Machaka-What are they?
 

We have Mictlan, the pseudo-aztecs, we have T'en C'hi, the psedo-chinese and then we have Machaka, the...
Wait, what are they actualy? I know they have a spider in their flag(or that's what i believe), but what they are exactly?

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

worshippers of a Spider Queen, which have pointy ears and a dark skin, and which use wrist attached poisonous crossbows?

not very original I would say. Hope thats something else? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">They are not intended to be dark elves, more like pseudo Zulus riding spiders. They are perhaps less identifiable as rooted in a specific mythology than some of the other nations.

I dont think they feel dark elfy at all and they have a decent mix of troops and mages. All in all I think they are a very well rounded and enjoyable nation to play.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The specific nation themes have new units, the standard themes doesnt for most nations. Ulm and Marignon does not have new units if you play them with the standard themes. A difference between dom 1 and dom 2 is that most nations cannot recruit holy troops outside their home citadel, Marignon has a slight advantage here in that they still can recruit flagellants in all their castles.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">They are not intended to be dark elves, more like pseudo Zulus riding spiders. They are perhaps less identifiable as rooted in a specific mythology than some of the other nations.

I dont think they feel dark elfy at all and they have a decent mix of troops and mages. All in all I think they are a very well rounded and enjoyable nation to play.</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The Machaka cult and priesthood was inspired by the Shona (south of the Zambesi river). Witch-doctors comes from general african anthropology and spider elements from diverse fantasy settings.

They are a very versatile and strong nation.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

These nations themes seems really interesting. Just hope that Ulm will not draw the shortest straw once again with theses.

I also really long to see how Caelum has been toned down. For example the Caelian nation is the sole which had all their troops bypassing etheralness. Just one example amongst many of the advantages Caelum have. Well we will see if tweaks were done on that too.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

I haven't played as the Machaka, but I played against them (as Caelum, I believe) . . .

They kicked my . . . umm, my you-know-what. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif

Lot's of fun though. Their spider mounts will continue to fight even if the riders are slain. I'll bet they're expensive, but they put up one MAJOR fight!!! Their webbing is rough on those enemy troop lines too, and they have some powerful magic-Users to back up the spider-cavalry. Cool stuff, and next on my list to play after Mictlan. (I haven't played with the Blood Magic yet; Mictlan seems like a good choice to try that.)

Oh, and about Ulm: I've played twice as Ulm and I really like them. I think they can hold their own against anybody, as long as you don't do what I did and try to push forward on too many fronts at once! I haven't tried Marignon yet, so can't give you any personal feedback on them.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Please tell they didn't nerf Caelum too much!

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Of course we nerfed them too much No point in nerfing too little. We like nerfing. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon10.gif

Actually the nerfing is not on Caelum, but on the storm-flight-archer complex.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Machaka is nothing like Dark elves and no spider queens or such in site. They just use spiders instead of normal horses. And they are very powerful indeed. I played them in Last game and I kicked some serious ... (censored http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/tongue.gif ) with them. They have more then just those spider thingies with them. A large variety of spell casters that cover almost all skill in magic and (I think the only thing missing is blood magic) and special troops that wear spider armor and 2 weapons (spider warriors I think they are called, since they wear some sort of spider armor which is much stronger then normal armor and not as cumbersome as Ulm armor) - something like human Lord Warden commanders but more protection (and they are standard troops). Another thing is that they have access to almost cheapest shortbows in game, which gives them an early edge, and they DO have heavy infantry (protection 19) so they don't suffer from frontal melee attacks like Man does.

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Don't know what problems Ulm had in Dominions I (didn’t play a lot of it, unfortunately) but if it's any indication in all games I play, Ulm is usually the strongest power there is. It even kicked the crap out of Ermor in one of those games (they did it alone, and Caelum only arrived at the end to pick the leftovers) and if you play without Ermor they are mostly 1st-2nd place.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Okay, i might be paranoid, but few things you have said imply that Caelum has been severely nerfed.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Nerfix : We know that your love of Caelum render you partial. See they are so powerful that you wouldnt dare play against them I'm sure... anyway it is not our decision to nerf or not nerf, so we'd better take the adjustments philosophically... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Daynarr : The problem with Ulm is that they lack long standing power. Initially they are powerful, but will fold rapidly against any marginally competent magic using player.

We are all happy to have soon Doms II, but ... I have to raise 2 issues : http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif

I dont want to be accusative, but to test play balance, you ought to test it up and including the end game, and with human opponents. It is easy to says that race are equilibrated, if test beds are made either against a computer, or with games which are stopped at turn 40. But I'm speaking of end game equilibrium here, the ones where you see armies of 150 summer lions, and scripting of your 100 mages into battles (any big map with 40% site frequency lead to that, nothing extraordinary in these settings).

Dunno if the beta team of illwinter tested much this, because this is the kind of thing which is not done over a week end. When you comes to these extremities of a game, then some flaws appears which are not perceived before. For example the hassle of having to script dozen of mages is perhaps not perceived so intensively by IW, because you need to play a game during 100+ hour playing time, against players which play competively to the point that not indulging yourself into micromanagment is certain death.

My point is ... does Dominions II performs better in the end game, speaking of game balance and mage scripting than Doms I (2 issues here) ? I never read on the dom 2 progress page anything about new interface dealing with the scripting of mages in battles for example.

[ September 19, 2003, 17:15: Message edited by: Pocus ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You seem to be under the impression that we do not play dominions, or that we do not play competively. The scripting is more or less identical. We usually finish our PBEMs before turn 60, one way or the other. So the scripting problem is perhaps not as obvious to us as it is to someone playing the way you and your friends do. But the thing is illwinter is short on resources and manpower, most of the changes and additions are made from the perspective of our playing style, not because illwinter is evil and do not care about your opinions, but because lack of manpower forces us (in this particular and many similar cases JK) to prioritise between new additions, the additions and changes that win out are most often the ones that affect dominions 2 the way we play it, rather perhaps than changes that would improve the game for people playing single player games or games on huge resource rich maps. Now once again this is not done out of disrespect for your opinions but simply because the game wouldnt have been made if it wasnt fun to make and the changes felt relevant to the developers. Dom 2 is a game that is made to be enjoyable to us and our friends, with the hope that other people will share our tastes, and thus play and buy the game.

In short empire management is easier than it was in dom 1, battle scripting is much the same. Micromanagemtn is reduced in some areas, not significantly in all.

I'll hope you will enjoy it anyway.

[ September 19, 2003, 18:05: Message edited by: johan osterman ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Ummm...
I considere the fact that i will have to produce less A4(papere) pollution a significant thing...
And yes, i'm talking about national overview.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

While the topic of Mirco has been brought up...

Empire management has been made easier you say, is there a place to see what the changes are? Or can they be quickly elaborated here?

Are there improvements to the army screen, in as far as assigning troops to commanders and setting up the orders/positions for the units and comanders?

Is there an overview of all comanders, sortable by magic/command/piety/...? This one would be of great use I'd imagine as once you get a decent sized empire you have so many commanders running around its hard to keep track of them all. It'd be even nicer if you could issue orders to the commanders directly from an overview screen, rather than having to go to the province they are in and select them there.

Is there any way to give sequntial orders to commanders? For example you have a new sage with different magic schools that you want to search 5 or 6 provinces. Can you set him to do so automatically? Can you give sequential orders so he will search/move/search/move/... without having to be ordered each turn?

Don't take these as complaints or criticisms, they are just questions or suggestions (though its a bit late for any new implementations to the code I'd imagine, short of future patches).

I really gave MoO3 and its Macro approach a long shake, and while in the end I turned away from MoO3, it wasn't due to the Macro approach (it had more to do with broken or missing features), I'd be really really happy if Dom2 added more macro abilities. The tediousness of keeping track of a large empire with potentially 100s of commanders is right now my only concern with Dom2, not to say I won't get it and enjoy the hell out of it, just that I think more Marco control is a good thing http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">All in all there are many changes to improve micro management. Changing orders of all or some commanders collectively is one. Research pool another. The long awaited search log. Many user friendly popups to make newbies comfortable. The nation overview is probably the feature you will like the most.

The problem with your question is that I havn't played Dominions I for about a year or so. I cant't remember exactly how the game was back then. Perhaps I should indulge myself in an old game of Dominions I http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Wow thanks for the prompt answers. I like alot of what I heard. The nation overview does sound very functional to me http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

How easy will it be to add more features to it though? I'm guessing (well in my case I know) that once I get my hands on it I'll have suggestions for additions to it (unless its just soooooo damn perfect the first time http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif )

I'm really looking forward to this now http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Probably worth a game or two Dom1 to refresh the memory, but I'd guess you'd rapidly begin to hate the micro since it sounds like you made alot of improvements to it in Dom2 http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">There will probably be a lot of suggestions. You always had (all of you) http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif . Some of these will probably be added in upcoming patches, but for now we are working on the most urgent and easily corrected issues. Our beta testers help us decide what these issues are, but they have almost gone silent on the beta forum. This is probably a good sign. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Well understood Johan. I can understand the logic of doing the tweaks which satisfy either the dev teams, or most of the players. Anyway, you spoke of the ability to change the scripting of commanders by Groups. This is a new thing in Doms II, and will already alleviate a bit the problem. My view is perhaps biased by the people which dwells in the csipg newsgroup, but many of these dominions players are kinda hardcore in their micromanaging approach.

So on the other hand I dont think that features which simplifies how to handle 80 mages on the battefields (saving and reloading orders templates) would only be enjoyed by an handful of players. Perhaps we can make a poll on the most wanted features, when the forum will be at full speed.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Hum...
Dominions II is getting more and more disturbing...
First, R'lyeh gets Tentacle Boogeymen and Tentacle Boogeymen/Human Crossbreeds http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/rolleyes.gif ...
Now, pseudo-Zulus riding spiders!!!???
http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/shock.gif

[ September 19, 2003, 12:55: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

they feel cool from your description. Thanks for this precious bit of infos.

Do you know if the old races have new units, or if units are changed? I'm not speaking of entries we saw in the Dom 2 progress page (regarding the Abysian blood mage e.g), but things dealing with for example Ulm, or Marignon? Where they perceived as a bit behind the other nations by Illwinter, or do they remain as they were?

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

I didn't get to play DomI, so I'm not sure if this was part of it...
Scripting: Each 'commander' can have 5 'squads'. Squads can be a mixture of units, so it's really 5 seperate 'lines' under the commander. Not only can each commander be assigned a script, but also each squad can be assigned one independently of the others. These are 'set' scripts you choose from a menu.

In the same screen, you can also choose independent 'starting' positions of commanders and squads, in relation to others, instead of just starting the battle as one 'mass' group.

Bear in mind, you adjust these settings prior to a battle...you have no control over the battle once it starts. If a script doesn't apply to the unit(s), it will fall back on it's 'default' setting. So if you set your unit(s) to attack enemy archers, and there are none, they'll find something else to beat on http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif Of course, you're going to check on what you're fighting, right http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Giraffe and Bird are just too busy editing text right now. When we get a break, we'll find some more nit-picky stuff for you to fix - just wait and see! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

"The Atlantean Spearmen need more blue in their uniforms!!!"

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

The features you describe were already in Doms I, excepted this one

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">pardom me, but could you explains again, how you use it, and what does it allows you to do? Also, if you are converging from several provinces, is it possible to see better how the 3+ armies will merge, when on the same battlefield.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Huh? Dom I lets you place your men wherever you like. You can even put "that diseased limping guy with one eye" way out in front to get killed.

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

PvK

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Then it sounds the same (or at least similar) as in DomI...
If you attack from different provinces, all your squads/armies still begin in the same area 'facing' the enemy. (All battles are head-to-head only). The 'position' you can place your squad(s) are relative to all armies...if you place a squad from one commander to your right-front, then do the same for a squad from a different commander (even from a different province), then both squads will start the battle intermixed at the same position.

[ September 20, 2003, 19:29: Message edited by: Strider ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

can you confirm that you can edit the script of several mages at once?

is the script limit is still limited to 5 spells?

Can a repeat <particular spell> be issued as standing order ?

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">no

yes

no

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

What are "monthly rituals"?

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

It an order to commander (not combat order, but the one you can make on strategic map) to cast a ritual spell every month so you don't have to select same spell over and over again each turn. Its VERY helpful when you plan to make an army of summonings. It looks similar to ritual spell order but it will be carried out every month, not just next one.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

BTW. where did you hear about monthly rituals?

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, you hear(or more likely read...) intresting stuff if you lurk the dominions 2 progress page long enough...
Vanheim has themes called Helgård and Midgård, Ermor has Soul Gate, Man has Last of Tuatha...

[ September 22, 2003, 05:57: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

nothing has been done to ease the handle of group of mages then? http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/image...s/confused.gif

<font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">no

yes

no</font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

This is one of the major issues with DOM-I.
I would really like to have script templates for mages.

BTW,
Are province spells still targeted with the province number? - It is much better to just click on the target province.
Item/gem transfer still works the same? - There was a bug in DOM-I that this didn't work for big armies with more the 25 (?) commanders.
The way it was implemented in DOM is not that convenient. you have to choose the target commander name. what if you don't remember his name? (when you have over 80 mages it's common)

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">... which appears overlooked.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Gem transer is easier. As Nerfix pointed out you click on the map to target spells . You can transfer gems between more than 25 cdommander.

[ October 01, 2003, 13:49: Message edited by: johan osterman ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

And yet again... *starts to sing* "Everything will be alrigth, everything will be ok, with JO here beside us, everything..."

[ October 01, 2003, 13:56: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Well, I have an idea on how to solve that issue and I will post it with my next bug report, so dont lose hope. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

I feel the Illwinter Dominion increasing...
If your idea gets in to the game...

Oh, and i think you can "ångle spell på clicking a kartta"(or something like that, that's Swenglish from dom2progress page...), I.E target spells by clicking map.

[ October 01, 2003, 13:19: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It looks like my idea passed! I think we will have much easier (read shorter) time scripting commanders now. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Thanks devs!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

[ October 05, 2003, 13:16: Message edited by: Daynarr ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It looks like my idea passed! I think we will have much easier (read shorter) time scripting commanders now. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Thanks devs!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">|-|00rj4y!
er...
HOORJAY!

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">It looks like my idea passed! I think we will have much easier (read shorter) time scripting commanders now. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Thanks devs!!! http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif </font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Hmmm, that's not very informative. For all I know, it could mean there's a new password-protected switch allowing access to commander scripting, and disabling access to the strategic map, so that you can force your little brother to script all your commanders while you go eat lunch, yet he can't retaliate by secretly messing with your move orders. This would rely on the presence of a little brother (or blood slave, etc).

Hopefully it's better than that? I mean, don't give us TOO much info, now... http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

-Cherry

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Oh, and might it be somehow related to this?

"* Ctrl 0-9 order scripting store and recall."

http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

The holy power of Illwinter rests within that piece of text.
Hallowed be those bytes that have been touched by Illwinter's divine power.

[ October 05, 2003, 15:55: Message edited by: Nerfix ]

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">Got it. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

Gotta go, can't tell too much. http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

that would be a real neat feature, which was not hopefully to long to implement. Congrats for suggesting that Daynarr.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Now that I actually had a chance to try the feature, let me tell something about it.

When scripting squad or commanders you can store their scripts in one of ten memory locations. You do that simply by placing mouse pointer over the script (not clicking any mouse buttons) and pressing CTRL+number (it can be any number 0-9). Now that script is memorized. When you want another commander/squad to use that script just place mouse pointer over the script of that commander and press number (no ctrl of anything else, just number) for that script and that commander will automatically get that script. All scripts you saved in your current game are saved with saved games so you don't have to do it over and over again when you exit/enter game.
Ok, here is an example:
I have several commanders that I want to (Cast)(Cast)(Attack Closest). I make that script for one of them (you have to make script before storing it, of course), place mouse over that script and press CTRL+1. Now that script is stored in memory location 1. Now lets assign that script to the rest of commanders. You place mouse over script of some other commander and press 1. His script will automatically change to (Cast)(Cast)(Attack Closest). Repeat that until all commanders have proper scripts (this is starting to sound like recipe http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon12.gif ).

When I say to place mouse over commander’s script I mean exactly that - not over his name, or his picture but over his script. Same thing goes for squads.

Just a note, scripts for commanders and scripts for squads are not compatible. You can't assign squad script to commander or vice versa so bear that in mind when you chose numbers. I like to use numbers 6-0 for squads (maybe less since they don't have so many commands) and 1-5 for commanders.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

That is great
Thanks IW, Daynarr.
I really liked the way you supported DOM-I http://forum.shrapnelgames.com/images/icons/icon7.gif

I'm content with this, but may I suggest small improvement. use ctl+# to store commander scripts and ctl+F# (or something) to store units scripts. this way there won't be a mixup and there is room for more scripts.

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

Possibly CTRL + # for commanders and ALT (or SHIFT) + # for squads?

Re: Machaka-What are they?
 

<font size="2" face="sans-serif, arial, verdana">That would be even better than the current system.
Of course the current system is realy good, no real gripes.