Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

I placed an order through Amazon on Dec 29th. When I received the confirmation email I was told that my order was being processed for a thrid party. This caused me great concern. I had no intention of ordering items from a third party and found the notification a jonny come lately.

Never the less the deal was a rather good one, you know the old saying, if its to good to be true, then is isn't. Well that applies here in spades.

The order was to have arrived no later than January 8th. Well it is now the 12th and no order. So I did a follow up and emailed the sellor on the 8th, 9th, 10th, and again today. All of my emails have been bounced back to me.

Amazon is no help either, they say give it 30 days, well in 30 days this scam artist is going to rip off many many more people. At the time that I placed my order there were no customer feed back reports on the sellor. Now there are over 20 and they are all bad.

I emailed Amazon about this and they say that they are not responsible for this and claim that I must continue to wait before they can accept a compaint form.

Well excuse me, but I found out without to much trouble the the sellor, dvdsofldwayne, is a scam and that is something that Amazon should have know long before they authorized this company, check that, rip off artist to do business under the Amazon name.

I call on everyone here to avoid doing business with Amazon.com until this matter is resloved. Thus far they have been very unwilling to help, and the list of victims is growing. If you can support my request and not do business with Amazon I would be very greatful, if not, good luck with your purchases.

[ January 13, 2004, 16:25: Message edited by: Atrocities ]

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

It's a common hazard. I got ripped off via EBay.
EBay eventually kicked the seller offsite, but not before I got ripped off.
Hope you have better luck than me...

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

The thing is, Amazon did not disclose that this was a third party sellor, and furthermore garunteed the deliverary and condition of the order via their merchant program. The problem is, the merchant program is a farse. Amazon does not reinburse for fraud or other. They file a complaint with the company and ask for your money back. That is the extent of what they do. They totally misrepresented the entire deal from the word go. It was a scam 100% and they lead customers right down the golden path to be mugged fully knowning that they were going to be mugged. And that is what pisses me off.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

So file a lawsuit.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Here is the latest email I received, formula to the letter and final period.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I got this TODAY! So what fricking help is this to me?

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">

[ January 13, 2004, 04:43: Message edited by: Atrocities ]

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">*shakes head* Why do I even bother reading Posts like this?

The point is I shouldn't have to do anything Fyron, the whole purpose of this thread is to warn others and ***** about what happened to me. I am taking action, but four word Posts as direct as yours, although I am sure meant to be helpful, just irk me. Then again I am very tired and tomorrow is a new day.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Thank you for warning us about this, Atrocities. I have bought a few things from Amazon.com before, but I won't buy anything else until this situation is sorted out. I had no idea they do stuff like that! Somehow I assumed they were a reputable company that wouldn't deal with questionable vendors like that, but I made that assumption just because Amazon is such a big, well-known company, and I guess that's not a good assumption. Thanks for letting us know.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Yep. You shouldn't have to do anything. Unfortuneatly, the world's an ugly place and you have to stand up or be rolled over.

anyhow, I have a suggestion and a question:

First, since it was a credit card payment, your CC company should have a fraud department. You should be able to simply call them and ask them to reverse the charges. Usually your word is good enough for this to be done, and unless the merchant has significant evidence to back their side up, the cardholder is given the benefit of the doubt. What stops this system from being abused, is that if the card holder is ever caught in a lie, he can pretty much kiss his credit goodbye.

As for my question, did this happen through a REGUAR Amazon sale? Or was it clearly labled as one of their "marketplace" things? I knew from outside news sources that the "marketplace" thing was a gathering of 3rd party merchants, but maybe it just wasnt clearly represented on their site?

But shoot man, if they offer a guarantee that they will regulate the sale and make sure the product is delivered as advertised, but in actuality do not, or dont really commit to it when you read the fine print... yeah, that really sucks. if you dont sue them, someone else probably will. ask around some more, and see if you can get in on a class action suit. at least get your money back.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

this is why i read those End-User Liscence Agreements. did you know that if you use your warcraft 3 map on the blizzard server's, blizzard automatically has borg rights on it?

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

AT. Go though your credit card company. They should and will help you as best as they can.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

AFter reading this, I'm glad I can't use my credit cards. I've never bought anything through the internet using a credit card. About the only things I've bought have been some of the games on this site, and I usually send in a check or money order. But Atrocities, you should contact your CC company; they should be able to do something.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Thanks Guys that is what I am doing, working through my CC company.

Here is the latest email from Amazon. Man they simply just don't understand, or care.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Unlikely Event???? They have 20 + people, 100% of the feed back for this sellor, saying they got ripped off, and they say Unlikely event. LOL.

The A to Z Guarantee is about worthless.

This is "just so ya know" info. Buyer beware.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Lets hope they put a hold on giving that person money. Reading the AtoZ thing it looks like they will refund your money.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Thanks for the warning.
Please keep us informed, as I find these sort of "ground user level" informations very precious.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

It sounds to me like they are doing everything reasonable to resolve the situation. It may be that you are right and the seller is a ripoff and taking advantage of Amazon. If that's the case, knowing how important their reputation is to them, I would be very suprised if they didn't do whatever it takes to get get your money back to you or whatever. It may also be a simple technical glitch or a big misunderstanding that will all get worked out in the end. But you have to be a little more patient dude.

I am not sure what you expect, but they aren't going to refund your money to you before it is clear the shipment isn't going to be received. And from what you have said here it's not even officially late yet.

What you are doing is the right thing. Being proactive and dealing with the CC and Amazon and letting them know there is a potential problem. All that will make it easier to get it resolved later if it turns out your fears are justified.

On a more personal level I don't really agree with you smearing Amazon's name or calling for a boycott before it's really clear they have done anything to damage you. But that's your right too I guess. It's a bit of a waste of energy though. Don't sweat the small stuff so much dude.

[ January 13, 2004, 16:35: Message edited by: geoschmo ]

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Geoschmo, just wait until its your turn to deal with them then come here and we can talk. I understand your dislike of this topic and I appreciate your honesty and condor about it.

*directed at Amazon*
However, Amazon is NOT doing anything about it, they are not helping in any way. They keep telling to email the sellor. Well, excuse me, but either he has blocked me, and all of the other people he has scammed, or the email address is simply no good, and in that case AMAZON should pull that SOB's access to doing business on Amazon.

*Me Ranting about it*
Instead they send out an email saying, the unlikely event that you do not receive your package then talk to us. WELL excuse me, but I have not recieved my package, and the sellor is running a scam on their site, and they do nothing.

*Talking to Geo Now*
Yes Geoschmo, they do not care, and they are not helping, so my smearing them is not smearing at all, but simply posting the facts about them not helping. (No offense intended)

*Polite Advisory*
And for the record, I am not sweating the small stuff, its only $150.00 bucks. The point is people should know about what is going on so that they do not become victims of Amazons and its "Merchant Sellors."

Of all the on line sites, Amazon has the highest rating for quality and the very name Amazon instills a sense of security. All I am saying is that anit true any more.

[ January 13, 2004, 16:37: Message edited by: Atrocities ]

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Geo... his shipment is late.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Geoschmo does have a point though. He stated that it will more than likely get resolved.

Amazon needs to improve their response time to matters like this when the Sellor is running a scam and taking advantage of Amazons name. At this point Amazon is simply denying t here is a problem and that is what is really frustrating me at the moment.

(EDIT)
Amazon is a victim as well, I should comment on that. Even though I am partcially holding them respondible for this, they too are as much a victim of this SOB as I. It is there name that is getting damaged, and scams like this hurt lagit sellors as well.

[ January 13, 2004, 16:27: Message edited by: Atrocities ]

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

You edited the topic. Boo. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Oh... and it is "seller," not "sellor."

[ January 13, 2004, 16:37: Message edited by: Imperator Fyron ]

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

I am sorry if I came off sounding condescending Atrocities. I did not intend too. And I meant no offense with the comment about your mom. That was my clumsy attempt to lighten your mood with a little humor.

I have been ripped off before. And it totally pisses you off, I know it. However, I have also had situations where I felt I was being taken advantage of at first, and it turned out to be simply a misunderstanding.

I bought a computer on Ebay one time, and after getting my money, the seller disapeared and I could not get any contact from him. I was not thrilled at all considering I had potentially lost several hundred bucks down a deep dark hole. But it turned out ok in the end as the seller hadn't really skipped, he was just having some problems with his ISP preventing him from getting any emails. I ended up getting everything I paid for and was completely satisfied.

I am hoping that in your case it turns as well, but if it does not, by all means keep after Amazon. I will be very suprised in the end if they don't make sure you aren't out anything but a little temporary inconveinence.

Geoschmo

[ January 13, 2004, 16:43: Message edited by: geoschmo ]

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Hey, anybody want to buy some DS9 CDs? Caveat emptor. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

By the way, I think maybe your complaints are having an effect with Amazon. I went to the site and cannot find any listings by that guy. Unless I am just lokking in the wrong place or something. So maybe they are taking you seriously and trying to prevent anyone else from getting ripped off in the short term. Not that it helps you much now, but it might make you feel a little better.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

i dunno, the form letters that AT reposted from Amazon dont sound too promissing.

"we will send your complaint to the right department, but wont tell you what department that is, and we wont tell you the results of our investigation, if we actually decide to have one."

Buying direct from Amazon, I still may do. Buying through their merhcant program, well, not without taking the same care as purchasing through e-bay, or some other unscrupulous source.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

For Amazon to keep their good name they should satify AT, but being a big company that could take some time.

I've only ever purchased 3 things off the Internet, SE 4, SE4G and a computer, from Ebay. And I only purchased the computer after I found out that is was from a valid Australian company, got their address, spoke to the dealer over the phone and spoke to another person who had prevoiusly dealt with them.

I might be paranoid but I'd prefer that than being ripped off. Just my 2 cents.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

I just got off the phone with Amazon Customer Service. It took me a while to get the number so I will share it with any one who needs it.

They are aware of the problem, but must stick to policy and not help people reclaim their money until 30 days after the order date and only after they fill out the A to Z form. I was assured that the A to Z form would get my money back, but I must file it before Jan 31st. *looks left to right and back* Why?

Well because Amazon can only refund money for purchases made between Nov X date, and Dec 31st if the customer files a return/refund notice by that date.

A Catch 22.

The guy I talked to at Amazon was very unhelpful, almost skittish to be talking to me and answering my questions. He was evasive and unwilling to provide me with his name or a contact person at Amazon that could help me.

In all honestly, I feel like never doing business with Amazon ever again. This whole affair has left a very bad taste in my mouth.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">i don't think your paraniod. paraniod is wondering if the person you talked to was paid off. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Atrocities, you may want to relay your story/experience to a media outlet, local or national, that blows the whistle on Companies with bad Business practices.

I don't know what's available in Portland or in the US, but here in Ottawa we have a local TV Station that you can relay stuff like this too and they'll do an investigation on it, and then relay their findings to the public.

...And then there are shows like MarketPlace (Wendy Mesley, rrrrow!) that air on the CBC that go after large Companies & Scamers to warn everyone about them, and to hopefully get the offending Companies to clean their act, and to get the Police at the doorstep of the Criminals.

One thing you can definetly do is report Amazon to the Better Business Bureau (or the US equivelent), and encourage everyone who posted complaints on Amazon to complain to the BBB aswell.

Make no mistake though that Amazon won't do anything different for you or anyone else in the future because of this experience. Large Companies want to make money, not spend it, and defiently not lose it. If their Marketplace Vendor thingamabob is making them money, they won't change a thing unless some negative press hits a major US Network (CNN would be good).

The fact that they hire & train support Staff to be evasive & misleading is a sure sign of where their true priorities lie.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

A lot of us have been there Atrocities, (bad experience with inet purchases) the only way I managed to clear things up was with the CC company. It took about a year and a half, but it eventually got fixed. (for some strange reason the target company's address was bouncing all over the US)

In your case, giving the CC company all the info you got, to show that this is a fraud should help to clear things up faster.

Your CC company might also contact Amazon to have them remove the 'fraudulent' company from their list.

I hope things get cleared up for you soon, Cheers!

[ January 13, 2004, 12:17: Message edited by: David E. Gervais ]

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">So let me get this straight. If you were more like me who quite possible would have waited until after Jan 31 to complain (I just now e-mailed a different company about an order i placed Dec 8) Amazon would have told you to go to hell???!! Waiting a month before complaining does not seem unreaonable to me.

I started avoiding Amazon a long time ago due to the shiping charges. Luckily in Canada we have chapters.ca (although i can't say for sure if they are any better but my few orders have went ok)

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Atrocities, my 2 pence (worth about 3 1/2 cents at today's exchange rates) for you.

Point 1 - Amazon do have a point, in that you do have to give someone a reasonable time to perform their end of the contract. Frustrating acts may mean that the sellers ISP is down, or he is just busy, or even just delayed in sending you the goods. I would watch and wait till nearer the 31/1 and then raise hell;

Point 2 - the US does have sale of goods legislation similar to what we have in England. You should have recourse to Amazon if the package does not arrive. Use their AtoZ guarantee first. If that doesnt work, raise hell.

Point 3 - you paid this on credit card. Your credit card company will have to reimburse you for the fraud.

Summary - You are 99% likely to get your money back.

For what it is worth, I have been stung several times on Amazon and Ebay. Amazon in each case refunded my money. In relation to Ebay, sellers kept my cash on 3 occassions. On each occassion, my credit card had to refund the cash spent and Ebay kicked the people of the sight.

On one the occassions, the seller sent me an email from his work, but didnt realise that his firm's server or whatever stuck a message on the email giving its name, address etc. Complied documents, got the CEO's name and personal address from Companies House, sent the bloke a letter saying "wouldn't normally trouble you but as this bloke (the seller) did send an email from work and has tried to stiff me, a lawyer etc..."

Got a cheque and an apology from the CEO on behalf of his employee (what a nice bloke) and a promise from the CEO that he didnt like the idea of his staff being crooks, and would therefore have words with said ****.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif I take back every bad word I ever said about your honarable profession Gt. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Thanks Geo,

It worked quite nicely. I simply wrote to the CEO of this small company, and explained that I had entered into email communications with one of his staff, who had responded from work. I explained that I had purchased something from this bloke, but that now he was refusing to answer my enquiries and not letting me have the goods, notwithstanding that he had been paid.

I then said that I was a solicitor, and said that much apologies but I would have to start legal proceedings against this bloke, and as the only address I had for him was at the office, please would the CEO accept my advance apologies that notice forms etc would have to go to the office until such time as I had the guys residential address. I apologised for contacting him direct, and apologised for the inconvenience, but explained that I would take it kindly if someone gave me advance notice re one of my staff, and hoped he appreciated it.

He called me, we chatted through the issue and he send me a cheque for the £30 the twat owed me. He said that he appreciated my candour, but felt he would rather deal with this internally by having a quiet word with the member of staff about sending personal emails from work, potentially dragging the name of the business into legal proceedings and all sorts of stuff. Decent guy. Hope he sorted the numpty out!

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Thanks Growltigger. I had already planned on letting the matter run its course.

Amazon no longer lists the seller as a merchant seller, and the guy I talked to on the phone, Todd, had let it slip that others had been calling about the same thing.

So the ball is rolling, albeit slowly.

And BTW, that was an inventive way to get your money back. Good for you. I had a guy I worked with run a Ebay scam where he would list new Computer parts for diret cheap then send the poeple junk with a little sticker on them that said they were P 150's when they were actually P 75's and such.

He got away with it for a long time, was actually able to buy a corvette with his earnings, but the law caught up to him and he got in some serious trouble. He was a weasel so he got what he deserved. We all found out about it when they showed up to work to arrest him for mail fraud or something like that. Come to find out he was stealing stuff from work as well and using his position to order stuff, using other peoples names, then intercepting the package, his position allowed him to do this, and then take it home and sell it on ebay or whatever.

I hope the SOB who ran this scam through Amazon gets caught, but the chances are he is already running a new scam through them much to the same as his old one. Oh well, buyer be ware.

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

I thought this post was relevant to this discussion....check out this news about Identity Fraud on ebay...

http://enterprisesecurity.symantec.c...265162&EID=551

It remains to be seen how seriously the authorities deal with these folks. If you read between the lines, it looks as though Civil Court isn't going to get all these folks money back. Do you think they'll get jail time?

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Oh man that is why I won't buy things off the internet unless its a established company

Re: Being Ripped Off By Online Sellor
 

Growltigger, you are a class act.

Good to hear of someone puting in some well thought out effort.