Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

I have visited a few game sites and non of them have posted any news about the latest SEIV patch.

Most noteably Gamespot.com They have vertually no info on the game and did not even bother to post the news about the update. All they have is the update and nothing more.

ADDITIONALLY! Go register and give the game a quck free review. (10's all way) Space Empires IV Gold (Must say GOLD)

This angers me greatly as SEIV has proven itself to be the hands down best 4X of this century. (No crap, released in 2000 nothing has come close to knocking it off the thrown.)

So why in the hell don't the game sites honor this game and at least post news about it when there is new news to post?

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

The reason is simple,.. You'd be amazed at how many people I know that have never heard of Shrapnel Games, let alone Malfador Machinations. Virtually all their business is strictly Online and I don't recall ever seeing an ad for their games in any magazines. I have seen a few reviews of their products, but usually they are single page reviews or smaller. The review runs in for just that one month and I'm sure the sales must increase slightly when the issue comes out. But the bottom line is Shrapnel and MM have made virtually all their success due to word of mouth.

Personally I would think that shrapnel along with a few of their best selling developers could manage to scrape up enough money to place a half (or full) page ad to run for a period of a few months. Word of mouth is a very good supliment to advertizing, but not a substitute.

AT, try this test,.. next time your in a computer store ask the shopper next to you if he/she has heard of Shrapnel or Malfador Machinations.

Heck, with the savings in bandwidth since the upload forums have been down they should have saved enough money to place full page adds in 2-3 magazines.

As far as the 'other' gamming sites not having an announcement of the new SE:IV GOLD patch, write a small review and highlight the best of the new features and send it to the gamesite's admins. I'm sure they would be happy to post it for you. Cause right now it's the fans that are supporting and promoting the game the most.

I really think that Shrapnel should get more agressive in their advertizing. They have many great games, and a whold world of potential clients that don't even know they exist.

Nuf said, Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

One place I can always count on to have the SEIV patches (and starfury) almost the same day as Shrapnel is the Adrenaline Vault (avault.com), great game site with tonnes of demos. This is actually where I first heard of Se4 while looking to see if there was a new Master of Orion in the works. Saw it in the Demos section and I've never turned back http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Well said.

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I have to agree.
Its sad, but Computer mags these days are cattering only to the cassual gamer, and occasionally to the hardcore RPGamer and FPShooter, but definitively not to Strategy or Tactical games/wargames/whatever.

I'm only interested in Strategy, and I haven't seen or heard of a mag that aims for this demographic group.
Maybe its too small to justify the investment?

The point is that people that play games like SE4 look for the latest news Online, not onpaper.

I would say that whatever the investment on ads may be, it should be Online, on gaming sites.


On the other hand, to contradict all the above, the first time I heard of this game was in Computer Game Magazine, when they sent us a demo CD with the Gold Demo for SE4, so there is not a clear cut of where the money works best for an 4X game like this one.

How about a poll in which every member of this forum can vote on where they heard first of SE4?

[ March 01, 2004, 13:08: Message edited by: SB ]

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

double post

[ March 01, 2004, 15:23: Message edited by: spoon ]

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Maybe Shrapnel didn't tell anybody??? I did notice that they have a link to the patch over at avault.com.

[ March 01, 2004, 15:23: Message edited by: spoon ]

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

Maybe an updated demo could be released with the 1.91 patch included, and MM or Shrapnel could get that demo out to the PC game magazines to be included on their demo discs. Just a thought.

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

Shrapnel is very good at getting the word out about updates and new games. The word was out, they got it, but they just don't care about the games Shrapnel offers. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Hell I will pay for an add and run it in the local computer magazine if it will help sell SE IV! Crap its not that expensive up here... But nationaly, in one magazine like PC gamer, well that is about $1200.00 per one half page color add. (Could be wrong, but that would be logical rate. Easy enought to check too.)

You run an add that is a half page that lists your top selling games. Just get the word out, let the web site and the forums do the rest. (The Demos to.)

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">That is an excellent idea. You should email that to MM right now Greg. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

$1200?

I think not. The kind of ad you describe would cost a lot more than that! These people who make the magazine need to eat as well!

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It was a guestimate. Call them and ask how much.

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PC Gamer mag just had a full page review of Starfury not to long back and I believe they did one for SE4 too. They gave Starfury a 80something% out of 100%. Which is fairy high praise. The only thing they thought was wrong with the game was some stablity issues and the long travel time between systems.

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

Actually, although Shrapnel is generally extremely good about sending out immediate press releases for every patch update and so forth, I think Shrapnel may not have done so this time. I don't see one in my email history.

The Wargamer news seems to have found it nonetheless - they mention it on this (linked) page.

PvK

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Yup, a total exageration, you mean the statement was almost reasonable enough to believe it was factual? hmmm. (that's another atempt at humor.)

Cheers! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">No, it wasn't reasonable enough for me to believe it was factual. But that doesn't mean you didn't believe it to be factual. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">i typed in 'space empires ship design' or 'space empires design' in yahoo. i was looking for another game where you could design ships, like stars!

kinda funny, now that i think about it.

at least, i think that's how i found it. that was a long time ago.

[ March 01, 2004, 20:40: Message edited by: narf poit chez BOOM ]

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">That is an excellent idea. You should email that to MM right now Greg. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Maybe when I get home, AT. One of my coworkers is getting canned, mostly in part for doing personal e-mails at work. So I'm not taking that kind of chance. But feel free to do so yourself if I don't get around to doing it tonight.

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

On the debate on cost of magazine ads.....

My Dad had a publishing company and the full page, full color ads those magazines back in the early 1970's was around 30,000 USD. Certainly not cheap.

Different industry that his mags had ads on but still....

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

gone gold usually plugs shrapnels stuff, and im supprised that they didnt mention the latest patch - they have mentioned all the other. maybe i just missed it.

They did, however, announce the latest coleseum patch (text based gladiator management program) which they have had high praise for.

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

How I acquired my copy of Space Empires IV Gold began with a magazine called Computer Gaming World. I read the small review, and decided that it was the game I wanted to play, a replacement for Stars! I suppose.

I downloaded the demo, and it was okay. I searched the information pertaining to Space Empires IV Gold, and I discovered Captain Kwok's Star Trek Mod. Believing he would complete it, I ordered the full Version. It was not played much, and eventually abandoned in the wake of Captain Kwok's unfortunate failure to finish the mod.

At a later time I felt curious and examined the information about the game again. I discovered that the mod has been resurrected, and promptly reinstalled Space Empires IV Gold.

As you can see, the review aided in my retrieval of this product, but it was the mod(s) that carried the day thus far.

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

I first heard of SE4 when Malfador announced the plans for it on their web site. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif I first heard of SE3 by finding it on a demo CD that came with Computer Games Strategy Plus (the title back then) magazine. Played it for a long while before actually ordering the game, as it worked great as its own standalone game. No silly turn limits, just tech limits and no ability to mod. Modding wasn't added in until patch 12 or 14 or whatever it was of SE3 anyways. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

well, actually, i found it early se3, too. i remember being impressed with the ability to mod when that came out, but i had no money back then.

i wonder how i first found stars!?

[ March 02, 2004, 00:08: Message edited by: narf poit chez BOOM ]

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'm so happy to have a subscription to PC Gamer because they are the reason that I discovered SEIV Gold. They showed a lot of love for SEIV becasue they review SEIV (March 2001; 80%) before it became gold and then reviewed it again (Can't find issue but I believe 88 or 89%) which is something they rarely do for a game that's not a full sequel. Plus PC Gamer, every so often, tries to get the word out about games that you can only find on the web. For example, "The Fifty Best Games on the web for free."

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

Shrapnel has tried the advertising route before. They found they were spending a whole lot of money and getting little or nothing in return.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Actually, word of mouth is much better for niche games like Shrapnel sells. Your typical gamer that will respond to an add is geared towards the more flashy graphics and whatnot that Shrapnel's games tend not to have. An add for a Shrapnel game isn't likely to catch their attention, and if it did, they are more likely to be disapointed then pleased when they try the games and realize they actually have to think to play them.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif Wow! You either are seriously overestimating the cost of bandwith, or you have no clue what it costs to place an ad in a magazine. Or maybe you are just joking? Exageration for effect? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

I first began playing Stars! with a demo disk my mother bought, when I was perusing the many titles available on it. Eventually, I came across it and began playing. I eventually came to like it, despite it's flaws.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">That is an excellent idea. You should email that to MM right now Greg. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Maybe when I get home, AT. One of my coworkers is getting canned, mostly in part for doing personal e-mails at work. So I'm not taking that kind of chance. But feel free to do so yourself if I don't get around to doing it tonight. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Man sounds like my old company when the belt got tightened. They would fire people for realy DUMB stuff. One guy spilled his breakfest, when we had cafiteria serivce, on the floor and it stained it. He was terminated. So people stopped buying food and they closed the cafiteria. Another guy was rifed for accepting a call from his wife on his own cell phone during a safety meeting.

I was there for both so I know. I heard that they fired people for surfing the web, emails, phone calls, sitting down when they should not have been, etc. Just uber nazi BS reasons.

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

about the cost for advertising in pc gamer...


$13K for a full page ONCE, $6k for 1/3 of a page ONCE. here's a link..


http://www.futurenetworkusa.com/pdf/...3-RateCard.pdf

i was doing this only becuase my turn was taking forever to process...

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

Wow, those magazine ads aren't cheap... Need to sell many many copies of the game from people seeing the ad, to make it worthwhile.

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Ahh....yess...many year ago...at the height of my nerdiness...I stumbled across a banner ad on some long since extinct website in some dusty corner of the internet at 3 am and was thereby introduced to the glories of SEIII. The resulting carnage was horrific...and strangely mesmerizing...and for hours...days...weeks...i continued to send my ill-conceived ships to the slaughter. The inevitable galactic dominance was eventually achieved...followed by a brief spell of boredom...until I learned of SEIV through the malfador web site and was launched into another orgy of mouse-shattering conquest and destruction.

Oh the horror...the sweet horror...

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">That is an excellent idea. You should email that to MM right now Greg. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Maybe when I get home, AT. One of my coworkers is getting canned, mostly in part for doing personal e-mails at work. So I'm not taking that kind of chance. But feel free to do so yourself if I don't get around to doing it tonight. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Man sounds like my old company when the belt got tightened. They would fire people for realy DUMB stuff. One guy spilled his breakfest, when we had cafiteria serivce, on the floor and it stained it. He was terminated. So people stopped buying food and they closed the cafiteria. Another guy was rifed for accepting a call from his wife on his own cell phone during a safety meeting.

I was there for both so I know. I heard that they fired people for surfing the web, emails, phone calls, sitting down when they should not have been, etc. Just uber nazi BS reasons. </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Well, I work for the state of Florida. Mostly in beaurocracies (?), once you're past your probation period, you're set for life. This person went too far in her antics, and therefore is being "encouraged" to resign. It would make for a better office atmosphere once she leaves, but unfortunately, until we get a replacement for her, I'll be stuck doing most of her work. So I might be going to this site less than I usually do once she leaves at the end of this month. Hopefully it won't be too long.

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

My experience was much the same as Lord Shleepy's. It was not so much that I was bored with the games I'd been playing, but that they were the sort of games that once you've been through them once or twice there's not much else to do but look for Easter eggs.

So I started a search. I spent some time looking over the freeware and shareware until I got hold of SEIII. It was tough getting started, but for some reason I had to learn to play it. Then, later on, when I found SEIV I had to buy it. Three years later, here I am hanging around in the Shrapnel Forums and playing SEIV Online.

I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I had to go looking in order learn the game existed, and it's that kind of interest that eventually leads us to a game like SEIV. I don't think there's anything wrong with the Online approach to promoting the game. Maybe there just need to be a few more links out there.

(hmmmm...what game like SEIV?)

edit: decided to get Lord Shleepy's name right. I had it 'Lord Schleppy'...heh heh

[ March 02, 2004, 14:17: Message edited by: Cipher7071 ]

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

I would love to get a job with the state I live in. But those jobs are reserved for college grads and family of those already employeed.

Tis a sad state I live in. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon8.gif

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

Hell if my state knew how much fun SEIV was, they would tax us everytime we booted it up and played it. (No kidding on that one folks, they tax us for farting if they could)

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">This has to be one of the best written Posts that I have ever had the pleasure of reading on any forum. Thank you.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Well, I had 2 2 year degrees, but I think what got me into Florida was my military career. Almost 10 years in the Air Force probably helped me more than anything else, since I had just moved into the state at the time. And no, not one of my in-laws were working for the state either.

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<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana"> <font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Hee hee! Lord Schleppy thanks you all. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: Oh This Just Ticks Me Off!
 

Well Greg any man who is man enough to have the DUKE as his avatar is ok in my book and deserves a good job.

"Well Pilgram?"

My dad new John Wayne. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif I wish that I would have had the chance to meet him before he passed on.