List of oddities
 

These are those things that are amusing or annoying, and probably bugs..but aren't worth bugging MM about by themselves. So I figure we can add them into a list and sent -that-.

First few:

-hitting yourself with a mine will make Terran units fire on you (I suppose because you shot a terran ship..)

-the Terran Starbase- and maybe others- can shoot itself with its missiles.

-no way to mod the radar display to show other than full, 300, 150, or 75 (I think)

-non-commented data files (SE4 had a listing of what everything does at the top of the files..SF lacks this)

-no way to make weapons that are more accurate, or that have minimum ranges

Speaking of which, what the heck does the emmisive armor damage resistance do, anyway?

EDIT: a few more..

Why does the manual list the out-system speed slowing as conserving fuel..when you can't even mod in energy useage for anything other than a weapon? (or maybe a shield capacitator pod..)

Cloaking. I have seen sensors to detect cloaked ships..I have yet to see a cloaking device.

[ October 15, 2003, 00:03: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It reduces the hull damage you take by X%

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Indeed. Hard to do Romulans without them... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: List of oddities
 

you know, it would be funny if other terran ships shot at the starbase after it shoots itself with a missile.

Re: List of oddities
 

Another..

-there doesn't seem to be a way to control which components are right-click useable and destroyed on use, and which aren't.

-anyone figured how the stealth cruisers in campaign 2 work yet? Just from looking at the files, I can't tell..

I'd love to be wrong on a lot of these, since the modding seems to have so much potential, but there's all these odd ommisions. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">I'm guessing any component with one or more effects and a placement location of 'None' works that way. Makes sense because there's no other purpose to adding an effect to a component that can't be installed anywhere.

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">They don't exist. There's no Fazrah Cruiser S in the enemies file.

[ October 15, 2003, 20:53: Message edited by: Mehrunes ]

Re: List of oddities
 

Hmm, could have sworn there was a cruiser/M in that group too. Ah well, it'll wait for the patch.

Re: List of oddities
 

If a Terran fighter smashes into your ship then all of the other Terran ships will start shooting at you. Even if you didn't shoot at the fighter at all and were just trying to avoid his drunk driving.. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ October 16, 2003, 21:11: Message edited by: ColdSteel ]

Re: List of oddities
 

correction on one of them..

-the Terran Starbase- and maybe others- can shoot itself with its missiles.

This was actually the satelites stationed around the starbase shooting it.

Re: List of oddities
 

More, this time unconfirmed bugs:

-First time I used Flailers, I got a access violation crash.

-Attempting to make point defense -beams- always gives me a Range Check Error crash.

-auto-firing doesn't seem to work if applied to weapons that shoot ships, like anti-proton beams. They fire maybe once, but not after that.

EDIT to add:

-directed torps always crash the game

-the "end game" event doesn't work

-negative offset values in stores.txt doesn't work.

[ October 22, 2003, 22:17: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: List of oddities
 

Be sure to report all errors to Aaron. I know that some of the problems you've encountered are being addressed.

Cloaking Devices are a high priority for a future patch.

Aaron also wants to put together a modding manual for SF - just hasn't had time for it yet.

The "Stealth" cruiser is just a description and not a real ship... yet - well, see above about cloaking.

Friendly fire incidents have been an issue with the beta testers and should have a high priority for a future patch.

Re: List of oddities
 

Yeah, I noticed that in the chat. Once I get the bugs confirmed I'll report them; the rest I was waiting until we have a nice list of them to send.

I especially want to nail down this weird flailer crash..so far, no luck.

Re: List of oddities
 

Still haven't nailed down the flailer crash, BUT! Directed torps do work.

The specific weapon type in bitmap effects must be the same as the weapon type, or SF crashes.

I kinda wish SF was more like SE4 in this regard- you CAN'T crash SE4 mid-game with a bad component. It just won't load in the first place..

Re: List of oddities
 

I'm not certain if this one was just me going insane or a genuine bug.

I want into a system, accepted a pirate mercenary mission, but died before I saved the game. When I loaded my game, the mission was gone! And I didnt have it...

When a ship crashes into an asteroid or planet, some of the cargo is created 'inside' the astrab body. I want a tractor beam!!

If you pick something up from a store by mistake and put it back again, you are chared some money for it (I think).

May or may not be existing bugs...I'll check em when I get home.

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">This is not a bug. Starfury stores operate on the "you grab it, you buy it" system. Just hover the pointer over the item to get its stats - don't pick it up unless you want to pay for it.

Re: List of oddities
 

But if you sell something accidentally, you can buy it back for the same price if you don't leave spacedock, so why shouldn't it work the other way? (Maybe to prevent recharging your shields by installing a fresh generator... haven't played with that much...)

Re: List of oddities
 

Can't be that Ed, since your shields are auto-recharged when you dock.

Re: List of oddities
 

I noticed a n odd one Last night. I was trying out fighter swarms, to see how well they worked (pants, as it turned out for me) and when on fighter blows up, all of my point defence cannons start firing on the about-to-explode fighter. Really, I think that fighters should not be able to crash into each other, or me. In just one batter I lost 8 of my 12 fighters because they crash into things.

I'll just have to mod it so fighters are twice as powerfull, and twice as big. Less fighters should make them crash less often.

Re: List of oddities
 

'If you pick something up from a store by mistake and put it back again, you are chared some money for it (I think).'

Well...I dont think you do anymore. Anyone else had the thing where you go to a system to a 'destroy a ship' mercenary mission, leave the system cos you got your butt kicked, and when you come back to the system the target you have to kill does not exist?

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">This is one that I hope gets fixed soon. I want to be able to mod ships with a few really big, non-autofiring weapons with long recharge times, and a whole bunch of autofiring guns that work constantly.

Re: List of oddities
 

Unfair to Lefties.

Need ability to remap keys.

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">In-game menu -> Controls -> click key window -> press new key

Re: List of oddities
 

what? more work?

Re: List of oddities
 

You can also add this:

speed slowing damage and true engine damage behave differently. If you are hit with a speed slowing weapon, you slowly drop down to your new speed. If your engines take damage you drop to your new speed -instantly-.

I'd prefer them both to work like speed-slowing damage does, myself..

Re: List of oddities
 

Have just recently seen a REAL oddity...

An INVISIBLE PLANET!!!

Yep, I entered the system as instructed and docked with a starbase. I got my next instructions and left. On the way out of the system, I hit something invisible!

So I reloaded the autosave game for that system and on way to the Starbase, I saw what I hit... a
planet! This planet was NOT there (at least not visible) on my first entry to system!!

I had previously encountered ships that were not visible, except for a strange light effect, and I thought they must be cloaked - now I wonder if the game glitched while displaying them.

Anybody else see one of these invisible planets? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

(...and no my navigator was NOT drunk!) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Under a SF QNP system, taking engine damage would cause you to coast along at a constant speed and be unable to turn or stop... The speed slowing damage would actually cause you to slow down.
Interesting effects, and it would solve the problem of engine damage being too deadly. Rather than being stuck there, you'd tend to sail by and hopefully have enough manoeuvering power to avoid any planets and asteroid belts in your path http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: List of oddities
 

[quote]Originally posted by Suicide Junkie:

Quote:

Under a SF QNP system, taking engine damage would cause you to coast along at a constant speed and be unable to turn or stop... The speed slowing damage would actually cause you to slow down. Interesting effects, and it would solve the problem of engine damage being too deadly. Rather than being stuck there, you'd tend to sail by and hopefully have enough manoeuvering power to avoid any planets and asteroid belts in your path http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">SJ, this was after I implimented a quasi-QNP system. Perhaps I did it wrong, but what I did was give the hulls a high maximum speed and put the turning/acceleration on the engines.

Re: List of oddities
 

The top speed referenced in the ship hull is just the point at which normal engines stop having any effect (some sort of structural stress derived speed limit)

One of the key points is that the actual top speed (sum over "propulsion base" divided by "# engine slots") should have nothing to do with the engines.

So, even if your engines are completely destroyed, you'll still have a top speed of say 10,000.

Re: List of oddities
 

SJ, propulsion base appears to give speed..if you take it away from the engines, you just move it to some other component which now acts like an engine..and if that gets damaged, you stop.

EDIT: unless, I suppose, it can be put on the hull itself..?

[ November 01, 2003, 19:07: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: List of oddities
 

Putting it on the hull would be the best choice, but I don't think it is possible yet. (I've made a request for it)

Alternatively, you could give propulsion base to EVERY component. Only once you're down to like 5 hitpoints will you notice a forced slowdown, at which point you're dead anyways.

Re: List of oddities
 

Of course, unlike SE4 you can't make an ability that doesn't show up, so all the components would show that in a mouseover..

Re: List of oddities
 

EDIT: wrong thread. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ November 01, 2003, 21:35: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: List of oddities
 

I was on the campaigns protect pirate base mission.

Pirate Space Station fired on me after recovering illegal item. Stopped firing after ejecting item.

I can understand the TCN starbase firing on me for illegal cargo. But, not the pirates.
It must be a copy the program code thing.

Re: List of oddities
 

A good oddity, and probably something useful for modders:

"Planet" is a valid target type. Nothing else extra seems to work, but this does. So the list for targets includes Ship, Base, Fighter, Satelite, Torpedo, and Planet.

This does NOT let you shoot planets by itself, since they aren't destroyables. But it would let you do that with a little modding..

Re: List of oddities
 

...Taz reads the previous post and immediately has daydreams of destroying WHOLE WORLDS! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif

It's one of those 'little things' in life that keeps a Taz happy!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

P.S. Now if we could only destroy a star... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif

[ November 17, 2003, 02:48: Message edited by: Taz-in-Space ]

Re: List of oddities
 

You could do that to. Just give it a target type of planet. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

It is odd though; giving something in the purchaseship enemy file an asteroid for a model works fine. Giving it a model of a planet crashes the game..

Re: List of oddities
 

Hmmm, something about how the program handles textures? Try something else graphically simple - like a sun?...

Re: List of oddities
 

Found the problem. Override textures don't work for ships, and there WAS no default texture for that .x file. Making one fixed the issue.

What this means, is you need a seperate .x file and texture for each killable planet. Not a big deal, since you don't want too many of them- each will have its own AI, and lots of them will slow the game down.

Re: List of oddities
 

And after a little messing around, I now have a completely functional, attackable Planet Earth. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Blows up real good, burns nicely too (which looks strange). Still need to edit the firing points for the "weapon platforms" and give it a proper portrait.

EDIT: well, not completely functional. About every other time I start up, I crash with an invalid floating point. Hmm.

[ November 17, 2003, 04:02: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: List of oddities
 

The game crashes on start-up? That would seem to indicate that a variable field was getting bad input - except that SHOULD crash it EVERY time...

Does it crash only after going through on a RELOAD? That would indicate that the bad value was being generated IN THE GAME.
Try this: load program from scratch, if no error then save and then blow up planet; and reload saved game. If it crashes on a RELOAD, that would indicate the bad value IS generated.
If above happens: Try load from scratch and play as above. BUT then get out of game ENTIRELY. Then load on a fresh start - If no error then you just proved the above. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

If the crash error is truly random then I haven't any suggestions... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon9.gif

Re: List of oddities
 

As far as I can tell, it only crashes the first time I start the game with a DIFFERENT ship type (I have two).

So, if I select the Terran Destroyer to start, crash. If I restart and select the destroyer again, all is well.

If I restart and select the Gunboat, crash. And vice versa..

Re: List of oddities
 

That would seem to indicate that there are some files loaded at the start of a NEW ship that is NOT loaded when using a ship same as the Last one loaded...

And I take it that this crash did NOT happen before the planet was blown up? Weird!

Sounds like a job for the Mighty Malfador Machinations Mastermind!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: List of oddities
 

The crash occurs just as the game is starting, as you click off the intro text..haven't had time to troubleshoot.

Re: List of oddities
 

A little more testing..and it seems that if an ENEMY ship has the target type of planet, the crash can occur. A Player ship (starting or purchased) can have a target type of planet, no problem..

EDIT: and changing campaigndata.txt (to point to purchaseshipsplayer) then changing the enemy files to match fixes that problem..

And copying some of the existing entries over fixes THAT. So there is something different between the player ship entries and the default enemy entries that prevents the crash from occuring.

[ November 19, 2003, 23:40: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: List of oddities
 

Oops. Embarrassed I didn't think of that earlier.

Changing the target type also changes the components that can be placed on the unit. Set it to planet and by default NOTHING fits. So game can't place any components on the ship, and as you might have noticed SF doesn't like that. Adding Planet components, or adding default components in (which is what the player file has that the enemy file doesn't), fixes the issue.

Re: List of oddities
 

Great!! Whoo-hoo!!!

Then I take it that Taz will soon be able to DESTROY WHOLE PLANETS!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon6.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Re: List of oddities
 

You'll have to wait a while. It might be in my campaign, but I still need to finish the map before I can start on that.

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">And thus did the earth go "NERK NERK NERK NERK" and spin around wildly and emit all sorts of flames and sparks... and then suddenly disappear, to be replaced by an oddly heart-shaped explosion... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

(Teletubbies with stellar manipulation? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif )

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">No, the most elderly gentleman from your crew will turn to you and say 'I felt a great disturbance in the force.' http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

[ November 20, 2003, 15:59: Message edited by: Devilsbane ]

Re: List of oddities
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">And thus did the earth go "NERK NERK NERK NERK" and spin around wildly and emit all sorts of flames and sparks... and then suddenly disappear, to be replaced by an oddly heart-shaped explosion... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

(Teletubbies with stellar manipulation? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif ) </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Actually, while it does flame by damage, the model's size prevents the usual explosions from appearing, and it can be preventing from noticbly spinning. At the end of that, it just vanishes to be replaced by the ring explosion.

(and don't tempt me to mod in a "I felt a disturbace" message when you kill a planet..it can be done. Sorta.)