New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

I'm sorry guys but any good will I had for Malfador has now gone completely, and I'll no longer be recommending anyone buy their games.

I thought I'd do a little more testing of the missile/point defense/iconic impact problem. So I swapped my high energy multiplier for an ionic disperser and went looking for a fight. I was also paying more attention to who was launching what and how many - much easier to do with only a single pirate cruiser to fight.

So sure enough in she comes, drops a pair of ionic missiles, my PD takes out 1 and the other hits home. Thats 70% of my engine capacity gone! Oh and neither of my missiles hit - both taken out by the cruisers PD. Just to note the cruiser fired both the ionics at 120ls I fired mine at 60 so at least 1 should have hit home.

I let the cruiser slide past and hit it with the disperser - no tangible effect. She makes a few more passes and I tag her about 5 more times before it has any noticable effect.

Then an nice Abbidon Cruiser appears along with a second pirate cruiser. I watch as the Abbidon cruiser takes 4 ionic missiles with NO effect.

Anyway having the cruiser about means my engines recover a bit and I can help dispatch the pirates. I also notice that the pirates AI only ever tags 1 of the Abbidon cruiser's missiles when fired from close range. It can also fire then at about three times the rate I can - interesting eh!

I then decide to check my player profile - the one that used to have resistance to lots of things. Guess what - they're all now zero.

So I'll not be playing any more as I don't see the point. I don't have another 30 or so hours to work through campaign 1 again on Expert level, and without a viable point defense or a capability of getting any missiles past pirate defenses there's no point in trying.

I guess I'll go play Cossack's or Total War or something that's enjoyable to play.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Testing this now..I -can- tell you you lost resistance because of a fix to scattering armor. At least that's the most likely explanation; it was giving resistances to everything and only supposed to give resistance to shield piercing.

EDIT: well, nothing so far. This was only vs. destroyers though. Aside from the usual problem of missiles being far too slow, zip. Shot down the expected number of missiles, saw the expected number of mine get shot down.

EDIT2: damage by ionics seems ok too. a hit with 2 level 12 ionic missiles took around 50% of my speed. not noticed the pirates firing any faster.

[ January 29, 2004, 23:55: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

A thought..had you modifed any of the data files? If you are using pre-patch files for some of them, SF might be acting strange because it's not finding all the lines its expecting. The tests below were on Expert, BTW.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">No. Game was exactly as installed plus 1.08 patch.

The single hit was from a level 16 iconic missile.

As regards the PD. Its broken. Sometimes 1 incoming missile, not even taken out - especially if you're turning.

Its always the case if you fire 2 missiles from >60ls at any AI ship with PD it will shoot down both missiles. If it fires 2 missiles at you 1 will always hit.
If you fire 2 missiles from <20ls the AI will always shoot 1 down. If the AI fires 2 missiles from <40ls they both hit.

That's the point of having multiple PD's installed. Except there's no point because they all fire at the same target.

Try the tests stationary as if you'd been hit by two iconic missiles.

[ January 30, 2004, 08:16: Message edited by: Vortex ]

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Plus 1.08? That one's been out for a while, surprised you hadn't noticed these before. At any rate, I still haven't been able to duplicate any of this, so I'm kind of stumped.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Well there's a reason NOT to upgrade. How do you unfix the fix to the scattering armor? How do you gain resistance to all the other items on the list without it?

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

You don't unfix it. Actually I didn't see it on the fixed list, but it seems to have been fixed anyway. Emissive armor can give you damage resistance, but other than that there -is- no way to gain resistance in stock SF. Something of a design flaw, that..

EDIT: though to be fair the fix affects the AI too, so against a scattering-armor equipped foe you should be more effective.

[ January 31, 2004, 05:22: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

What scattering armor foes? Only the Abbidon use it and I never have reason to fight them. I have to agree with Vortex - the game has become seriously unbalanced. No, make that fatally unbalanced. Not as bad a flaw as MOO3 but still a complete buzz kill none the less. A fun diVersion gone so frustratingly difficult as to not only completely discourage playing but to have the even more chilling effect of negative word of mouth and lost sales. If it takes even a month to fix this gaff, I predict the patient will be as moribund as the MOO3 forum. Come to think of it, this board is pretty much dead already. Maybe the less literate, motivated, or hopeful have already voted with their silence.

[ January 31, 2004, 16:49: Message edited by: Otter ]

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

And I still can't see what I'm missing. Otter, are you -just- refering to the scattering armor thing or are you seeing Vortex's problems as well? Because I'd like to know what the @!$% is going on, and I can't find anything that changed over the previous patch.

I'd rather be doing my own campaign than replaying this again to see if I can find a problem I couldn't duplicate through testing..but if I don't resolve this it's going to come back and bite me in the ***.

EDIT: if you want the scattering armor back to how it was before, here.

http://members.cox.net/phoenix-d/Main_Components.txt

copy that to your Starfury/Campaigns/Campaign # folder. Overwrite the existing file. If you need to change back, use this file.

http://members.cox.net/phoenix-d/Mai...onents.txt.bak

[ January 31, 2004, 17:07: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

I have seen the same behavior as Vortex describes and was initially very frustrated by it. The only strategy facing two or more ships was to run, get one to break off from the pack and chase you, tear his rear off, and then go back and repeat for the rest. Then I discovered the wonderful effects of scattering armor and no longer feared wading into even a dozen enemies. OK maybe a little too overbalanced in my favor but then I appreciate Patton's words, "War is not dying for your country; it's making the other sonofab**** die for his country." Remarkably poetic. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Anyway, I should have known the Scattering Armor fix would be in a mod file and take far less than a month to fix. Thanks! [wipes egg from face and happily goes back to playing game]

[ January 31, 2004, 17:34: Message edited by: Otter ]

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

That's very strange. The only thing I can think of is you two are much higher level than me- which would raise the ionic missile's damage. It would also give the enemies a fairly substantial Resist All bonus, since they gain 3% of that with every level.

The fix took about..3 seconds. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Of course, it would take longer if I didn't already know what was needed before I started.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Actually, this thread brings up an important point. There are many useful abilities in the game but not available in components in the stock game. We need a mod to add some good images for extra components and implement these abilities. I've modded Neutronium Armor to use the 'Resist Armor Piercing' ability for myself, but there are several more I haven't gotten to, like 'Resist Speed Slowing'. For resist speed slowing it could be called 'Ionic Baffle' or 'Ionic Buffer' or something like that.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Actually, SF uses higher-resolution components than SE4.

We could always start a collection. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

I already have, remember. All the SE4 components are ready, and I'll port image mod comps on request. Right now I'm porting them as I use them for my mod. And while SF uses higher resuolution for the minis, it doesn't use higher resolution than the SE4 -portraits- which makes porting them fairly simple.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

won't the components pack from the se4 image mod work for that? (after changing background color, and such)

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Well, if it's just the Scattering Armor (which I myself never use anyway) Then dont use it. Use someting else. theres armors with the same hull increase, and possibly more additives then Scattering Armor. I use the Phased Shields along with the others and I have at LEAST 4 turrets in front and 4 in back. No missiles ever hit me =^_^=

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Considering you're spending 160kt on just point defense, I'd say that's reasonable http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">how about Ionic Waffle?

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

I didnt see this anywhere so I wonder what level was Votexs PDC? I don't know awhole lot about Starfury yet but couldnt that have an effect on how many/fast he can kill incoming seekers.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Either the same of 1 level less than me - ie 16/17.

And the damage is only relavent at low levels where the damage frmm 1 hit is less than the damage required to destroy a missile.

I think 1 hit = 1 kill about level 5.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">What level are you, Vortex?

I'm almost afraid to ask the next question. Someone in another thread mentioned reaching level 32, and there being more. From what you say, at level 33, enemies would be at 99% Resist All. Er... does this mean, you then have to do 100 times the usual damage to hurt them?

I mean, I don't care for the idea of the universe warping against me because I've done well, but unless that doesn't do what it sounds like it does, there would seem to be a problem. No?

PvK

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

I think he already said part of it was him patching and continuing with his previous game..apparently SF doesn't like that. And yes, Resist All does get kind of insane, though fortunately its capped.

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Can you mod the cap level? (For instance, to zero...)

PvK

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Yup. EDIT: its from the top of enemies.txt
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">code:</font><hr /><pre style="font-size:x-small; font-family: monospace;">Enemy Base Resist All Start := 0
Enemy Resist All Modifier Per Level Added Amount := 0
Enemy Resist All Mod Per Lev For Easy Difficulty := 0
Enemy Resist All Mod Per Lev For Average Difficulty := 1
Enemy Resist All Mod Per Lev For Advanced Difficulty := 2
Enemy Resist All Mod Per Lev For Expert Difficulty := 2
Enemy Resist All Maximum For Easy Difficulty := 0
Enemy Resist All Maximum For Average Difficulty := 30
Enemy Resist All Maximum For Advanced Difficulty := 50
Enemy Resist All Maximum For Expert Difficulty := 70</pre><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">

[ February 18, 2004, 14:20: Message edited by: Phoenix-D ]

Re: New Patch - Fatally Flawed - I give up
 

Aha! Cool - thanks.

PvK