didn't think Diplomatic Immunity was as good a book as the rest, and I've been reading them (and re-reading them) since about '88 or '89, whenever I first ran across Miles in the pages of Analog (the story where he meets Taura, title escapes me at the moment). Diplomatic Immunity just felt too much like she was going through the motions without anything really interesting to say, which was a significant letdown from her usual quality.

I'm happy to report that Bujold's latest book, Paladin of Souls (second in the Chalion series, not a Vorkosigan book), is an excellent story and shows very well that she has not lost her touch - perhaps she just needs to get away from Miles for awhile.

SpaceBadger

[ January 03, 2004, 02:47: Message edited by: SpaceBadger ]

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well, ok, it has adventure's. but not the level of hilarity of the other books. and, alot was happening offstage. but, it was told from vorkosigan's point of view and he was unconcious for the wrap up and not very on top of things until the end, where he showed his usual style. i didn't find it quite as engrossing as the other's, but i think it was just a difference in the style. mostly.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">how so? </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I think that Cipher, like me, reads everything he can lay his hands on including cereal boxes. When Atrocities (an otherwise noble individual) said he don't read tomes...
Well, Ciper and I have something in common.

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It surely reads like one http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I don't really like "Shiva Option". It was damn obviuos from the beginning that humans will win. But "In death ground" makes my hair rise.

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What Narratio says four Posts down is essentially true. But rather rather than reading 'everything I can get my hands on' I tend to delve into whatever it is that's caught my interest. One year it was Mycology. Another it was any wild edible plants (related, eh?). And, of course, I've since spent five or six years getting a couple of baccalaureate degrees.

I guess I say I'm a dinosaur (when it comes to this thread) because I haven't really read any sci-fi lately. So, I didn't know there were more "Foundation" books beyond the trilogy.

So many things to read and learn, so little time...I've drifted away from fiction.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">you cant decide on wether a book is good or not only after a few pages. you have to read the whole thing.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">try some of Heinlein's Young Adult stuff, they are all light to read, not long drawn out stuff like Asimov's stuff tends to be. Have Space Suit will travel for example. I have read that something like five times http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif
his (Heinlein's) adult stuff tends to be a little bit more drawn out and a little harder to read.

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Well the one i was reading was something about this Honour Harrington having been captured and her friends being worried about it. There was also something about some alien pet, a cat i think, and I just thought after 10 or 15 pages "so what". I will admit its probably more for people who have already read the previous books, so know about and care about the characters already. I once read a book by my favourite author and got half way through before i decided it was his worst and stopped. I also read nearly all the way to the end of a trilogy with maybe 20 pages left when i came to the conclusion that i frankly didn't care about the ending, in fact wished the good guys were defeated, so much i stopped reading. I still have the book on the shelf and have no desire to finish it (I did read the sequels though, don't ask me why, and was glad to see the good guys from the first books were made to look like the arrogant deluded idiots they were).

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Since this thread started out about David Weber. I am currently reading the "Shiva Option". I swear it reads like a game of SE4 (or another space empires game). You have fleets with say 68 Battlecruisers, 40 Monitors, 40 Carriers, 100 cruisers and 2000 fighters taking each other on. First they enter through a warp point destroy all the mines and warp point defenses including bases, then move into the system and fight other fleets sometimes chasing them to other warp points in the system or attacking planets. It is just fleet engagement after fleet engagement with almost no coverage outside battles, except a few pages every once in a while about the empires planning their war on the enemy. The Writers even thank a fellow wargamer who created one of the empires. Its like they played a game and one of them wrote a book about what happened each turn. I think the "Bahgs" would be an interesting empire to play, but of course they have absolutely no opportunity for roleplaying. I tried reading honour harrington books once but didn't like the first one i tried after a few pages.

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Just realised what i said of the plot was a bit misleading. There is a bit more than combat, but mostly just admirals remembering what happened to such and such planet or fleet that got killed by the enemy. The "Bahgs" of course have no personality at all.

edit: These were my first Posts and I only noticed the edit function now (so sorry for 2 Posts in a row). Rereading this thread i noticed a mention of the shiva option already (sorry, missed it) and a reference to the starfire series, and starfire mini-games. So am i right, the book is just the narrative for a game?.

[ January 03, 2004, 12:41: Message edited by: Randallw ]